Here is what I want to know from Democrats at USMB....

[leftwinger]

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

yeah those late 70's early 80's cars were a real treat out of the UAW etc.

 

[Papageorgio]

This would be the same Reagan who quadrupled the national debt after cutting taxes for the rich and shifting the burden on the poor?

LMFAO... So now, just in this thread alone, Reagan has gone from tripling to quadrupling the debt! And not a BIT of that is the fault of spend-happy Democrats who never met a spending bill they didn't like and never filled every bill with as much pork as they could cram in it.

Then Clinton made the rich pay their fair share again, and lo and behold, we had balanced budgets.

And that glorious "surplus" that never existed but is often claimed... which was actually created with smoke and mirrors by including the Social Security trust fund in the general budget,

By the way.... the RICH don't pay taxes... you mean the highest income earners... and for the record, they are currently paying more than they paid under Clinton.

It's always fun to watch them exaggerate on every post. They have to lie, they have nothing else.

 

[rightwinger]

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

yeah those late 70's early 80's cars were a real treat out of the UAW etc.

Cars in the 70s and 80s were not designed by unions

They were designed by executives looking for a quick profit off an inferior product.

 

[Papageorgio]

What do you mean "let's?"

The only people that can get themselves higher wages are themselves. Government can't do everything for you. Everybody should be paying into income tax regardless of their income.

You are right

Workers need to start demanding more of the wealth they are creating.

Workers don't create wealth, they create work.

Wealth is created by capital whereas one invests their money to create more money.

Investors move money from one point to another

It is the worker actually creating the wealth. With strong unions, they used to demand a bigger share. Today, they barely get enough to survive on without government subsidy

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Oh for the good ole days

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

But conservatives put them in their place. The workforce became pliable. Temporary workers were ready to take your place with lower wages and no benefits

When assembly lines, hotel workers, casino workers increased the demand for union workers grew. As skill positions, such as computer programming, high tech communications grew, the skilled workers wrote their own tickets and don't need unions. So as the lesser skilled workers are not in high demand, the demand for unions has fell. Also as organized crime had less influence on the unions the tougher it was to keep the unions in tact.

I thought workers voted unions in and out.

 

[rightwinger]

You are right

Workers need to start demanding more of the wealth they are creating.

Workers don't create wealth, they create work.

Wealth is created by capital whereas one invests their money to create more money.

Investors move money from one point to another

It is the worker actually creating the wealth. With strong unions, they used to demand a bigger share. Today, they barely get enough to survive on without government subsidy

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Oh for the good ole days

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

But conservatives put them in their place. The workforce became pliable. Temporary workers were ready to take your place with lower wages and no benefits

When assembly lines, hotel workers, casino workers increased the demand for union workers grew. As skill positions, such as computer programming, high tech communications grew, the skilled workers wrote their own tickets and don't need unions. So as the lesser skilled workers are not in high demand, the demand for unions has fell. Also as organized crime had less influence on the unions the tougher it was to keep the unions in tact.

I thought workers voted unions in and out.

Another conservative innovation....." Right to work" or right to receive low wages

Screw the unions. Every man for himself. Break collective bargaining and make it every man for himself

 

[JoeB131]

dear, you have learned 65 times now they have tried 30 times to make debt illegal. Get it, illegal!!!!!Do you understand??? Slow???

The sad thing is you actually think you make valid points.

Here's the problem. When the GOP Gets into power, they double and triple the debt.

So the fact they said "Debt bad" like a retard on low blood sugar impresses no one but you, Corky.

 

[JoeB131]

Can you explain to me what "the wealth" is? The wealth of what?

You liberals think that we live in this encapsulated country where there is only so much money, and when one has too much, that's why others have too little.

Yeah, that pretty much covers it.

The wealth is pretty clear- the end result of all labor performed creating goods and services. And when working people can't pay the rent but the Romney's can spend millions of dollars on Dancing Horses, something is pretty fucked up.

The truth of the matter is that money is endless in this country. You can take every last dime from the wealthy and you won't see your paycheck increase by one dollar. The wealth...

If you need more money, don't worry about the rich, worry about yourself. You make yourself worth more money. The rich can't do that for you.

No, but I can keep them from ripping me off at every opportunity by reforming the banking laws, reforming health care and reforming labor laws. That's what I can do. If you want to keep bending over for the wealthy and let them bone you up the ass, that's your business. Just keep clinging to you gun and your bible.

Borrowing money at 0% interest is the smart thing to do. And as far as banks giving credit cards to unworthy borrowers, you libs were all behind giving out loans to risky customers until the housing collapse. It was your party and Barney Frank that said everything was just fine; don't worry about it; we need to put more minorities in their own homes.

Bush said the same thing. The problem wasn't poor people getting houses. It was banks lying about the value of those mortgages and then selling them as investments.

 

[JoeB131]

When assembly lines, hotel workers, casino workers increased the demand for union workers grew. As skill positions, such as computer programming, high tech communications grew, the skilled workers wrote their own tickets and don't need unions. So as the lesser skilled workers are not in high demand, the demand for unions has fell. Also as organized crime had less influence on the unions the tougher it was to keep the unions in tact.

I thought workers voted unions in and out.

Guy, we have airline pilots selling their blood plasma and adjunct professors on food stamps. Please don't give me any horseshit about "getting more skills" is going to make us all richer.

Unions and strong government. THat's how you make the rich cocksuckers behave themselves. Throw a couple of them in big boy prison instead of Club Fed.

 

[JoeB131]

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Someone who blames unions for outsourcing is like a creep who blames a rape victim for wearing a short dress.

Company I just quit after seven years of cheating me at every opportunity.

Not a union company. Most of the assembly line jobs were done by immigrants from Poland, Mexico and India. Most of them women.

And you know what the shitheads who ran the place did? They still found excuses to move production to Malaysia and China and Mexico. NOt because it was that much cheaper, because it wasn't after you factored in the costs of transportation, having to carry extra stock to make up for long lead times, and constantly issuing RMA's because the quality was so shitty.

Outsourcing has always been about breaking the American WOrking class. and dumb ass bitter clingers like you keep letting them do it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Someone who blames unions for outsourcing is like a creep who blames a rape victim for wearing a short dress.

Company I just quit after seven years of cheating me at every opportunity.

Not a union company. Most of the assembly line jobs were done by immigrants from Poland, Mexico and India. Most of them women.

And you know what the shitheads who ran the place did? They still found excuses to move production to Malaysia and China and Mexico. NOt because it was that much cheaper, because it wasn't after you factored in the costs of transportation, having to carry extra stock to make up for long lead times, and constantly issuing RMA's because the quality was so shitty.

Outsourcing has always been about breaking the American WOrking class. and dumb ass bitter clingers like you keep letting them do it.

Oh really, then do tell, how do we stop them Joe? Meet them at the shipping yards and not allow them to hop on the boats?

You liberals blame everybody else except the people that are to blame because most of them are liberals--the consumers.

It's all those Democrats at Walmart's that's causing manufacturers to look for cheaper ways to do things. Quit blaming the rich people, the Republicans, the Chinese. It's the consumer that causes manufacturers to make products as cheaply as possible.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Can you explain to me what "the wealth" is? The wealth of what?

You liberals think that we live in this encapsulated country where there is only so much money, and when one has too much, that's why others have too little.

Yeah, that pretty much covers it.

The wealth is pretty clear- the end result of all labor performed creating goods and services. And when working people can't pay the rent but the Romney's can spend millions of dollars on Dancing Horses, something is pretty fucked up.

The truth of the matter is that money is endless in this country. You can take every last dime from the wealthy and you won't see your paycheck increase by one dollar. The wealth...

If you need more money, don't worry about the rich, worry about yourself. You make yourself worth more money. The rich can't do that for you.

No, but I can keep them from ripping me off at every opportunity by reforming the banking laws, reforming health care and reforming labor laws. That's what I can do. If you want to keep bending over for the wealthy and let them bone you up the ass, that's your business. Just keep clinging to you gun and your bible.

Borrowing money at 0% interest is the smart thing to do. And as far as banks giving credit cards to unworthy borrowers, you libs were all behind giving out loans to risky customers until the housing collapse. It was your party and Barney Frank that said everything was just fine; don't worry about it; we need to put more minorities in their own homes.

Bush said the same thing. The problem wasn't poor people getting houses. It was banks lying about the value of those mortgages and then selling them as investments.

Actually it was both, but it all started with putting Democrat voters in homes of their own. You can't sell bad securities unless you have those bad securities to begin with.

And I thought your big eared leader reformed healthcare. That's what he said he was going to do with Commie Care. Oh gee, I guess like all the other things he said, it was all a lie.

And what labor laws do we need reformed? Like what? Barack Castro had two years to do that; same with the banks.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

dear, you have learned 65 times now they have tried 30 times to make debt illegal. Get it, illegal!!!!!Do you understand??? Slow???

The sad thing is you actually think you make valid points.

Here's the problem. When the GOP Gets into power, they double and triple the debt.

So the fact they said "Debt bad" like a retard on low blood sugar impresses no one but you, Corky.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

yeah those late 70's early 80's cars were a real treat out of the UAW etc.

Cars in the 70s and 80s were not designed by unions

They were designed by executives looking for a quick profit off an inferior product.

No, as my mechanic explained to me (before I switched to Toyota) US manufacturers had to pay so much in labor that they built their cars with cheap parts to offset costs. That's why Toyota can give you a 100,000 mile or seven year bumper-to-bumper warranty and US manufacturers usually only 30,000 miles.

 

[Papageorgio]

Workers don't create wealth, they create work.

Wealth is created by capital whereas one invests their money to create more money.

Investors move money from one point to another

It is the worker actually creating the wealth. With strong unions, they used to demand a bigger share. Today, they barely get enough to survive on without government subsidy

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Oh for the good ole days

When unions looked out for workers. Overtime was plentiful and fairly distributed

But conservatives put them in their place. The workforce became pliable. Temporary workers were ready to take your place with lower wages and no benefits

When assembly lines, hotel workers, casino workers increased the demand for union workers grew. As skill positions, such as computer programming, high tech communications grew, the skilled workers wrote their own tickets and don't need unions. So as the lesser skilled workers are not in high demand, the demand for unions has fell. Also as organized crime had less influence on the unions the tougher it was to keep the unions in tact.

I thought workers voted unions in and out.

Another conservative innovation....." Right to work" or right to receive low wages

Screw the unions. Every man for himself. Break collective bargaining and make it every man for himself

You really think so? If you are skilled labor, the employer is going to pay you more. It is tougher to find people skilled in that area. If you work am assembly line, anyone can do the job, you need a union.

I'm not against unions, I think they have gotten to greedy.

 

[Papageorgio]

No, unions were only a portion of our workforce. The rest worked jobs the same way they do today. Except years ago in the union days, people were too proud to live off of other taxpayers. They had morals. If they needed more money, they simply worked more hours. If their job didn't allow them to work more hours, they got a second job.

Yes, union workers did get a larger share. That's why most of our goods are made in China today.

Someone who blames unions for outsourcing is like a creep who blames a rape victim for wearing a short dress.

Company I just quit after seven years of cheating me at every opportunity.

Not a union company. Most of the assembly line jobs were done by immigrants from Poland, Mexico and India. Most of them women.

And you know what the shitheads who ran the place did? They still found excuses to move production to Malaysia and China and Mexico. NOt because it was that much cheaper, because it wasn't after you factored in the costs of transportation, having to carry extra stock to make up for long lead times, and constantly issuing RMA's because the quality was so shitty.

Outsourcing has always been about breaking the American WOrking class. and dumb ass bitter clingers like you keep letting them do it.

Oh really, then do tell, how do we stop them Joe? Meet them at the shipping yards and not allow them to hop on the boats?

You liberals blame everybody else except the people that are to blame because most of them are liberals--the consumers.

It's all those Democrats at Walmart's that's causing manufacturers to look for cheaper ways to do things. Quit blaming the rich people, the Republicans, the Chinese. It's the consumer that causes manufacturers to make products as cheaply as possible.

8 years and Obama has done nothing to correct anything. Why? Because you can't force cheapskates to buy the more expensive items made by US unionized employees. Most want to buy the cheap imported crap from Mexico or overseas. What is a business supposed to do? Lose money and sell at a loss? Americans need to wake up and blame themselves for the situation they created.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh really, then do tell, how do we stop them Joe? Meet them at the shipping yards and not allow them to hop on the boats?

Oh, here's what I would do.

Let a company that outsource know that they will get absolutely no government contracts.

Let them know they and their officers will be audited by the IRS on a regular basis. When you find that he's been paying his mistress on the payroll, let his wife know.

My personal favorite. When a CEO outsources, PUBLICLY SHAME HIM. Run a commercial with pictures. "This is Bob. Bob moved his factory overseas, putting all these nice Americans out of work. This is where Bob lives. This is Bob's Wife. This is where that bitch gets her hair done. These are Bob's kids. This is where those little douchebags go to college."

The government has all sorts of way to make rich people miserable.

You liberals blame everybody else except the people that are to blame because most of them are liberals--the consumers.

It's all those Democrats at Walmart's that's causing manufacturers to look for cheaper ways to do things. Quit blaming the rich people, the Republicans, the Chinese. It's the consumer that causes manufacturers to make products as cheaply as possible.

Horseshit. Most things we consume are made here. Can't make the food in China.

You see, the one thing I like about Trump is he gets it on fair trade.

 

[JoeB131]

8 years and Obama has done nothing to correct anything. Why? Because you can't force cheapskates to buy the more expensive items made by US unionized employees. Most want to buy the cheap imported crap from Mexico or overseas. What is a business supposed to do? Lose money and sell at a loss? Americans need to wake up and blame themselves for the situation they created.

Again, you probably blame rape victims for dressing like sluts.

 

[JoeB131]

Actually it was both, but it all started with putting Democrat voters in homes of their own. You can't sell bad securities unless you have those bad securities to begin with.

uh, no, guy, it was the banks lying about the value of those mortgages that was the problem. the thing was, it wasn't poor people buying modest houses in the inner city which was the problem. It was Republicans buying McMansions they couldn't afford in the hope of flipping them in five years that caused the collapse.

But you keep taking it up the ass from the rich.

And I thought your big eared leader reformed healthcare. That's what he said he was going to do with Commie Care. Oh gee, I guess like all the other things he said, it was all a lie.

Gee, I honestly hope you never get so sick that an insurance company decides its cheaper to let you die. While it would be Karma, it would still be wrong.

What we should have done was go to single payer like every other country has.

And what labor laws do we need reformed? Like what? Barack Castro had two years to do that; same with the banks.

Well, first, we need a Living Wage Law. we could start there.

 

[MarcATL]

Of course not, you're a Socialist and you believe government should control everything including banks and their practices.

we've seen what happens when the Banks are allowed to do whatever they want. We saw that in 1929, in 1989 and again in 2008. Yes, I really do want the government to regulate the banks, given the fact the rest of us are the ones who end up dealing with them.

Yes, I'm a responsible borrower. I pay my bill every month and in the meantime, I'm using interest free money. This is unlike your clan that throws credit card bills away or avoids paying them. They should be the ones paying the banks--not me. My fair share........

Guy, if you are a responsible borrower, you wouldn't be switching your debt from one card to another every year. I should also point out that if this clan who doesn't pay their bills was so irresponsible in the first place, the banks never should have given them credit cards. So the banks can't screw poor people anymore, and you are whining about it.

"Tell me what is YOUR fair share of what somebody else worked for?"
Thomas Sowell

Oh, look, Uncle Tom is telling you how the other Negroes are so shiftless? Isn't that cute?

Guy, the top 1% has 43% of the wealthy. They did not do 43% of the work to create that wealth.

In your world, THIS woman is a maker....

While this woman is a "taker" who deserves to be screwed by her credit card company.

I'm sorry you can't see how fucked up your thinking is.

Conservatism is a form of Stockholm syndrome.

Amen!

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[MarcATL]

And this is straight up Marxist/Maoist propaganda. You can't match labor production to wealth acquisition because the production is not what generates the wealth. If you want to prove that, go out in your yard with a shovel and start digging a hole. See how long you have to dig before any wealth is realized from your efforts. Wealth is produced through a variety of things happening in conjunction with labor of production.

When the "fair for all" system you dream of has been attempted, what happened was, the people who are the authority, the ruling class, became the wealthiest 1% controlling 43% of the wealth (or more). The "worker" class became peasants who existed at their pleasure. No opportunity to acquire wealth and escape their class, no political voice to affect change. When the people realized they had been duped and protested, they were executed and dumped into mass graves by the millions.

Guy, why don't you take your Bircher Bullshit and go somewhere else with it.

The places that had communism were miserable shitholes before the Communists got there.

Here's the thing. Russians still think pretty highly of Stalin even though not so much about Communism anymore. Chinese still think highly of Mao even though they've traded in their Mao jackets for Blue Suits.

But we aren't talking about Communism. We are talking about what a country looks like when the wealth IS fairly distributed. We had that in this country after WWII, when a large chunk of the workforce was unionized and the rich paid high income taxes like they are supposed to. And we had unparalleled prosperity when that happened.

The Europeans and Japanese STILL do it this way. Which is why they have higher standards of living than we do. And nowhere near the crime rates.

But someone complains about the 1% and you'll whine about what happened in Russia 70 years ago.

You are really one stupid tool, aren't you?

Basically.

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