Is the Bible the inerrent word of God?

[Avatar4321]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

I’ll hop in. Considering we’re talking about people who had no concept that the sun was just a star, and the stars were just suns really really far away, that the earth was round, that disease was cause by tiny life, no concept of matter, energy, atoms, elements, the language/vocabulary to even describe this stuff, and thousands of other things we take for granted today...does it not raise eyebrows for you how close they got the creation story (especially compared to any other creation story out there)? There was a great void and emptiness, then boom, then god gave the heavens and earth shape, then the earth formed land and sea, then god created life in the sea, then the animals of the land, then finally humans...At the very least you have to be impressed with how close this spoken word, passed down for generations and finally into text, came to what we with all our knowledge know. This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them. I mean if you explained how the universe came into existence to a 5 year old, and they went and explained it to other 5 year olds, it just might sound something like that

Yeah, except it wasn't. First, you seem to forget that Genesis isn't as clear on that order as you present. You see, in chapter 1 of Genesis, it does appear to be in the correct evolutionary order. But, then, in chapter 2, the writer of Genesis changed their mind, and insisted that Man was created first, then all of the other animals. Also, there seems to be a little trouble with the physics even in Genesis, Chapter 1, You see, God, somehow, apparently created light, before creating the sun, and stars, even though light is generated by the sun, and stars. You want to pretend that Genesis perfectly aligns with our scientific knowledge of the universe. Except it really doesn't.

The source of light is God. He gives the sun light

 

[Czernobog]

I’ll hop in. C This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them.

Who thought the earth was flat? that's a myth dreamed up by ...um .... 18th and 19th Century allegedly 'educated atheists'.

Myth of the flat Earth - Wikipedia

Uh...I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the belief that the Earth was flat goes back a great deal further than that. In fact The Early Church ridiculed, and even imprisoned for heresy anyone "silly enough" to suggest that the earth was a sphere:

Christian Topography (547) by the Alexandrian monk Cosmas Indicopleustes, who had travelled as far as Sri Lanka and the source of the Blue Nile, is now widely considered the most valuable geographical document of the early medieval age, although it received relatively little attention from contemporaries. In it, the author repeatedly expounds the doctrine that the universe consists of only two places, the Earth below the firmament and heaven above it. Carefully drawing on arguments from scripture, he describes the Earth as a rectangle, 400 day's journey long by 200 wide, surrounded by four oceans and enclosed by four massive walls which support the firmament. The spherical Earth theory is contemptuously dismissed as "pagan"

So...yeah...the idea that the Earth was flat precedes the 1800's by quite a bit.

 

[Czernobog]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

I’ll hop in. Considering we’re talking about people who had no concept that the sun was just a star, and the stars were just suns really really far away, that the earth was round, that disease was cause by tiny life, no concept of matter, energy, atoms, elements, the language/vocabulary to even describe this stuff, and thousands of other things we take for granted today...does it not raise eyebrows for you how close they got the creation story (especially compared to any other creation story out there)? There was a great void and emptiness, then boom, then god gave the heavens and earth shape, then the earth formed land and sea, then god created life in the sea, then the animals of the land, then finally humans...At the very least you have to be impressed with how close this spoken word, passed down for generations and finally into text, came to what we with all our knowledge know. This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them. I mean if you explained how the universe came into existence to a 5 year old, and they went and explained it to other 5 year olds, it just might sound something like that

Yeah, except it wasn't. First, you seem to forget that Genesis isn't as clear on that order as you present. You see, in chapter 1 of Genesis, it does appear to be in the correct evolutionary order. But, then, in chapter 2, the writer of Genesis changed their mind, and insisted that Man was created first, then all of the other animals. Also, there seems to be a little trouble with the physics even in Genesis, Chapter 1, You see, God, somehow, apparently created light, before creating the sun, and stars, even though light is generated by the sun, and stars. You want to pretend that Genesis perfectly aligns with our scientific knowledge of the universe. Except it really doesn't.

The source of light is God. He gives the sun light

 

[Mudda]

It says on page fuckng ONE of the bible, god said "let there be light". When Superman wants to fly, he doesnt say out loud "let me fly", he just flies. See what I'm saying?

For us to know that Superman is flying, does an author use words to describe to us that Superman is flying? Perhaps try looking at it this way. The author did not describe God creating wire, then electricity, and then a light bulb. The author said God commanded light and there was light. Why do you believe God needed an audience? Don't we often use words in simple thoughts? There is no reason to complicate things. God commanded light and there was light. No audience required.

But who was god commanding light from? A command demands that someone be commanded.

 

[Mudda]

It says on page fuckng ONE of the bible, god said "let there be light". When Superman wants to fly, he doesnt say out loud "let me fly", he just flies. See what I'm saying?

For us to know that Superman is flying, does an author use words to describe to us that Superman is flying? Perhaps try looking at it this way. The author did not describe God creating wire, then electricity, and then a light bulb. The author said God commanded light and there was light. Why do you believe God needed an audience? Don't we often use words in simple thoughts? There is no reason to complicate things. God commanded light and there was light. No audience required.

The law was spoken into existence as a light to the nations. The story of the creation of heaven and earth is really very uncomplicated already. Of course it matters if you do or don't understand what the story is even about.

Blindness of the audience must be addressed before anyone can see that light.

Nations didn't exist when the lights went on in our universe.

 

[Mudda]

When god said "let there be light", to whom was he talking to?

The Sons of God. Us. In the premortal realm as spirit sons and daughters we knew and worshipped God as our heavenly Father and accepted His plan. His plan was to create an earth where would could have a physical body and gain earthly experience in order to progress toward perfection and to ultimately realize our destiny as heirs of eternal life

You have proof for this tall tale?

The witness of the Holy Ghost. You are free to ask Him for yourself.

Somehow I expect you wont do the work necessary to learn. Perhaps I should have more faith in others

Ok, I asked him and haven't heard back. How long does it usually take for him to get back to someone?

He will get back to you when you are prepared. He is Eternal and has infinite patience. You and me, not so much.

If you want answers you get them on His terms.

"Behold, you have not understood; you have supposed that I would give it unto you, when you took no thought save it was to ask me.

"But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

"But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong" (D&C 9:7-9)
​

There are other conditions:

" Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these things, and ponder it in your hearts.

"And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

" And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things."(Moroni 10:3-5)​

So think it out
Ask with sincerity
In the name of Christ

"And now behold, I say unto you, my brethren, if ye have experienced a change of heart, and if ye have felt to sing the song of redeeming love, I would ask, can ye feel so now?

"Have ye walked, keeping yourselves blameless before God? Could ye say, if ye were called to die at this time, within yourselves, that ye have been sufficiently humble? That your garments have been cleansed and made white through the blood of Christ, who will come to redeem his people from their sins?

" Behold, are ye stripped of pride? I say unto you, if ye are not ye are not prepared to meet God. Behold ye must prepare quickly; for the kingdom of heaven is soon at hand, and such an one hath not eternal life.

" Behold, I say, is there one among you who is not stripped of envy? I say unto you that such an one is not prepared; and I would that he should prepare quickly, for the hour is close at hand, and he knoweth not when the time shall come; for such an one is not found guiltless.

"And again I say unto you, is there one among you that doth make a mock of his brother, or that heapeth upon him persecutions?

" Wo unto such an one, for he is not prepared, and the time is at hand that he must repent or he cannot be saved!

"Yea, even wo unto all ye workers of iniquity; repent, repent, for the Lord God hath spoken it!

"Behold, he sendeth an invitation unto all men, for the arms of mercy are extended towards them, and he saith: Repent, and I will receive you." (Alma 5:26-33)
​

Strip yourself of your pride
Strip yourself of your envy
Don't mock your brothers.

Or else you aren't prepared to know God.

If you really want to know your Father in Heaven, seek Him the way He invites us to.

The religious books of fiction invite us to self-delude, god doesn't say anything. Ever.

 

[sakinago]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

I’ll hop in. Considering we’re talking about people who had no concept that the sun was just a star, and the stars were just suns really really far away, that the earth was round, that disease was cause by tiny life, no concept of matter, energy, atoms, elements, the language/vocabulary to even describe this stuff, and thousands of other things we take for granted today...does it not raise eyebrows for you how close they got the creation story (especially compared to any other creation story out there)? There was a great void and emptiness, then boom, then god gave the heavens and earth shape, then the earth formed land and sea, then god created life in the sea, then the animals of the land, then finally humans...At the very least you have to be impressed with how close this spoken word, passed down for generations and finally into text, came to what we with all our knowledge know. This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them. I mean if you explained how the universe came into existence to a 5 year old, and they went and explained it to other 5 year olds, it just might sound something like that

Yeah, except it wasn't. First, you seem to forget that Genesis isn't as clear on that order as you present. You see, in chapter 1 of Genesis, it does appear to be in the correct evolutionary order. But, then, in chapter 2, the writer of Genesis changed their mind, and insisted that Man was created first, then all of the other animals. Also, there seems to be a little trouble with the physics even in Genesis, Chapter 1, You see, God, somehow, apparently created light, before creating the sun, and stars, even though light is generated by the sun, and stars. You want to pretend that Genesis perfectly aligns with our scientific knowledge of the universe. Except it really doesn't.

I never said it perfectly aligns at all, I said they got it suprispingly close considering. Stop making strawmen. And how do you explain a singularity, where ZERO light exists, no spacetime, then a great explosion, filling the universe and spewing vast ammounts of radiation, matter and a shit ton of energy...to scientific toddlers. And then consider these scientific toddlers go on and pass this story on and on. I would say light still holds up, there was plenty of energy, radiation, etc. going on before stars formed.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

To answer the question in the title, Yes, it is.

 

[sakinago]

I’ll hop in. C This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them.

Who thought the earth was flat? that's a myth dreamed up by ...um .... 18th and 19th Century allegedly 'educated atheists'.

Myth of the flat Earth - Wikipedia

Uh...I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the belief that the Earth was flat goes back a great deal further than that. In fact The Early Church ridiculed, and even imprisoned for heresy anyone "silly enough" to suggest that the earth was a sphere:

Christian Topography (547) by the Alexandrian monk Cosmas Indicopleustes, who had travelled as far as Sri Lanka and the source of the Blue Nile, is now widely considered the most valuable geographical document of the early medieval age, although it received relatively little attention from contemporaries. In it, the author repeatedly expounds the doctrine that the universe consists of only two places, the Earth below the firmament and heaven above it. Carefully drawing on arguments from scripture, he describes the Earth as a rectangle, 400 day's journey long by 200 wide, surrounded by four oceans and enclosed by four massive walls which support the firmament. The spherical Earth theory is contemptuously dismissed as "pagan"

So...yeah...the idea that the Earth was flat precedes the 1800's by quite a bit.

Cborg is correct on this. But back to the let there be light. I never claimed that god said that verbatim, that’s what early Jews said...obviously.

 

[Meriweather]

But who was god commanding light from? A command demands that someone be commanded.

Different premise from the Biblical premise that words have power. This author of Genesis was answering the question of how light came into existence. His conclusion? In his thinking light didn't come into existence by something manual, such as rubbing two sticks together. A word brought it into existence--it was spoken into existence.

If you want to tell a different story, or bring more characters into the story, then write a different story. I'm explaining the Genesis story, nothing more, nothing less.

The Greek creation story has chaos and darkness. It says simply that Love was born, and from Love came light. The Greek myth doesn't say how Love was born, or how light came from Love. It simply states this is what occurred.

 

[Mudda]

But who was god commanding light from? A command demands that someone be commanded.

Different premise from the Biblical premise that words have power. This author of Genesis was answering the question of how light came into existence. His conclusion? In his thinking light didn't come into existence by something manual, such as rubbing two sticks together. A word brought it into existence--it was spoken into existence.

If you want to tell a different story, or bring more characters into the story, then write a different story. I'm explaining the Genesis story, nothing more, nothing less.

The Greek creation story has chaos and darkness. It says simply that Love was born, and from Love came light. The Greek myth doesn't say how Love was born, or how light came from Love. It simply states this is what occurred.

So if you didn't know whom god was talking to, why did you respond to my initial question: to whom was god talking to when he said "let there be light"?

 

[hobelim]

It says on page fuckng ONE of the bible, god said "let there be light". When Superman wants to fly, he doesnt say out loud "let me fly", he just flies. See what I'm saying?

For us to know that Superman is flying, does an author use words to describe to us that Superman is flying? Perhaps try looking at it this way. The author did not describe God creating wire, then electricity, and then a light bulb. The author said God commanded light and there was light. Why do you believe God needed an audience? Don't we often use words in simple thoughts? There is no reason to complicate things. God commanded light and there was light. No audience required.

The law was spoken into existence as a light to the nations. The story of the creation of heaven and earth is really very uncomplicated already. Of course it matters if you do or don't understand what the story is even about.

Blindness of the audience must be addressed before anyone can see that light.

Nations didn't exist when the lights went on in our universe.

Ugh.. Is that the best you can do?

Before the law was given as a light that teaches people to distinguish between good and evil, true and false, clean and unclean, etc., the world was without form and void, and darkness covered the face of the deep.

The story of genesis has absolutely nothing whatever to do with the creation of the universe, or the solar system or the first plants, animals or human beings..

 

[Mudda]

It says on page fuckng ONE of the bible, god said "let there be light". When Superman wants to fly, he doesnt say out loud "let me fly", he just flies. See what I'm saying?

For us to know that Superman is flying, does an author use words to describe to us that Superman is flying? Perhaps try looking at it this way. The author did not describe God creating wire, then electricity, and then a light bulb. The author said God commanded light and there was light. Why do you believe God needed an audience? Don't we often use words in simple thoughts? There is no reason to complicate things. God commanded light and there was light. No audience required.

The law was spoken into existence as a light to the nations. The story of the creation of heaven and earth is really very uncomplicated already. Of course it matters if you do or don't understand what the story is even about.

Blindness of the audience must be addressed before anyone can see that light.

Nations didn't exist when the lights went on in our universe.

Ugh.. Is that the best you can do?

Before the law was given as a light that teaches people to distinguish between good and evil, true and false, clean and unclean, etc., the world was without form and void, and darkness covered the face of the deep.

The story of genesis has absolutely nothing whatever to do with the creation of the universe, or the solar system or the first plants, animals or human beings..

lol, nothing in the bible means what's written it seems, because every time I bring something up, someone says "well, what's written is not what it means".

 

[RodISHI]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

I’ll hop in. Considering we’re talking about people who had no concept that the sun was just a star, and the stars were just suns really really far away, that the earth was round, that disease was cause by tiny life, no concept of matter, energy, atoms, elements, the language/vocabulary to even describe this stuff, and thousands of other things we take for granted today...does it not raise eyebrows for you how close they got the creation story (especially compared to any other creation story out there)? There was a great void and emptiness, then boom, then god gave the heavens and earth shape, then the earth formed land and sea, then god created life in the sea, then the animals of the land, then finally humans...At the very least you have to be impressed with how close this spoken word, passed down for generations and finally into text, came to what we with all our knowledge know. This is people who thought the earth was flat and the sun and moon spinned around them. I mean if you explained how the universe came into existence to a 5 year old, and they went and explained it to other 5 year olds, it just might sound something like that

Yeah, except it wasn't. First, you seem to forget that Genesis isn't as clear on that order as you present. You see, in chapter 1 of Genesis, it does appear to be in the correct evolutionary order. But, then, in chapter 2, the writer of Genesis changed their mind, and insisted that Man was created first, then all of the other animals. Also, there seems to be a little trouble with the physics even in Genesis, Chapter 1, You see, God, somehow, apparently created light, before creating the sun, and stars, even though light is generated by the sun, and stars. You want to pretend that Genesis perfectly aligns with our scientific knowledge of the universe. Except it really doesn't.

The forward of the book details in a very brief description the whole aka In the beginning......to the end. Then in brief details that are in the body of the document that are written into the books and chapters that follow.

 

[hobelim]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

Apparently your logic and reasoning abilities are not as amazing as you like to imagine that they are.

If they were you wouldn't be arguing about or trying so desperately to disprove what scripture is not about.

How smart is that?

Are you a really a scientist or a comedian?

 

[RodISHI]

I mean, I get it. After all, my questions put theists in a tight spot.

Funny how you see us in a tight spot while we, relaxed and comfortable, watch as you tie yourself up in knots over something that you say holds no meaning for you. Whatever it is you are seeking, I hope you find it.

Funny how the only way you can stay relaxed, and comfortable is by not honestly answering the question in the OP. And I'm not tied into anything. I found what I was seeking. Reason, and logic.

Apparently your logic and reasoning abilities are not as amazing as you like to imagine that they are.

If they were you wouldn't be arguing about or trying so desperately to disprove what scripture is not about.

How smart is that?

Are you a really a scientist or a comedian?



View attachment 159999

That cartoon is a hoot....

 

[Meriweather]

So if you didn't know whom god was talking to, why did you respond to my initial question: to whom was god talking to when he said "let there be light"?

You are still not listening. I did respond to your question. In the Genesis account, God is not speaking to anyone. I've said this over and over and over and over and over....

The purpose of the Genesis account is to tell how light came into being. According to the Genesis account, the power of God's word brought light into being.

 

[hobelim]

It says on page fuckng ONE of the bible, god said "let there be light". When Superman wants to fly, he doesnt say out loud "let me fly", he just flies. See what I'm saying?

For us to know that Superman is flying, does an author use words to describe to us that Superman is flying? Perhaps try looking at it this way. The author did not describe God creating wire, then electricity, and then a light bulb. The author said God commanded light and there was light. Why do you believe God needed an audience? Don't we often use words in simple thoughts? There is no reason to complicate things. God commanded light and there was light. No audience required.

The law was spoken into existence as a light to the nations. The story of the creation of heaven and earth is really very uncomplicated already. Of course it matters if you do or don't understand what the story is even about.

Blindness of the audience must be addressed before anyone can see that light.

Nations didn't exist when the lights went on in our universe.

Ugh.. Is that the best you can do?

Before the law was given as a light that teaches people to distinguish between good and evil, true and false, clean and unclean, etc., the world was without form and void, and darkness covered the face of the deep.

The story of genesis has absolutely nothing whatever to do with the creation of the universe, or the solar system or the first plants, animals or human beings..

lol, nothing in the bible means what's written it seems, because every time I bring something up, someone says "well, what's written is not what it means".

You like to dismiss the stories as fairy tales or fables but then balk at the revelation of the hidden teaching.

In any fairy tale with talking animals in a mythological place what it means, the teaching conveyed, is not necessarily directly connected to the literal meanings of the words used.

Does this shock you? Am I telling you something that you don't already know?

Are you still angry at God because he let grandma get eaten by the big bad wolf?

sheesh...

When a child asks you for something good to eat for breakfast would you give them a bowl of turds?

What makes you think that when bronze age Hebrew children were hungry to start learning about life in the greater world they were given a load of crap?

 

[hobelim]

So if you didn't know whom god was talking to, why did you respond to my initial question: to whom was god talking to when he said "let there be light"?

You are still not listening. I did respond to your question. In the Genesis account, God is not speaking to anyone. I've said this over and over and over and over and over....

The purpose of the Genesis account is to tell how light came into being. According to the Genesis account, the power of God's word brought light into being.

Ugh.

What is the nature of light from God?

When Jesus said that he was the light of the world was he claiming to be the sun?

 

[Meriweather]

So, I have a question. The creation Truth Foundation, in their statement of faith, claims, “The unique divine inspiration of all the canonical books of the Old and New Testaments as originally given, so that they are infallibly and uniquely authoritative and free from error of any sort, in all matters with which they deal, scientific and historical as well as moral and theological.”

This might be a good time to remind everyone that while a relatively small group of Fundamentalist Christians who take everything in the Bible literally may claim the Bible inerrant in all matters, the greatest majority of Christians point out that Biblical inerrancy pertains to matters of faith.