In light of the attacks in Paris...shall we discuss gun control?

[Brain357]

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

 

[2aguy]

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

 

[Brain357]

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

 

[2aguy]

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

 

[2aguy]

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

And some truth and facts…..

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Here are the stats on some common types of death....it would be better to start a crusade to teach people how to walk upright...and save them from falling deaths...you would save more lives.....

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

guns, drowning and poisoning....

If you cared about people....you would push to ban the following...


http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Cars, Accidental deaths 2013......35,369

Poisons...accidental deaths 2013....38,851

Alcohol...accidental deaths 2013...29,001

gravity....accidental falling deaths 2013...30,208
Accidental drowning.....3,391
Accidental exposure to smoke, fire and flames.....2,760

Accidental gun deaths 2013......505

Accidental gun deaths of children under 14 in 2013....

Under 1 year old: 3

1-4 years old: 27

5-14 years old: 39
Total: 69 ( in a country of 320 million people)


2012...

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_09.pdf

Then by year accidental gun deaths going down according to CDC final statistics table 10 from 2010-2013...

2010...606
2011...591
2012...548
2013...505
So...accidental gun deaths have been coming down as more people own and carry guns for self defense....now 12.8 million people actually carry guns for self defense......on their person, and the accidental gun death rate is going down, not up...

 

[Brain357]

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

Again when based on use. Since cars are used millions of times more the numbers can't be compared without considering how much each is used. Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once? It's a very simple concept. If guns were used as much as cars the numbers would be astronomically higher.

 

[2aguy]

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

Again when based on use. Since cars are used millions of times more the numbers can't be compared without considering how much each is used. Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once? It's a very simple concept. If guns were used as much as cars the numbers would be astronomically higher.

Sorry….you don't get to play with the numbers….cars kill more people accidentally each year than guns do when they are used and cause an accidental death or when a criminal uses them to murder someone……..cars are far more dangerous than guns and we let kids drive them.

 

[Brain357]

Cars are used millions of times more than guns. Based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

Again when based on use. Since cars are used millions of times more the numbers can't be compared without considering how much each is used. Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once? It's a very simple concept. If guns were used as much as cars the numbers would be astronomically higher.

Sorry….you don't get to play with the numbers….cars kill more people accidentally each year than guns do when they are used and cause an accidental death or when a criminal uses them to murder someone……..cars are far more dangerous than guns and we let kids drive them.

Yes you do have to look at them based on use. Your argument looks very weak when you have to be so dishonest.

Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once?

Use matters. I guess because nukes don't kill anyone each year they are not dangerous? Or does use matter?

 

[2aguy]

Nope……cars kill far more people every year than guns do…and that is using the cars in a legal way..that is just accidents….

Car accidental deaths..over 33,000

Gun accidental deaths….505. with over 13 million people carrying them and over 320 million in private hands…..

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

Again when based on use. Since cars are used millions of times more the numbers can't be compared without considering how much each is used. Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once? It's a very simple concept. If guns were used as much as cars the numbers would be astronomically higher.

Sorry….you don't get to play with the numbers….cars kill more people accidentally each year than guns do when they are used and cause an accidental death or when a criminal uses them to murder someone……..cars are far more dangerous than guns and we let kids drive them.

Yes you do have to look at them based on use. Your argument looks very weak when you have to be so dishonest.

Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once?

Use matters. I guess because nukes don't kill anyone each year they are not dangerous? Or does use matter?

Use does matter…..using guns legally and as intended results in 505 accidental deaths in 2013….

using cars legally and as intended resulted in 35,369 deaths…..

Which is more dangerous when used as intended? And legally?

 

[Brain357]

Again cars are used millions of times more than guns, of course they kill more. But based on use guns are far more dangerous.

Sorry brain, saying it doesn't make it so……illegal use of a gun to commit a crime and suicide are not allowed in the comparison…..if you compare people who intentionally drive their cars into things to commit suicide, or people who use cars in a garage to suck in CO2, then you can use them…..

intentional use of guns result in only 505 accidental gun deaths…

intentional use of cars results in over 34,000 car deaths….

Again when based on use. Since cars are used millions of times more the numbers can't be compared without considering how much each is used. Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once? It's a very simple concept. If guns were used as much as cars the numbers would be astronomically higher.

Sorry….you don't get to play with the numbers….cars kill more people accidentally each year than guns do when they are used and cause an accidental death or when a criminal uses them to murder someone……..cars are far more dangerous than guns and we let kids drive them.

Yes you do have to look at them based on use. Your argument looks very weak when you have to be so dishonest.

Are you more likely to get in a car accident this year if you drive every day or if you only drive once?

Use matters. I guess because nukes don't kill anyone each year they are not dangerous? Or does use matter?

Use does matter…..using guns legally and as intended results in 505 accidental deaths in 2013….

using cars legally and as intended resulted in 35,369 deaths…..

Which is more dangerous when used as intended? And legally?

And cars are used millions of times more. Why don't you answer my questions? Do they do too much to show how silly your arguments are?

Pitbulls kill a lot more people here than tigers. I guess pitbulls are way more dangerous right? Has nothing to do with there being way more pitbulls than tigers. You lose again.

 

[M14 Shooter]

How can you politicise this tragedy before the bodies are even cold?!

--Cough--
Sandyhook
--Cough--

 

[kaz]

And you have no idea how many of the cars on the interstate have guns in them, do you?

We know how many legally carry. Are you suggesting they are shooting while driving?

Did I say anything that would suggest that? In my State anyone who can legally own a gun can carry one concealed in their car, no permit needed.

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

Whenever a point is made, you just make a poor attempt to move the goalposts

 

[OKTexas]

Thank you, OK Texas, for answering my question.
Perhaps ONE of the reasons there have been so few terrorist attacks on US soil since 9-11 is that there are so many armed citizens walking around that aren't afraid to shoot. I'm not a gun grabber--I'm totally at a loss how to stop individuals from killing each other indiscriminately.
Peace to you and yours.

I doesn't take a magic potion to stop people from killing each other indiscriminately, people need to be taught from day one to respect authority and that life is valuable. Too many Americans aren't taught that any more and then our fine government imports millions that also have never been taught the concept. It's a recipe for disaster.

 

[rightwinger]

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars kill by accident

Guns kill on purpose

 

[kaz]

We know how many legally carry. Are you suggesting they are shooting while driving?

Did I say anything that would suggest that? In my State anyone who can legally own a gun can carry one concealed in their car, no permit needed.

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Great point, but Wry is under the table hiding from his tooth paste right now, it looked at him funny. Sure, few people percentage wise are killed by toothpaste, but you do realize it's everywhere? Have to seen "The Birds?" you never know, Wry can't be too safe...

 

[kaz]

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

And guns aren't causing accidents sitting on a table…or in the holster, or in the safe….

And if you have a gun in the home and a car…odds are you will be killed by the car….

Unless you are using the car while shooting. When in use guns are far more dangerous.

Actually, no they aren't…they have a very narrow area that you have to pay attention to, and if your finger isn't on the trigger it isn't going to fire…..

We let 16 year old kids take cars onto busy streets with pedestrians, other cars, bike riders…..cars are far more dangerous and we let kids drive them all by themselves without supervision…cars kill more kids than guns do.

Cars kill by accident

Guns kill on purpose

Guns protect you from those bad people, the ones you want to be the only ones with guns. Cars? Not so much

 

[OKTexas]

What happened in Paris makes us all want to bomb something or dream of being there to shoot the bad guys! Of course it does! And everytime there's a mass shooting, Second Amendment defenders say "if they had only been carrying...." But I'm still waiting to hear of a time when a mass shooting was stopped or nipped in the bud by an armed citizen. Surely, if that is the answer, it will have happened plenty of times, considering how many mass shootings we've had and how many gun carrying folks live in this country. Why has it never stopped a mass shooting yet?

Google Oregon Mall shooter. Guns are used about 2 million times a year for defensive purposes, in most cases a shot is never fired. A bad guy just knowing you're armed will usually send them scurrying for safer ground, because they are basically cowards.

Clackamas mall shooter faced man with concealed weapon

OK Texas, I looked up your Oregon Mall shooter. The citizen never shot (probably for good reason). The reason the shooter commited suicide was most likely that his gun was jammed when the police arrived. One questionable incident from three years ago is all you've got? That's actually sad. It's certainly not enough to convince me that arming more citizens will stop the violence.

Once confronted by a gun the Oregon shooters next shot was to kill himself, the vast majority of DGU's do not involve a shot being fired. The bad guy usually takes off, the Oregon shooter planned to die that day and he did, but his damage was limited. Also what did you fail to understand that mass shooters purposefully go to gun free zones?

 

[Brain357]

We know how many legally carry. Are you suggesting they are shooting while driving?

Did I say anything that would suggest that? In my State anyone who can legally own a gun can carry one concealed in their car, no permit needed.

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

Whenever a point is made, you just make a poor attempt to move the goalposts

An honest comparison is moving the goal posts? I said based on use from the very start.

 

[OldLady]

What happened in Paris makes us all want to bomb something or dream of being there to shoot the bad guys! Of course it does! And everytime there's a mass shooting, Second Amendment defenders say "if they had only been carrying...." But I'm still waiting to hear of a time when a mass shooting was stopped or nipped in the bud by an armed citizen. Surely, if that is the answer, it will have happened plenty of times, considering how many mass shootings we've had and how many gun carrying folks live in this country. Why has it never stopped a mass shooting yet?

Google Oregon Mall shooter. Guns are used about 2 million times a year for defensive purposes, in most cases a shot is never fired. A bad guy just knowing you're armed will usually send them scurrying for safer ground, because they are basically cowards.

Clackamas mall shooter faced man with concealed weapon

OK Texas, I looked up your Oregon Mall shooter. The citizen never shot (probably for good reason). The reason the shooter commited suicide was most likely that his gun was jammed when the police arrived. One questionable incident from three years ago is all you've got? That's actually sad. It's certainly not enough to convince me that arming more citizens will stop the violence.

And here is the Oregon Mall shooter……

8. Clackamas Town Center Mall


Dec. 11, 2012
Two people were killed and a third was seriously wounded at Clackamas Town Center near Portland, Oregon when a rifle-toting gunman opened fire in in the busy food court. Nick Meli, a shopper in the mall, drew a personally owned firearm on the gunman, who immediately retreated to a service corridor and killed himself. Meli did not fire his weapon for fear of striking bystanders yet authorities say his actions caused the gunman to cease his attack and end his own life.

 

[kaz]

Did I say anything that would suggest that? In my State anyone who can legally own a gun can carry one concealed in their car, no permit needed.

Then what was the point of your question?

You changed the point from having guns to shooting them

Well cars aren't causing accidents while in the garage. The comparison has to be done with actual use obviously.

Whenever a point is made, you just make a poor attempt to move the goalposts

An honest comparison is moving the goal posts? I said based on use from the very start.

So you honestly changed the standard? OK, but that is still moving the goal posts. When you come up with a standard you'll stick to, let me know