CDZ gun magazine bullet limits...they only effect law abiding gun owners so why do we need them.

[2aguy]

Their criminals don't commit murder as often as our criminals do...regardless of weapon......and yet they have easy access to guns..........our non gun murder rate is higher than their entire murder rate......

It is the criminal culture and their willingness to commit murder that is different...our criminals shoot and murder 9 year old boys in alleys to get revenge on the boys gang banger father......theirs don't do that......

You believe that the mere precense of guns creates gun murder....and that is where you are wrong.......

We had 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s......we now have 357,000,000 guns in private hands...and our gun murder rate went down........our gun crime rate went down....our violent crime rate went down......adding guns did not increase gun crime...you are wrong.

Britain confiscated guns from law abiding gun owners...and their gun crime rate stayed the same......

Guns do not create murder.....social factors that create the criminal sub culture and their attitude toward murder do.......

I don't see a French gun murder rate ANYWHERE in this tripe. Are you afraid to answer?

so a gun murder is somehow worse than a knife murder?

Murder is murder

Our murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950

The UK's murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950 and the UK passed extremely strict gun laws in 1968

So tell me why isn't the murder rate in the UK less that what it was in 1950 and why isn't ours astronomically higher than it was in 1950?

Link me to a comparison between UK's gun death rate in 1968 and UK's gun death rate now. Not murder rate, gun death rate. Please.

It doesn't matter.

You people say more guns equal more murder I have shown you that it doesn't

To a certain degree, it does.

Does one more gun equal one more murder? Not necessarily. But 300 million guns certainly means more murders than 300 guns.

Actual facts show you are wrong......more people have more guns.....and our gun murder rate went down.......from 1990s to 2016...by almost 50%... You are wrong.......

 

[alang1216]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

If you actually look at the numbers you would see that outside of just 6 or so large cities our murder rate is not very different than other countries.

Our numbers are skewed by high levels of crime in urban just a few urban areas some of which have the strictest gun laws in the country

The reason for our higher murder rate is not merely gun ownership. It is due to social, demographic, economic, and a host of other problems with guns being quite low on the list

 

[OldLady]

Okay. Prove it. What's the gun death rate in France as compared to the U.S.?

Their criminals don't commit murder as often as our criminals do...regardless of weapon......and yet they have easy access to guns..........our non gun murder rate is higher than their entire murder rate......

It is the criminal culture and their willingness to commit murder that is different...our criminals shoot and murder 9 year old boys in alleys to get revenge on the boys gang banger father......theirs don't do that......

You believe that the mere precense of guns creates gun murder....and that is where you are wrong.......

We had 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s......we now have 357,000,000 guns in private hands...and our gun murder rate went down........our gun crime rate went down....our violent crime rate went down......adding guns did not increase gun crime...you are wrong.

Britain confiscated guns from law abiding gun owners...and their gun crime rate stayed the same......

Guns do not create murder.....social factors that create the criminal sub culture and their attitude toward murder do.......

I don't see a French gun murder rate ANYWHERE in this tripe. Are you afraid to answer?

so a gun murder is somehow worse than a knife murder?

Murder is murder

Our murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950

The UK's murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950 and the UK passed extremely strict gun laws in 1968

So tell me why isn't the murder rate in the UK less that what it was in 1950 and why isn't ours astronomically higher than it was in 1950?

Link me to a comparison between UK's gun death rate in 1968 and UK's gun death rate now. Not murder rate, gun death rate. Please.

It doesn't matter.

You people say more guns equal more murder I have shown you that it doesn't

Not by comparing murder rates in the UK in 1950 and now when the gun control laws were passed in 1968, it doesn't.
I'm not holding my breath. You won't because the numbers won't look good for your argument, I'm guessing.

 

[OldLady]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

If you actually look at the numbers you would see that outside of just 6 or so large cities our murder rate is not very different than other countries.

Our numbers are skewed by high levels of crime in urban just a few urban areas some of which have the strictest gun laws in the country

The reason for our higher murder rate is not merely gun ownership. It is due to social, demographic, economic, and a host of other problems with guns being quite low on the list

Those people in those urban areas matter, too. Without the guns, they would go back to knives, which require being within hitting distance, and a drive by knifing is much harder to accomplish and probably many innocent folk on the sidewalk or sitting in their living room wouldn't be hit. We need to get the guns out of the inner cities and more laws won't hinder that. The FBI also needs to get moving.

 

[Hiryuu]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

I mean we don't know who you are, and have no obligation to make you feel comfortable about anything. You are the one running around scared the boogeyman is in every shadow, so perhaps you need to deal with your personal issues before you subjugate us to your foolishness.

 

[GaryDog]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

I mean we don't know who you are, and have no obligation to make you feel comfortable about anything. You are the one running around scared the boogeyman is in every shadow, so perhaps you need to deal with your personal issues before you subjugate us to your foolishness.

Jesus, what relationship did your reply bear to his post? That was bizarre. Dude made extremely valid points.

 

[GaryDog]

I don't see a French gun murder rate ANYWHERE in this tripe. Are you afraid to answer?

so a gun murder is somehow worse than a knife murder?

Murder is murder

Our murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950

The UK's murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950 and the UK passed extremely strict gun laws in 1968

So tell me why isn't the murder rate in the UK less that what it was in 1950 and why isn't ours astronomically higher than it was in 1950?

Link me to a comparison between UK's gun death rate in 1968 and UK's gun death rate now. Not murder rate, gun death rate. Please.

It doesn't matter.

You people say more guns equal more murder I have shown you that it doesn't

To a certain degree, it does.

Does one more gun equal one more murder? Not necessarily. But 300 million guns certainly means more murders than 300 guns.

Actual facts show you are wrong......more people have more guns.....and our gun murder rate went down.......from 1990s to 2016...by almost 50%... You are wrong.......

We all know you're being intellectually dishonest with your cherry-picking of stats. We're all talking gun murders, not just murders.

 

[Hiryuu]

Jesus, what relationship did your reply bear to his post? That was bizarre. Dude made extremely valid points.

Probably the part where the poster suggested it would be nice if we made them feel more comfortable with our owning a firearm. They are only valid points if you assume everyone has to prove to you they are worthy to your satisfaction, when I really don't remember that being a requirement.

We are innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around. It is already against the law for convicted criminals and crazy people to own firearms. If you have a problem with the inability of the government to properly enforce the laws they already have in place, then that would not be a glowing recommendation towards the idea we should give them any more power to screw up with.

But alas, since you didn't grasp the meaning and implications in the post you responded to, or the post I was responding to, perhaps it is just better you don't dig your hole any deeper.

 

[GaryDog]

Jesus, what relationship did your reply bear to his post? That was bizarre. Dude made extremely valid points.

Probably the part where the poster suggested it would be nice if we made them feel more comfortable with our owning a firearm. They are only valid points if you assume everyone has to prove to you they are worthy to your satisfaction, when I really don't remember that being a requirement.

We are innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around. It is already against the law for convicted criminals and crazy people to own firearms. If you have a problem with the inability of the government to properly enforce the laws they already have in place, then that would not be a glowing recommendation towards the idea we should give them any more power to screw up with.

But alas, since you didn't grasp the meaning and implications in the post you responded to, or the post I was responding to, perhaps it is just better you don't dig your hole any deeper.

Being "innocent" doesn't absolve you from the duty of citizenship, including being subjected to background checks if you want certain privileges. No one knows you're a "good guy". All we know is you want to own a device capable of causing instant death for a room full of people. And you don't think that should carry some responsibilities? You have to be a nutjob to believe that.

I didn't see the word "comfortable" in his post at all. I don't think you're reading.

 

[Hiryuu]

Being "innocent" doesn't absolve you from the duty of citizenship, including being subjected to background checks if you want certain privileges. No one knows you're a "good guy". All we know is you want to own a device capable of causing instant death for a room full of people. And you don't think that should carry some responsibilities? You have to be a nutjob to believe that.

I didn't see the word "comfortable" in his post at all. I don't think you're reading.

A right isn't a privilege, we are subject to background checks. It isn't my problem you are paranoid, because the existing law doesn't require me to nurture your foolishness. It does carry some responsibility, and you don't get to decide we are irresponsible because of your mental issues and insecurities.

 

[GaryDog]

Being "innocent" doesn't absolve you from the duty of citizenship, including being subjected to background checks if you want certain privileges. No one knows you're a "good guy". All we know is you want to own a device capable of causing instant death for a room full of people. And you don't think that should carry some responsibilities? You have to be a nutjob to believe that.

I didn't see the word "comfortable" in his post at all. I don't think you're reading.

A right isn't a privilege, we are subject to background checks. It isn't my problem you are paranoid, because the existing law doesn't require me to nurture your foolishness. It does carry some responsibility, and you don't get to decide we are irresponsible because of your mental issues and insecurities.

Of course it's a privilege. And the background checks aren't universal. I'm not deciding you're irresponsible. Just because you need a test to get a driver's license doesn't meant the DMV is personally attacking you. Do you struggle at checkout lines because they want ID?

 

[Hiryuu]

Of course it's a privilege. And the background checks aren't universal. I'm not deciding you're irresponsible. Just because you need a test to get a driver's license doesn't meant the DMV is personally attacking you. Do you struggle at checkout lines because they want ID?

Driving is a privilege, and not a right. Dang, you really don't know jack about the law do you?

 

[GaryDog]

Of course it's a privilege. And the background checks aren't universal. I'm not deciding you're irresponsible. Just because you need a test to get a driver's license doesn't meant the DMV is personally attacking you. Do you struggle at checkout lines because they want ID?

Driving is a privilege, and not a right. Dang, you really don't know jack about the law do you?

They're startlingly similar in their requirements for you to exercise "privilege" and a "right", aren't they?

Care to revise?

 

[Hiryuu]

They're startlingly similar in their requirements for you to exercise "privilege" and a "right", aren't they?

Care to revise?

Of course I don't care to revise because you are dead wrong.
They are not only different, they are defined as being different in the law. The right to bear arms is a protected right in the Constitution, and the ability to drive is a privilege granted by the state where you acquire a driver's license.

Do you care to double down on stupid ... Again?

 

[GaryDog]

They're startlingly similar in their requirements for you to exercise "privilege" and a "right", aren't they?

Care to revise?

Of course I don't care to revise because you are dead wrong.
They are not only different, they are defined as being different in the law. The right to bear arms is a protected right in the Constitution, and the ability to drive is a privilege granted by the state where you acquire a driver's license.

Do you care to double down on stupid ... Again?

I realize what the law says. Better than you, I'm sure. But in terms of practicality, there's little difference in terms of the rigor of what they require. You have to pass a background check, take a class, and get certified to have a CWP in most states.

So how is that possible if ***GASP!!!***** It's a "right"?!

It's because we recognize that this "right" is rightfully subject to many restrictions and rules, regardless of how unchecked a dumb redneck somewhere thinks it should be.

 

[Hiryuu]

I realize what the law says. Better than you, I'm sure. But in terms of practicality, there's little difference in terms of the rigor of what they require. You have to pass a background check, take a class, and get certified to have a CWP in most states.

So how is that possible if ***GASP!!!***** It's a "right"?!

It's because we recognize that this "right" is rightfully subject to many restrictions and rules, regardless of how unchecked a dumb redneck somewhere thinks it should be.

You obviously don't understand the difference, and your continued argument still doesn't make it so. They don't even originate from the same source, and are two entirely difference things. It doesn't matter how much you want to say they are the same or alike, but they aren't and don't carry the same weight, responsibilities or authority. The only problem with your last statement above, is the "we" you attempt to give any authority in the matter does no exist in that capacity. "You" don't grant us rights.

There is no need to argue with you though, at least not until you bring yourself up to speed with the facts of the matter.

 

[2aguy]

so a gun murder is somehow worse than a knife murder?

Murder is murder

Our murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950

The UK's murder rate is almost exactly what it was in 1950 and the UK passed extremely strict gun laws in 1968

So tell me why isn't the murder rate in the UK less that what it was in 1950 and why isn't ours astronomically higher than it was in 1950?

Link me to a comparison between UK's gun death rate in 1968 and UK's gun death rate now. Not murder rate, gun death rate. Please.

It doesn't matter.

You people say more guns equal more murder I have shown you that it doesn't

To a certain degree, it does.

Does one more gun equal one more murder? Not necessarily. But 300 million guns certainly means more murders than 300 guns.

Actual facts show you are wrong......more people have more guns.....and our gun murder rate went down.......from 1990s to 2016...by almost 50%... You are wrong.......

We all know you're being intellectually dishonest with your cherry-picking of stats. We're all talking gun murders, not just murders.

Wrong.......we use only gun murders...but all murders are down........gun murders have come down according to the FBI table 8 on homicides..............

 

[2aguy]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

Wrong....Mexico and Russia are far higher........and they have absolute gun control there......

We have 357,000,000 guns in private hands.....and in 2014, 8,124 gun murders, 90% of which were committed by criminals legally barred from buying, owning or carrying guns......and they commit their murder in very tiny areas of our inner cities...the rest of the country has a lower murder rate than Europe.......

Americans use guns 1,500,000 times a year to stop violent criminal attack and to save lives, many times stopping mass shooters.......

So take guns away....and you have 1,500,000 more victims.....

 

[2aguy]

Wrong. You hate guns.....so your beliefs about guns will not be swayed by evidence....

200 million guns in private hands in 1990s.....357,000,000 guns in private hands in 2016 and our gun murder rate dropped almost 50%... That is the truth....but you don't care.

Guns are just inanimate objects to me, I neither love them or hate them. I can appreciate people enjoy shooting them, I certainly do. I can also appreciate some people feel safer with a gun in their possession. I don't and I think the statistics will back me up but I don't want your gun, I just want to know you're a good guy. That doesn't seem like too big a thing to ask.

What would the murder rate have been if there had been no guns in private hands? Here are some other facts. The United States has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world — by far. And it has the highest rate of homicides among advanced countries.

If you actually look at the numbers you would see that outside of just 6 or so large cities our murder rate is not very different than other countries.

Our numbers are skewed by high levels of crime in urban just a few urban areas some of which have the strictest gun laws in the country

The reason for our higher murder rate is not merely gun ownership. It is due to social, demographic, economic, and a host of other problems with guns being quite low on the list

Those people in those urban areas matter, too. Without the guns, they would go back to knives, which require being within hitting distance, and a drive by knifing is much harder to accomplish and probably many innocent folk on the sidewalk or sitting in their living room wouldn't be hit. We need to get the guns out of the inner cities and more laws won't hinder that. The FBI also needs to get moving.

Wrong......the criminals in France and Britain get guns and they are outlawed there........Gun crime in Britain went up 4% last year and did not go down after they banned guns...

You are wrong.....have always been wrong.........

The problem we have is that gun laws are not being enforced.....felons, with multiple....I repeat....multiple illegal gun possession charges...are being released by prosecutors and judges...knowing that these guys are the shooters killing people.......that is what needs to be addressed, not law abiding gun owners.....