India:man drugs family, cuts their throats, still good though, no gun used.

[Rustic]

The vast majority of our military soldiers believe 100% in the Second Amendment dumbass

They won't when it's no longer the law of the land.

Did you think we wouldn't do this lawfully? That's not very bright...

You know what they'll say to that, being believers in the Second Amendment - fuck this paper tiger, and the emperor has no clothes.

The emperor pays their bills, and sends them a check each month.

Printed paper, don't make me laugh

 

[PaintMyHouse]

The vast majority of our military soldiers believe 100% in the Second Amendment dumbass

They won't when it's no longer the law of the land.

Did you think we wouldn't do this lawfully? That's not very bright...

You know what they'll say to that, being believers in the Second Amendment - fuck this paper tiger, and the emperor has no clothes.

The emperor pays their bills, and sends them a check each month.

Printed paper, don't make me laugh

What would you like them live on after walking away from their sworn duty?

 

[Rustic]

The vast majority of our military soldiers believe 100% in the Second Amendment dumbass

They won't when it's no longer the law of the land.

Did you think we wouldn't do this lawfully? That's not very bright...

You know what they'll say to that, being believers in the Second Amendment - fuck this paper tiger, and the emperor has no clothes.

The emperor pays their bills, and sends them a check each month.

Printed paper, don't make me laugh

What would you like them live on after walking away from their sworn duty?

Most distrusting people of the federal government I know are without a doubt military folk... No one can blame them.
They've gotten extremely distrustful in the last 7/8 years, hence the incredible increase in firearm and ammo sales...
Guns are a great investment for the future

 

[PaintMyHouse]

They won't when it's no longer the law of the land.

Did you think we wouldn't do this lawfully? That's not very bright...

You know what they'll say to that, being believers in the Second Amendment - fuck this paper tiger, and the emperor has no clothes.

The emperor pays their bills, and sends them a check each month.

Printed paper, don't make me laugh

What would you like them live on after walking away from their sworn duty?

Most distrusting people of the federal government I know are without a doubt military folk... No one can blame them.
They've gotten extremely distrustful in the last 7/8 years, hence the incredible increase in firearm and ammo sales...
Guns are a great investment for the future

No answer I see? Fine.

 

[OldLady]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

 

[Rustic]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

More self-defense less crime

 

[JimBowie1958]

I was talking about guns, not insurance. Sorry.

Yeah it is telling when we have to narrowly select the topics that a sitting President wont lie about, isnt it?

 

[charwin95]

One horrible incident in India does not equate with the multiple mass murders committed daily and weekly in this country involving guns. Those statistics do not lie. The President does not lie. He has not done enough to stop it.

There were 4 mass public shooting last year...totol number of dead...37.


hE wants to use a tiny problem ( 35,000 people were killed in car accidents) to take guns away from over normal people who own 356,991,876 million guns which they do not use in gum mirder....

and how do you explain that as more people carry guns in the U.S....our gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
Please explain the problem in light of the actual facts, the truth and the reality.....

We have a criminal problem....they commit almost all of the gun murder mainly against each other....

Normal gun owners are not the problem....but people like you focus entirely on them....people not committing crimes with guns....

Why is that?

Normal gun ownership IS the problem. The problem isn't the number of deaths in mass shootings, it's the overall death rate by gun in the US.

It's the suicides, the accidental shootings, the enormous numbers of children involved in accidental shootings, it's the safety of women and children in homes with guns.

Compare all of these statistics to those nations with strict restrictions on gun ownership.

Here you go...some actual facts so you can understand what you are trying to talk about...

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

And here is the FBI table 8……it is a great table because it goes back4 years to show the rates of decrease….

FBI Table 2004

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8 - Crime in the United States 2008

2014 table…..

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

From 2014…..and I added 2011……

2006

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8 and

2006 fbi table 8

Murder by firearm….

Federal Bureau of Investigation - Uniform Crime Reports - 2000

gun murder rate 1997 -2000


1997..... 10,729
1998..... 9,257
1999..... 8,480
2000..... 8,493
2001..... 8,719
2002... 9,369
2003.... 9,638
2004..... 9,385
2005.... 10,158
2006.... 10,225
2007 10,129
2008-- 9,528
2009-- 9,199
2010- 8,874
2011-- 8,653
2012-- 8,897
2013-- 8,454
2014-- 8,124
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Accidental gun deaths 2013......505
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_09.pdf

Then by year accidental gun deaths going down according to CDC final statistics table 10 from 2010-2013...

2010...606
2011...591
2012...548
2013...505
Accidental gun deaths of children under 14 in 2013....

Under 1 year old: 3

1-4 years old: 27

5-14 years old: 39

Total: 69 ( in a country of 320 million people)
Gun Suicide: 21,175
Non gun suicide: 19,974


http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Here are the stats on some common types of death....it would be better to start a crusade to teach people how to walk upright...and save them from falling deaths...you would save more lives.....

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

guns, drowning and poisoning....

If you cared about people....you would push to ban the following...


http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Cars, Accidental deaths 2013......35,369

Poisons...accidental deaths 2013....38,851

Alcohol...accidental deaths 2013...29,001

gravity....accidental falling deaths 2013...30,208
Accidental drowning.....3,391
Accidental exposure to smoke, fire and flames.....2,760

Accidental gun deaths 2013......505

Accidental gun deaths of children under 14 in 2013....

Under 1 year old: 3

1-4 years old: 27

5-14 years old: 39

Total: 69 ( in a country of 320 million people)
Gun Suicide: 21,175
Non gun suicide: 19,974

2012...

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_09.pdf

Then by year accidental gun deaths going down according to CDC final statistics table 10 from 2010-2013...

2010...606
2011...591
2012...548
2013...505
So...accidental gun deaths have been coming down as more people own and carry guns for self defense....now 12.8 million people actually carry guns for self defense......on their person, and the accidental gun death rate is going down, not up.

So your only solution is to........ Flood the streets with more guns sell them like cigarettes so you make more money? Am I right? You keep posting the same spread sheets over and over that I don't read it anymore.

 

[2aguy]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

Again....please explain how it is possible that 13 million Americans carry guns...which you say creates more crime, suicides and accidents....and all three of those categories have gone down, not up, as more people carry guns. in 2013 there were 11.1 million and more....gun murder went down, in 2013 there were 12.8 million.....gun murder went down, and 2014 we had over 13 million...and gun murder went down.......

And as 18 studies show....concealed carry does help to lower the violent crime rate...I have that for you if you want......

They are not a growing threat to us all.......they are tiny....tiny numbers.....you would win the powerball several times over before you were involved in a mass public shooting......

And you would disarm 1,500,000 Americans who actually use guns to stop violent crime......over 37 people killed by nuts...in a country with 357,000,000 guns in private hands.....

356,991,876 million which were not used to commit any crimes.....

Do you even pause to contemplate the size of that number? Or does your phobia prevent even that much rational thought from you?

 

[2aguy]

One horrible incident in India does not equate with the multiple mass murders committed daily and weekly in this country involving guns. Those statistics do not lie. The President does not lie. He has not done enough to stop it.

There were 4 mass public shooting last year...totol number of dead...37.


hE wants to use a tiny problem ( 35,000 people were killed in car accidents) to take guns away from over normal people who own 356,991,876 million guns which they do not use in gum mirder....

and how do you explain that as more people carry guns in the U.S....our gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
Please explain the problem in light of the actual facts, the truth and the reality.....

We have a criminal problem....they commit almost all of the gun murder mainly against each other....

Normal gun owners are not the problem....but people like you focus entirely on them....people not committing crimes with guns....

Why is that?

Normal gun ownership IS the problem. The problem isn't the number of deaths in mass shootings, it's the overall death rate by gun in the US.

It's the suicides, the accidental shootings, the enormous numbers of children involved in accidental shootings, it's the safety of women and children in homes with guns.

Compare all of these statistics to those nations with strict restrictions on gun ownership.

Here you go...some actual facts so you can understand what you are trying to talk about...

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

And here is the FBI table 8……it is a great table because it goes back4 years to show the rates of decrease….

FBI Table 2004

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8 - Crime in the United States 2008

2014 table…..

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

From 2014…..and I added 2011……

2006

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8 and

2006 fbi table 8

Murder by firearm….

Federal Bureau of Investigation - Uniform Crime Reports - 2000

gun murder rate 1997 -2000


1997..... 10,729
1998..... 9,257
1999..... 8,480
2000..... 8,493
2001..... 8,719
2002... 9,369
2003.... 9,638
2004..... 9,385
2005.... 10,158
2006.... 10,225
2007 10,129
2008-- 9,528
2009-- 9,199
2010- 8,874
2011-- 8,653
2012-- 8,897
2013-- 8,454
2014-- 8,124
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Accidental gun deaths 2013......505
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_09.pdf

Then by year accidental gun deaths going down according to CDC final statistics table 10 from 2010-2013...

2010...606
2011...591
2012...548
2013...505
Accidental gun deaths of children under 14 in 2013....

Under 1 year old: 3

1-4 years old: 27

5-14 years old: 39

Total: 69 ( in a country of 320 million people)
Gun Suicide: 21,175
Non gun suicide: 19,974


http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Here are the stats on some common types of death....it would be better to start a crusade to teach people how to walk upright...and save them from falling deaths...you would save more lives.....

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

guns, drowning and poisoning....

If you cared about people....you would push to ban the following...


http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf

Cars, Accidental deaths 2013......35,369

Poisons...accidental deaths 2013....38,851

Alcohol...accidental deaths 2013...29,001

gravity....accidental falling deaths 2013...30,208
Accidental drowning.....3,391
Accidental exposure to smoke, fire and flames.....2,760

Accidental gun deaths 2013......505

Accidental gun deaths of children under 14 in 2013....

Under 1 year old: 3

1-4 years old: 27

5-14 years old: 39

Total: 69 ( in a country of 320 million people)
Gun Suicide: 21,175
Non gun suicide: 19,974

2012...

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_09.pdf

Then by year accidental gun deaths going down according to CDC final statistics table 10 from 2010-2013...

2010...606
2011...591
2012...548
2013...505
So...accidental gun deaths have been coming down as more people own and carry guns for self defense....now 12.8 million people actually carry guns for self defense......on their person, and the accidental gun death rate is going down, not up.

So your only solution is to........ Flood the streets with more guns sell them like cigarettes so you make more money? Am I right? You keep posting the same spread sheets over and over that I don't read it anymore.

Nope...my solution...lock up gun criminals for a long time, don't let prosecutors and judges let felons caught with guns go free......end gun free killing zones....and allow Americans to carry and own guns for self defense....

That is my solution...oh yeah....and back up the police when they arrest thugs.....that too.....

 

[2aguy]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

And this is how wrong you are, last year Viringia allowed concealed carry in Bars...and people like you said it would result in shoot outs between drunks and blood all over the place.....

The violent crime rate in Virginia bars went down 5.1%.......

I have the link and the article......

 

[2aguy]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

You do realize the kansas shooter, whom you named.....was a 3x convicted felon who was not legally allowed to own or carry those guns...right......he got past the background check you probably support by getting his baby mama to get the gun...right?

And no...those shootings are not increasing, not according to Mother Jones.....and if you guys want them to increase....keep glamorizing these shooters and popularizing the AR-15......

 

[2aguy]

What's Behind The Decline In Crime?
Crime has gone down a lot since the 90's. This article suggests various reasons, none of which is more people carrying guns.
A coworker today shared an amusing correlation in data: The declining divorce rate in our state has tracked almost perfectly with a decline in margarine consumption. Graphed, it would appear the two are "twins." They have nothing to do with each other.
One point made in the Forbes article is that people believe crime is increasing because 24/7 news channels and social media make us much more aware of the crime that does take place. While this is true, I am not yet so senile that I can't appreciate the increasing number of gun attacks like Cedric Ford and Jason Dalton last week. While you like to pooh-pooh my concern because the numbers of dead aren't equivalent to car crashes, I wish you would at least recognize that these types of crimes ARE increasing and are a growing threat to us all. In the old days, if you stayed out of a bad neighborhood and minded your own business, you were probably okay. Now, not so much. That's not paranoia. That's the truth.

In case you miss this in the other thread...

Report: Number Of Concealed Carry Permits Surges As Violent Crime Rate Drops

The “Concealed Carry Permit Holders Across the United States” report from the Crime Prevention Research Center released Wednesday analyzed parallels between a 22 percent drop in the overall violent crime rate in the same time period in which the percentage of the adult population with concealed carry permits soared by 130 percent.

The report finds that 11.1 million Americans now have permits to carry concealed weapons, which are up from 4.5 million in 2007. This 146 percent increase parallels a nearly one-quarter (22 percent) drop in both murder and violent crime rates during the same time period.

Regarding right-to-carry laws as a form of deterrence to violent crime, the study authors note that the large majority of peer-reviewed academic studies conclude that permitted concealed handguns reduce violent crime. Those debates center around those who claim concealed handgun permits reduce crime and those who say it has no effect. The CPRC report focuses on states that allow right-to-carry permits and states that don’t require permits for concealed weapons rather than just the amount of permits.

Additionally, the report notes that the number of concealed carry permit holders “is likely much higher than 11.1 million,” because numbers are not available for all statues that issue permits, such as New York. And four states and the vast majority of Montana don’t require residents to have a
---------
Although cautioning that nationwide “simple cross-sectional comparisons” can present misleading data, the report used new state -level permit data from 2007 on to determine that for each one percentage point increase in the percent of the U.S. adult population holding permits is roughly paralleled with a 1.4 percent drop in the murder rate.

 

[Dragonlady]

So how do you account for similar drops in the crime rate for the rest of the world?

Much of the reduced crime rates are tied to aging populations. Crimes are usually committed by younger people. As the average age of the population increased, the crime rate came down, not just in the US, I might add.

 

[Rustic]

So how do you account for similar drops in the crime rate for the rest of the world?

Much of the reduced crime rates are tied to aging populations. Crimes are usually committed by younger people. As the average age of the population increased, the crime rate came down, not just in the US, I might add.

More laws result in less freedoms...
More gun control laws are wanted by asshole control freaks... Not for safer community.

 

[2aguy]

So how do you account for similar drops in the crime rate for the rest of the world?

Much of the reduced crime rates are tied to aging populations. Crimes are usually committed by younger people. As the average age of the population increased, the crime rate came down, not just in the US, I might add.

And you still haven't accounted for the fact that in 2012 11.1 million people had concealed carry permits and the gun murder rate went down and the accidental gun death rate went down.......so normal people carrying guns did not increase the crime rate....or gun accidental death.....

In 2013 there were 12.8 million people with concealed carry permits and the crime rate and the gun murder rate went down again, and the gun accidental death rate went down...so normal people carrying and owning guns did not increase the gun murder or violent crime....

In 2014, 13 million people carried guns for self defense....and the violent crime rate went down and the gun murder rate went down, and the accidental gun death rate went down.....so normal people carrying guns and owning them in their homes did not increase crime or accidental gun death...

So everything you believe about normal people owning and carrying guns is wrong......

you claim it leads to more violence...and that has been proven untrue.......

 

[Dragonlady]

Try comparing your rates of gun death, not just murder, but all shooting deaths, to the rest of the world, instead of just US stats from previous years.

No First World country has as many people dying from guns. Americans spend 9 billion dollars every year treating gunshot wounds for the 100,000 plus people who are shot every year but don't die. Average treatment cost is $14,000.

 

[2aguy]

Try comparing your rates of gun death, not just murder, but all shooting deaths, to the rest of the world, instead of just US stats from previous years.

No First World country has as many people dying from guns. Americans spend 9 billion dollars every year treating gunshot wounds for the 100,000 plus people who are shot every year but don't die. Average treatment cost is $14,000.

Sorry...that doesn't work either....we only had 505 accidental gun deaths out of 320 million people in 2013......do you know how big a difference that is?

And our biggest death rate comes from gun suicide...but 21,000 people committed sucide with guns while 19,974 committed suicide by other means in 2013......

On top of that suicide in Japan, China and South Korea where they have 0 access to guns, except for their criminals, is higher than here in the U.S.....that is also true of many European countries and in particular France that has strict gun control laws......

And you tell me how much money is saved when 1,500,000 Americans use guns to stop violent criminal attack....robberies, brutal rapes, and murder......

And there are not 100,000 people shot every year...please provide the anti gunner link that shows that....

Gun murder in 2014...8,124 FBI table 8 2014

Accidental gun death 2013....505 CDC final death count table 10 2013


Non fatal gun accidents.....19,000

How Many Accidental Gun Injuries per Year? - The Volokh Conspiracy

A guest on the HuffPost Live discussion noted in the post below mentioned that guns injure 5,000 people per year (presumably in the U.S.). Actually, according to CDC’s WISQARS, there are about 14,000-19,000 nonfatal injuries stemming from accidental shootings per year in the U.S., though only about 600 people killed in such shootings. As always, keep in mind the limitations of this data, including that some suicides and suicide attempts could be misclassified as accidents.



That doesn't even come close to 100,000 people a year being shot.....

And how many are not shot because 1,500,000 Americans use guns to stop violent criminal attack?