Global Warming Liars

[surada]

context su! context!

Read up on the sugar beet lobby. The Soviets saved Cuba by buying up their whole sugar crop.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

Read up on the sugar beet lobby. The Soviets saved Cuba by buying up their whole sugar crop.

proving that marxist/communist cuba needs to be propped up to survive...it was once a beautiful thriving capitalist paradise, it is now a coummnist patch of dirt....

...and as for the Soviet Union, well even cuba out lasted them.

 

[surada]

proving that marxist/communist cuba needs to be propped up to survive...it was once a beautiful thriving capitalist paradise, it is now a coummnist patch of dirt....

...and as for the Soviet Union, well even cuba out lasted them.

The US bought their sugar cane until the sugar beet lobby stopped that. Were you 3 years old?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Again, you disingenuously fail to acknowledge the influence and power the American empire has over the world's economy, including trade. The Cuban government or any Cuban company or citizen living in Cuba is unable to open bank accounts with any bank outside of the Island, hence can't open lines of credit. Any company in the world that does business in Cuba, can't do business with the US. Any merchant ship that docks in a Cuban port, can't dock in any American port in the United States mainland, or in any of its territories for at least six months.

Ship & Container Tracking - VesselFinder

VesselFinder is a FREE AIS vessel tracking web site. VesselFinder displays real time ship positions and marine traffic detected by global AIS network.

www.vesselfinder.com

779

home.treasury.gov

Any product that has 10% or more American-made, owned or patented parts, can not be sold to Cuba from any country. If any country or company sells such products to Cuba, it can't trade with the United States and may be sanctioned itself. There is also a long list of raw materials that Cuba can't purchase, and any ship found with those materials heading to a Cuban port will be barred from the US indefinitely and even seized by US authorities. Venezuela has already had more than one of its oil tankers prevented from docking in Cuba by the US Navy. The United States through Guantanamo has its navy monitoring all Cuban ports and identifying the merchant ship traffic around Cuba, not to speak of the fact that every one of these ships is registered into a GPS tracking network controlled by the United States. You can't run a shipping company without your fleet being registered.

There is also the problem of the United States freezing assets of sanctioned countries. Cuba, Venezuela, and Afghanistan, all of these sanctioned countries have billions of dollars of their gold, cash, and resources frozen by the United States empire, in banks around the world. Venezuela has nine billion dollars in gold frozen in London. Afghanistan has 7 billion dollars frozen in Western European banks. Cuba just lost 250 million dollars in one of the US government's latest asset-seizure campaigns. Cuba is an Island in the shadow of a capitalist empire that won't allow it to adopt socialism, out of fear that if it succeeds, the American working class will start getting some "bad ideas" about socialism and try to establish it here in the United States. The American ruling class, hates socialism and makes sure that every nation that identifies as having a Marxist, socialist economy and government, is severly punished, financially and otherwise.

US politicians also threaten Cuba with war. In the latest CIA orchestrated protests in Cuba, about a year ago, Senator Rubio and others were threatening to invade Cuba. So Cuba has to deal with the economic impact of the sanctions plus a possible invasion by the US. It's essentially a nation under siege by the United States empire. HELLO? Wake up.

Again, you disingenuously fail to acknowledge the influence and power the American empire has over the world's economy, including trade.

More power than the Soviet Union? Weird.

The Cuban government or any Cuban company or citizen living in Cuba is unable to open bank accounts with any bank outside of the Island, hence can't open lines of credit.

I know. Commies don't like their citizens to have the ability to move money out of the country.

There is also a long list of raw materials that Cuba can't purchase, and any ship found with those materials heading to a Cuban port will be barred from the US indefinitely

That's awful! Cuba should do the same to ships heading to US ports.
Stick it to those greedy kulaks, eh comrade?

It's essentially a nation under siege by the United States empire.

So much for historical inevitability.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

This is another one of those silly arguments. You need to think before you adopt a line of argumentation because that same argument may be used against you. Don't you realize that? Cuba is sanctioned, and under seige by the United States yet there are nations with capitalist economies that are not sanctioned or under siege by the US and yet are in worse condition than Cuba...

View attachment 687880
CAPITALIST HAITI

View attachment 687881
CAPITALIST HAITI

View attachment 687883
Haitians trying to escape from Capitalist run and exploited Haiti.



View attachment 687891
CAPITALIST UGANDA

​

You need to ask yourself "can the argument that I am about to post, be used against me?".....You need to ask those types of questions. Can your opponent turn the table and use the same, exact line of argumentation, against you? This is a classical debate principle taught in schools that have debate clubs. Basic stuff. Think before you post.

​

Haitians trying to escape from Capitalist run and exploited Haiti.

The Cuban government should let them in. Teach them the wonders of communism.
I hear the streets in Cuba are paved with gold.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

The US bought their sugar cane until the sugar beet lobby stopped that. Were you 3 years old?

Is there a point of any kind to this su? so what? there was a time we did all kinds of business with cuba. your posts seem to just go from pillar to post as though they're/you're looking for an escape hatch.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The Cuban people need to be freed from US bullying and sanctions.

Awwwww.....poor commies, everybody is always picking on them.
Then they go home and use their jackboots to kick the Cuban people.

 

[surada]

Is there a point of any kind to this su? so what? there was a time we did all kinds of business with cuba. your posts seem to just go from pillar to post as though they're looking for an escape hatch.

Esso had a refinery there. Cuba had the very rich minority and the very poor majority. Remember Castro asked for help from the US.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Lol that's idiotic. Democrats don't want a Cuban style government. Is that the crap you're pushing? We drove Cuba into the arms of the Soviets. How old are you?

How'd that work out for Cuba? Are they a shining beacon for Commies worldwide?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Cuba had the very rich minority

But enough about the nomenklatura.

 

[surada]

But enough about the nomenklatura.

Castro and the Cold War | American Experience | PBS

For four decades, Castro stood at the center of a dangerous game for political pre-eminence in the Third World.

www.pbs.org

 

[Frankeneinstein]

Esso had a refinery there. Cuba had the very rich minority and the very poor majority.

and now the rich are no more

Remember Castro asked for help from the US.

yes, I have read several biographies on Castro and his animal husbandry "degree", Castro was ignored because he took power by force without regard for American interests on the Island, the favor is being returned in spades.

If castro had been anything but communist the liberals in this country would have treated him like Pinochet...or Nixon

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Castro and the Cold War | American Experience | PBS

For four decades, Castro stood at the center of a dangerous game for political pre-eminence in the Third World.

www.pbs.org

Cuba had the very rich minority and the very poor majority.

Thank goodness Castro fixed that problem. What did Cuba have after the Revolution?

 

[ChemEngineer]

How many immigrants are making their way to Cuba?
How many to the *awful* United States that Leftists hate so much but will not leave, to go to Cuba, or North Korea?

Now back to global warming liars. They have reached a new low.
http://JustStopOil.org

Noam Chomsky says of crude oil and natural gas, "What we face is the greatest imposition of suffering and injustice in the history of humanity."

My suffering and inhumanity consisted of flying to Europe for many vacations, taking my five sisters in law and wife to Europe, flying to Hawaii and taking my inlaws, Mother and sisters in law, driving to Mammoth to snow ski, being pulled behind my ski boat on a slalom, riding a 120 foot fishing boat out 200 miles to catch large tuna and yellowtail, wahoo and dorado, go scuba diving, ride a 490 YZ Yamaha across the desert at 110 MPH, and drive to relatives' and friends' homes and entertainment venues my entire, busy life.

Oh the suffering. Oh the injustice. That oil needs to remain underground, foever..... why?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

It's been over 50 years. Why do you care what kind of government they have?

 

[Red Front]

Again, you disingenuously fail to acknowledge the influence and power the American empire has over the world's economy, including trade.

More power than the Soviet Union? Weird.

The Cuban government or any Cuban company or citizen living in Cuba is unable to open bank accounts with any bank outside of the Island, hence can't open lines of credit.

I know. Commies don't like their citizens to have the ability to move money out of the country.

There is also a long list of raw materials that Cuba can't purchase, and any ship found with those materials heading to a Cuban port will be barred from the US indefinitely

That's awful! Cuba should do the same to ships heading to US ports.
Stick it to those greedy kulaks, eh comrade?

It's essentially a nation under siege by the United States empire.

So much for historical inevitability.

The kings and nobles had more power than the merchant-republicans for centuries before the merchant defenders of republics and capitalism became wealthy industrialists, acquiring more power and wealth than monarchs and feudal lords. Were the merchant republicans doomed to an inferior position forever? No. Todd your line of reasoning and arguments can very easily be turned against your own position.

There are Cuban privately owned companies and entrepreneurs, who are barred from using the international banking system, not by the Cuban socialist government but by US sanctions. The international banking cartel doesn't want to risk offending the American empire and hence avoids Cuba like avoiding a lepper.

The US is an empire with 325 million people and the largest economy in the world. It's the primary world hegemon and consumer, with 700+ military bases and installations around the world. How would Cuba, an Island nation with ten million people, with a tiny navy, prevent the US from importing raw materials? It's the US that is blocking the Island of Cuba from importing the raw materials that it needs to develop its infrastructure. You don't have much of an argument against socialism in Cuba when the US is doing everything possible to undermine Cuba's economy and ability to develop.

Can you further elaborate on what you mean by "historical inevitability"?

Usually I ignore people who behave like you but for the sake of others I will respond to your dishonest, silly troll like comments and arguments.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The kings and nobles had more power than the merchant-republicans for centuries before the merchant defenders of republics and capitalism became wealthy industrialists, acquiring more power and wealth than monarchs and feudal lords. Were the merchant republicans doomed to an inferior position forever? No. Todd your line of reasoning and arguments can very easily be turned against your own position.

There are Cuban privately owned companies and entrepreneurs, who are barred from using the international banking system, not by the Cuban socialist government but by US sanctions. The international banking cartel doesn't want to risk offending the American empire and hence avoids Cuba like avoiding a lepper.

The US is an empire with 325 million people and the largest economy in the world. It's the primary world hegemon and consumer, with 700+ military bases and installations around the world. How would Cuba, an Island nation with ten million people, and a tiny navy, prevent the US from importing raw materials? It's the US that is blocking the Island of Cuba from importing the raw materials that it needs to develop its infrastructure. You don't have much of an argument against socialism in Cuba when the US is doing everything possible to undermine Cuba's economy and ability to develop.

Can you further elaborate on what you mean by "historical inevitability"?

Usually I ignore people who behave like you but for the sake of others I will respond to your dishonest, silly troll like comments and arguments.

There are Cuban privately owned companies and entrepreneurs, who are barred from using the international banking system, not by the Cuban socialist government but by US sanctions.

That sounds awesome!

You have a list?

How would Cuba, an Island nation with ten million people, and a tiny navy, prevent the US from importing raw materials?

You think we prevent Cuba from importing raw materials? Which ones? How do we stop them?

You don't have much of an argument against socialism in Cuba

Enslaving their people. Stopping them from leaving. Do I need more?

Can you further elaborate on what you mean by "historical inevitability"?

Didn't Marx say communism was going to defeat capitalism? It couldn't be stopped?
Has that changed recently?

 

[Red Front]

There are Cuban privately owned companies and entrepreneurs, who are barred from using the international banking system, not by the Cuban socialist government but by US sanctions.

That sounds awesome!

You have a list?

How would Cuba, an Island nation with ten million people, and a tiny navy, prevent the US from importing raw materials?

You think we prevent Cuba from importing raw materials? Which ones? How do we stop them?

You don't have much of an argument against socialism in Cuba

Enslaving their people. Stopping them from leaving. Do I need more?

Can you further elaborate on what you mean by "historical inevitability"?

Didn't Marx say communism was going to defeat capitalism? It couldn't be stopped?
Has that changed recently?

A few private Cuban companies:

List of companies of Cuba - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Companies and countries often don't sell materials and spare parts, to Cuba out of fear of being barred from doing business with the US (not just selling to the US market but buying from the US as well). Shipping companies also risk losing millions of dollars by being refused to port in Cuba, which happens quite often, not to speak of the fact that they're prohibited from docking at any American port for at least six months when they dock in Cuba. What company or nation wants to have its merchant fleet prohibited from docking in the US, the nation with the largest economy in the world and prime consumer?

Again your last comment is absurd. You keep falling into the same flawed reasoning, asserting that an economic or political system has to replace its predecessor overnight or within a certain arbitrarily set period of time in order to be considered a viable and successful successor or alternative. It must also do it without committing any mistakes or suffering any defeats. Advancing this idea is just silly, because it can be used against capitalism. As I mentioned in my previous post and in many others before that, capitalism didn't replace chattel slavery and feudalism overnight, in one decisive, victorias revolution or battle. The power and wealth of monarchs and feudal lords wasn't replaced with the money and power of capitalist industrialists in a few years, it took centuries for them to rise to prominence. Why do you apply different standards of success to socialism than you do to capitalism? Why do you continue resorting to these misleading, irrational arguments?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

A few private Cuban companies:

List of companies of Cuba - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Companies and countries often don't sell materials and spare parts, to Cuba out of fear of being barred from doing business with the US (not just selling to the US market but buying from the US as well). Shipping companies also risk losing millions of dollars by being refused to port in Cuba, which happens quite often, not to speak of the fact that they're prohibited from docking at any American port for at least six months when they dock in Cuba. What company or nation wants to have its merchant fleet prohibited from docking in the US, the nation with the largest economy in the world and prime consumer?

Again your last comment is absurd. You keep falling into the same flawed reasoning, asserting that an economic or political system has to replace its predecessor overnight or within a certain arbitrarily set period of time in order to be considered a viable and successful successor or alternative. It must also do it without committing any mistakes or suffering any defeats. Advancing this idea is just silly, because it can be used against capitalism. As I mentioned in my previous post and in many others before that, capitalism didn't replace chattel slavery and feudalism overnight, in one decisive, victorias revolution or battle. The power and wealth of monarchs and feudal lords wasn't replaced with the money and power of capitalist industrialists in a few years, it took centuries for them to rise to prominence. Why do you apply different standards of success to socialism than you do to capitalism? Why do you continue resorting to these horrible, irrational arguments?

A few private Cuban companies:

Two is very few.

Companies and countries often don't sell materials and spare parts, to Cuba out of fear of being barred from doing business with the US (not just selling to the US market but buying from the US as well)

Really? We have a law against other countries trading with Cuba? Link?

Again your last comment is absurd. You keep falling into the same flawed reasoning, asserting that an economic or political system has to replace its predecessor overnight or within a certain arbitrarily set period of time

Well, you guys were feeling pretty confident 100 years ago.
You stopped advancing while Reagan was president and then you started going backward.
So when is it gonna happen?

Why do you apply different standards of success to socialism than you do to capitalism?

Socialism? What happened to communism?

Why do you continue resorting to these horrible, irrational arguments?

Communism is irrational, what sort of arguments should I use?

 

[mamooth]

What we learn from this thread is that denialism and bitter-kook-loser-right-wing-fringe extremism are the same thing. You don't get one without the other.

Denialism is entirely political. Deniers literally care nothing about the science. They say whatever their political cult tells them to say, whatever the topic is. If right wing politics vanished, denialism would instantly vanish along with it.

In contrast, if left-wing politics vanished, climate science wouldn't change a bit. That's because it's actual science, and not political dogma.