I may have gotten the impeachment thing all wrong

[The Original Tree]

They will vote on a fishing expedition. The House Clowns want to go fishing for whatever they can find because they failed to do their job before the trial. They have no clue what any witness would say, or what evidence is in the documents. They should have gone after all that prior to the trial.

They have a pretty good idea on what they will say, since a dozen or so people already testified to it....

But, you all made the "there are no first hand witnesses" a talking point, and defense.... So I'll be damn! Guess what? Here are those first hand witnesses you claimed were needed!!! Shut up, or put up, and vote to hear them!!!

Why are you so immoral, unethical, and so bent to pathological lying? Why do you hate this country and it's president?

There are no first hand witnesses. That is a fact, and not a talking point.
If there were first hand witnesses, Schiff and Nadler would have called them.
As it stands, they didn't even want to let anyone talk to the fake Whistleblowers who started this whole hoax, because they'd be sent to jail for espionage and perjury.

There is no evidence. That is why ShiftFace quoted a made up transcript of the Ukraine call, won't let anybody interview the "whistleblower", is keeping ICIG's testimony in the deep freeze (i.e. GOP members aren't allowed to review it), and misrepresented the "Mr. Z." notes as being related to President Zelensky instead of Zlovchevsky (founder of Burisma).

You God damn lying fuck.

Republicans had the same access to the ICIG as the Democrats.

You are sorely misinformed. Schiff is preventing the Atkinson transcript from being used in the Senate hearing. The House members that were allowed to see it are not allowed to quote it. He's not hiding it from Dems in the Senate - he's hiding it from the GOP as it clearly contains exculpatory evidence for Trump.

And all of this material should be made available to Trump's lawyers; which Schiff is preventing.

The investigators say that details about how the whistleblower consulted with Schiff’s staff and perhaps misled Atkinson about those interactions are contained in the transcript of a closed-door briefing Atkinson gave to the House Intelligence Committee last October. However, Schiff has sealed the transcript from public view. It is the only impeachment witness transcript out of 18 that he has not released.

Schiff has classified the document “Secret,” preventing Republicans who attended the Atkinson briefing from quoting from it. Even impeachment investigators cannot view it outside a highly secured room, known as a “SCIF," in the basement of the Capitol. Members must first get permission from Schiff, and they are forbidden from bringing phones into the SCIF or from taking notes from the document.

https://www.realclearinvestigations...ing_with_ally_how_to_remove_trump_121701.html

The President and his staff should move to declassify parts or all of this document as much as is possible if this is the case.

 

[The Original Tree]

Fine. Why should Republicans play fair now when Dems did not during the actual impeachment process/voting?

Absolutely! Republicans should always blame their own behavior on someone else - Democrats, if possible.

Sorry, Dems in the house tipped the scales first in this process. All on them, none on us.

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

not an open opportunity, a scripted one.

Dems made the rules in the House to favor them, why should Republicans play fair now?

Because if they don't they are going to lose control of the Senate in 2020. And Rump campaigning for them will be a poison pen. At this point, you think the Dems are on trial? The entire Federal Government is on trial including the Senate and the President. And that is the way it should be. You keep forgetting that it's an election year and there are more non affiliated voters than either party and we are fed up with this dog and pony act especially since the fat lady, the donkey and the disappearing midget (use your own imagination) were added to the 3 ring circus.

America has noted your Gestapo Tactics since 2016 and will take corrective actions in 2020.

 

[The Original Tree]

So you have direct quotes from him about specific people he wanted to testify?

Not "leaks" or "sources say" references?

DAVOS, Switzerland — President Donald Trump said on Wednesday that he would like to see former National Security Adviser John Bolton and other top officials testify at his Senate impeachment trial, but suggested he would block their testimony.

Trump said he'd also like to see testimony from Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, chief of staff Mick Mulvaney, and former Energy Secretary Rick Perry, who he said has been asking to testify in the impeachment proceedings. But Trump then argued that he could assert executive privilege to try to block the witnesses if called, saying it could be a national security risk if they shared private conversation they had with the president.

Trump says he'd like Bolton, Pompeo to testify but will leave witnesses up to Senate

Sort of. There are dozens of links to Trump saying he wanted, or would allow, witnesses, frequently in combination with an escape clause. You've never heard him say it?

A bunch of "like tos", and "maybes" and "let the senate figure it outs".

He hasn't said what he would do, but what he might do.

Are you going to impeach him for this now?

LOL

No, he's already being impeached.

LOL back atcha.

I doubt that will stop Dems from trying again if he wins in 2020 and they keep the house somehow.

or win it back in 2022.

He's been impeached on 2 articles, note they actually debated 4, but the other two were too crazy for even Dems (and thats pretty crazy)

That's all up to President Trump..... whether he abuses his power again or not, or breaks the law or not, or is corrupt or not....

He never abused his power. There is no such thing in US Code, and The President has the right to challenge subpoenas, and the right to delay foreign aid as he did with Mexico, Guatemala, El Salvador and Honduras recently.

The articles are a fraud, much like your immoral unethical self.

It's not about Proof, or Truth, or even about Impeachment

 

[The Original Tree]

They have a pretty good idea on what they will say, since a dozen or so people already testified to it....

But, you all made the "there are no first hand witnesses" a talking point, and defense.... So I'll be damn! Guess what? Here are those first hand witnesses you claimed were needed!!! Shut up, or put up, and vote to hear them!!!

Why are you so immoral, unethical, and so bent to pathological lying? Why do you hate this country and it's president?

There are no first hand witnesses. That is a fact, and not a talking point.
If there were first hand witnesses, Schiff and Nadler would have called them.
As it stands, they didn't even want to let anyone talk to the fake Whistleblowers who started this whole hoax, because they'd be sent to jail for espionage and perjury.

There is no evidence. That is why ShiftFace quoted a made up transcript of the Ukraine call, won't let anybody interview the "whistleblower", is keeping ICIG's testimony in the deep freeze (i.e. GOP members aren't allowed to review it), and misrepresented the "Mr. Z." notes as being related to President Zelensky instead of Zlovchevsky (founder of Burisma).

You God damn lying fuck.

Republicans had the same access to the ICIG as the Democrats.

You are sorely misinformed. Schiff is preventing the Atkinson transcript from being used in the Senate hearing. The House members that were allowed to see it are not allowed to quote it. He's not hiding it from Dems in the Senate - he's hiding it from the GOP as it clearly contains exculpatory evidence for Trump.

And all of this material should be made available to Trump's lawyers; which Schiff is preventing.

The investigators say that details about how the whistleblower consulted with Schiff’s staff and perhaps misled Atkinson about those interactions are contained in the transcript of a closed-door briefing Atkinson gave to the House Intelligence Committee last October. However, Schiff has sealed the transcript from public view. It is the only impeachment witness transcript out of 18 that he has not released.

Schiff has classified the document “Secret,” preventing Republicans who attended the Atkinson briefing from quoting from it. Even impeachment investigators cannot view it outside a highly secured room, known as a “SCIF," in the basement of the Capitol. Members must first get permission from Schiff, and they are forbidden from bringing phones into the SCIF or from taking notes from the document.

https://www.realclearinvestigations...ing_with_ally_how_to_remove_trump_121701.html

What is Pencil Neck hiding?

He is hiding all the underpinning structures of COUP 2.0

It's not about Proof, or Truth, or even about Impeachment

 

[Care4all]

He claimed the accusers had only second hand witnesses, blah blah blah, no first hand witnesses, blah blah blah as his defense.

Well hell's bells, here are the first hand witnesses, just vote to hear them. Put up, or shut up.... now is the time.

Ask your House Clowns why they didn't follow protocol to get them to testify before they shut down their "overwhelming" investigation.

Spare answered that, right above... the Senate had a better shot to get them immediately.... Trump couldn't fight them as ferociously to deny them, because they are the same party, he needs them all, to save him, from himself.

Executive Privilege is the same regarding House subpoenas and Senate subpoenas. The WH can challenge both and go to the courts for a ruling.

Once again you are trying to put the job of the House on the Senate. Your House Clowns refused to follow protocol. That's on them, not Trump, not the Senate.

He never executed his executive privilege rights in the house. NOT ONCE.... He simply defied the subpoenas and the law on everything. Another impeachment article on those unlawful actions.

The Senate, can go directly to the Supreme court in the impeachment trial, skipping years of litigation and appeals.

Trump can not stall it.

He wanted to stall being impeached, it did not work. In the Senate, he wouldn't want to stall his verdict.

If you were paying attention you would know that his lawyers explained why the subpoenas were defied.

The were not valid subpoenas since they were tied to an impeachment inquiry. There was no required vote to implement impeachment in the House, so the subpoenas are invalid.

If your House Clowns think they are valid the protocol is to go to the courts for a ruling. The refused to follow protocol. Your beef should be with your House Clowns.

His lawyers were idiots.

And since then, where it is working its way through the courts, all appeal courts have ruled there is no such thing as absolute immunity and the House has won their suit for his white house lawyer Don McGahn, to testify....... waiting for the SC.

 

[martybegan]

So you have direct quotes from him about specific people he wanted to testify?

Not "leaks" or "sources say" references?

DAVOS, Switzerland — President Donald Trump said on Wednesday that he would like to see former National Security Adviser John Bolton and other top officials testify at his Senate impeachment trial, but suggested he would block their testimony.

Trump said he'd also like to see testimony from Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, chief of staff Mick Mulvaney, and former Energy Secretary Rick Perry, who he said has been asking to testify in the impeachment proceedings. But Trump then argued that he could assert executive privilege to try to block the witnesses if called, saying it could be a national security risk if they shared private conversation they had with the president.

Trump says he'd like Bolton, Pompeo to testify but will leave witnesses up to Senate

Sort of. There are dozens of links to Trump saying he wanted, or would allow, witnesses, frequently in combination with an escape clause. You've never heard him say it?

A bunch of "like tos", and "maybes" and "let the senate figure it outs".

He hasn't said what he would do, but what he might do.

Are you going to impeach him for this now?

LOL

No, he's already being impeached.

LOL back atcha.

I doubt that will stop Dems from trying again if he wins in 2020 and they keep the house somehow.

or win it back in 2022.

He's been impeached on 2 articles, note they actually debated 4, but the other two were too crazy for even Dems (and thats pretty crazy)

That's all up to President Trump..... whether he abuses his power again or not, or breaks the law or not, or is corrupt or not....

"again"

Assuming facts not in evidence.

 

[The Original Tree]

Ask your House Clowns why they didn't follow protocol to get them to testify before they shut down their "overwhelming" investigation.

Spare answered that, right above... the Senate had a better shot to get them immediately.... Trump couldn't fight them as ferociously to deny them, because they are the same party, he needs them all, to save him, from himself.

Executive Privilege is the same regarding House subpoenas and Senate subpoenas. The WH can challenge both and go to the courts for a ruling.

Once again you are trying to put the job of the House on the Senate. Your House Clowns refused to follow protocol. That's on them, not Trump, not the Senate.

He never executed his executive privilege rights in the house. NOT ONCE.... He simply defied the subpoenas and the law on everything. Another impeachment article on those unlawful actions.

The Senate, can go directly to the Supreme court in the impeachment trial, skipping years of litigation and appeals.

Trump can not stall it.

He wanted to stall being impeached, it did not work. In the Senate, he wouldn't want to stall his verdict.

If you were paying attention you would know that his lawyers explained why the subpoenas were defied.

The were not valid subpoenas since they were tied to an impeachment inquiry. There was no required vote to implement impeachment in the House, so the subpoenas are invalid.

If your House Clowns think they are valid the protocol is to go to the courts for a ruling. The refused to follow protocol. Your beef should be with your House Clowns.

His lawyers were idiots.

And since then, where it is working its way through the courts, all appeal courts have ruled there is no such thing as absolute immunity and the House has won their suit for his white house lawyer Don McGahn, to testify....... waiting for the SC.

If there is no such thing as Immunity then why was James Comey able to give Blanket Immunity to THE ENTIRE CLINTON CAMPAIGN and also THE PODESTA GROUP? Why are you an immoral and unethical pathological liar and slanderer, and engaged in treachery, sedition and false allegations?

It's not about Proof, or Truth, or even about Impeachment

 

[martybegan]

Fine. Why should Republicans play fair now when Dems did not during the actual impeachment process/voting?

Absolutely! Republicans should always blame their own behavior on someone else - Democrats, if possible.

Sorry, Dems in the house tipped the scales first in this process. All on them, none on us.

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

not an open opportunity, a scripted one.

Dems made the rules in the House to favor them, why should Republicans play fair now?

Because if they don't they are going to lose control of the Senate in 2020. And Rump campaigning for them will be a poison pen. At this point, you think the Dems are on trial? The entire Federal Government is on trial including the Senate and the President. And that is the way it should be. You keep forgetting that it's an election year and there are more non affiliated voters than either party and we are fed up with this dog and pony act especially since the fat lady, the donkey and the disappearing midget (use your own imagination) were added to the 3 ring circus.

So the Dems get a pass for making the process as partisan as possible in the House because ???????

Sorry, but any play at fairness by republicans would be taken by Dems as a sign of weakness and exploited to fullest.

 

[martybegan]

Absolutely! Republicans should always blame their own behavior on someone else - Democrats, if possible.

Sorry, Dems in the house tipped the scales first in this process. All on them, none on us.

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

It's easier for them to complain about the 'process' if they lie about it.

The process was rigged and set by the Dems in power. Now you mewl like wibble baby brats when Republicans do the same thing with the part of the process they control.

We see through your bullshit, you dime store SJW soi boi.

Yeah, the last time I corrected you, you went straight to your shopworn insults. Your side wants to hide evidence. All the baby talk babble in the world won't hide that.

you didn't correct jack shit.

"Hide evidence" is the new talking point trying to hide the fact your side HAS NOTHING.

 

[Nostra]

Ask your House Clowns why they didn't follow protocol to get them to testify before they shut down their "overwhelming" investigation.

Spare answered that, right above... the Senate had a better shot to get them immediately.... Trump couldn't fight them as ferociously to deny them, because they are the same party, he needs them all, to save him, from himself.

Executive Privilege is the same regarding House subpoenas and Senate subpoenas. The WH can challenge both and go to the courts for a ruling.

Once again you are trying to put the job of the House on the Senate. Your House Clowns refused to follow protocol. That's on them, not Trump, not the Senate.

He never executed his executive privilege rights in the house. NOT ONCE.... He simply defied the subpoenas and the law on everything. Another impeachment article on those unlawful actions.

The Senate, can go directly to the Supreme court in the impeachment trial, skipping years of litigation and appeals.

Trump can not stall it.

He wanted to stall being impeached, it did not work. In the Senate, he wouldn't want to stall his verdict.

If you were paying attention you would know that his lawyers explained why the subpoenas were defied.

The were not valid subpoenas since they were tied to an impeachment inquiry. There was no required vote to implement impeachment in the House, so the subpoenas are invalid.

If your House Clowns think they are valid the protocol is to go to the courts for a ruling. The refused to follow protocol. Your beef should be with your House Clowns.

His lawyers were idiots.

And since then, where it is working its way through the courts, all appeal courts have ruled there is no such thing as absolute immunity and the House has won their suit for his white house lawyer Don McGahn, to testify....... waiting for the SC.

Your opinion of his lawyers doesn't matter.

Normal protocol is to go to court and get a ruling. Your House Clowns refused to follow normal protocol. That's on them.

Dimwingers always try to blame others for their failures, and this is no different.

 

[The Original Tree]

Sorry, Dems in the house tipped the scales first in this process. All on them, none on us.

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

It's easier for them to complain about the 'process' if they lie about it.

The process was rigged and set by the Dems in power. Now you mewl like wibble baby brats when Republicans do the same thing with the part of the process they control.

We see through your bullshit, you dime store SJW soi boi.

Yeah, the last time I corrected you, you went straight to your shopworn insults. Your side wants to hide evidence. All the baby talk babble in the world won't hide that.

you didn't correct jack shit.

"Hide evidence" is the new talking point trying to hide the fact your side HAS NOTHING.

Why if we give them unlimited resources and 4 more years to find something why they have to find something right?

Wait, didn't we just go through that?

It's not about Proof, or Truth, or even about Impeachment

 

[AntonToo]

Oh P-shaw!

We already know that Trump puts ketchup on his welldone steak, has two scoops of vanilla ice cream, and gets to use larger Salt and Pepper shakers than everyone else.

We don't really need to tie up the entire legislative branch to publicize these Trumpian Character "Flaws".

Abuse of Power is not a character flaw. Abuse of American foreign policy for personal political gain is not a character flaw.

It's an impeachable offense against this country by our Presdient.

 

[joaquinmiller]

Sorry, Dems in the house tipped the scales first in this process. All on them, none on us.

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

It's easier for them to complain about the 'process' if they lie about it.

The process was rigged and set by the Dems in power. Now you mewl like wibble baby brats when Republicans do the same thing with the part of the process they control.

We see through your bullshit, you dime store SJW soi boi.

Yeah, the last time I corrected you, you went straight to your shopworn insults. Your side wants to hide evidence. All the baby talk babble in the world won't hide that.

you didn't correct jack shit.

"Hide evidence" is the new talking point trying to hide the fact your side HAS NOTHING.

You must have a braille typewriter.

 

[MACAULAY]

The truth is that Biden is corrupt and needs to be investigated and Trump was right to ask for help from a foreign government which likely has some of the evidence.

The Truth is that Biden doesn't get a pass from investigation for possible criminal wrongdoing when he was VP just because he is now one of several candidates for president....no matter what the Democratic/Socialist Controlled Media says.

And this is why he and his crack-head son need to testify at this farce of an impeachment--if there are any witnesses at all. Defendants get to Defend themselves. Trump's phone call to the president of Ukraine was "perfect" and if the Bidens have to answer questions under oath---they will prove it!

Two separate things nothing to this impeachment
The biden corruption(s) investigation need to be separate
No reason in the world to tie one to the other.

_______

You are a blind partisan. Meaning you only see the side of the case Adam Schiff wants you to see.

But, there are always TWO sides. and another Truth: The other side gets to tell their side!

If Biden's conduct in Ukraine was illegal, or unethical, then it was the job of the Executive to investigate---and Trump is the head. His making a request for help in developing facts of very suspicious behavior by our then Vice-President.

You say: Two separate things nothing {to do} with this impeachment

No, it has everything to do with Trump's right to mount a defence of the Impeachment. If he was doing his job in investigating corruption by Biden---it was irrelevant that Biden is running for office. He doesn't get a pass for possibly illegal conduct in the past, by running for office now.

 

[boedicca]

Oh P-shaw!

We already know that Trump puts ketchup on his welldone steak, has two scoops of vanilla ice cream, and gets to use larger Salt and Pepper shakers than everyone else.

We don't really need to tie up the entire legislative branch to publicize these Trumpian Character "Flaws".

Abuse of Power is not a character flaw. Abuse of American foreign policy for personal political gain is not a character flaw.

It's an impeachable offense against this country by our Presdient.

That sounds really groovy to the thoroughly programmed, but it's nonsense.

1. Trump didn't abuse power.
2. Even if he did, it's not "Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors".

If anyone is abusing power in this situation, it's the Legislative Dems.

 

[AntonToo]

Oh P-shaw!

We already know that Trump puts ketchup on his welldone steak, has two scoops of vanilla ice cream, and gets to use larger Salt and Pepper shakers than everyone else.

We don't really need to tie up the entire legislative branch to publicize these Trumpian Character "Flaws".

Abuse of Power is not a character flaw. Abuse of American foreign policy for personal political gain is not a character flaw.

It's an impeachable offense against this country by our Presdient.

That sounds really groovy to the thoroughly programmed, but it's nonsense.

1. Trump didn't abuse power.
2. Even if he did, it's not "Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors".

If anyone is abusing power in this situation, it's the Legislative Dems.

You asserting that Trump did nothing is wrong is nice and all, but of course that is not what the evidence and Trump's indictment says.

What you assert is not a serious alternative to a proper TRIAL.

 

[martybegan]

The Republicans had their opportunities to ask questions.

It's easier for them to complain about the 'process' if they lie about it.

The process was rigged and set by the Dems in power. Now you mewl like wibble baby brats when Republicans do the same thing with the part of the process they control.

We see through your bullshit, you dime store SJW soi boi.

Yeah, the last time I corrected you, you went straight to your shopworn insults. Your side wants to hide evidence. All the baby talk babble in the world won't hide that.

you didn't correct jack shit.

"Hide evidence" is the new talking point trying to hide the fact your side HAS NOTHING.

You must have a braille typewriter.

And you drank the flavor-aid a long time ago.

 

[joaquinmiller]

If Repubs really believed the Democrats impeachment was dishonest or unfair, you wouldn't be able to stop them from calling witnesses to "correct" the record.

When is knowing less, or learning less, ever a good argument? Other than when one wants to hide the truth, of course.

 

[Care4all]

Spare answered that, right above... the Senate had a better shot to get them immediately.... Trump couldn't fight them as ferociously to deny them, because they are the same party, he needs them all, to save him, from himself.

Executive Privilege is the same regarding House subpoenas and Senate subpoenas. The WH can challenge both and go to the courts for a ruling.

Once again you are trying to put the job of the House on the Senate. Your House Clowns refused to follow protocol. That's on them, not Trump, not the Senate.

He never executed his executive privilege rights in the house. NOT ONCE.... He simply defied the subpoenas and the law on everything. Another impeachment article on those unlawful actions.

The Senate, can go directly to the Supreme court in the impeachment trial, skipping years of litigation and appeals.

Trump can not stall it.

He wanted to stall being impeached, it did not work. In the Senate, he wouldn't want to stall his verdict.

If you were paying attention you would know that his lawyers explained why the subpoenas were defied.

The were not valid subpoenas since they were tied to an impeachment inquiry. There was no required vote to implement impeachment in the House, so the subpoenas are invalid.

If your House Clowns think they are valid the protocol is to go to the courts for a ruling. The refused to follow protocol. Your beef should be with your House Clowns.

His lawyers were idiots.

And since then, where it is working its way through the courts, all appeal courts have ruled there is no such thing as absolute immunity and the House has won their suit for his white house lawyer Don McGahn, to testify....... waiting for the SC.

Your opinion of his lawyers doesn't matter.

Normal protocol is to go to court and get a ruling. Your House Clowns refused to follow normal protocol. That's on them.

Dimwingers always try to blame others for their failures, and this is no different.

There is already precedence though, it has already been established in the SC, with the Nixon Impeachment hearings, the oval office tapes were relevant to the impeachment, thus executive privilege did not apply.

Thus all the rulings in the McGahn trial have ruled in the House's favor, the precedence set on it.

The suits are stall tactics, they know the end result won't be with him, imo.

 

[Nostra]

If Repubs really believed the Democrats impeachment was dishonest or unfair, you wouldn't be able to stop them from calling witnesses to "correct" the record.

When is knowing less, or learning less, ever a good argument? Other than when one wants to hide the truth, of course.

Apparently you have not been paying attention. The House Clowns played all kinds of videos of their witnesses they used to put together their "overwhelming case".

Please get up to speed before posting further.