Georgia Seniors Told They Can't Pray Before Meals

[Sky Dancer]

A Moment of Silence imposed by the Government is not the same thing as the free expression of religion protected by the First Amendment.

And here's the thing: someone else's Freedom of Speech doesn't require Your Sanction.

What are they doing practicing 'free expression of religion' in a public building funded by the feds?

 

[boedicca]

Indeed. The Conformity of SILENCE.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Indeed. The Conformity of SILENCE.

Have you ever been anywhere for a moment of silence and felt respect? How about for fallen soldiers?

 

[boedicca]

A Moment of Silence imposed by the Government is not the same thing as the free expression of religion protected by the First Amendment.

And here's the thing: someone else's Freedom of Speech doesn't require Your Sanction.

What are they doing practicing 'free expression of religion' in a public building funded by the feds?

The Feds paid for $5.45 per meal, for which the seniors also paid a small portion of their own money. Is the price of such aid that one give up one's Constitutional Rights?

If that's the case, then all government employee, SS recipients, Medicare recipientss, government contractors etc. (who all receive far more than $5.45 btw) have No 1st Amendment rights.

How lovely.

 

[boedicca]

Indeed. The Conformity of SILENCE.

Have you ever been anywhere for a moment of silence and felt respect? How about for fallen soldiers?

I'm not objecting to the concept of a moment of silence - but rather the imposition of it upon people who would rather exercise their freedom of speech and freedom to exercise their religion.

A reminder:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

 

[Sky Dancer]

Continue to blow the whole thing out of proportion. The reality is if you have a moment of silence you still get to pray--you just don't get to make others recite YOUR particular prayer.

What if all the other non-christian religions asked for equal prayer time? Are Christians the only seniors? Why is Christian grace required for a meal? I say pray silently in public and loudly at home and at church.

 

[boedicca]

Those who think that violating the freedom of others is not a big deal, hold liberty very cheaply.

 

[boedicca]

Continue to blow the whole thing out of proportion. The reality is if you have a moment of silence you still get to pray--you just don't get to make others recite YOUR particular prayer.

What if all the other non-christian religions asked for equal prayer time? Are Christians the only seniors?

So? What if others wish to pray? Nobody is stopping them except for officious bureaucrats.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Continue to blow the whole thing out of proportion. The reality is if you have a moment of silence you still get to pray--you just don't get to make others recite YOUR particular prayer.

What if all the other non-christian religions asked for equal prayer time? Are Christians the only seniors?

So? What if others wish to pray? Nobody is stopping them except for officious bureaucrats.

Let people pray in silently in public buildings using federal dollars. It's perfectly reasonable. If the seniors want to pray out loud let them meet in a church and have their communal meals there. Let the churches fund the loud prayers.

 

[Avatar4321]

They can pray. It's just not an organized prayer.

Or they could always refuse funding.

As usual, the right can't do nuance on the separation of church and state issue.

Which is probably why they are so confused.

How is serving people food a separation of Church and state issue?

 

[Sky Dancer]

They can pray. It's just not an organized prayer.

Or they could always refuse funding.

As usual, the right can't do nuance on the separation of church and state issue.

Which is probably why they are so confused.

How is serving people food a separation of Church and state issue?

It's about where the funds come from. Some folks want to have their federally funded lunch cake and eat it too. They want to accept federal dollars and still act like they're in church.

 

[Avatar4321]

There is also one that prevents the government from establishing a religion and that is why the Supreme Court has consistently ruled that group prayer sessions in the public domain are unconstitutional.

You certainly aren't seeing anyone saying group prayer should be banned in church. That's the other side of this coin.

No religion was established by the government.

As I said, the court cases disagree with your opinion on these matters.

Please cite the Court case that says that the elderly cannot have group prayer when their food is provided by the Federal Government.

 

[Avatar4321]

No one stoped anyone from praying

Where does the Federal Government have the power to prevent people from praying together?

 

[Avatar4321]

No one stoped anyone from praying

Yes, they were prevented from saying Grace out loud.

Their First Amendment Rights were violated.

You dont have to pray out loud.

They were not prevented from praying.

They were prevented from forcing a their prayers on the others who were not of the same religion.

Where is all your concern for the people who were not christian and their rights?

No you don't have to pray out loud. But the First amendment gives you every right to pray outloud, if you choose to do so.

What do you have against people praying outloud?

 

[Sky Dancer]

No one stoped anyone from praying

Where does the Federal Government have the power to prevent people from praying together?

They can pray together silently--otherwise they have to let every single faith group say their own prayers.

Might be interesting. Native American grace. Muslim grace. Hindu grace. Buddhist grace. Jewish grace. Quaker grace, etc etc etc.

Too bad Christians don't want to share.

 

[Avatar4321]

Did you support Iraq?

Because if you are going to talk of values and bankruptcy out of one side of your mouth while supporting a war the deaths of thousands of innocents, the destruction of homes, and cost us a shit-ton of money that we borrowed from the Chinese out of the other, I am going to think you are F.O.S.

What a disingenuous comment.

You think that citing something you think is wrong is a justification for a further wrong?

Grow up.

The truth hurts doesn't it?

So since you did support a war of adventure that resulted in the death of thousands of innocents and has further bankrupted out country, you can spare me the lectures.

If you think we have bankrupted our country are you likewise outraged at the irresponsible spending by the current administration for wasteful government programs they have no authority to create to begin with?

 

[Sky Dancer]

Yes, they were prevented from saying Grace out loud.

Their First Amendment Rights were violated.

You dont have to pray out loud.

They were not prevented from praying.

They were prevented from forcing a their prayers on the others who were not of the same religion.

Where is all your concern for the people who were not christian and their rights?

No you don't have to pray out loud. But the First amendment gives you every right to pray outloud, if you choose to do so.

What do you have against people praying outloud?

I'd be all for praying out loud with federal funding if it wasn't always a Christian prayer that was said.

For respect for our plurality, say Native American grace, Jewish grace, Quaker grace, Buddhist grace. Take turns. Or just for practicality pray in silence. It's the reason that you cannot pray out loud when you're getting federally funded. The government is not allowed to endorse Christianity by making Christian prayer mandatory in a public place.

 

[Avatar4321]

The Christian majority is sometimes like white males. They can be blind to the advantages their status has given them.

So, your feelings are based in resentment and jealousy then? What advantages do I have over you because I'm a christian?

No, my feelings are not based on resentment and jealousy. I have nothing to envy from Christians. I wouldn't want to be one anymore that I'd like to be a white male, regardless of the advantages.

My feelings are based on what is right and fair to all people.

Cause telling people they can't pray outloud or they won't get food is right and fair to all

 

[Sky Dancer]

So, your feelings are based in resentment and jealousy then? What advantages do I have over you because I'm a christian?

No, my feelings are not based on resentment and jealousy. I have nothing to envy from Christians. I wouldn't want to be one anymore that I'd like to be a white male, regardless of the advantages.

My feelings are based on what is right and fair to all people.

Cause telling people they can't pray outloud or they won't get food is right and fair to all

Telling people they can't eat unless they pray loudly to YOUR god in YOUR way is fair and right to all.

 

[Avatar4321]

i find it amusing you deny the christian hate that is shown on this board.

Amusing is a sad sort of way. If I were a Christian I'd be cringing at some of the things said here in defense of religious oppression.

I do cringe at much of what you say.