Final wind-turbine rule permits thousands of eagle deaths

[Syriusly]

Oh! And since this is okay with you leftists let's not hear any more whining about humans destroying the environment with fossil fuels.

LOL- hell you are okay with destroying the environment.

You just are against wind turbines.

You hate eagles and the environment.

No- I just hate your hypocrisy.

You would eat Bald eagle burgers if eating them stopped wind power.

 

[Syriusly]

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy.

Details details details. Sorry they fly right over your empty head!

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy.

Obummer took the federal law protecting bald eagles! Negated it, and gave the right to slaughter them to green energy. Those are the facts and all the horseshit you are throwing will not change a single fact!

Nope- they aren't the 'facts' they are just your usual horseshit to attack wind power

Under the new rule, wind companies and other power providers will not face a penalty if they kill or injure up to 4,200 bald eagles, nearly four times the current limit.

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

 

[WillowTree]

Details details details. Sorry they fly right over your empty head!

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy.

Obummer took the federal law protecting bald eagles! Negated it, and gave the right to slaughter them to green energy. Those are the facts and all the horseshit you are throwing will not change a single fact!

Nope- they aren't the 'facts' they are just your usual horseshit to attack wind power

Under the new rule, wind companies and other power providers will not face a penalty if they kill or injure up to 4,200 bald eagles, nearly four times the current limit.

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

You hate eagles. I got it.

 

[Syriusly]

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy.

Obummer took the federal law protecting bald eagles! Negated it, and gave the right to slaughter them to green energy. Those are the facts and all the horseshit you are throwing will not change a single fact!

Nope- they aren't the 'facts' they are just your usual horseshit to attack wind power

Under the new rule, wind companies and other power providers will not face a penalty if they kill or injure up to 4,200 bald eagles, nearly four times the current limit.

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

You hate eagles. I got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch.

 

[WillowTree]

Obummer took the federal law protecting bald eagles! Negated it, and gave the right to slaughter them to green energy. Those are the facts and all the horseshit you are throwing will not change a single fact!

Nope- they aren't the 'facts' they are just your usual horseshit to attack wind power

Under the new rule, wind companies and other power providers will not face a penalty if they kill or injure up to 4,200 bald eagles, nearly four times the current limit.

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

You hate eagles. I got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch.

You hate eagles. We got it.

 

[Dot Com]

You can go to jail and pay a $100 000.00 fine for picking up an eagle feather. Obummer just gave " green energy" the right to slaughter them. Cool beans huh!

sucks to be you WillerTwaffle

Are you always this bitter? No wonder you don't have any friends

 

[Syriusly]

Nope- they aren't the 'facts' they are just your usual horseshit to attack wind power

Under the new rule, wind companies and other power providers will not face a penalty if they kill or injure up to 4,200 bald eagles, nearly four times the current limit.

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

You hate eagles. I got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch.

You hate eagles. We got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch

 

[WillowTree]

If it is okay for your wind power to mess up the environment do not whine about fossil fuels. In a few million years those dead eagles will make fine fossil fuel.

You do realize that every eagle alive today will be dead in a few millions years- regardless of wind power.

You hate eagles. I got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch.

You hate eagles. We got it.

You don't give a crap about eagles. If there were no wind farms, you would not have started a single thread discussing their welfare.

Eagles are just another tool for you to attack wind energy

If eating eagle burgers would stop wind power, you would be eating bald eagle burgers for breakfast and lunch

You hate eagles. We get it.

 

[Old Rocks]

All those dead birds are a pretty good indication that bells and whistles don't save birds from being killed by the spinning blades of turbines.

It is bizarre to be told on the one hand that it is green and good to use wind while on the other hand it is ok that the green power kills living creatures. Indeed, the Obama administration not only blithely ignores the death of birds, Obama et al even goes so far as to ok ignoring federal law when a protected species is killed.

Except when it comes to these highly overvalued delta smelt minnows in California. Then, we simply have to protect their environment so they can survive, and by doing so cause a total drought in the valley for 10,000 farmers who can no longer get the water to irrigate their fields. And I believe they estimated another 30,000 jobs lost if the farmers go down. This was 5 or 6 years ago and the last I knew the feds held firm and stopped the irrigation flow. Not sure if any of the minnows wrote thank you letters.
Californians lose 800,000 acre-feet of water to 305 minnows

Yes. The inconsistency is difficult to ignore. It makes you wonder what the green mind finds so special about wind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels
By DIANE CARDWELLNOV. 23, 2014

Continue reading the main storyShare This Page

• Share
• Tweet
• Email
• More

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

This was written over two years ago, and the price of both wind and solar have continued to decrease. Today many utilities in that ultra-liberal state of Texas are making major investments in the renewables. And will continue to, irregardless of the Trump administrations policies.

 

[turzovka]

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

As long as these companies do not distribute the capital costs to build them across all its other energy revenue streams. From the wind website itself it says >>
How much do wind turbines cost? - Windustry
The costs for a utility scale wind turbine range from about $1.3 million to $2.2 million per MW of nameplate capacity installed. Most of the commercial-scale turbines installed today are 2 MW in size and cost roughly $3-$4 million installed.

So the question is how much energy does each of these turbines put out? And how many kilowatt hours will it have to generate to recover its capital cost?
As an aside, I know, maybe 10 years ago, the U of Minn spent many millions to install solar panels on some locations and the local news reported it would take 60 years (of energy cost savings) to recover its initial costs. That I would not have gone with.

 

[Old Rocks]

Wind Turbines are worthless, so this is just silly.

Not an intelligent statement. Not at all.

Agreed. The costs are coming down to a point where I want to install a wind turbine for my home. Average wind speed around here is about 10mph, just right for home turbine use. I'm also considering a combination of solar and wind.

As for birds, it's like road kill and motorcyclists; evolution in action.

Evolution? It's a slaughter out there. And a preventable one. Don't allow wind farms on migratory paths. Change how you run the turbines to save bats.

All preventable. What is totally bizarre is that for a government so hell bent for leather to regulate every thing else including cow freaking farts it's not stepping up to the plate for making mandatory regulations for the placement and operation of the wind farms. Not voluntary.

You can't claim to be saving the planet when you are wantonly destroying wildlife including protected species.

That's bullshit.

A chart showing estimated numbers of birds killed annually by each of several different causes. Data from various

Causes of Bird Mortality - Sibley Guides

LOL And you wish to convince us that you care about anything other than 'Conservatve' talking points. LOL

 

[Compost]

All those dead birds are a pretty good indication that bells and whistles don't save birds from being killed by the spinning blades of turbines.

It is bizarre to be told on the one hand that it is green and good to use wind while on the other hand it is ok that the green power kills living creatures. Indeed, the Obama administration not only blithely ignores the death of birds, Obama et al even goes so far as to ok ignoring federal law when a protected species is killed.

Except when it comes to these highly overvalued delta smelt minnows in California. Then, we simply have to protect their environment so they can survive, and by doing so cause a total drought in the valley for 10,000 farmers who can no longer get the water to irrigate their fields. And I believe they estimated another 30,000 jobs lost if the farmers go down. This was 5 or 6 years ago and the last I knew the feds held firm and stopped the irrigation flow. Not sure if any of the minnows wrote thank you letters.
Californians lose 800,000 acre-feet of water to 305 minnows

Yes. The inconsistency is difficult to ignore. It makes you wonder what the green mind finds so special about wind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels
By DIANE CARDWELLNOV. 23, 2014

Continue reading the main storyShare This Page

• Share
• Tweet
• Email
• More

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

This was written over two years ago, and the price of both wind and solar have continued to decrease. Today many utilities in that ultra-liberal state of Texas are making major investments in the renewables. And will continue to, irregardless of the Trump administrations policies.

So the reason the federal law against killing eagles is waived for wind is because it makes sense to the ratepayers?

 

[Divine Wind]

All those dead birds are a pretty good indication that bells and whistles don't save birds from being killed by the spinning blades of turbines.

It is bizarre to be told on the one hand that it is green and good to use wind while on the other hand it is ok that the green power kills living creatures. Indeed, the Obama administration not only blithely ignores the death of birds, Obama et al even goes so far as to ok ignoring federal law when a protected species is killed.

Except when it comes to these highly overvalued delta smelt minnows in California. Then, we simply have to protect their environment so they can survive, and by doing so cause a total drought in the valley for 10,000 farmers who can no longer get the water to irrigate their fields. And I believe they estimated another 30,000 jobs lost if the farmers go down. This was 5 or 6 years ago and the last I knew the feds held firm and stopped the irrigation flow. Not sure if any of the minnows wrote thank you letters.
Californians lose 800,000 acre-feet of water to 305 minnows

Yes. The inconsistency is difficult to ignore. It makes you wonder what the green mind finds so special about wind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels
By DIANE CARDWELLNOV. 23, 2014

Continue reading the main storyShare This Page

• Share
• Tweet
• Email
• More

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

This was written over two years ago, and the price of both wind and solar have continued to decrease. Today many utilities in that ultra-liberal state of Texas are making major investments in the renewables. And will continue to, irregardless of the Trump administrations policies.

So the reason the federal law against killing eagles is waived for wind is because it makes sense to the ratepayers?

There's a law against killing eagles, but no law against eagles committing suicide.

 

[Compost]

Wind Turbines are worthless, so this is just silly.

Not an intelligent statement. Not at all.

Agreed. The costs are coming down to a point where I want to install a wind turbine for my home. Average wind speed around here is about 10mph, just right for home turbine use. I'm also considering a combination of solar and wind.

As for birds, it's like road kill and motorcyclists; evolution in action.

Evolution? It's a slaughter out there. And a preventable one. Don't allow wind farms on migratory paths. Change how you run the turbines to save bats.

All preventable. What is totally bizarre is that for a government so hell bent for leather to regulate every thing else including cow freaking farts it's not stepping up to the plate for making mandatory regulations for the placement and operation of the wind farms. Not voluntary.

You can't claim to be saving the planet when you are wantonly destroying wildlife including protected species.

That's bullshit.

A chart showing estimated numbers of birds killed annually by each of several different causes. Data from various

Causes of Bird Mortality - Sibley Guides

LOL And you wish to convince us that you care about anything other than 'Conservatve' talking points. LOL

It isn't funny that you are not addressing the topic. Why is federal law not enforced when an eagle is killed by a wind turbine? Are you too stuck on your talking points to answer?

 

[Compost]

All those dead birds are a pretty good indication that bells and whistles don't save birds from being killed by the spinning blades of turbines.

It is bizarre to be told on the one hand that it is green and good to use wind while on the other hand it is ok that the green power kills living creatures. Indeed, the Obama administration not only blithely ignores the death of birds, Obama et al even goes so far as to ok ignoring federal law when a protected species is killed.

Except when it comes to these highly overvalued delta smelt minnows in California. Then, we simply have to protect their environment so they can survive, and by doing so cause a total drought in the valley for 10,000 farmers who can no longer get the water to irrigate their fields. And I believe they estimated another 30,000 jobs lost if the farmers go down. This was 5 or 6 years ago and the last I knew the feds held firm and stopped the irrigation flow. Not sure if any of the minnows wrote thank you letters.
Californians lose 800,000 acre-feet of water to 305 minnows

Yes. The inconsistency is difficult to ignore. It makes you wonder what the green mind finds so special about wind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels
By DIANE CARDWELLNOV. 23, 2014

Continue reading the main storyShare This Page

• Share
• Tweet
• Email
• More

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

This was written over two years ago, and the price of both wind and solar have continued to decrease. Today many utilities in that ultra-liberal state of Texas are making major investments in the renewables. And will continue to, irregardless of the Trump administrations policies.

So the reason the federal law against killing eagles is waived for wind is because it makes sense to the ratepayers?

There's a law against killing eagles, but no law against eagles committing suicide.

Eagles are not committing suicide when they are struck by a turbine blade.

 

[Old Rocks]

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

As long as these companies do not distribute the capital costs to build them across all its other energy revenue streams. From the wind website itself it says >>
How much do wind turbines cost? - Windustry
The costs for a utility scale wind turbine range from about $1.3 million to $2.2 million per MW of nameplate capacity installed. Most of the commercial-scale turbines installed today are 2 MW in size and cost roughly $3-$4 million installed.

So the question is how much energy does each of these turbines put out? And how many kilowatt hours will it have to generate to recover its capital cost?
As an aside, I know, maybe 10 years ago, the U of Minn spent many millions to install solar panels on some locations and the local news reported it would take 60 years (of energy cost savings) to recover its initial costs. That I would not have gone with.

This is the cost decrease over the last 6 years for a complete system, installed. If you do your own installation the price is significantly lower.

The Price of Solar Is Declining to Unprecedented Lows

Put together, the reports show that all categories of solar have seen significantly declining costs since 2010. Furthermore, larger solar installations consistently beat out their smaller counterparts when it comes to the installed cost per rated Watt of solar generating capacity (or $/WDC).

The installed price of solar in dollars per Watt of rated generation capacity has declined significantly across all categories since 2010. Credit: LBNL
The installed cost includes everything needed to get a solar power system up and running: the panels, the power electronics, the mounting hardware, and the installation itself. The continued decline in total installed cost is noteworthy considering the fact that the price of the solar panels (or modules) themselves has remained relatively flat since 2012. This means that the decline in installed cost observed since 2012 was largely caused by a decline in the cost of the inverters that convert the DC power produced by solar panels to AC power for the grid and other “soft” costs such as customer acquisition, system design, installation, and permitting.

 

[Divine Wind]

Except when it comes to these highly overvalued delta smelt minnows in California. Then, we simply have to protect their environment so they can survive, and by doing so cause a total drought in the valley for 10,000 farmers who can no longer get the water to irrigate their fields. And I believe they estimated another 30,000 jobs lost if the farmers go down. This was 5 or 6 years ago and the last I knew the feds held firm and stopped the irrigation flow. Not sure if any of the minnows wrote thank you letters.
Californians lose 800,000 acre-feet of water to 305 minnows

Yes. The inconsistency is difficult to ignore. It makes you wonder what the green mind finds so special about wind.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels
By DIANE CARDWELLNOV. 23, 2014

Continue reading the main storyShare This Page

• Share
• Tweet
• Email
• More

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

This was written over two years ago, and the price of both wind and solar have continued to decrease. Today many utilities in that ultra-liberal state of Texas are making major investments in the renewables. And will continue to, irregardless of the Trump administrations policies.

So the reason the federal law against killing eagles is waived for wind is because it makes sense to the ratepayers?

There's a law against killing eagles, but no law against eagles committing suicide.

Eagles are not committing suicide when they are struck by a turbine blade.

Are they committing suicide flying into a window? A power line? Do you want to ban those, or like fucking Liberals and anti-gun laws vs. cars, do you only want to ban what you don't use?

 

[Old Rocks]

Isn't China still where the majority of turbines are coming from?

List of wind turbine manufacturers - Wikipedia

Large Wind Turbines Manufacturers[edit]

Multibrid 5000 Prototype, north of Bremerhaven (Germany)

Wakamatsu wind farm, Kitakyushu (Japan)

General Electric Wind turbines in Solano County, California (USA)
Alstom Wind (Spain) - subsidiary of General Electric since 2014
China Guodian Corporation (China) - turbine brand United Wind Power
Clipper Windpower (USA)
CNR (China)
CSIC (Chongqing) HZ Wind Power (China)
DeWind (Germany/USA) - subsidiary of Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering (South Korea)
Doosan (South Korea)
DSTN (DSME Trenton) (Canada)
Ecotècnia (Spain) - acquired by Alstom Wind (Later acquired by General Electric, now GE Power Conversion)
Elecon Engineering (India)
Enercon (Germany)
Enron Wind (now defunct) - wind-turbine manufacturing assets bought by General Electric in 2002
Envision Energy (China)
Gamesa (Spain) (previously known as Gamesa Eólica)
General Electric (USA)
Goldwind (China)
Hanjin (South Korea)
Hitachi (Japan) - acquired the wind turbine business of Fuji Heavy Industries in 2012[1]
Hyosung (South Korea)
Hyundai Heavy Industries (South Korea)
Japan Steel Works (Japan)
Končar (Croatia)
Leitner Group (Italy)
Mapna (Iran)
Ming Yang (China)
Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (Japan)
NEG Micon - now part of Vestas
Nordex SE (Germany)
Nordic Windpower (USA) - bankrupted in 2012
Northern Power Systems (USA)
PacWind (USA)
Raum Energy Inc. (Canada)
RRB Energy Limited (India)
Samsung Heavy Industries (South Korea)
SANY (China)
Scanwind (Norway) - bought by General Electric in 2009
Schuler (Germany)
Senvion (Germany)
Shanghai Electric (China) (SEwind)
Siemens Wind Power (Germany/Denmark)
Sinovel (China)
STX Windpower (South Korea / The Netherlands)
Suzlon (India)
TECO (Taiwan)
Vergnet (France)
Vestas (Denmark) - the world's largest manufacturer of wind turbines[2]
WEG (Brasil)
Windflow (New Zealand)
WinWinD (Finland)
XEMC (China)

The steel mill I work at in Portland, Oregon, rolls the steel for the wind towers for the Vestas mill in the US.

 

[WillowTree]

I drove through wind farms in Texas many of them were not even working.



The United States is Littered With More than 14,000 Abandoned Wind Turbines

 

[turzovka]

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

As long as these companies do not distribute the capital costs to build them across all its other energy revenue streams. From the wind website itself it says >>
How much do wind turbines cost? - Windustry
The costs for a utility scale wind turbine range from about $1.3 million to $2.2 million per MW of nameplate capacity installed. Most of the commercial-scale turbines installed today are 2 MW in size and cost roughly $3-$4 million installed.

So the question is how much energy does each of these turbines put out? And how many kilowatt hours will it have to generate to recover its capital cost?
As an aside, I know, maybe 10 years ago, the U of Minn spent many millions to install solar panels on some locations and the local news reported it would take 60 years (of energy cost savings) to recover its initial costs. That I would not have gone with.

This is the cost decrease over the last 6 years for a complete system, installed. If you do your own installation the price is significantly lower.

The Price of Solar Is Declining to Unprecedented Lows

Put together, the reports show that all categories of solar have seen significantly declining costs since 2010. Furthermore, larger solar installations consistently beat out their smaller counterparts when it comes to the installed cost per rated Watt of solar generating capacity (or $/WDC).

The installed price of solar in dollars per Watt of rated generation capacity has declined significantly across all categories since 2010. Credit: LBNL
The installed cost includes everything needed to get a solar power system up and running: the panels, the power electronics, the mounting hardware, and the installation itself. The continued decline in total installed cost is noteworthy considering the fact that the price of the solar panels (or modules) themselves has remained relatively flat since 2012. This means that the decline in installed cost observed since 2012 was largely caused by a decline in the cost of the inverters that convert the DC power produced by solar panels to AC power for the grid and other “soft” costs such as customer acquisition, system design, installation, and permitting.

I'm going to take your word on this one. I was just expressing my one concern.

fyi, sorry I insulted you in that other thread. I'm sure you have many good ideas, but I took your comment as a regular "immediate dismisser" of all points they were opposed to.