Georgia Seniors Told They Can't Pray Before Meals

[Avatar4321]

do you honestly think so little of your god that he does not hear the prayers of your heart?

Are you insecure in your faith that you can't accept people exercising their God given freedom to praise Him in public?

 

[Sky Dancer]

do you honestly think so little of your god that he does not hear the prayers of your heart?

Are you insecure in your faith that you can't accept people exercising their God given freedom to praise Him in public?

Some people don't consider god to be a him or her.

 

[Avatar4321]

I don't care if it says "In God We Trust" on our money.

Why? It's a government endorsement of God and should be removed IMO.

Because acknowleging our Creator is clearly a great evil in this world right?

 

[Avatar4321]

You know as well as I do that the right to free speech is not unconditional.

Then in order to be consistent with your own viewpoints, I presume you will now cease to exercise your first amendment rights because you use the public highways everyday.

I don't really care what you think. If you think I am going to stop praying outloud or personally because someone from the government says so, you are sadly mistaken.

 

[Avatar4321]

For you and I the experience only gives us the creeps. We are fortunate. Others suffer worse injustices. That is why our Constitution gives us freedom of religion.

Can you read?

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The senior center should not have accepted federal assistance if they were not willing to abide by the regulations. But it looks like they want to have their cake and eat it too. Shame on them for jeopardizing the welfare of senior citizens, not to mention subjecting them to religion before they can get their dinner.

There are very few times when I am absolutely infuriated reading posts on this board. This is one of those few times.

You have no problem with the fact that these people were told they could not exercise their rights if they wanted to eat. Basic fundamental rights including free speech or religion. You honestly think the government should have the power to tell people what they can or can't say simply because they provide food?

Rephrasing that to make the point: You really think you have the right to tell them to starve unless they cease to exercise their freedom?

 

[Avatar4321]

So, I guess once the feds take over health care if someone wants a minister to pray with them before a surgery or while someone is dying, you say too damn bad since the surgery, the hosptial, the doctor, etc... will be 'federally funded', no prayer for you. Good bye any kind of chapel at the hospital as well. This is a perfect example, fellow board members, why you do not let the federal government into anything at all, you do not accept their dirty money for anything. Mindless people that are championing the curtailment of freedom will use any excuse to control you and your behavior in order to move their agenda forward. They're using the influence of money as bribes. You want financial assistance, well you have to comply to our rules. It's pathetic.

Wow. Now that's a scary thought.

"You need to shut up or we will pull the plug."

Even scarier some of the people here are actually telling us the government has that power.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I don't care if it says "In God We Trust" on our money.

Why? It's a government endorsement of God and should be removed IMO.

Because acknowleging our Creator is clearly a great evil in this world right?

Belief in a creator god is not a citizen nor tax payer requirement.

 

[Avatar4321]

The loss federal funding was used as the excuse to stop the old folks from saying grace before they ate nothing else.

I would say its more to stop the organization recieving federal funding from praying rather than not permiting individuals to pray. The individuals should be able pray or celebrate God in anyway they see fit. If some asshole wants to act like an ass durning the "prayer time" or talk during the moment of silence they can do that as well. Federal funding shouldnt really be used to encourge a silly little religious ritual like this group prayer.

The funding was for the meals not the prayer. the prayer was done before the meals were eaten.

I fail to see why so many people are "offended" by this.

Because they are as intolerant as they claim others are.

 

[Avatar4321]

Only radical atheists would answer "yes" No one would admit to that skull. Honesty is not part of their religion.

The ironic thing is that I am an atheist. And I don't care one iota that some senior citizens said grace.

I wouldn't care if my tax dollars paid for the food, the building, the transportation to get to the building or the clothes the old people were wearing.

What is wrong with you people who do?

They don't really care about freedom of religion. It's just a pretext for enforcing their views on others.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Consider how to make prayer inclusive for all people....pray silently....give people the option of praying in silence or sitting in respectful silence.

Pray vigorously and loudly in all private places including houses of worship. Live and let live.

Think of how few people like to hear the Koran recited in public.

 

[Avatar4321]

Do you know what separation of Church and State means?

Yes. Very much so. It means that the State will not establish a religion to be the State religion.

Do you understand what "Shall not prohibit the free exercise of" means?

 

[Avatar4321]

Quit robbing my wallet and they can do as they want.
The real story here is why am I, and not their families, paying for their meals?
Plenty of wannahbe conservatives here.

So you don't think we should have to support our elderly? Our disabled? When did we stop being a civilized country?

What I think he means is that the primary people who are to be supporting them should be their families and local communities and not the Federal Government.

A point which has validity.

 

[Avatar4321]

Keep prayer in the Churches and home and practice a moment or so of silence. It does wonders for a sense of inclusiveness.

Is the goal of prayer inclusiveness or communication and gratitute for Diety?

Is the Goal of the Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religion inclusiveness or give the people to act and speak their conscience even if others don't like what they have to say or how they choose to worship?

No one excludes you from prayer. You're very much invited to join. If you choose not to, you can't really complain about inclusiveness when you exclude yourself.

 

[Avatar4321]

Bingo.

Nice try, but no. I said I seldom say grace, not that I never say grace. Believe as you will, you do not have the right not to hear me say grace.

Say your grace silently and respectfully or say it in your home or church. Don't make me say it with you. If we both pray in silence there is connection and respect.

How is it at all respectful for you to tell me how I can or can't worship when I have the freedom to worship as I choose?

 

[Avatar4321]

All this brouhaha over one moment of silence. It's sad.

Actually no. The brouhaha is over someone on behalf of the Federal Government telling people they can't pray outloud.

 

[Avatar4321]

Would you like to have my Buddhist prayer publically inflicted on you? Probably not.

I don't see at all how you can inflict prayer on me. I would be more than happy to listen to your prayer. In fact, I would defend your right to do it with my own life.

 

[Avatar4321]

Are you ok with the seniors reciting prayers from the Koran instead of the Bible?

Yep. Go right ahead. They have every right to under the First amendment.

 

[Avatar4321]

Are you ok with the seniors reciting prayers from the Koran instead of the Bible?

If that is what they wish to do, it's no skin off my nose. Perhaps if you weren't so intolerant of others who do not share your beliefs, you would be able to grok that the 1st Amendment applies to all religious beliefs or the complete absence thereof.

I am all for a moment (or minutes) of silence which allows all those who pray--even when their prayers differ--to do so together and respects people who don't pray at all. Silence is inclusive and tolerant. Public prayer is exclusive and intolerant.

There is nothing intolerant or exclusive about public prayer. What is intolerant is telling someone they can't pray outloud on some phoney Separation of Church and State claim.

 

[Avatar4321]

Continue to blow the whole thing out of proportion. The reality is if you have a moment of silence you still get to pray--you just don't get to make others recite YOUR particular prayer.

What if all the other non-christian religions asked for equal prayer time? Are Christians the only seniors? Why is Christian grace required for a meal? I say pray silently in public and loudly at home and at church.

You have no right to enforce such an activity on other people. We are protected under the Constitution.

They can pray all they want. No one is stopping them. Nor is anyone stoppping them from choosing not to pray if they want.

But the idea that the Federal Government has the power to take someones right to freely exercise their religion and to freely speak is absurd.

You can say what you want all you want. But you cant enforce your viewpoints on others through government action.

 

[Avatar4321]

Let people pray in silently in public buildings using federal dollars. It's perfectly reasonable. If the seniors want to pray out loud let them meet in a church and have their communal meals there. Let the churches fund the loud prayers.

No. It isn't perfectly reasonable to tell someone they can worship only if they comport with your ideas.