I was wrong on Pelosi. I side with Leon Panetta.

[DiveCon]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

 

[amrchaos]

Here is the problem I see concerning Pelosi versus the CIA.

First, Pelosi is a politician. Politicians LIE

Second, the CIA will Lie to the public if it is in the interest of preserving the nation. Lie more than a politician.

So I am at the cross roads. Should we believe a snake in the grass(Pelosi) that will lie to save te skin it will soon shed. Or should we believe an organization that specializes in presenting information in such a manner to shape perceptions?

Pelosi makes a relevant point when she talks about how accusations of WMD's in Iraq(OH--how about Iran is a few weeks from a nuke and we must attack Iran now--circa Jan 2008? Thank god the Military shoot that hysterical crap down!!) So to assume that the CIA is not infalliable is not a stretch of the imagination, but adequately proved in reality.

Also, the CIA does not make a substantial case for itself by saying "We do not Lie" considering much of its reputation over the past couple of years is a bunch of crap. The "GOVERNMENT IS INCOMPETENT" crowd can use the Central Intelligence Agency as a poster child.

 

[Ravi]

Do either of you have sources to back these claims?

Here's the google search listing on it....pick and choose any of your choice...

porter goss pelosi - Google Search

i just picked out this guys comments because of its clarity, but there are a ton of links on google that you can read...

The Plum LineGreg Sargent's

Porter Goss Won’t Say Whether He And Pelosi Were Told About Use Of Torture

Porter Goss, the former GOP Congressman who was in the room with Nancy Pelosi during their 2002 CIA briefing on interrogations, is declining through a spokesperson to say whether the two of them were told that enhanced interrogation techniques had been used.

Goss’ reticence raises still another round of questions about the accuracy of the recently-released CIA documents purporting to detail what members of Congress were told about the use of torture.

The CIA documents say that Pelosi and Goss, then the House Intelligence Committee chair, were given a description on September 4th, 2002, of the enhanced interrogation techniques that “had been employed” during interrogations. Republicans have seized on this as proof that Pelosi was told that torture, including waterboarding, was already in use, which she has denied.

I asked a spokesperson for Goss if he would confirm that he and Pelosi had been informed of the use of torture. Goss was out of town, so it took her a while to get back to me, but now she has: She declined to answer the question, saying that Goss would not elaborate beyond what he said in a Washington Post Op ed last month.

In that carefully-worded piece, Goss did not write he had been told that torture had been used. Rather, he merely wrote that members of Congress were told that the CIA was “holding and interrogating” suspects and that EITs had been developed. He said that members should have “understood” that EITs “were to actually be employed” in the future, without saying that they were even told this, let alone told that they’d been used.

This does not contradict Pelosi’s claim that she was only told that such techniques were legal, not that they had been or certainly would be used — the crux of the GOP’s attack.

So I asked Goss’ spokesperson directly: Were he and Pelosi informed that EITs, including waterboarding, had already been used, and were they given a rough sense that Abu Zubaydah had been waterboarded more than 83 times the previous month?

Her answer: “He believes that his Op-ed makes it very clear and is not engaging beyond it at this time.” She declined repeated requests to elaborate.

So here’s where we are: The Republican Congressman who was in the room during Pelosi’s briefing won’t directly vouch for the accuracy of the CIA’s claim that she had been briefed on the use of torture.

absolutely and completely WRONG
thats why you shouldnt trust fucking BLOGS

What Congress Knew - WSJ.com

You've linked to an op ed piece. There is no source for Goss's quote...there or anywhere else on the internet. Where is the transcript?

 

[Ravi]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

 

[Care4all]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

yep, it was a crafty piece that said nothing substantial that differs with what pelosi has said...

he does not say that they were told they used waterboarding on Abu z 83 times

 

[DiveCon]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

you are a fucking moron
what the fuck do you think this means?

Let me be clear. It is my recollection that:

-- The chairs and the ranking minority members of the House and Senate intelligence committees, known as the Gang of Four, were briefed that the CIA was holding and interrogating high-value terrorists.

-- We understood what the CIA was doing.

-- We gave the CIA our bipartisan support.

-- We gave the CIA funding to carry out its activities.

-- On a bipartisan basis, we asked if the CIA needed more support from Congress to carry out its mission against al-Qaeda.

who the fuck do you think "gang of four" refers to?
god damn you are too fucking stupid

 

[DiveCon]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

yep, it was a crafty piece that said nothing substantial that differs with what pelosi has said...

he does not say that they were told they used waterboarding on Abu z 83 times

WRONG
he was quite clear if you werent looking for a partisan way out

 

[Ravi]

and here is another one for ya
Porter J. Goss - Security Before Politics - washingtonpost.com
written by Porter Goss himself

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

you are a fucking moron
what the fuck do you think this means?

Let me be clear. It is my recollection that:

-- The chairs and the ranking minority members of the House and Senate intelligence committees, known as the Gang of Four, were briefed that the CIA was holding and interrogating high-value terrorists.

-- We understood what the CIA was doing.

-- We gave the CIA our bipartisan support.

-- We gave the CIA funding to carry out its activities.

-- On a bipartisan basis, we asked if the CIA needed more support from Congress to carry out its mission against al-Qaeda.

who the fuck do you think "gang of four" refers to?
god damn you are too fucking stupid

That would depend on which year he is talking about. Also notice that there is nothing in what you just posted about waterboarding.

 

[DiveCon]

No mention of Pelosi in that piece.

you are a fucking moron
what the fuck do you think this means?

Let me be clear. It is my recollection that:

-- The chairs and the ranking minority members of the House and Senate intelligence committees, known as the Gang of Four, were briefed that the CIA was holding and interrogating high-value terrorists.

-- We understood what the CIA was doing.

-- We gave the CIA our bipartisan support.

-- We gave the CIA funding to carry out its activities.

-- On a bipartisan basis, we asked if the CIA needed more support from Congress to carry out its mission against al-Qaeda.

who the fuck do you think "gang of four" refers to?
god damn you are too fucking stupid

That would depend on which year he is talking about. Also notice that there is nothing in what you just posted about waterboarding.

see above

 

[Ravi]

Porter Goss apparently fooled your dumb ass.

 

[amrchaos]

you are a fucking moron
what the fuck do you think this means?
who the fuck do you think "gang of four" refers to?
god damn you are too fucking stupid

That would depend on which year he is talking about. Also notice that there is nothing in what you just posted about waterboarding.

see above

The Gang of 4 relates to Bush, Cheney, Pelosi and Reid.

The question is whether the Gang of four actual knew what type of "Humane enhance interrogation techniques" were being used.

It is even possible that Bush/Cheney did not know until it was too late. For some reason, I doubt that the previous administration gave orders to "water board the living crap out of them". Something about this seems a bit unreal.

Thus I think that Bush sought legal advice on the issue "after" it was discovered that Waterboarding was being used by the CIA..Of course, this is mere speculation. I think we need a truth commission on this issue. Because if this speculation is correct, then we have rogue CIA agents on our hands.

 

[DiveCon]

Porter Goss apparently fooled your dumb ass.

how ironic for someone as fucking stupoid as you to call ANYONE dumb

you really should be ashamed of yourself, but its clear you are too fucking stupid to be ashamed

 

[DiveCon]

That would depend on which year he is talking about. Also notice that there is nothing in what you just posted about waterboarding.

see above

The Gang of 4 relates to Bush, Cheney, Pelosi and Reid.

The question is whether the Gang of four actual knew what type of "Humane enhance interrogation techniques" were being used.

It is even possible that Bush/Cheney did not know until it was too late. For some reason, I doubt that the previous administration gave orders to "water board the living crap out of them". Something about this seems a bit unreal.

Thus I think that Bush sought legal advice on the issue "after" it was discovered that Waterboarding was being used by the CIA..Of course, this is mere speculation. I think we need a truth commission on this issue. Because if this speculation is correct, then we have rogue CIA agents on our hands.

actually, the "gang of Four" refers to the 4 congressional leaders
Pelosi, Goss, and i forget the other two(at that time)

 

[Ravi]

Porter Goss apparently fooled your dumb ass.

how ironic for someone as fucking stupoid as you to call ANYONE dumb

you really should be ashamed of yourself, but its clear you are too fucking stupid to be ashamed

If Goss wanted to say Pelosi he could have. He didn't...therefore his op/ed piece is meaningless.

 

[amrchaos]

see above

The Gang of 4 relates to Bush, Cheney, Pelosi and Reid.

The question is whether the Gang of four actual knew what type of "Humane enhance interrogation techniques" were being used.

It is even possible that Bush/Cheney did not know until it was too late. For some reason, I doubt that the previous administration gave orders to "water board the living crap out of them". Something about this seems a bit unreal.

Thus I think that Bush sought legal advice on the issue "after" it was discovered that Waterboarding was being used by the CIA..Of course, this is mere speculation. I think we need a truth commission on this issue. Because if this speculation is correct, then we have rogue CIA agents on our hands.

actually, the "gang of Four" refers to the 4 congressional leaders
Pelosi, Goss, and i forget the other two(at that time)

Wait, I think you are right--

Hold it--according to Wiki--the gang of four refers to four Chinese Communists party officials.

Damn, so Bush is a liberal!!

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Porter Goss apparently fooled your dumb ass.

how ironic for someone as fucking stupoid as you to call ANYONE dumb

you really should be ashamed of yourself, but its clear you are too fucking stupid to be ashamed

If Goss wanted to say Pelosi he could have. He didn't...therefore his op/ed piece is meaningless.

Ahh so if I say the POTUS or the Commander in Chief instead of Bush You can assume I did not mean Bush, RIGHT? You fucking DUMB SHIT.

 

[Ravi]

how ironic for someone as fucking stupoid as you to call ANYONE dumb

you really should be ashamed of yourself, but its clear you are too fucking stupid to be ashamed

If Goss wanted to say Pelosi he could have. He didn't...therefore his op/ed piece is meaningless.

Ahh so if I say the POTUS or the Commander in Chief instead of Bush You can assume I did not mean Bush, RIGHT? You fucking DUMB SHIT.

Not sure if you've noticed, but Bush isn't POTUS you dumb fuck.

 

[DiveCon]

Porter Goss apparently fooled your dumb ass.

how ironic for someone as fucking stupoid as you to call ANYONE dumb

you really should be ashamed of yourself, but its clear you are too fucking stupid to be ashamed

If Goss wanted to say Pelosi he could have. He didn't...therefore his op/ed piece is meaningless.

you really should be worried
they can legally remove sustenance from the brain dead

 

[RetiredGySgt]

If Goss wanted to say Pelosi he could have. He didn't...therefore his op/ed piece is meaningless.

Ahh so if I say the POTUS or the Commander in Chief instead of Bush You can assume I did not mean Bush, RIGHT? You fucking DUMB SHIT.

Not sure if you've noticed, but Bush isn't POTUS you dumb fuck.

You are BEYOND STUPID, You are INSANELY BRAIN DEAD. How in the fuck do you exist day to day? Do you have people to dress and feed you? Someone to take care of you 24 hours a day? NO ONE AS fucking IGNORANT as you can possibly be on their own.

 

[amrchaos]

Found it--

The gang of four are the congressional leaders on the Congression intelligence commitees (Senate and House)

Bob Graham
Richard Shelby
Pelosi and Goss

Which reminds me, Bob Graham gave an interview here in miam on WIOD that he was not informed about water boardi8ng himself, and Bob Graham is a notorious note keeper. In fact, he "proved" to the CIA that the CIA claimed to have held meetings that never occured.

I found that a bit interesting that the Senate was left out of knowing the type of techniques that were being used but the House was fully informed.

WIOD is a conservative Talk Radio Station. I doubt that if the Republican Senator Graham was playing partisan politics, he would make mention of some questionable claims by the CIA that could be used to build Pelosi case.