Is this religion or mental illness?

[eots]

religion as a trigger for schizophrenia[edit]

schizophrenia can be triggered by a variety of environmental factors, including significant stress, intensely emotional situations, and disturbing or uncomfortable experiences. It is possible that religion itself may be a trigger for schizophrenia; religious imagery is often very grandiose, and defies commonly-held beliefs of what is realistic and natural in the world. Experiencing an intense religious experience may trigger a psychotic episode in those who are vulnerable to them, because religion often requires a believer to suspend their usual idea of what is possible and impossible. This could potentially lead to a psychotic episode due to the shift in realistic thinking; a sufferer may believe that they themselves are religious deities or messiahs, or that god himself is speaking to the individual. It has been shown that those with schizophrenia who suffer from religious delusions are more religious than those who do not suffer from these delusions.[13] it has also been shown that those who suffer from religious delusions are less likely to continue long-term treatment
religion and schizophrenia - wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

schizophrenia is genetic and runs in families.

family statistics
as can be seen from the graph below, schizophrenia definitely has a very significant genetic component. Those who have a third degree relative with schizophrenia are twice as likely to develop schizophrenia as those in the general population. Those with a second degree relative have a several-fold higher incidence of schizophrenia than the general population, and first degree relatives have an incidence of schizophrenia an order of magnitude higher than the general populace. Following are two images that summarize the average risks for developing schizophrenia for different groups of people. (the statistics in the two images vary slightly due to inclusion of different study data).



(image source: Debby tsuang, m.d., m.sc., university of washington/vapshcs, special thanks to dr. Kristin cadenhead, ucsd)

(source: Gottesman, 1991)

it is of much interest, though, that the correlation of schizophrenia between identical twins, who have identical genomes, is less than one-half. This indicates that schizophrenia is not entirely a genetic disease.

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

 

[Smilebong]

Herbert And Catherine Schaible, Faith-Healing Parents, To Hear Evidence In 2 Child Deaths

I don't understand how they were allowed to keep the 2nd child after they let the first one die.

PHILADELPHIA — A Philadelphia couple who believes in faith healing over medicine was ordered Wednesday to stand trial on murder charges in the second pneumonia death of one of their children in a four-year span.

Herbert and Catherine Schaible remained held without bail on third-degree murder charges after their preliminary hearing.

Their two-year-old son Kent died in 2009, followed by 8-month-old Brandon in April. Prosecutors contend both boys were sick for nearly two weeks.

The Schaibles are both third-generation members and former teachers at their small fundamentalist Christian church, the First Century Gospel Church in northeast Philadelphia. They have seven surviving children.

"We believe in divine healing, that Jesus shed blood for our healing and that he died on the cross to break the devil's power," Herbert Schaible, 44, said in a police statement read in court Wednesday. Medicine, he said, "is against our religious beliefs."

Added his wife, in her statement: "It means that we pray and ask to be healed the way that Jesus did when he was on Earth."

A jury had convicted them of involuntary manslaughter in Kent's death, and they were put on 10 years of probation that included orders to seek medical care if any other child got sick.

After Brandon's death, an irate judge found they had violated parole and sent them to prison.

However, defense lawyer Bobby Hoof, fighting the murder charge Wednesday, said Brandon's autopsy states that he had symptoms for just three days.

"It's not unreasonable for parents to wait three days to seek medical care," Hoof argued.

Prosecutors have described the boys' symptoms as "eerily similar," and said they included labored breathing and a refusal to eat. Catherine Schaible's lawyer, though, said her client tried to feed Brandon during his illness, and applied baby powder to keep him comfortable. And the evidence shows he had food in his system, she said.

"This was a mother who certainly, until the very end, was giving this child a lot of love. To take from that that she acted with malice was more than just a stretch," public defender Mythri Jayaraman said after the hearing.

Their pastor, Nelson Clark, has said the Schaibles lost their sons because of a "spiritual lack" in their lives and insisted they would not seek medical care even if another child appeared near death.

Their other children, the oldest nearly 18, are now in foster care.

The Schaibles return to court July 3 to be formally arraigned on murder, involuntary manslaughter, child endangerment and conspiracy charges.

These people are stupid, asinine, do not understand the Bible and should be put in prison. And I have two master's degrees in Theology.

that's as useful as a masters degree in ceramics...
before you ask, I too have a masters in technical theatre and film and minored in electrical engineering.
the point is, so the fuck what...

"So the fuck what?" Bitter much?
I have studied the Bible for many years and understand how it speaks to healing. What they are doing is not what the Bible teaches. And if I needed to I could defend that statement.

Just because you reject the Bible does not mean that my education is useless.

I know people who have degrees in Ceramic Engineering, and their education is very useful. They developed the ceramic tiles on the Space Shuttle.

Go be bitter with someone else.

 

[eots]

FDA tracks rising impact of the 'placebo effect' in antipsychotic trials

June 22, 2012 | By John Carroll
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One of the big conundrums in the neurosciences branch of drug discovery is the ever-present threat that a therapy that delivered sterling proof-of-concept data in Phase II will go down to defeat in late-stage studies, often because the placebo response suddenly spikes. That placebo wild card helped drive GlaxoSmithKline ($GSK) and others out of CNS. And now a study by the FDA underscores how rising placebo responses have been eroding the treatment benefits that have been recorded in schizophrenia studies over the past two decades.



FDA tracks rising impact of the 'placebo effect' in antipsychotic trials - FierceBiotech FDA tracks rising impact of the 'placebo effect' in antipsychotic trials - FierceBiotech
Subscribe at FierceBiotech

 

[eots]

I think what is interesting about crazy peoples delusions is they are on some level correct...some common delusion like everything is wiretapped the tv and computer is listening to me..are in fact based in reality..even thinking they are a messiah is a recognition of the divine in all..i believe these staes of mind we call psychosis in fact information overload the by-pass filter is allowing to much information to process

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHoKnrw9I7Q]Doors of Perception... Out of the jar....mash up by eots - YouTube[/ame]

 

[daws101]

These people are stupid, asinine, do not understand the Bible and should be put in prison. And I have two master's degrees in Theology.

that's as useful as a masters degree in ceramics...
before you ask, I too have a masters in technical theatre and film and minored in electrical engineering.
the point is, so the fuck what...

"So the fuck what?" Bitter much?
I have studied the Bible for many years and understand how it speaks to healing. What they are doing is not what the Bible teaches. And if I needed to I could defend that statement.

Just because you reject the Bible does not mean that my education is useless.

I know people who have degrees in Ceramic Engineering, and their education is very useful. They developed the ceramic tiles on the Space Shuttle.

Go be bitter with someone else.

the bible says whatever you want it to say...
the old bitter ploy! get some new material already.
btw ceramics and ceramic engineering are two separate fields...
you knew what I was inferring...got to give you some cred for a good dodge!

 

[daws101]

schizophrenia is genetic and runs in families.

family statistics
as can be seen from the graph below, schizophrenia definitely has a very significant genetic component. Those who have a third degree relative with schizophrenia are twice as likely to develop schizophrenia as those in the general population. Those with a second degree relative have a several-fold higher incidence of schizophrenia than the general population, and first degree relatives have an incidence of schizophrenia an order of magnitude higher than the general populace. Following are two images that summarize the average risks for developing schizophrenia for different groups of people. (the statistics in the two images vary slightly due to inclusion of different study data).



(image source: Debby tsuang, m.d., m.sc., university of washington/vapshcs, special thanks to dr. Kristin cadenhead, ucsd)

(source: Gottesman, 1991)

it is of much interest, though, that the correlation of schizophrenia between identical twins, who have identical genomes, is less than one-half. This indicates that schizophrenia is not entirely a genetic disease.

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

wow.. you can read!

 

[Smilebong]

that's as useful as a masters degree in ceramics...
before you ask, I too have a masters in technical theatre and film and minored in electrical engineering.
the point is, so the fuck what...

"So the fuck what?" Bitter much?
I have studied the Bible for many years and understand how it speaks to healing. What they are doing is not what the Bible teaches. And if I needed to I could defend that statement.

Just because you reject the Bible does not mean that my education is useless.

I know people who have degrees in Ceramic Engineering, and their education is very useful. They developed the ceramic tiles on the Space Shuttle.

Go be bitter with someone else.

the bible says whatever you want it to say...
the old bitter ploy! get some new material already.
btw ceramics and ceramic engineering are two separate fields...
you knew what I was inferring...got to give you some cred for a good dodge!

No, the Bible does not say whatever you want it to say. It is interpreted the same way any document is, according to the normal rules of grammar and logic.

 

[SillyWabbit]

Convict them and then when they get deathly ill, tell them to pray for God to save them. If they suffer, tell them it is God's will. If they die, that is God's will as well.

They have suffered enough. Its not like they did anything active to give the kid freaking pnuemonia.

If we want to live in a free society we have to tolerate things such as this.

I'm not going to go with "tolerate" so much as "send the assholes to prison and keep their living kids away from them and people like them who'll just let a child die like that." But that's just me.

 

[daws101]

"So the fuck what?" Bitter much?
I have studied the Bible for many years and understand how it speaks to healing. What they are doing is not what the Bible teaches. And if I needed to I could defend that statement.

Just because you reject the Bible does not mean that my education is useless.

I know people who have degrees in Ceramic Engineering, and their education is very useful. They developed the ceramic tiles on the Space Shuttle.

Go be bitter with someone else.

the bible says whatever you want it to say...
the old bitter ploy! get some new material already.
btw ceramics and ceramic engineering are two separate fields...
you knew what I was inferring...got to give you some cred for a good dodge!

No, the Bible does not say whatever you want it to say. It is interpreted the same way any document is, according to the normal rules of grammar and logic.

 

[Gadawg73]

Religion is belief.
Mental illness is a disease, something that can not be influenced by religious beliefs.

 

[Gadawg73]

schizophrenia is genetic and runs in families.

family statistics
as can be seen from the graph below, schizophrenia definitely has a very significant genetic component. Those who have a third degree relative with schizophrenia are twice as likely to develop schizophrenia as those in the general population. Those with a second degree relative have a several-fold higher incidence of schizophrenia than the general population, and first degree relatives have an incidence of schizophrenia an order of magnitude higher than the general populace. Following are two images that summarize the average risks for developing schizophrenia for different groups of people. (the statistics in the two images vary slightly due to inclusion of different study data).



(image source: Debby tsuang, m.d., m.sc., university of washington/vapshcs, special thanks to dr. Kristin cadenhead, ucsd)

(source: Gottesman, 1991)

it is of much interest, though, that the correlation of schizophrenia between identical twins, who have identical genomes, is less than one-half. This indicates that schizophrenia is not entirely a genetic disease.

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

LOL, take your shades off and take another look at these statistics.
They are that the overall population rates with the relation %.
Uh, hate to bust the news to you but ALL schizophrenics have parents!
Again, read the stats again, will give you the benefit of the doubt this time.

 

[daws101]

family statistics
as can be seen from the graph below, schizophrenia definitely has a very significant genetic component. Those who have a third degree relative with schizophrenia are twice as likely to develop schizophrenia as those in the general population. Those with a second degree relative have a several-fold higher incidence of schizophrenia than the general population, and first degree relatives have an incidence of schizophrenia an order of magnitude higher than the general populace. Following are two images that summarize the average risks for developing schizophrenia for different groups of people. (the statistics in the two images vary slightly due to inclusion of different study data).



(image source: Debby tsuang, m.d., m.sc., university of washington/vapshcs, special thanks to dr. Kristin cadenhead, ucsd)

(source: Gottesman, 1991)

it is of much interest, though, that the correlation of schizophrenia between identical twins, who have identical genomes, is less than one-half. This indicates that schizophrenia is not entirely a genetic disease.

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

LOL, take your shades off and take another look at these statistics.
They are that the overall population rates with the relation %.
Uh, hate to bust the news to you but ALL schizophrenics have parents!
Again, read the stats again, will give you the benefit of the doubt this time.

yes the y do ...what's your point? if schizophrenia is genetic then one of the parents would have to have it or be a carrier..or does schizophrenia skip generations?

 

[eots]

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

LOL, take your shades off and take another look at these statistics.
They are that the overall population rates with the relation %.
Uh, hate to bust the news to you but ALL schizophrenics have parents!
Again, read the stats again, will give you the benefit of the doubt this time.

yes the y do ...what's your point? if schizophrenia is genetic then one of the parents would have to have it or be a carrier..or does schizophrenia skip generations?

or is it an illness that is not genetic and the cause or causes are yet unknown

 

[eots]

Tyronne Cannon reviewed the situation, stating: "Previous twin studies have reported estimates of broad heritability ranging from 0.41 to 0.87"[12] Yet, in the "Pairs of Veteran Twins" study, for example, 338 pairs were schizophrenic with only 26 pairs concordant, and it was concluded in one report: "the role of the suggested genetic factor appears to be a limited one; 85 percent of the affected monozygotic pairs in the sample were discordant for schizophrenia".[16] This is in line with a large Swedish study of 12884 twin pairs, were 249 had a psychotich disorder, and the found a statistically significant impact of shared environment while no significant impact of shared genes.[17] In addition, some scientists criticize the methodology of the twin studies, and have argued that the genetic basis of schizophrenia is still largely unknown or open to different interpretations.[13]
For example, although the concordance of schizophrenia occurrence in monozygotic twins has traditionally been used to estimate a genetic component to the illness, the results could be skewed because of environmental factors like a shared placenta[18][19][20]

Causes of schizophrenia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Gadawg73]

depending on whos statistics you read between 60-70 % of those diagnosed with schizophrenia have no close relation with schizophrenia and correlation is not causation.. It could be speculated those with one or two schizophrenic parents are because of the psychological effects of being raised by schizophrenics...as of yet there is no genetic marker for schizophrenia and no diagnostic test of any kind for schizophrenia no explanation for why many people only ever have one schizophrenic episode in a lifetime or why large numbers can be brought out of psychosis with no more than a sugar pill

LOL, take your shades off and take another look at these statistics.
They are that the overall population rates with the relation %.
Uh, hate to bust the news to you but ALL schizophrenics have parents!
Again, read the stats again, will give you the benefit of the doubt this time.

yes the y do ...what's your point? if schizophrenia is genetic then one of the parents would have to have it or be a carrier..or does schizophrenia skip generations?

No oh clueless one, genes can stay dormant a generation or two.
More studies than one can count on twins that confirm that schizophrenia is genetic.
All genes can skip a generation or two and be dormant.
Everyone carries some things in them that their relatives have, they are dormant in some and some get it.
Most everything about you is genetic, the blue print of your life.
No way schizophrenia could be anything else anyway. I have dealt with schizophrenics for many years. No way what they have is from an environment.

 

[eots]

LOL, take your shades off and take another look at these statistics.
They are that the overall population rates with the relation %.
Uh, hate to bust the news to you but ALL schizophrenics have parents!
Again, read the stats again, will give you the benefit of the doubt this time.

yes the y do ...what's your point? if schizophrenia is genetic then one of the parents would have to have it or be a carrier..or does schizophrenia skip generations?

No oh clueless one, genes can stay dormant a generation or two.
More studies than one can count on twins that confirm that schizophrenia is genetic.
All genes can skip a generation or two and be dormant.
Everyone carries some things in them that their relatives have, they are dormant in some and some get it.
Most everything about you is genetic, the blue print of your life.
No way schizophrenia could be anything else anyway. I have dealt with schizophrenics for many years. No way what they have is from an environment.

Saying nothing but genes that could cause schizophrenic symptoms is a ridiculous statement and at this point in time there is no conclusive genetic cause or gene identified for schizophrenia...so you are free to speculate their one day will be...but to say there is at this time is not a statement of fact

 

[hobelim]

yes the y do ...what's your point? if schizophrenia is genetic then one of the parents would have to have it or be a carrier..or does schizophrenia skip generations?

No oh clueless one, genes can stay dormant a generation or two.
More studies than one can count on twins that confirm that schizophrenia is genetic.
All genes can skip a generation or two and be dormant.
Everyone carries some things in them that their relatives have, they are dormant in some and some get it.
Most everything about you is genetic, the blue print of your life.
No way schizophrenia could be anything else anyway. I have dealt with schizophrenics for many years. No way what they have is from an environment.

Saying nothing but genes that could cause schizophrenic symptoms is a ridiculous statement and at this point in time there is no conclusive genetic cause or gene identified for schizophrenia...so you are free to speculate their one day will be...but to say there is at this time is not a statement of fact

Since most people suffering from schizophrenia have delusions, hallucinations, paranoia, etc, that are entirely based on religious ideations , religious beliefs in their heads must have something to do with their disturbing symptoms and mental illness.

Filling their heads with more irrational religious beliefs certainly won't make them well anymore than chemical straight jackets will if the cause of their mental incoherence is not extirpated.

 

[koshergrl]

Here we go again. The progressive loons trying to find new ways to justify criminalizing Christianity, while at the same time seeking ways to lock up those who refuse to recant.

 

[hobelim]

Here we go again. The progressive loons trying to find new ways to justify criminalizing Christianity, while at the same time seeking ways to lock up those who refuse to recant.

Right, like irrational religious beliefs have nothing to do with the cause of suffering of millions of people who are a danger to themselves and others because they are afraid the devil is trying to possess them or the world is going to end or their children are possessed or they are about to float up into the sky to meet the Jesus mothership.

And like its not criminal to fuck up peoples minds for life trying to get 10% of their income for life.