Giffords seeks "bold" action as Congress takes up gun control

[Sallow]

Mostly suicides, which the gun grabbers convinently keep leaving in.

And how would you know that?

The NRA blocked government from providing statistics on gun violence.

Funny. CDC has a database showing cause of death for a 10 year span. Whats this blocking you are talking about?

WONDER Message

How the NRA Blocks Gun Research | Mother Jones
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/26/us/26guns.html?_r=0

The reality is that even these and other basic questions cannot be fully answered, because not enough research has been done. And there is a reason for that. Scientists in the field and former officials with the government agency that used to finance the great bulk of this research say the influence of the National Rife Association has all but choked off money for such work.

“We’ve been stopped from answering the basic questions,” said Mark Rosenberg, former director of the National Center for Injury Control and Prevention, part of the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which was for about a decade the leading source of financing for firearms research.

Chris Cox, the N.R.A.’s chief lobbyist, said his group had not tried to squelch genuine scientific inquiries, just politically slanted ones.

“Our concern is not with legitimate medical science,” Mr. Cox said. “Our concern is they were promoting the idea that gun ownership was a disease that needed to be eradicated.”

The amount of money available today for studying the impact of firearms is a fraction of what it was in the mid-1990s, and the number of scientists toiling in the field has dwindled to just a handful as a result, researchers say.

The dearth of money can be traced in large measure to a clash between public health scientists and the N.R.A. in the mid-1990s. At the time, Dr. Rosenberg and others at the C.D.C. were becoming increasingly assertive about the importance of studying gun-related injuries and deaths as a public health phenomenon, financing studies that found, for example, having a gun in the house, rather than conferring protection, significantly increased the risk of homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Agreed but here is a fact. There are more people killed by guns in this country than any other county in the world. Comment?

Nope.

Because the fact that I own weapons has nothing to do with what some other person does.

I have owned a rifle since I was 6 years old. In the 40 years since my 6th birthday I have bought several more rifles, shotguns and handguns. I have fired countless rounds of ammunition on the rifle, pistol and skeet ranges at various venues. In the past 40 years I have never once pointed a weapon at another person. I have never once fired a weapon accidentally. I have never injured myself or another with a weapon.

So tell me what does my owning weapons have to do with any violent crime committed by another.

How has my owning weapons for the past 40 years had anything to do with any shooting death in this country?

I'll help you out here.

There is absolutely no correlation to me owning weapons and violent crime.

That's you.

There are 300 million more guns out there.

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

 

[whitehall]

A victim always seeks "bold action". It's part of the psychological makeup of victimhood. When the victim is a politician the "action" needs to be bolder. I would like to see Giffords demand that the persons responsible for authorizing the shipment of 3,000 illegal weapons to drug cartels in Mexico, which resulted in an estimated 400 deaths of Mexican civilians and one US Border Patrol officer, be brought to justice but it ain't gonna happen because Giffords is a democrat and political power is more important than justice.

 

[Capstone]

How would you know that?

Click here, and be sure to examine the references. It's not a perfect list by any stretch of the imagination, but it serves as a pretty good indicator of where else to look.

And here's a decent site for determining gun regulations and other related facts by country (even though the information is presented in a biased/misleading way in a number of instances, the source material is generally pretty good).

 

[martybegan]

And how would you know that?

The NRA blocked government from providing statistics on gun violence.

Funny. CDC has a database showing cause of death for a 10 year span. Whats this blocking you are talking about?

WONDER Message

How the NRA Blocks Gun Research | Mother Jones
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/26/us/26guns.html?_r=0

The reality is that even these and other basic questions cannot be fully answered, because not enough research has been done. And there is a reason for that. Scientists in the field and former officials with the government agency that used to finance the great bulk of this research say the influence of the National Rife Association has all but choked off money for such work.

“We’ve been stopped from answering the basic questions,” said Mark Rosenberg, former director of the National Center for Injury Control and Prevention, part of the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which was for about a decade the leading source of financing for firearms research.

Chris Cox, the N.R.A.’s chief lobbyist, said his group had not tried to squelch genuine scientific inquiries, just politically slanted ones.

“Our concern is not with legitimate medical science,” Mr. Cox said. “Our concern is they were promoting the idea that gun ownership was a disease that needed to be eradicated.”

The amount of money available today for studying the impact of firearms is a fraction of what it was in the mid-1990s, and the number of scientists toiling in the field has dwindled to just a handful as a result, researchers say.

The dearth of money can be traced in large measure to a clash between public health scientists and the N.R.A. in the mid-1990s. At the time, Dr. Rosenberg and others at the C.D.C. were becoming increasingly assertive about the importance of studying gun-related injuries and deaths as a public health phenomenon, financing studies that found, for example, having a gun in the house, rather than conferring protection, significantly increased the risk of homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

yet all the data is still there. Some group can use thier own funding to analyze the data and spin it to whatever gun grabbers such as yourself want.

How about you set up a fund to finance the studies? If its so important to you why wait for the government to look at it?

Once again its spin. you imply that somehow the NRA quashed the data, when no such thing happened. What happened is that there was no funding for obvious GUNZ R BADZ studies due to lobbying by the NRA and other gun rights groups.

 

[Saigon]

[...] There are more people killed by guns in this country than any other county in the world. Comment?

Not per capita.

More importantly, most (if not all) of the countries with higher (in several cases MUCH higher) gun deaths per capita also have tougher regulations in place and/or no legal guarantees of the right or privilege to own firearms.

Yes, per capita the US has more homicides and more gun-related deaths than any other developed country in the world. Do go and check.

 

[Saigon]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

No, I totally agree.

But if the entire US makes assault weapons illegal, criminals will have problems finding them.

 

[martybegan]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

No, I totally agree.

But if the entire US makes assault weapons illegal, criminals will have problems finding them.

lol. First good luck with that. and second, semi auto rifles are used in less crimes than baseball bats and hammers.

Semi autos are most commonly used criminally by very meticulous people who plan out whatever they intend to do. Do you really think a ban will prevent someone like that from getting whatever gun they want to use?

 

[Sallow]

Nope.

Because the fact that I own weapons has nothing to do with what some other person does.

I have owned a rifle since I was 6 years old. In the 40 years since my 6th birthday I have bought several more rifles, shotguns and handguns. I have fired countless rounds of ammunition on the rifle, pistol and skeet ranges at various venues. In the past 40 years I have never once pointed a weapon at another person. I have never once fired a weapon accidentally. I have never injured myself or another with a weapon.

So tell me what does my owning weapons have to do with any violent crime committed by another.

How has my owning weapons for the past 40 years had anything to do with any shooting death in this country?

I'll help you out here.

There is absolutely no correlation to me owning weapons and violent crime.

That's you.

There are 300 million more guns out there.

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

Unless you are crazy, a terrorist or a criminal..or you want military weapons..

You have nothing to worry about.

 

[Sallow]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

No, I totally agree.

But if the entire US makes assault weapons illegal, criminals will have problems finding them.

lol. First good luck with that. and second, semi auto rifles are used in less crimes than baseball bats and hammers.

Semi autos are most commonly used criminally by very meticulous people who plan out whatever they intend to do. Do you really think a ban will prevent someone like that from getting whatever gun they want to use?

Yup

 

[Sallow]

How would you know that?

Click here, and be sure to examine the references. It's not a perfect list by any stretch of the imagination, but it serves as a pretty good indicator of where else to look.

And here's a decent site for determining gun regulations and other related facts by country (even though the information is presented in a biased/misleading way in a number of instances, the source material is generally pretty good).

The US stats aren't accurate.

 

[Capstone]

The US stats aren't accurate.

Well, let's see your stats, so we can determine the rate per 100K in a population of 312,780,968.

 

[Skull Pilot]

That's you.

There are 300 million more guns out there.

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

Unless you are crazy, a terrorist or a criminal..or you want military weapons..

You have nothing to worry about.

How many times do you have to be told that a so called assault rifle such as an AR 15 that shoots a .223 round is functionally no different than a ranch rifle that shoots a .223 round?

Here let me use pictures

This gun

Is functionally no different from this gun

So what is the sense in banning one and not the other?

 

[nodoginnafight]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

We don't really know what kind of person you are.

But, we can take steps to help prevent the bad apples from obtaining guns without keeping them from law-abiding, responsible people. Background checks for every gun purchase is a good example.

 

[bayoubill]

No, but it makes it a lot easier to commit evil.

Most gun deaths are suicides, accidents and domestic arguments gone wrong. The one with a criminal preying on an innocent citizen are the exception.

A knife makes it easier to commit evil

1694 were murdered by knives in 2011

Are you going to throw in bathtub accidents, too... because you gun whacks LOVE to change the subject when confronted.

You don't need a gun if you aren't a cop or a soldier.

Period.

and you apparently don't need a brain if you're a liberal...

Period.

 

[bayoubill]

No, I totally agree.

But if the entire US makes assault weapons illegal, criminals will have problems finding them.

lol. First good luck with that. and second, semi auto rifles are used in less crimes than baseball bats and hammers.

Semi autos are most commonly used criminally by very meticulous people who plan out whatever they intend to do. Do you really think a ban will prevent someone like that from getting whatever gun they want to use?

Yup

further proving my point...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/6749580-post95.html

 

[Skull Pilot]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

We don't really know what kind of person you are.

But, we can take steps to help prevent the bad apples from obtaining guns without keeping them from law-abiding, responsible people. Background checks for every gun purchase is a good example.

I have owned a rifle since I was 6 years old. In the 40 years since my 6th birthday I have bought several more rifles, shotguns and handguns. I have fired countless rounds of ammunition on the rifle, pistol and skeet ranges at various venues. In the past 40 years I have never once pointed a weapon at another person. I have never once fired a weapon accidentally. I have never injured myself or another with a weapon.

I have a concealed carry permit and my fingerprints are on file with the state. So Sorry but there is no reason that I should not be able to buy any gun I want whenever I want.

Granted I most likely won't be buying more weapons but if I want to it really is none of your business.

 

[nodoginnafight]

And you don't get guns out of the hands of criminals by preventing people like me from owning them.

We don't really know what kind of person you are.

But, we can take steps to help prevent the bad apples from obtaining guns without keeping them from law-abiding, responsible people. Background checks for every gun purchase is a good example.

I have owned a rifle since I was 6 years old. In the 40 years since my 6th birthday I have bought several more rifles, shotguns and handguns. I have fired countless rounds of ammunition on the rifle, pistol and skeet ranges at various venues. In the past 40 years I have never once pointed a weapon at another person. I have never once fired a weapon accidentally. I have never injured myself or another with a weapon.

I have a concealed carry permit and my fingerprints are on file with the state. So Sorry but there is no reason that I should not be able to buy any gun I want whenever I want.

Granted I most likely won't be buying more weapons but if I want to it really is none of your business.

And if you can pass a background check, then no one should stand in your way. It occurs to me that if EVERY gun owner could tout your record, this wouldn't even be under discussion. But they can't - so there is no problem weeding out the bad apples with universal background checks.

My second layer would be to hold gun owners liable is they've been grossly neglegent in securing their firearm and it winds up being used in a crime.

 

[Skull Pilot]

We don't really know what kind of person you are.

But, we can take steps to help prevent the bad apples from obtaining guns without keeping them from law-abiding, responsible people. Background checks for every gun purchase is a good example.

I have owned a rifle since I was 6 years old. In the 40 years since my 6th birthday I have bought several more rifles, shotguns and handguns. I have fired countless rounds of ammunition on the rifle, pistol and skeet ranges at various venues. In the past 40 years I have never once pointed a weapon at another person. I have never once fired a weapon accidentally. I have never injured myself or another with a weapon.

I have a concealed carry permit and my fingerprints are on file with the state. So Sorry but there is no reason that I should not be able to buy any gun I want whenever I want.

Granted I most likely won't be buying more weapons but if I want to it really is none of your business.

And if you can pass a background check, then no one should stand in your way. It occurs to me that if EVERY gun owner could tout your record, this wouldn't even be under discussion. But they can't - so there is no problem weeding out the bad apples with universal background checks.

My second layer would be to hold gun owners liable is they've been grossly neglegent in securing their firearm and it winds up being used in a crime.

I have already passed an extensive check in order to get my concealed carry permit.

 

[Sallow]

The US stats aren't accurate.

Well, let's see your stats, so we can determine the rate per 100K in a population of 312,780,968.

That's the point, man.

The NRA blocked the government from getting accurate stats on gun deaths.