How Much of a Theist or Atheist are You?

[Foxfyre]

Quote me saying I hate anyone for their religious beliefs. If not you will be known as a low down scumbag lying hypocrite.

I hate the sin not the sinners. I feel sorry for you ignorant fools. And you're holding us back as a species.

Has religion interfered with the advancement of humankind more than it has contributed to it?

the Dark Ages refers to a period of roughly 1,000 years during which the science of the ancient Greek and Roman societies was forgotten, discouraged, and suppressed by medieval Christians. By placing their "holy" book above all else and fighting anything that was not consistent with it, early Christians set back scientific progress approximately 1,000 years.

What is even more troublesome than losing the advances of the ancients to early Christians' war on reality is that there are Christians today working toward similar ends. Recall that opposition to modernism and anti-intellectualism are key components of Christian extremism. The result is that we have a politically influential movement in the United States opposing education, battling science, and working to prevent equality for women, LGBT persons and many other groups.

You know who makes me mad? Nancy Reagan. She was against stem cell until Ronny got Alzheimers. She was against gays before she found out her son was gay. And I'm sure religion played a part in her initial ignorant positions.

If you guys are offended, don't come to a thread like this. You will run into extreme atheists like me.

Being an extreme atheist means you extremely disavow God. It may not mean you're a hater, but it means that you'll likely turn into a Commie. I think atheism is for those people who do not like to think and be rational. Do you find yourself spouting liberal dogma and believe everything they tell you to believe? What's funny is that they claim to be the ones who invented rational thought. The theists are and will be better off.

Some of the current liberal trend is for politics to invade sports and consumerism. The idea is to separate teams and individuals who are liberal vs conservative. The actions are to buy products based on politics. It's silly. Buy what you want or need. It's not Coke vs Pepsi.

That's funny you say that

Why American Sports Are Socialist

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

 

[sealybobo]

Perhaps, but it would also create significant changes in who humans are and how they interact and form societies. I highly doubt that we would be the social creatures we are now.

Agreed except I think we'd be even more sociable. You seem to think such a thing would be bad, while I think it would be the next step in our evolution.

Sometimes religion has united us other times it has divided us. Maybe there was a time when they were useful but now they seem better when kept private. It's one of the 3 things you don't discuss. Politics race and religio

Religion, like politics, is simply a tool which can be used wisely or wrongly.

True. Hey, did you ever see the post where I said you have always responded very professionally, classy and respecfully no matter what an ahole I was? I just wanted to give you props. You seem like a good person.

Remember, this is the only place us atheists preach.

 

[sealybobo]

Being an extreme atheist means you extremely disavow God. It may not mean you're a hater, but it means that you'll likely turn into a Commie. I think atheism is for those people who do not like to think and be rational. Do you find yourself spouting liberal dogma and believe everything they tell you to believe? What's funny is that they claim to be the ones who invented rational thought. The theists are and will be better off.

Some of the current liberal trend is for politics to invade sports and consumerism. The idea is to separate teams and individuals who are liberal vs conservative. The actions are to buy products based on politics. It's silly. Buy what you want or need. It's not Coke vs Pepsi.

That's funny you say that

Why American Sports Are Socialist

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

 

[sealybobo]

The first time I heard of a scale being around was through Richard Dawkins, one of the founders of the New Atheism group. Since I do not have a differing widely known scale, I use his. He's eliminating other beliefs and the like for those whose beliefs lie elsewhere, so I include "Other" in my poll.

1. Strong Theist: I do not question the existence of God, I KNOW he exists.
2. De-facto Theist: I cannot know for certain but I strongly believe in God and I live my life on the assumption that he is there.
3. Weak Theist: I am very uncertain, but I am inclined to believe in God.
4. Pure Agnostic: God’s existence and non-existence are exactly equiprobable.
5. Weak Atheist: I do not know whether God exists but I’m inclined to be skeptical.
6. De-facto Atheist: I cannot know for certain but I think God is very improbable and I live my life under the assumption that he is not there.
7. Strong Atheist: I am 100% sure that there is no God.

If this has been posted before, then please forgive. I did a search and did not find.

I don't even believe your results. Why?

U.S. surveys in recent years have calculated atheists make up between 3 percent and 10 percent of the population. But the percentage may actually be much higher, because the stigma surrounding disbelief in God likely prevents people from honestly answering pollsters’ questions about their beliefs. Study concluded the true number of American atheists may be as high as 26 percent of the population. That's more than 1 in every 4 people.

There are profound social pressures to be — or at least appear — religious.

There is a social stigma surrounding atheism in the U.S., which may lead people to tell pollsters they believe in God even if they don’t. A January Pew asked respondents to rate different groups from 0 to 100. Atheists received a rating of 50, the second-lowest rating for a religious group, after Muslims. Why? What do we do to theists for them to be so negative towards us? I mean besides here. Other than here we are virtually silent. Look at how you treat Steven Hawking, Neal DeGrasse Tyson & Carl Sagan.

 

[Foxfyre]

That's funny you say that

Why American Sports Are Socialist

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

 

[BreezeWood]

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

 

[sealybobo]

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

You have it backward. When we boycott business its because you are intolerant. We force you to behave better.

I want to form a union on the net made up of Walmart, target, meijers, public, CVS, rite aid, Kroger, etc. And this union made up of all these workers anonymously dish on the companies and we shame them into treating employees better and if we have to picket and boycott.

You don't picket your own company. Other members do that so you don't get fired.

Eventually workers will fight back if the wage gap keeps widening

 

[ding]

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

You have it backward. When we boycott business its because you are intolerant. We force you to behave better.

I want to form a union on the net made up of Walmart, target, meijers, public, CVS, rite aid, Kroger, etc. And this union made up of all these workers anonymously dish on the companies and we shame them into treating employees better and if we have to picket and boycott.

You don't picket your own company. Other members do that so you don't get fired.

Eventually workers will fight back if the wage gap keeps widening

Karl? Karl Marx? Is that you?

 

[sealybobo]

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

You have it backward. When we boycott business its because you are intolerant. We force you to behave better.

I want to form a union on the net made up of Walmart, target, meijers, public, CVS, rite aid, Kroger, etc. And this union made up of all these workers anonymously dish on the companies and we shame them into treating employees better and if we have to picket and boycott.

You don't picket your own company. Other members do that so you don't get fired.

Eventually workers will fight back if the wage gap keeps widening

Karl? Karl Marx? Is that you?

Did he argue that workers should make more? I didn't know he was pro union.

 

[james bond]

I think in a very real way atheists are MORE fanatical. I mean, theists evangelize because they were told to do so by God, at least in their eyes, and because they want to save other people from miserable lives on Earth and eternal damnation afterward. What the hell is the overriding motivation for atheists to evangelize? But they do it, frequently with more fervor than I've seen from most religious types.

Great question. First, I want to save people too like my neighbor who killed himself because his Catholic mom told him being gay sends you to hell. I never judged him. As an atheist it's OK to be gay.

Eternal damnation offends me. That's another reason I mock.

Just what do you think will be eternal damnation? The burning 24/7 forever is an old Roman Catholic belief which is probably overblown. What about losing your identity?

Doesn't really matter. The point is, religious people who evangelize do so because they believe there will be eternal negative repercussions to people if they don't. What each theist individually believes those repercussions are going to be is irrelevant to the point.

I can use facts, reasoning and historical truths. Just because something could be material doesn't mean it exists as material. For example, the unicorn, the flying spaghetti monster, aliens, multiverses, traveling back to the past and so on. All of these are fictional and only exist in the imagination. We have atheist scientists who believe in aliens or multiverses without one shred of evidence. They claim we will find some microbe on another planet in ten years. They think life can just happen. It's all based on faith. Faith in evolutionary thinking or what they call "science."

Is this short life of ours all there is? No. The evidence is in the Creator and us. He's just like us. He created this wonderful place called Earth and some take it for granted. There are still places I haven't been to, sights I haven't seen, food I haven't tasted and things I haven't experienced. For almost all of us, the experiences of our lifetimes will be here. There are memories of our experiences. That isn't material. You have to ask yourself why there is so much power in love, the mind, ideas, intuition, certain thoughts and more. We also have an immaterial thing called identity. These aren't material things, but they exist. Another is that we all have a sense of justice. We all have a conscience. A couple more immaterial things, but still very powerful. All of these are evidence of an intelligent Creator and the immaterial exist.

That leads us to... Will there will have to be some sort of final judgment over one's life. Isn't that where religion comes in? Even atheists want some kind of punishment for the wicked. Those that murder. Those that provide false witness. Those that commit arson. Those that cheat the system to reward themselves. Even religions without so-called deity or deities think karma, the rebirth of one's spirit or the supernatural exists. The only religion I can think of without this is atheism (maybe they believe in luck). Why? Because atheism is more political than religious.



The biggest takeaway from this is another immaterial thing called identity. We all have that in this life. It's become more important now as one has to be able to prove one's identity.

Very easy to find the flaws in your logic.

We think there might be life on Europa and there might be multiverse. Key word might. Why do you know there aren't?

More holes in the atheist's logic. I am confident that the atheist scientists are wrong about we'll find microbe alien life within ten years or even twenty years. For one, we haven't found microbes anywhere else besides earth. We have multi-million dollar equipment and equipment to collect samples, but still no evidence. I think George Hanson (in Easy Rider) said that the aliens are here and hiding, but he was known to hit the bottle pretty hard. That was the first time I heard of the idea when I was a kid. The idea of multiverses is silly. Not much common sense there. Also, can we put the racist idea that our ancestors were apes to rest? Not many believe in Lucy anymore except Uncle Degrasse. Why not dolphins? They're the smartest mammals and are from the sea.

I also can tell that the important immaterial things are being ignored by you. What about the 5th dimension? Mathematically, we can show the existence of the 5th dimension. I'm not sure beyond that although people like to think there are. Or the achievement of perfection? Why do we admire perfection so?

 

[Foxfyre]

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

This is the second time you have posted something so non sequitur to what was being discussed that I don't have a clue what you are getting at. I suspect you might not either.

 

[Foxfyre]

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

You have it backward. When we boycott business its because you are intolerant. We force you to behave better.

I want to form a union on the net made up of Walmart, target, meijers, public, CVS, rite aid, Kroger, etc. And this union made up of all these workers anonymously dish on the companies and we shame them into treating employees better and if we have to picket and boycott.

You don't picket your own company. Other members do that so you don't get fired.

Eventually workers will fight back if the wage gap keeps widening

If I speak in defense of traditional marriage, how am I being intolerant in any way?

If you speak in defense of gay marriage, how are you being intolerant in any way?

But if I seek to punish you because of your point of view or to force you to speak differently, I am not punishing your intolerance. I am being intolerant.

If you seek to punish me because of my point of view or to force me to speak differently, you are not punishing my intolerance. You are being intolerant.

 

[sealybobo]

Great question. First, I want to save people too like my neighbor who killed himself because his Catholic mom told him being gay sends you to hell. I never judged him. As an atheist it's OK to be gay.

Eternal damnation offends me. That's another reason I mock.

Just what do you think will be eternal damnation? The burning 24/7 forever is an old Roman Catholic belief which is probably overblown. What about losing your identity?

Doesn't really matter. The point is, religious people who evangelize do so because they believe there will be eternal negative repercussions to people if they don't. What each theist individually believes those repercussions are going to be is irrelevant to the point.

I can use facts, reasoning and historical truths. Just because something could be material doesn't mean it exists as material. For example, the unicorn, the flying spaghetti monster, aliens, multiverses, traveling back to the past and so on. All of these are fictional and only exist in the imagination. We have atheist scientists who believe in aliens or multiverses without one shred of evidence. They claim we will find some microbe on another planet in ten years. They think life can just happen. It's all based on faith. Faith in evolutionary thinking or what they call "science."

Is this short life of ours all there is? No. The evidence is in the Creator and us. He's just like us. He created this wonderful place called Earth and some take it for granted. There are still places I haven't been to, sights I haven't seen, food I haven't tasted and things I haven't experienced. For almost all of us, the experiences of our lifetimes will be here. There are memories of our experiences. That isn't material. You have to ask yourself why there is so much power in love, the mind, ideas, intuition, certain thoughts and more. We also have an immaterial thing called identity. These aren't material things, but they exist. Another is that we all have a sense of justice. We all have a conscience. A couple more immaterial things, but still very powerful. All of these are evidence of an intelligent Creator and the immaterial exist.

That leads us to... Will there will have to be some sort of final judgment over one's life. Isn't that where religion comes in? Even atheists want some kind of punishment for the wicked. Those that murder. Those that provide false witness. Those that commit arson. Those that cheat the system to reward themselves. Even religions without so-called deity or deities think karma, the rebirth of one's spirit or the supernatural exists. The only religion I can think of without this is atheism (maybe they believe in luck). Why? Because atheism is more political than religious.



The biggest takeaway from this is another immaterial thing called identity. We all have that in this life. It's become more important now as one has to be able to prove one's identity.

Very easy to find the flaws in your logic.

We think there might be life on Europa and there might be multiverse. Key word might. Why do you know there aren't?

More holes in the atheist's logic. I am confident that the atheist scientists are wrong about we'll find microbe alien life within ten years or even twenty years. For one, we haven't found microbes anywhere else besides earth. We have multi-million dollar equipment and equipment to collect samples, but still no evidence. I think George Hanson (in Easy Rider) said that the aliens are here and hiding, but he was known to hit the bottle pretty hard. That was the first time I heard of the idea when I was a kid. The idea of multiverses is silly. Not much common sense there. Also, can we put the racist idea that our ancestors were apes to rest? Not many believe in Lucy anymore except Uncle Degrasse. Why not dolphins? They're the smartest mammals and are from the sea.

I also can tell that the important immaterial things are being ignored by you. What about the 5th dimension? Mathematically, we can show the existence of the 5th dimension. I'm not sure beyond that although people like to think there are. Or the achievement of perfection? Why do we admire perfection so?

We are also related to dolphins.

 

[ding]

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

You have it backward. When we boycott business its because you are intolerant. We force you to behave better.

I want to form a union on the net made up of Walmart, target, meijers, public, CVS, rite aid, Kroger, etc. And this union made up of all these workers anonymously dish on the companies and we shame them into treating employees better and if we have to picket and boycott.

You don't picket your own company. Other members do that so you don't get fired.

Eventually workers will fight back if the wage gap keeps widening

Karl? Karl Marx? Is that you?

Did he argue that workers should make more? I didn't know he was pro union.

Yes, he was. He was your kind a guy.

Occupy! Occupy! Occupy! Occupy! Occupy! Occupy! Occupy! Occupy!

 

[BreezeWood]

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

This is the second time you have posted something so non sequitur to what was being discussed that I don't have a clue what you are getting at. I suspect you might not either.

.

This is the second time you have posted something so non sequitur to what was being discussed that I don't have a clue what you are getting at.

How Much of a Theist or Atheist are You?

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

I disagree that you find the response non sequitur to the subject of the thread, whether to respond to the content pertaining to the events of the 1st century from your post is not my concern.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Perhaps, but it would also create significant changes in who humans are and how they interact and form societies. I highly doubt that we would be the social creatures we are now.

Agreed except I think we'd be even more sociable. You seem to think such a thing would be bad, while I think it would be the next step in our evolution.

I can't imagine how you think that knowing intimately the negative aspects of another person's character and psyche would make us more sociable with them. Right now, we have the ability to suppress and censor those things from others and keep them to ourselves and present to others the parts of ourselves that reflect the person we aspire to be, rather than everything about what we are at the moment.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Being an extreme atheist means you extremely disavow God. It may not mean you're a hater, but it means that you'll likely turn into a Commie. I think atheism is for those people who do not like to think and be rational. Do you find yourself spouting liberal dogma and believe everything they tell you to believe? What's funny is that they claim to be the ones who invented rational thought. The theists are and will be better off.

Some of the current liberal trend is for politics to invade sports and consumerism. The idea is to separate teams and individuals who are liberal vs conservative. The actions are to buy products based on politics. It's silly. Buy what you want or need. It's not Coke vs Pepsi.

That's funny you say that

Why American Sports Are Socialist

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

There's a difference between choosing not to do business with someone, and denying them their freedom to act as they choose. I just see it as two separate expressions of the exact same freedom.

My decision to not do business with certain people isn't so much to act on my beliefs and ethics; it's more that their actions have made them sufficiently difficult and unpleasant to do business with that it's not worth it. I also stopped watching Tom Cruise movies years ago, not because of repugnant beliefs so much as that he had been so over-hyped that it became impossible to see him as anyone except "Tom Cruise playing the part of . . ."

Pretty much, my position is that I will be more than happy to be oblivious to people's personal lives and choices if they will just give me the opportunity to do so by not insisting on telling me about it at every turn.

 

[Cecilie1200]

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

Thank God there are at least legal limits on how much you can harass and threaten other people and interfere with their lives. Now if we could only get the authorities to enforce those limits.

 

[Foxfyre]

That's funny you say that

Why American Sports Are Socialist

See what I mean? The liberal masters, i.e. the rich want you to think politics should be in everything including sports and consumerism. I can show you an article between Nike (liberal) vs Under Armour (conservative) because UA's CEO spouted something.

My thinking is ignore all that BS. If you like Nike products and their shoes look good and fit you well, then buy it. Don't buy or not buy products because of political beliefs. Also, people with a business shouldn't mix business with politics or religion.

But even if they do, what harm is there? If the Chic-fil-a CEO advertises their policy that all their stores will close on Sundays so that their employees can attend church or just have a day off on what he believes is God's Sabbath Day, how does that harm anybody? If Tom and Jerry's choose to put a float in a Gay Nazi parade, how does that harm anybody? Am I going to refuse to buy something in either place because of their religious or political stances? No.

Should I refuse to enjoy "Sister Act", a movie I do enjoy, just because Whoopi Goldberg is politically offensive to me? Or "Moonstruck" (Cher) or "Shall We Dance" (Susan Sarandon.)

I do confess when Target refused to allow the Salvation Army Santa and kettle in front of their stores and Wal-mart continued that tradition, I chose to go to Wal-mart instead of Target. But that was to reward Wal-mart for what I see as a wonderful tradition, not to punish Target. If what I needed was at Target and not at Wal-mart, I would go to Target.

From one of my favorite all-time movies: "Chocolat":

I think you mean Ben & Jerry's.

To an extent, you're both correct. Mixing political or religious views with business is probably bad business practice, but that doesn't mean people should be stopped from doing so if that's their choice. Freedom means the freedom to be stupid, if that's what floats one's boat.

SHOULD you avoid things simply because one aspect of it is offensive to you? Not if you don't want to. By the same token, there's no "should" about ignoring those aspects, either, if you don't want to.

I stop doing business with companies when their offensive behavior becomes too much for me to ignore. Maybe it's cumulative, or maybe it's just one big thing they do that's too much for me. Depends entirely on the business and what they do. I won't eat Ben & Jerry's or buy Starbucks because their self-righteous proselytizing through their products has just accumulated too much, to the point where it completely overshadows their actual product. I won't watch a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal or Alec Baldwin in it, to name two, because their behavior outside of their acting has become so pervasive in my consciousness that I simply can't forget who they are and see them as their characters any more. I think it's a serious mistake for actors to make the public too aware of them as regular people, because their careers depend on their ability to make us believe in them as their characters, at least for the length of time that the show lasts.

On the other hand, there are companies who do things I don't care for, but I still do business with, because they haven't shoved it into my face sufficiently to make me stay away. There are actors whose personal politics I find distasteful, but they're smart enough to mostly keep it personal and allow to largely ignore it.

Won't shop at Target, because I don't like shopping somewhere I don't feel comfortable using the bathroom.

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

There's a difference between choosing not to do business with someone, and denying them their freedom to act as they choose. I just see it as two separate expressions of the exact same freedom.

My decision to not do business with certain people isn't so much to act on my beliefs and ethics; it's more that their actions have made them sufficiently difficult and unpleasant to do business with that it's not worth it. I also stopped watching Tom Cruise movies years ago, not because of repugnant beliefs so much as that he had been so over-hyped that it became impossible to see him as anyone except "Tom Cruise playing the part of . . ."

Pretty much, my position is that I will be more than happy to be oblivious to people's personal lives and choices if they will just give me the opportunity to do so by not insisting on telling me about it at every turn.

I'm not faulting your choices or decisions expressed as your personal opinion. I would not think well of an attempt to organize an attempt to boycott or ban Tom Cruise movies because you don't like Tom Cruise, but that isn't what you are arguing for. Kudos on standing by your principles while allowing others to stand by theirs.

Yes, I will patronize the business that I believe stands for moral or defensible principles as opposed to the one I disagree with. That would be my personal or moral choice. But I won't try to harm the business I disagree with just because I disagree with them. If they are physically harming somebody with unethical or malicious intention, then yes, I would take them on.

But not just because I disagree.

Of all the evil or wrongheadedness that I see in modern day American progressivism, one of the worst is that it seeks to attack, punish, silence, ban, and/or if it can, destroy those with whom it disagrees and calls that a moral choice. I see that as intolerance of the most extreme variety and evil.

And I do credit my Christian faith with providing far more tolerance than anything the Atheists generally exhibit on that score.

 

[sealybobo]

Yeah, I did mean Ben and Jerry's. (I thought that didn't look right when I typed it, but. . .)

I pretty much allow people to be who and what they are unless their actions are physically or materially harming somebody. So I can honor and respect your choices who where to shop based on your personal code of ethics, right and wrong, etc. and will not criticize you for that. You are acting on your convictions in a way that harms nobody.

I personally take the point of view that if I value the right to be able to express my point of view, my values, my beliefs, my opinions without fear some gang of snowflakes will descend on me to prevent me for speaking at a venue, will try to get me fired from my job, or threaten my customers, suppliers, advertisers, etc. in my business. . .

. . .then it logically follows to me that I should allow them their point of view, their values, their beliefs, their opinions without fear that I will try to punish, or if possible destroy them.

It sort of follows the commandment to do unto others what you would have them do unto you. That is something the snowflakes among us neither embrace nor comprehend and certainly does not respect.

But don't we have the right to descend onto an event you are speaking at and boycott your sorry ass?

If you are a right wing nutjob and we don't like rwnj's and you are open about it, don't we have to right to write your boss and tell them we are boycotting his business because he employs you?

Is it illegal to fire someone for being a liberal or Democrat or Republican? I hope it is. But it's not illegal to boycott a conservatives business. Least not last I checked. And that's affecting his income or YOUR income. So keep your politics to yourself until you find out all your co-workers and customers are conservative because if I found out you were a con I'd look for a new supplier.

Do unto others as I would have them do unto you? Sorry pal. I'm an atheist. I would love it if theists didn't discriminate against atheists but the fact is they do. So, I keep my religious beliefs to myself. If not I would expect a lot of customers to stop buying from me. For one reason because I'm an atheist and for two I'm stupid to have let it become public. Same with your politics. Don't put that on facebook. You will lose friends. You don't care? Neither do I. But I do care if I lose customers.

You have every right to share as much or as little of your opinions and beliefs as you choose to do so. You have every right to run your business as you see fit for your own benefit.

You also have every right to boycott anybody you want to, to call people names, to insult their intelligence, or anything else you wish to do.

You even have the right to organize your buddies and picket my business, harass and threaten my customers, threaten my suppliers or advertisers or pretty much do anything you want to make my life miserable, punish me, and destroy me if you can because I don't agree with you.

That is pretty much legal. It shouldn't be, but it is.

But when you do that, you diminish us all, you weaken us as a society, and make us meaner, more coarse, more hateful, and more intolerant.

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better. They will build people up, do good when all others are doing bad, and only those who have never sinned have any grounds to judge others as somehow morally inferior.

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I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

This is the second time you have posted something so non sequitur to what was being discussed that I don't have a clue what you are getting at. I suspect you might not either.

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This is the second time you have posted something so non sequitur to what was being discussed that I don't have a clue what you are getting at.

How Much of a Theist or Atheist are You?

I think the message of Christ was that those who love God will do better.

what event during the 1st century makes you believe atheism was ever discussed or made an issue of for consideration.

that is your 4th century christ that placed himself before the Almighty in your book, who can disagree with loving of anything .... though it is not loving the Almighty that moves a Spirit to Remission.

I disagree that you find the response non sequitur to the subject of the thread, whether to respond to the content pertaining to the events of the 1st century from your post is not my concern.

No I agree you often don't make any sense. The other times you make little sense. I think I understand the point you are trying to make but I'm not sure.