Zone1 Jesus' truth

[Cougarbear]

EL is always a short version of Elohim. You best tell Jesus-John 20:17

The fact is, El refers to the almighty God. But, as scholars will tell you if you would study others besides your pathetic false prophet scholars, El also refers to Jehovah as well. As it should. Father and Son are both our almighty Gods. Your issue is you get caught up in semantics and force things to fit into your narrative. So, let me help here.

First in that scripture, what is being pointed out is that Jesus is not trying to take the place of Elohim, the Father of all spirits and mankind. Again, Jesus is the Son of God making him a God. This actually fits the LDS doctrine of the trinity and not the mainstream Christian doctrine that there is but one God manifested into 3 personages. Instead, this scripture proves the LDS doctrine that there are 3 separate personages of a Godhead, two of them Father and Son God. And, that Jesus does not attempt to usurp Father God in Heaven's position as the Most High God, Elohim. "God" is a title, not a name. Once you understand that, you can move on from your narrative and understand doctrine better.

 

[ninja007]

When was Jesus ever God--Psalm 45:7--he has a God-prior to earth,) John 20:17-He has a God while on earth)--Rev 3:12 he has a God while back in heaven.

the word was with God- Jesus was never created.

 

[ninja007]

Jesus can, His God gave him all authority



Jesus' God gave him all authority in heaven and on earth, so yes he can if God says he can.
Your statement is basically telling God that his decision on the matter is wrong.

Isaiah 44:24
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update
​

24 Thus says the Lord, your aRedeemer, and the one who bformed you from the womb,

“I, the Lord, am the maker of all things,

cStretching out the heavens by Myself

And spreading out the earth 1all alone,

 

[ninja007]

When was Jesus ever God--Psalm 45:7--he has a God-prior to earth,) John 20:17-He has a God while on earth)--Rev 3:12 he has a God while back in heaven.

Isaiah 44:24
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update
​

24 Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb,

“I, the Lord, am the maker of all things,

cStretching out the heavens by Myself

And spreading out the earth 1all alone,

 

[ninja007]

You best check the facts- The Hebrew scholars say that statement in the OT translates-i will be what i will be, NOT i am that i am. Jesus is not called capitol G God in the Greek lexicons the way its worded. You best recheck the facts.

First and Last

1. How many firsts and lasts are there? In the Bible, God is called the first and last and so is Jesus. Since God says there is no God apart from Him and Jesus and God are both addressed by the same title, then that poses a problem for the Jehovah’s Witness.
   1. Isaiah 44:6, “This is what the LORD says, -Israel’s King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”
   2. Revelation 1:8, “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”
   3. Revelation 1:17-18, “When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.”
      1. Obviously, Rev. 1:17-18 can only refer to Jesus.
   4. Revelation 22:12-13, “Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to every one according to what he has done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.”
      1. Here, both the “Alpha and the Omega” and the “First and the Last” are said to be one and the same.
      2. Also, at this point go to Titus 2:13 where it says that Jesus is the one who is coming soon; therefore, Jesus and Jehovah are the same.

 

[kjw47]

The fact is, El refers to the almighty God. But, as scholars will tell you if you would study others besides your pathetic false prophet scholars, El also refers to Jehovah as well. As it should. Father and Son are both our almighty Gods. Your issue is you get caught up in semantics and force things to fit into your narrative. So, let me help here.

First in that scripture, what is being pointed out is that Jesus is not trying to take the place of Elohim, the Father of all spirits and mankind. Again, Jesus is the Son of God making him a God. This actually fits the LDS doctrine of the trinity and not the mainstream Christian doctrine that there is but one God manifested into 3 personages. Instead, this scripture proves the LDS doctrine that there are 3 separate personages of a Godhead, two of them Father and Son God. And, that Jesus does not attempt to usurp Father God in Heaven's position as the Most High God, Elohim. "God" is a title, not a name. Once you understand that, you can move on from your narrative and understand doctrine better.

Jehovah is the only true God, he is the Father.

 

[kjw47]

the word was with God- Jesus was never created.

Yes he was with God after God created him=The FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION.
But in plain English your 2nd line at John 1:1 reads-And God(word) was with God--how many Gods does that make?

 

[kjw47]

Isaiah 44:24​

New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update​

​

24 Thus says the Lord, your aRedeemer, and the one who bformed you from the womb,

“I, the Lord, am the maker of all things,

cStretching out the heavens by Myself

And spreading out the earth 1all alone,

Yes, Jehovah is the only one with the wisdom and power to create anything. That is what is being said.

 

[kjw47]

First and Last

1. How many firsts and lasts are there? In the Bible, God is called the first and last and so is Jesus. Since God says there is no God apart from Him and Jesus and God are both addressed by the same title, then that poses a problem for the Jehovah’s Witness.
   1. Isaiah 44:6, “This is what the LORD says, -Israel’s King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”
   2. Revelation 1:8, “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”
   3. Revelation 1:17-18, “When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.”
      1. Obviously, Rev. 1:17-18 can only refer to Jesus.
   4. Revelation 22:12-13, “Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to every one according to what he has done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.”
      1. Here, both the “Alpha and the Omega” and the “First and the Last” are said to be one and the same.
      2. Also, at this point go to Titus 2:13 where it says that Jesus is the one who is coming soon; therefore, Jesus and Jehovah are the same.

In a real translation, that supports Gods will over satans will-Isaiah 44:6 reads-This is what Jehovah says.
Jesus is coming to do Jehovah's will, thus in that sense Jehovah is coming as well.
Jehovah speaks every spot about the Alpha and Omega.

Jesus is first and last in many things-1) First born of all creation-created direct-first and last
Gods appointed king from heaven= first and last
Sent to earth from heaven as a ransom sacrifice=first and last.
Etc.

 

[The Irish Ram]

your problem is your not God and trying to put him in your human mind box.

They called Jesus Emanuel ~ God with us.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Yes, Jehovah is the only one with the wisdom and power to create anything. That is what is being said.

John 1:1-5 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.

 

[Cougarbear]

Jehovah is the only true God, he is the Father.

You refuse to even try to understand. I wrote what I did from what biblical scholars have said. “God” is a title, not his name. Both Father and Son God are God’s of this world and universe. The Father directs the Son and the Son does all things with the purpose of glorifying the Father.

 

[kjw47]

John 1:1-5 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.

The word is not called capitol G God in the Greek lexicons. --All( other) things were made through him---see the words through him-that means another actually did it=his God and Father=YHVH(Jehovah)
It worked the same through Moses, Moses didn't part the red sea, YHVH(Jehovah) God parted it through Moses.

 

[kjw47]

You refuse to even try to understand. I wrote what I did from what biblical scholars have said. “God” is a title, not his name. Both Father and Son God are God’s of this world and universe. The Father directs the Son and the Son does all things with the purpose of glorifying the Father.

There are no Gods as you suggest, there is one God=The Father-1Cor 8:6

 

[Cougarbear]

There are no Gods as you suggest, there is one God=The Father-1Cor 8:6

Genesis says there are. “Man has become as one of “us.” Matt:28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
The Godhead…God is a title, not His name.

 

[kjw47]

Genesis says there are. “Man has become as one of “us.” Matt:28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
The Godhead…God is a title, not His name.

us= YHVH(Jehovah) and the one beside him during the creation process=Gods master worker( Jesus)( Prov 8:30)
John 12:28--Father glorify YOUR name)
Our Father who art in heaven hallowed be YOUR name,))) --not our name.
John 17:6-I have made ( Father)YOUR name manifest)---not our name.
John 17:26- I have made ( Father)YOUR name known to them and will make it known

 

[Cougarbear]

us= YHVH(Jehovah) and the one beside him during the creation process=Gods master worker( Jesus)( Prov 8:30)
John 12:28--Father glorify YOUR name)
Our Father who art in heaven hallowed be YOUR name,))) --not our name.
John 17:6-I have made ( Father)YOUR name manifest)---not our name.
John 17:26- I have made ( Father)YOUR name known to them and will make it known

That’s not what the Bible says. You are making up who “us” is and the rest. None of it is Biblical.
To be clear, if Jesus or Jehovah says “I have made your name” does not explain Jesus or Jehovah’s position at all. Father could turn around and say, “This is my beloved Son hear ye him.” And, the Father has done just that.

 

[ninja007]

Yes he was with God after God created him=The FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION.
But in plain English your 2nd line at John 1:1 reads-And God(word) was with God--how many Gods does that make?

first born doesnt mean what you think. Note that Jesus is the firstborn over all creation, not the firstborn of all creation. Another way to say it is that Jesus has a unique pre-eminence or supremacy over all of creation, which He must have because He created everything (Colossians 1:15,16; Hebrews 1:2,10). Only God created all things. So Jesus is God; He is not the angel Michael.

 

[ninja007]

The Jehovah's Witness Bible (The New World Translation) is the only version that translates the final portion of John 1:1 as "the Word was a god." All others versions translate this as "the Word was God" or "God was the Word."

 

[kjw47]

That’s not what the Bible says. You are making up who “us” is and the rest. None of it is Biblical.
To be clear, if Jesus or Jehovah says “I have made your name” does not explain Jesus or Jehovah’s position at all. Father could turn around and say, “This is my beloved Son hear ye him.” And, the Father has done just that.

I am not making it up. Jesus was the one beside God during the creation process. He is Gods master worker. He gives God 100% credit for creating at Prov 8.