Irrefutable legal arguments supporting the right of secession

[Bombur]

 

[paperview]

I like this one.

 

[bripat9643]

Look at that disgusting shrine. It's almost a copy of the temple the Greeks built to honor the God Zeus. The Lincoln cult has made him into a god.

The funniest part is the fact that it's a complete fraud. Lincoln was a mass murderer and a dictator. Be belongs alongside Stalin, Mao and Hitler.

 

[there4eyeM]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

 

[bripat9643]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

Yeah, Lincoln was such a humanitarian. He only killed 850,000 of them!

 

[bripat9643]

There is no law against secession, so how can it be illegal?

Texas v White.

Fin.

That's not a law. That's a bogus claim with no visible means of support issue by a gang of Lincoln selected hacks.

It's case law, you fucknut.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's not valid.

In other words, it's nothing but the opinions of a bunch of political hacks put on the court specifically to make the decisions their benefactors wanted them to make.

Case Law is mostly a collection of lies and fairy tails.

Says you citing you. And you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. For example.....since we're on the topic of lies and fairy 'tails', why don't you show us anything to back your distinction of 'federal property' and 'federal territory' as it relates to federal jurisdiction. There's no mention anywhere in US law that callng something 'federal property' magically removes federal jurisdiction. No where in the constitution is that distinction recognized. No where in the constitutional convention is it mentioned.

You literally made it up. And then based your entire secession argument on it. And your imagination isn't legal evidence. That's the absurdity of your position. You ignore Madison, the father of the constitution, you ignore the constitution, you ignore the supremecy clause, you ignore every court ruling that contradicts you......

......and replace it with jack shit. As you can't back your claims. Leaving us with the most relevant question:

Why would we give a shit what nonsense you tell yourself when you can't back your bullshit up?

Stating your opinion is not citing yourself, asshole.

I've already provided abundant examples of federal property that isn't federal territory. Every overseas military base we have is federal property, but it isn't federal territory. The laws of the host country are still in force there. The people stationed there are subject to all those laws.The U.S. maintains those bases only so long as the host country allows it. The minute that permission is revoked, we have to leave. Failing to do so would be an act of war, although few of our host countries would be willing to take us on.

 

[bripat9643]

Let me explicitly refute the second so-called irrefutable point in the OP:

Second, and most importantly, the U.S. Constitution does not forbid secession. According to the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution, “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution nor prohibited to the states, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.” Stated alternatively, that which is not expressly prohibited by the Constitution is allowed.

The Supremacy Clause of the Constitution expressly prohibits state laws that violate federal law. Secession cannot be accomplished without the violation of federal law,

therefore secession is expressly prohibited by the Constitution.

Since there is no law against secession, it can easily be accomplished without violating the Supremacy clause.

Uhm, no. And it's been explained to you about 50 times on this thread.

Question: are you brain damaged, or simply an idiot savant?

Gesendet von meinem GT-I9515 mit Tapatalk

No, it's been repeated 50 times, and it's been wrong 50 times. The only evidence we have the secession violates the Supremacy clause is NYCarbineer's insistence that it doesn't. His understanding of the clause is that a state can't do anything the federal government doesn't want it to do even if there's no statute prohibiting it. I can't imagine a bigger pile of bullshit than that.

The Supremecy clause establishes, unambiguously, federal jurisdiction over all territory within a State. If the federal government can apply its law in the territory within a state then it is a sovereign of that territory. Since a State can also apply its laws to the same territory, the State and Federal government have concurrent jurisdiction. Or what Madison called 'concurrent government'.

And if you want to make any territorial decisions for territory under two sovereigns, you need the agreement of both. Not just one or the other. The Federal government can't unilaterally cede State territory to another state or power. Nor can the State unilaterally do the same. Only through agreement between the Federal and State government can territorial decisions be made.

As an example, look at the District of Columbia. Both Virginia and Maryland had to grant their permission for the land to be ceded for the capital. The federal government also had to agree. Only when BOTH sovereigns agreed could territorial decisions be made.

South Carolina didn't get the agreement of the other sovereign of the territory within South Carolina: the Federal government. And without the agreement of BOTH sovereigns, no territorial changes can be made. Thus, the territory remained under concurrent jurisdiction. As every State is part of the United States. And the US federal government has jurisdiction over the whole of the United States.

Including the territory in South Carolina.

That's made up horseshit. There is no basis in the Constitution or in law for it. If a state secedes, the federal government no longer has jurisdiction over any territory within its boundaries. That's the bottom line.

 

[bripat9643]

If there are irrefutable legal arguments that states have the right to secede, why didn't those Southern Civil War states use those irrefutable legal arguments earlier?

Lincoln didn't give a damn about logic and facts. He was an accomplished manipulator and propagandist, and he used his skills to get the result he wanted. The dumbass Yankees were too stupid to see through his con.

But if the arguments were irrefutable how could Lincoln resist? Sounds like the arguments were refutable, and if that's true and the law doesn't work that pretty much leaves force, and force didn't seem to work either.

Lincoln ignored logic for the same reason you do, because he was a thug.

Lincoln ignored logic? Oh yes, because the ramblings of a paranoid right winger on a message board are completely relevant to Abraham Lincolns history as a man who helped stop a bunch of racist white idiots from continuing slavery on a massive scale for their own profit. If that makes him a thug, we need more like him.

What would you know about logic?

 

[bripat9643]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

 

[there4eyeM]

Further display of absurd hyperbole.

 

[Socialist]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

Jesus christ, what the fuck are you talking about?

 

[Socialist]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

How was lincoln a dictator? Oh wait, he wasn't, you're a fucking nut, this doesn't surprise me since you believe "marxism" has infected all of society, dude, you have no fucking idea what marxism is, let alone anything about lincoln.

 

[Socialist]

Look at that disgusting shrine. It's almost a copy of the temple the Greeks built to honor the God Zeus. The Lincoln cult has made him into a god.

The funniest part is the fact that it's a complete fraud. Lincoln was a mass murderer and a dictator. Be belongs alongside Stalin, Mao and Hitler.

He belongs next to stalin/mao? Jesus.. fuck.. what.. I can't even, I'm sorry, but what the hell is wrong with you?

 

[bripat9643]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

How was lincoln a dictator? Oh wait, he wasn't, you're a fucking nut, this doesn't surprise me since you believe "marxism" has infected all of society, dude, you have no fucking idea what marxism is, let alone anything about lincoln.

He threw people into concentration camps without a trial. He shut down 300 newspapers for printing criticism of his policies. He threw the entire state legislature of Maryland in prison. He had people executed without a trial. He waged war on his fellow Americans.

How is he not a dictator?

 

[bripat9643]

Look at that disgusting shrine. It's almost a copy of the temple the Greeks built to honor the God Zeus. The Lincoln cult has made him into a god.

The funniest part is the fact that it's a complete fraud. Lincoln was a mass murderer and a dictator. Be belongs alongside Stalin, Mao and Hitler.

He belongs next to stalin/mao? Jesus.. fuck.. what.. I can't even, I'm sorry, but what the hell is wrong with you?

I confess my sin: I know the truth. I'm not a brainwashed drone like you.

 

[Socialist]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

How was lincoln a dictator? Oh wait, he wasn't, you're a fucking nut, this doesn't surprise me since you believe "marxism" has infected all of society, dude, you have no fucking idea what marxism is, let alone anything about lincoln.

He threw people into concentration camps without a trial. He shut down 300 newspapers for printing criticism of his policies. He threw the entire state legislature of Maryland in prison. He had people executed without a trial. He waged war on his fellow Americans.

How is he not a dictator?

Concentration camps? What the hell? Oh, because lincoln is the only one who ever did this.. We might aswell call the president during the red scare a dictator for viciously hunting down communists/socialists and shutting down the left wing, but no, you're ok with that, you partisan fuck. He executed people without a trial? Oh, you mean the people who declared war on the union? Fuck off, you've been shit on through this entire thread, you're a laughing stock on par with PC.

 

[Socialist]

Look at that disgusting shrine. It's almost a copy of the temple the Greeks built to honor the God Zeus. The Lincoln cult has made him into a god.

The funniest part is the fact that it's a complete fraud. Lincoln was a mass murderer and a dictator. Be belongs alongside Stalin, Mao and Hitler.

He belongs next to stalin/mao? Jesus.. fuck.. what.. I can't even, I'm sorry, but what the hell is wrong with you?

I confess my sin: I know the truth. I'm not a brainwashed drone like you.

Dear god, everyone you disagree with is obviously a brainwashed drone, because all college professors are marxists paid for by the evil communists who run the government. You probably believe this, which should show everyone on this forum what a fucking idiot you are.

 

[bripat9643]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

How was lincoln a dictator? Oh wait, he wasn't, you're a fucking nut, this doesn't surprise me since you believe "marxism" has infected all of society, dude, you have no fucking idea what marxism is, let alone anything about lincoln.

He threw people into concentration camps without a trial. He shut down 300 newspapers for printing criticism of his policies. He threw the entire state legislature of Maryland in prison. He had people executed without a trial. He waged war on his fellow Americans.

How is he not a dictator?

Concentration camps? What the hell? Oh, because lincoln is the only one who ever did this.. We might aswell call the president during the red scare a dictator for viciously hunting down communists/socialists and shutting down the left wing, but no, you're ok with that, you partisan fuck. He executed people without a trial? Oh, you mean the people who declared war on the union? Fuck off, you've been shit on through this entire thread, you're a laughing stock on par with PC.

Mod edit: *No linking to other forums

Lincoln was a War Criminal it s a FACT Southern Sentinel​

• The Lincoln administration allowed the taking of private property for public use without just compensation or due process of law.
• The Lincoln Administration routinely used water torture against the thousands of Union prisoners arrested and jailed without trail.
• He suspended the writ of habeas corpus without the consent of Congress (as required by the Constitution).
• He illegally shut down and confiscated the printing presses of dozens of newspapers that had spoken out against him.
• He re-instated and summarily promoted an Army officer who had been court martialed and cashiered by the US Army for war crimes.
• He even had an arrest warrant issued for the Chief Justice of the US Supreme Court because said justice refused to back his illegal actions.
• Chief Justice Roger B Taney ruled that Lincolns actions were illegal, criminal and unconstitutional.
• He invaded the South without the consent of Congress as required by the Constitution.
• He blockaded Southern ports without a declaration of war, as required by the Constitution.
• He imprisoned without trial, hundreds of newspaper editors and owners and censored all newspaper and telegraph communication.
• He created two new states without the consent of the citizens of those states in order to artificially inflate the Republican Party's electoral vote.
• He ordered Federal troops to interfere with Northern elections to assure his Parties victories.
• He confiscated private property, including firearms, in violation of the Second Amendment; and effectively gutted the Tenth and Ninth Amendments as well.
• He had his Generals attack US cities full of women and children and burn them to the ground.

 

[Socialist]

The assassination of Lincoln only increased the tragic consequences for the South after the failed rebellion. His murder by a frustrated coward only made things worse.

He sure as hell wasn't a coward. Assassinating a dictator takes a lot of courage.

How was lincoln a dictator? Oh wait, he wasn't, you're a fucking nut, this doesn't surprise me since you believe "marxism" has infected all of society, dude, you have no fucking idea what marxism is, let alone anything about lincoln.

He threw people into concentration camps without a trial. He shut down 300 newspapers for printing criticism of his policies. He threw the entire state legislature of Maryland in prison. He had people executed without a trial. He waged war on his fellow Americans.

How is he not a dictator?

Concentration camps? What the hell? Oh, because lincoln is the only one who ever did this.. We might aswell call the president during the red scare a dictator for viciously hunting down communists/socialists and shutting down the left wing, but no, you're ok with that, you partisan fuck. He executed people without a trial? Oh, you mean the people who declared war on the union? Fuck off, you've been shit on through this entire thread, you're a laughing stock on par with PC.

Lincoln s Crimes and Violations of the Constitution... - The History Forum

Lincoln as already mentioned, trashed the Constitution by suspending the Writ of Habeas Corpus and sending troops door to door confiscating weapons in areas of Maryland.

• Lincoln ordered the arrest of thousands Marylanders for the crime of 'suspected Southern sympathies'.
• Lincoln ordered the arrest of US Congressman Henry May representing Maryland. #7
• Lincoln also had arrested...
  • Most of the Maryland State Legislature #8
  • Most of the Baltimore city council #9
  • The police commissioner of Baltimore #10
  • The mayor of Baltimore #11
  • Thousands of prominent Maryland citizens. #12
  • These people were arrested and held in Military prisons, without trial, some of them for years.
• April 25 1861, When it looks as though Maryland may secede from the Union, Lincoln sends a letter to General Winfield Scott giving him permission to bombard Maryland's Cities.

Lincoln was a War Criminal it s a FACT Southern Sentinel​

• The Lincoln administration allowed the taking of private property for public use without just compensation or due process of law.
• The Lincoln Administration routinely used water torture against the thousands of Union prisoners arrested and jailed without trail.
• He suspended the writ of habeas corpus without the consent of Congress (as required by the Constitution).
• He illegally shut down and confiscated the printing presses of dozens of newspapers that had spoken out against him.
• He re-instated and summarily promoted an Army officer who had been court martialed and cashiered by the US Army for war crimes.
• He even had an arrest warrant issued for the Chief Justice of the US Supreme Court because said justice refused to back his illegal actions.
• Chief Justice Roger B Taney ruled that Lincolns actions were illegal, criminal and unconstitutional.
• He invaded the South without the consent of Congress as required by the Constitution.
• He blockaded Southern ports without a declaration of war, as required by the Constitution.
• He imprisoned without trial, hundreds of newspaper editors and owners and censored all newspaper and telegraph communication.
• He created two new states without the consent of the citizens of those states in order to artificially inflate the Republican Party's electoral vote.
• He ordered Federal troops to interfere with Northern elections to assure his Parties victories.
• He confiscated private property, including firearms, in violation of the Second Amendment; and effectively gutted the Tenth and Ninth Amendments as well.
• He had his Generals attack US cities full of women and children and burn them to the ground.

 

[Contumacious]

JOHN WILKES BOOTH BELIEVED THAT THE PENALTY FOR TREASON AGAINST THE CONSTITUTION WAS DEATH

It's interesting to know how you would like to treat your fellow Americans.

Is everybody seeing this?

Lookit bripat make warm fuzzies for a man - and that man's co-conspirators - who killed a US President.

If I didn't know any better, I'd say you approve of presidential assassination.

If I didn't know any better , I'd say that you approved of treason against the Constitution (1787) and domestic terrorism.


1-650,000 Americans dead
2-The sovereignty of the states destroyed
3- the concentration of power in DC - the states have been reduced to mere provinces
4- the introduction of the "income" tax
5- the introduction of paper money

Oh, wait , you are one of those scumbags who believe that "when the president does it, it means is not a crime"


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