Is Russia Now the World's Leading Military Power?

[Grau]

It's likely to be moronic to ask Christians in America, on account of prophesy and the secured feelings of righteousness among them.

But there's always going to be the real world!
To people like you it's an annoying question on account of your secure feelings that America could never lose a war.

You know, of course, that there will be no winner in the next war so ensuring our mutual co existence should be a top priority.

I'm old enough to remember the "Cuban Missile Crisis" but for some reason I felt that the old, Soviet WW 2 Veterans had already seen enough bloodshed and were less likely to strike first.

Thanks,

 

[Donald H]

You know, of course, that there will be no winner in the next war so ensuring our mutual co existence should be a top priority.

I know that the war is raging and there almost certainly not be a 'next' war

I'm old enough to remember the "Cuban Missile Crisis" but for some reason I felt that the old, Soviet WW 2 Veterans had already seen enough bloodshed and were less likely to strike first.

Thanks,

Can you remember when you learned that Kruschev succeeded on securing Russia's demands?

I think the truth wasn't widely known in America until the early nineties!

 

[Dayton3]

You know, of course, that there will be no winner in the next war so ensuring our mutual co existence should be a top priority.

Why do you say that? Any war is winnable.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

The definition of 'banned' weapons is subject to change according to America's needs. I think at present America might be claiming to not be a signatory to any bans.

We do know that Russia is not observing any ban on cluster munitions, as they have likely escalated their use beyond that of the Ukraine.

As is the practice of late on all weapons and escalations.

they are not illegal or banned, you lied.

 

[Grau]

Why do you say that? Any war is winnable.

I was thinking of a full scale nuclear war.

I believe it was Einstein who predicted that WW 4 would be fought with sticks and stones.

 

[Donald H]

they are not illegal or banned, you lied.

Did I lie or did I fall victim to the confusion Biden generated when he justified their use? I'm good with either. Biden certainly appeared to have some reservations but they may have been feigned.

Better with your interpretation because it's an opportunity to allow you to score a point!

 

[Grau]

I know that the war is raging and there almost certainly not be a 'next' war

Can you remember when you learned that Kruschev succeeded on securing Russia's demands?

I think the truth wasn't widely known in America until the early nineties!

I'm sorry that I didn't make myself clear when I wrote: "... next war".
I meant a full scale nuclear war .

You're right, there is a horrific war currently underway and there will probably be more contained wars like it.

Yes, I did learn about deal between JFK and Khrushchev when I was in the US Army long, long ago.

Truth is, indeed, stranger than fiction.

Thanks,

 

[Donald H]

I'm sorry that I didn't make myself clear when I wrote: "... next war".
I meant a full scale nuclear war .

You're right, there is a horrific war currently underway and there will probably be more contained wars like it.

Yes, I did learn about deal between JFK and Khrushchev when I was in the US Army long, long ago.

Truth is, indeed, stranger than fiction.

Thanks,

Thanks for your reply too. I look forward to rational discussion being possible between usl.

 

[Grau]

Thanks for your reply too. I look forward to rational discussion being possible between usl.

Thanks for your kind words.
I fully believe that people can even have different opinions and still discuss them rationally and with civility.

Think how boring things would be if everyone agreed on everything.

I look forward to reading your thoughts and opinions.

Thanks,

 

[bodecea]

https://www.globalpoliticsreview.com/publications/2464-9929_v06_i1-2_p057.pdf

Could it be actually true in a strategic sense?

Or is it redundant to speculate considering that any major conflict will soon turn to a nuclear war?

Still, the question should be asked for a war that is restricted to only conventional weapons.

I've placed this topic here in Military in hopes of a serious discussion that doesn't belong in the Badlands. Moderator cooperation would be appreciated.

No...as Their current disaster in Ukraine proves.

 

[AZrailwhale]

I am simply agreeing with you and your interpretation on the question.

After all is said and done, Biden's decision to allow cluster munitions has only freed up Russia to act in kind.
Or more to the point, in kind X 10 if they please.

Russia hasn't been constrained by any agreements that it has signed or by international law.

 

[Dayton3]

I was thinking of a full scale nuclear war.

I believe it was Einstein who predicted that WW 4 would be fought with sticks and stones.

Einstein knew nothing about modern warfare. Any war is winnable

 

[Mushroom]

Can you remember when you learned that Kruschev succeeded on securing Russia's demands?

Can you remember that it did not even matter?

Yes, we removed the Jupiter PGM-19 missiles from Turkey. But guess what? They were already obsolete, being phased out, and that was one of the last two units that used them (the US had already phased them all out between 1959-1961). The only thing that did was speed up the deactivation by a few months as they were already scheduled to be retired at the start of 1963.

In fact, this can be seen in that in early 1963 the last Jupiter missiles deployed anywhere in the world were in Italy. And those were retired in March 1963. The same time the missiles in Turkey were scheduled to be retired.

So the US was more than happy to pull them out of Turkey if that meant a peaceful end to the crisis. They were already scheduled to be removed in under 6 months anyways. Because at that time, the MGM-31 Pershing was coming online, and it was vastly superior to the Jupiter. Most specifically because it was intended to be launched from a mobile launcher, and used solid fuel engines instead of liquid fuel so maintenance was easier and time before launch was greatly reduced. From well over two hours to about 15 minutes.

 

[Mushroom]

Russia hasn't been constrained by any agreements that it has signed or by international law.

Which I find sad, because the Soviets were always very meticulous in following the agreements they made. One thing I do clearly remember from the Cold War was that whenever we reached an agreement with them, they followed it to the letter. Even going so far as to ask us for help in eliminating some of their weapons when they were not able to do it themselves.

Sadly, the current Russian government is nothing like that, even violating treaties that the USSR had agreed to decades earlier.

 

[Mushroom]

After all is said and done, Biden's decision to allow cluster munitions has only freed up Russia to act in kind.

The Russians had been using them since the very start of the conflict. The very initial invasion in February 2002 was kicked off with salvos of Russian cluster munitions against Ukrainian military sites and runways.

So how in the hell the President had anything to do with that, I have absolutely no idea. Just as the Russians used them in 2015 and 2016 when President Obama was still in office.

 

[Donald H]

Can you remember that it did not even matter?

Yes, we removed the Jupiter PGM-19 missiles from Turkey. But guess what? They were already obsolete, being phased out, and that was one of the last two units that used them (the US had already phased them all out between 1959-1961). The only thing that did was speed up the deactivation by a few months as they were already scheduled to be retired at the start of 1963.

In fact, this can be seen in that in early 1963 the last Jupiter missiles deployed anywhere in the world were in Italy. And those were retired in March 1963. The same time the missiles in Turkey were scheduled to be retired.

So the US was more than happy to pull them out of Turkey if that meant a peaceful end to the crisis. They were already scheduled to be removed in under 6 months anyways. Because at that time, the MGM-31 Pershing was coming online, and it was vastly superior to the Jupiter. Most specifically because it was intended to be launched from a mobile launcher, and used solid fuel engines instead of liquid fuel so maintenance was easier and time before launch was greatly reduced. From well over two hours to about 15 minutes.

Yeah buts noted.

America's aggression and imperialism has not been deterred, but the facts on Kruschev's win are still being acknowledged by a minority of Americans and you at least.

 

[Donald H]

Which I find sad, because the Soviets were always very meticulous in following the agreements they made. One thing I do clearly remember from the Cold War was that whenever we reached an agreement with them, they followed it to the letter. Even going so far as to ask us for help in eliminating some of their weapons when they were not able to do it themselves.

Sadly, the current Russian government is nothing like that, even violating treaties that the USSR had agreed to decades earlier.

Russia's resolve to exist intact as a superpower hasn't changed.

And specifically, Russia has not failed to honour any agreements as long as America has done likewise.

But America didn't do likewise and it chose military aggression against Russia that has resluted in Russia's turning to defensive measures.

 

[Mushroom]

More ignorance duck. The US is not a party to the cluster munitions ban.

And it is not even really a "ban" in the first place. That is the first thing a lot of people get wrong about it.

All it is is an agreement by some countries to limit the kinds of cluster munitions used. Those that use 10 submunitions or less are still allowed. As are any that use submunitions that weigh at least 20 kg (44 pounds). Those are all still allowed also. As are any that has any form of acquisition and homing system that allows it to engage a single target.

It is not a ban, nor is it any kind of Law of Land Warfare. They are not illegal to use. Even those nations that agreed to the convention are still allowed to use them, just within specific limits.

 

[Mushroom]

And specifically, Russia has not failed to honour any agreements as long as America has done likewise.

Wrong, oh so very wrong.

In 2008 Russia started testing the SSC-8 "SLINGSHOT" missile, which was in violation of the INF treaty.

In 2013 they started testing the SS-25 "SICKLE" and RD-26 Rubzh missiles. Both road mobile IRBMs that were in clear violation of the INF treaty. And the Russians pretty much said they were going to continue to ignore it as China was in no way bound to the restrictions. And the day the US pulled out of that treaty, the Russians announced they were already developing a land based launcher for the SS-N-27 "SIZZLER" missile.

Interestingly enough, since the US pulled out of that treaty in 2018 the most the US has done is test a new GLCM system in 2019. And there have been no further attempts in developing that platform since 2020 as the Army has no interest in fielding it.

Sorry, feel free to look into the timeline of the INF, that proves what you said is a lie.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Russia's resolve to exist intact as a superpower hasn't changed.

And specifically, Russia has not failed to honour any agreements as long as America has done likewise.

But America didn't do likewise and it chose military aggression against Russia that has resluted in Russia's turning to defensive measures.

LOL invading another Country twice is NOT defensive.