Internet sales tax? yea or nay?

[Dot Com]

I think the $ 10 million threshold is cool, but in the end, this simppet here;

"CBPP’s Michael Mazerov sums up the main case in favor here: The bill would flatten the playing field between online retailers and local stores. It would allow states to recoup a few billion in taxes that are currently owed and go uncollected. And it would make tax collections slightly more progressive, since poorer Americans are less likely to shop online."


the marketplace will settle this. We don't need congress to get involved in '"flattening" any playing field, all they do is make it more convoluted.



And let me tell you straight up, Durbin says this has zero to do with federal taxes......NOW it may not, , but we all know thats BS, they will , not now not next year but in 3-5 years find a way to get in on the $$ grab.

municipalities are being starved for revenue by hipster netizens who evade local taxes by buying their stuff out of a warehouse in Long Beach. I'm guilty as well. This is more about people who live in a municipality funding their local government rather than brick & mortar v. online store's survival.

I am a huge online purchaser....I was in fact one of amazons first 1000 customers, they sent me some note 3-4 years ago during their anniversary....big whoop ...but I will say they have always been on the money with me, they have fantastic customer service.

BUT after this latest move? I'll shop around more.

as to hip netsters, I don't think at my age I am too hip anymore, BUT I am a Customer, in a free market, capitalist economy and this how it works......its called creative destruction.

If brick and mortar establishments are no longer needed or required to meet the shopping needs of society I don't see where and why gov. needs to get involved trying to circumvent reality and the future....do I need to whip out ( no pun intended ) the horse and buggy vs. car analogy?

We don't need the gov. getting int the way or trying to rescue us, example-

they have tried that crap with Green Tech. for a few decades now and if you have not noticed the cap and trade European program has now completely and absolutely fallen apart, and the Green religion apostles/acolytes etc. all petitioned the EU to save it by subsidization and taxes, but not even the professional bureaucrats in the EU would save it, they said no....because its unworkable....


Same here, if the brick and mortar model is no longer efficable, then, let it die, don't tax me for some guilt ridden Quixotic charge to save the superfluous and un-savable....

all that & you failed to address the revenue shortfalls generated by main street closing shop.

 

[Dot Com]

I'm pretty sure your state sales tax doesn't pay for the US Military.

got to have infrastructure to transport those tanks now.

Why do I get the impression that you're one-sided on this issue? Please make a comment w/ one credible link. ONE!!! This is how the CDZ works. is that too much to ask? You're a maude for cryin out loud!!!

The tax will help pay for the public union pensions which are draining most states.

Just another angle to get in eveybodies pocket.

link? you know this is the CDZ? Those sales would have previously been made in brick & mortar establishments and the corresponding sales tax paid.

 

[The Rabbi]

I think the $ 10 million threshold is cool, but in the end, this simppet here;

"CBPP’s Michael Mazerov sums up the main case in favor here: The bill would flatten the playing field between online retailers and local stores. It would allow states to recoup a few billion in taxes that are currently owed and go uncollected. And it would make tax collections slightly more progressive, since poorer Americans are less likely to shop online."


the marketplace will settle this. We don't need congress to get involved in '"flattening" any playing field, all they do is make it more convoluted.



And let me tell you straight up, Durbin says this has zero to do with federal taxes......NOW it may not, , but we all know thats BS, they will , not now not next year but in 3-5 years find a way to get in on the $$ grab.

municipalities are being starved for revenue by hipster netizens who evade local taxes by buying their stuff out of a warehouse in Long Beach. I'm guilty as well. This is more about people who live in a municipality funding their local government rather than brick & mortar v. online store's survival.

I am a huge online purchaser....I was in fact one of amazons first 1000 customers, they sent me some note 3-4 years ago during their anniversary....big whoop ...but I will say they have always been on the money with me, they have fantastic customer service.

BUT after this latest move? I'll shop around more.

as to hip netsters, I don't think at my age I am too hip anymore, BUT I am a Customer, in a free market, capitalist economy and this how it works......its called creative destruction.

If brick and mortar establishments are no longer needed or required to meet the shopping needs of society I don't see where and why gov. needs to get involved trying to circumvent reality and the future....do I need to whip out ( no pun intended ) the horse and buggy vs. car analogy?

We don't need the gov. getting int the way or trying to rescue us, example-

they have tried that crap with Green Tech. for a few decades now and if you have not noticed the cap and trade European program has now completely and absolutely fallen apart, and the Green religion apostles/acolytes etc. all petitioned the EU to save it by subsidization and taxes, but not even the professional bureaucrats in the EU would save it, they said no....because its unworkable....


Same here, if the brick and mortar model is no longer efficable, then, let it die, don't tax me for some guilt ridden Quixotic charge to save the superfluous and un-savable....

I do a lot of online shopping myself because I can get the exact item I want, plus often read reviews of it. It's a time saver.
But that doesn't mean B&M is dead.
Each one has advantages and disadvantages.
But this isn't about society choosing one way and gov't dictating another. It is about collecting taxes that are due anyway.

 

[S.J.]

quite a few good constructive comments here but not much in the way of links. Come on people.

I came up w/ a compromise last night, how about taxing BUT at a lower rate for online sales. Maybe even 1/2 the rate or whatever rate will negate the shippping cost as a factor plus give them a margin to make up for the start-up costs of say building websites to advertise.. There's a few things that can be done here.

How about lowering the tax on the brick and mortar businesses instead of taxing the online sales? Why punish the consumer?

Great idea. Then they can just shut down all state government.

Don't have to shut them down but they could stand to be downsized a little. Government is an inefficient money pit and should be limited as much as possible.

 

[Meister]

got to have infrastructure to transport those tanks now.

Why do I get the impression that you're one-sided on this issue? Please make a comment w/ one credible link. ONE!!! This is how the CDZ works. is that too much to ask? You're a maude for cryin out loud!!!

The tax will help pay for the public union pensions which are draining most states.

Just another angle to get in eveybodies pocket.

link? you know this is the CDZ? Those sales would have previously been made in brick & mortar establishments and the corresponding sales tax paid.

Yes, I know this is in the CDZ....I didn't post anything disrespectful
Just where do you think these taxes will end up?
With politicians it's all about picking a persons pocket.....it's their job.

 

[boedicca]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

 

[The Rabbi]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Eh, not so much.
There wont be thousands of state county and local taxes. In order to participate states have to sign on to a unified rate and some other conditions. And they must provide free software for compliance.

 

[Underhill]

What is the problem? We pay taxes now on stuff we buy in stores. We either should pay those taxes online, or not pay them to anyone.

It's that simple. Why should we let internet stores have an advantage? Because you get your shit cheaper?

Suck it up. Don't want to pay taxes? Move to Antarctica.

 

[Underhill]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Sorry but that is silly.

There is already software (some retailers already use it) that simply takes your zip code and calculates tax rates. It is cheap and widely available. There are already states that require taxes from internet sales. So this could be easily implemented.

 

[The Rabbi]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Sorry but that is silly.

There is already software (some retailers already use it) that simply takes your zip code and calculates tax rates. It is cheap and widely available. There are already states that require taxes from internet sales. So this could be easily implemented.

If they can calculate shipping to your zip code they can calculate taxes as well. It's not rocket science.

 

[eflatminor]

Nay.

Against government forcing private businesses to do the job government is supposed to do, like collecting taxes. If state #1 isn't getting it's citizens to fork over the sales tax they owe, that should not be the problem of a business in state #2.

Besides, a federal law requiring the collection of all state taxes will KILL smaller online businesses, leaving only those 'too big to fail' companies that can comply. Another example of government meddling having the exact opposite effect from the goals they claim to strive for.

 

[boedicca]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Eh, not so much.
There wont be thousands of state county and local taxes. In order to participate states have to sign on to a unified rate and some other conditions. And they must provide free software for compliance.

Free software for tax compliance? There is no such thing.

Also - good luck squashing all the State, county and local taxes into one size fits all rates. For example, here in the Bay Area, some counties have an extra 1/4 cent sales tax to pay for BART. So what's the solution? Raising taxes for everyone.

One size fits all sales taxes are just as inane a DC idea as one size fits all health plans.

 

[boedicca]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Sorry but that is silly.

There is already software (some retailers already use it) that simply takes your zip code and calculates tax rates. It is cheap and widely available. There are already states that require taxes from internet sales. So this could be easily implemented.

If they can calculate shipping to your zip code they can calculate taxes as well. It's not rocket science.

I believe neither of you have ever dealt with this in real life. I have. It's not the trivial exercise you think it is.

 

[boedicca]

Yes, this will be So Simple and So Free:

For mammoth retailers like Amazon or Walmart, the prospect of juggling "a few thousand local tax rates" may not be an intolerable burden. For countless smaller online businesses, however, it could be the kiss of death. And what happens when the technology turns out not to be quite as cheap and easy as advertised? Writing in the Wall Street Journal last summer, Overstock.com's chairman/CEO, Patrick Byrne, and president, Jonathan Johnson, warned against complacency:

"It took our team of 20-30 experienced IT professionals 9,412 hours over five months to install, test and integrate the software that let us properly calculate use tax in one additional state. The annual software license fees for the first year, the internal and external development and installation costs, and the cost of collateral hardware and software came to $1.3 million. And that's just for one state."...


http://www.jeffjacoby.com/13202/there-nothing-fair-about-the-marketplace-fairness

 

[BillyV]

I am against the states levying sales tax against internet merchants; it just opens up a can of worms. States now are allowed to charge taxes on business based upon whether the business has “nexus” in the state; simply put, if you have a “permanent establishment” (usually a physical location), then the state is allowed to tax you. So of course Walmart is for it; they have nexus in every state, and are already required to collect sales tax on internet sales in virtually all states.

What this would do is subvert those nexus rules so that the state can tax you despite the fact that you have no presence in the state. How long before California decides it should be able to charge income tax on those same sales, or on some other basis? No, it is not only unworkable in its implementation, it is a slippery slope. If fairness to brick and mortar retailers is the issue (and it is a reasonable complaint), I would suggest that a unified rate be applied to internet purchases, collected as a federal tax and then distributed by the feds to the states based upon delivery address. One form for the retailer, 50 monthly payments for the feds to the states and you’re done. Compliance costs for such a system should be relatively low. And as has been said, the states already have the right to tax the consumer under the “use” tax rules, but the costs of other than voluntary compliance would be more than the tax that would be collected.

 

[FireFly]

I am not for taxing previously taxed used stuff sold on eBay or Craigs List. No tax for small guy selling under ten thousand dollars a year.

 

[Trajan]

Thinking about this a little more.....I'm wondering what else they're tacking on to this Bill?
Call me skeptical

are you ready for the rain tax that is about to rear its ugly head?

yea, I read about that, just unreal....

 

[Trajan]

Sorry but that is silly.

There is already software (some retailers already use it) that simply takes your zip code and calculates tax rates. It is cheap and widely available. There are already states that require taxes from internet sales. So this could be easily implemented.

If they can calculate shipping to your zip code they can calculate taxes as well. It's not rocket science.

I believe neither of you have ever dealt with this in real life. I have. It's not the trivial exercise you think it is.

yup, heres one, how states consider items- example, some states consider snickers a candy but not twixt............ It matters cause one is taxed, the other isn't.....

 

[The Rabbi]

This bill is yet more rent-seeking to the benefit of Corporate Cronies of Big Government.

Big companies already have the infrastructure to comply with the thousands of state, county and local taxes. Small ones don't and will be harmed to the point of being uncompetitive.

And that's the point.

Eh, not so much.
There wont be thousands of state county and local taxes. In order to participate states have to sign on to a unified rate and some other conditions. And they must provide free software for compliance.

Free software for tax compliance? There is no such thing.

Also - good luck squashing all the State, county and local taxes into one size fits all rates. For example, here in the Bay Area, some counties have an extra 1/4 cent sales tax to pay for BART. So what's the solution? Raising taxes for everyone.

One size fits all sales taxes are just as inane a DC idea as one size fits all health plans.

You didnt read the proposed bill.

 

[boedicca]

Eh, not so much.
There wont be thousands of state county and local taxes. In order to participate states have to sign on to a unified rate and some other conditions. And they must provide free software for compliance.

Free software for tax compliance? There is no such thing.

Also - good luck squashing all the State, county and local taxes into one size fits all rates. For example, here in the Bay Area, some counties have an extra 1/4 cent sales tax to pay for BART. So what's the solution? Raising taxes for everyone.

One size fits all sales taxes are just as inane a DC idea as one size fits all health plans.

You didnt read the proposed bill.

Uh. Dood. Get with the program. Nobody reads bills before they are passed anymore. We have to pass them to find out what's in them.