The divine entity who has existed and will exist forever? And the benefit of removing his own curse or whatever on mankind that he'd imposed?
Yeah, right. I'm so impressed.
Zone1 how to be saved?
- Thread starter ninja007
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Yeah, right. I'm so impressed.
Meriweather
Not all who wander are lost
- Oct 21, 2014
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How did you reach your conclusions about God and His plan/work? Where did God curse mankind? Mankind chose do go against God's plan, to go with another plan. God pointed out what they had chosen, the consequences such a choice brings with it. And...God promised to help them through it.
Once again, lets review the words of Jesus Christ himself:
Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Here Jesus is clearly telling us that only those who do the will of his Father in Heaven shall enter into the kingdom of heaven. There will surely be those who say to him, Lord, Lord we professed belief in thee but no we didn't do the works. Then, as the rest of the story goes:
Matthew 7:22-27
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Here Jesus is clearly telling us that only those who do the will of his Father in Heaven shall enter into the kingdom of heaven. There will surely be those who say to him, Lord, Lord we professed belief in thee but no we didn't do the works. Then, as the rest of the story goes:
Matthew 7:22-27
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Original sin.
Meriweather
Not all who wander are lost
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Not if one is on the consequence/cursed end. Especially when the curse is a consequence that requires the curser to sacrifice himself.
Meriweather
Not all who wander are lost
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What is the curse/consequence (Genesis 3:16-19) that troubles you the most? The pain of childbirth? The ground being cursed so it also produces thorns and weeds, so that the man must toil in the field to produce his food?
Have you studied the history/intent of sacrifice? How about God telling the people He desires mercy, not sacrifice? The Commandment is to place God first. The purpose of sacrifice: To give God your best, to give to God first.
God, through the Son, Jesus who is both fully human and divine, came to show us that living in obedience to God, no matter what the cost, results in life.
Dwelling on the perspective of an angry God is like imagining fantasy as the reality. A careful read of scripture reveals a loving, patient God who is working with people, teaching them of His ways and His love for them.
You know what else is seen in scripture? The same thing we see today: People determined to prove the fault lies in God, not in people and their choices.
ninja007
Gold Member
- Thread starter
- #49
We believe the general plan of salvation is best presented and practiced in the following manner:
- Establish the fact that all men are sinners (Roman 3:10; Isaiah 64:6; Romans 3:23; James 2:10; Jeremiah 17:9).
- Establish the fact that the penalty of sin is death (Romans 6:23; Ezekiel 18:20).
- Establish the fact that man must be perfect to enter heaven (Revelation 21:27).
- Establish the fact that man can do nothing of himself to obtain this perfection (Ephesians 2:8,9; Galatians 2:21; Romans 4:5).
- Establish how God provided a Sin-bearer and imputes to man His righteousness (2 Corinthians 5:21; Philippians 3:9, Isaiah 53:6; 1 Peter 3:18).
- Establish the fact that man needs only belief in the Lord Jesus Christ as his personal Savior for salvation (John 3:16; John 1:12; Acts 16:31).
- Establish the fact that man can be certain of his salvation now, and that his salvation cannot be lost, because eternal life is eternal (John 6:37-39; John 10:28; 1 Peter 1:5; Hebrews 10:10-14; 1 John 5:13).
zaangalewa
Gold Member
- Jan 24, 2015
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Establish the fact our father loves all of his children more than anyone or anything else - even more than his children on their own. If I'm right he told me in a way I do not understand.
Liebe ist in allen Dingen im Ãœberfluss vorhanden
Caritas abundat in Omnia
Love aboundeth in all things
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Salvation is a gift. Just because God requires us to do works, does not mean that those works earn us a spot in heaven. The works are not earnings of heaven but merely a requirement that the Lord asks of us before he will grant his gift of salvation. We are not saved by those works but only by the grace of Jesus Christ even though he does require them at our hands.
Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
In this verse it is made clear that we are not saved by works but only by the grace of God. "Not of yourselves" tells us that no part of our works is part of our salvation. "Not of works, lest any man should boast" also tells us that works do not contribute to our salvation. Yet, "we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."
Yes, you are absolutely right that works are not what saves us. But you are mistaken in that we are not required to do good works. It is a requirement of us to enter the highest degree in heaven. God has foreordained that we should walk in good works and that we were created unto good works. Jesus may not grant his gift of entering the kingdom of heaven if do not do the will of His Father in Heaven by doing good works.
Matthew 7:21-27
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Works don't save us, but they are required of us before we can be saved into the kingdom of heaven by the grace of God. Let us be wise not foolish and do the will of God and engage in the good works of a true faith as the apostle James in his 2nd chapter so clearly tells us. Jesus will give us his free gift if we but learn to obey the Lord and follow his ways, otherwise your house may fall.
Titus 3:8
8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works.
kjw47
Gold Member
Believe= learn all he taught, apply all he taught, obey all he taught.
kjw47
Gold Member
These believe and have enough love to do powerful works in Jesus' name, yet will hear those( Matt 7:21-23) words as judgement. proving 100% believing is what i shared.
kjw47
Gold Member
Jesus assures all at John 15:10-14-- To remain his friend and remain in his love one MUST obey him.
John 3:36--he that disobeys the son, Gods wrath remains upon that one.
There is a whole bible.
kjw47
Gold Member
All true followers obey to the very best of their abilities.
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