Liberalism and Limitless Welfare: An Explanation.

[PoliticalChic]

William Voegeli spoke at Hillsdale College in October, analyzing why, with inordinate growth and very little in results of solving poverty, "liberals do not seem all that concerned about whether the machine they’ve built, and want to keep expanding, is running well.

For inflation-adjusted, per capita federal welfare state spending to increase by 254 percent from 1977 to 2013, without a correspondingly dramatic reduction in poverty, and for liberals to react to this phenomenon by taking the position that our welfare state’s only real defect is that it is insufficiently generous,..."


No...not insanity, although one could make that argument.
Voegeli explains it as a different twist of their psyche.




1. "....while the welfare state was growing constantly, liberals were insisting constantly it wasn’t big enough or growing fast enough..... the welfare state is a permanent work-in-progress, and its liberal advocates believe that however many resources it has, it always needs a great deal more.

2. [We are left with] two of the journalist’s standard questions:
What is the liberal disposition regarding the growth of the welfare state? ....
Why do liberals feel that no matter how much we’re doing through government programs to alleviate and prevent poverty, whatever we are doing is shamefully inadequate?




3. [From a policy perspective,] Progressives of a century ago, followed by New Deal and Great Society liberals, worked to transform a republic where the government had limited duties and powers into a nation where there were no grievances the government could or should refrain from addressing, and where no means of responding to those grievances lie outside the scope of the government’s legitimate authority.




4. If we make ...an effort to understand committed liberals as they understand themselves—then we have to understand them as people who, by their own account, get up every morning asking, “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?” ....the question of liberal compassion,....

a. Empathetic kindness is “what binds us together, and . . . how we’ve always moved forward, based on the idea that we have a stake in each other’s success.” [These are the] Arguments and rhetoric that work—that impress voters and intimidate opponents—are used again and again.




5. [But] disciplining government according to “measured provable performance and effective spending” ought to be a “completely philosophically neutral objective.” Skinflint conservatives want government to be thrifty for obvious reasons, but ... liberals’ motivations should be even stronger.

a. ‘You [Liberals] ought to be the most offended of anybody if a dollar that could help a poor person is being squandered in some way.’"
Current Issue

 

[frigidweirdo]

William Voegeli spoke at Hillsdale College in October, analyzing why, with inordinate growth and very little in results of solving poverty, "liberals do not seem all that concerned about whether the machine they’ve built, and want to keep expanding, is running well.

For inflation-adjusted, per capita federal welfare state spending to increase by 254 percent from 1977 to 2013, without a correspondingly dramatic reduction in poverty, and for liberals to react to this phenomenon by taking the position that our welfare state’s only real defect is that it is insufficiently generous,..."


No...not insanity, although one could make that argument.
Voegeli explains it as a different twist of their psyche.




1. "....while the welfare state was growing constantly, liberals were insisting constantly it wasn’t big enough or growing fast enough..... the welfare state is a permanent work-in-progress, and its liberal advocates believe that however many resources it has, it always needs a great deal more.

2. [We are left with] two of the journalist’s standard questions:
What is the liberal disposition regarding the growth of the welfare state? ....
Why do liberals feel that no matter how much we’re doing through government programs to alleviate and prevent poverty, whatever we are doing is shamefully inadequate?




3. [From a policy perspective,] Progressives of a century ago, followed by New Deal and Great Society liberals, worked to transform a republic where the government had limited duties and powers into a nation where there were no grievances the government could or should refrain from addressing, and where no means of responding to those grievances lie outside the scope of the government’s legitimate authority.




4. If we make ...an effort to understand committed liberals as they understand themselves—then we have to understand them as people who, by their own account, get up every morning asking, “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?” ....the question of liberal compassion,....

a. Empathetic kindness is “what binds us together, and . . . how we’ve always moved forward, based on the idea that we have a stake in each other’s success.” [These are the] Arguments and rhetoric that work—that impress voters and intimidate opponents—are used again and again.




5. [But] disciplining government according to “measured provable performance and effective spending” ought to be a “completely philosophically neutral objective.” Skinflint conservatives want government to be thrifty for obvious reasons, but ... liberals’ motivations should be even stronger.

a. ‘You [Liberals] ought to be the most offended of anybody if a dollar that could help a poor person is being squandered in some way.’"
Current Issue

Do the right care if it's running well? They care if they profit out of it, they don't care if lives are lost, in fact they seem to encourage people getting themselves killed for the cause of making more rich people richer.

 

[eagle1462010]

I've posted an opinion on other threads this morning that went something like the following..........

As an electrician I always look for the core problem when troubleshooting a faulty electrical circuit...............To fix the problem correctly and once and for all..............

A Liberal/prog electrician doesn't fix the real problem.......The underlying problem............When they a fuse blow they just put in a bigger fuse to fix it...........but it never fixed why the fuse blew the first time..............The underlying problem gets worse.............bigger fuse...........and continue to put in bigger fuses to keep the circuit going until they BURN THE HOUSE DOWN...............Because they refuse to address the real problem, and ignore repairing it by taking the temp easy way out by putting in larger fuses.....................

Minimum wage being an example................Common core another.............Their economic fixes are band aides...........They don't fix the underlying problems with our economy and standard of living..............As the current of lower standards increases they go.............bigger fuse.............more minimum wage..........problem repeats....................

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

 

[Brucethethinker]

liberals... “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?”

Liberals think with their heart, not their brain. They use their brains for some things, but not for political thought. The welfare programs exist for one purpose, to get liberals/demonrats elected. If poverty were to end, look at all the votes the liberal/demonrats would lose? It would be a disaster. Liberal programs exist not to end poverty, but to increase it, and thereby increase the political power of the left.

 

[frigidweirdo]

I've posted an opinion on other threads this morning that went something like the following..........

As an electrician I always look for the core problem when troubleshooting a faulty electrical circuit...............To fix the problem correctly and once and for all..............

A Liberal/prog electrician doesn't fix the real problem.......The underlying problem............When they a fuse blow they just put in a bigger fuse to fix it...........but it never fixed why the fuse blew the first time..............The underlying problem gets worse.............bigger fuse...........and continue to put in bigger fuses to keep the circuit going until they BURN THE HOUSE DOWN...............Because they refuse to address the real problem, and ignore repairing it by taking the temp easy way out by putting in larger fuses.....................

Minimum wage being an example................Common core another.............Their economic fixes are band aides...........They don't fix the underlying problems with our economy and standard of living..............As the current of lower standards increases they go.............bigger fuse.............more minimum wage..........problem repeats....................

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

And the republicans are any better? No, they're not. They don't even bother trying to fix the problem. The problem is good for them. They're like the electrician who always does a shoddy job, so he gets called out time and time and time again.

 

[frigidweirdo]

liberals... “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?”

Liberals think with their heart, not their brain. They use their brains for some things, but not for political thought. The welfare programs exist for one purpose, to get liberals/demonrats elected. If poverty were to end, look at all the votes the liberal/demonrats would lose? It would be a disaster. Liberal programs exist not to end poverty, but to increase it, and thereby increase the political power of the left.

And republicans think with what? Not their brains either....

 

[Brucethethinker]

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

What makes one electrician better than another? Some would say the better electrician is the one that does the better work. Others might say the better electrician is the one who makes the most money. I'm sure you've seen people make more money by doing poor work than they do by doing good work. By changing the fuse, that electrician will keep getting called back, until the house burns down of course. But by that time he'll have made more money than the electrician who actually fixes the problem, and never gets called back.

 

[Moonglow]

liberals... “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?”

Liberals think with their heart, not their brain. They use their brains for some things, but not for political thought. The welfare programs exist for one purpose, to get liberals/demonrats elected. If poverty were to end, look at all the votes the liberal/demonrats would lose? It would be a disaster. Liberal programs exist not to end poverty, but to increase it, and thereby increase the political power of the left.

And republicans think with what? Not their brains either....

They are claiming that only conservatives know what is right with the USA....You know the Rand Paul kind...

 

[eagle1462010]

I've posted an opinion on other threads this morning that went something like the following..........

As an electrician I always look for the core problem when troubleshooting a faulty electrical circuit...............To fix the problem correctly and once and for all..............

A Liberal/prog electrician doesn't fix the real problem.......The underlying problem............When they a fuse blow they just put in a bigger fuse to fix it...........but it never fixed why the fuse blew the first time..............The underlying problem gets worse.............bigger fuse...........and continue to put in bigger fuses to keep the circuit going until they BURN THE HOUSE DOWN...............Because they refuse to address the real problem, and ignore repairing it by taking the temp easy way out by putting in larger fuses.....................

Minimum wage being an example................Common core another.............Their economic fixes are band aides...........They don't fix the underlying problems with our economy and standard of living..............As the current of lower standards increases they go.............bigger fuse.............more minimum wage..........problem repeats....................

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

And the republicans are any better? No, they're not. They don't even bother trying to fix the problem. The problem is good for them. They're like the electrician who always does a shoddy job, so he gets called out time and time and time again.

Who says I agree with them lock stock and barrel........If they are a shitty electrician then they are a shitty electrician........Doesn't matter on the party.

 

[Moonglow]

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

What makes one electrician better than another? Some would say the better electrician is the one that does the better work. Others might say the better electrician is the one who makes the most money. I'm sure you've seen people make more money by doing poor work than they do by doing good work. By changing the fuse, that electrician will keep getting called back, until the house burns down of course. But by that time he'll have made more money than the electrician who actually fixes the problem, and never gets called back.

I am just looking for an electrician to get these shorts outta my azz....

 

[Rotagilla]

William Voegeli spoke at Hillsdale College in October, analyzing why, with inordinate growth and very little in results of solving poverty, "liberals do not seem all that concerned about whether the machine they’ve built, and want to keep expanding, is running well.

For inflation-adjusted, per capita federal welfare state spending to increase by 254 percent from 1977 to 2013, without a correspondingly dramatic reduction in poverty, and for liberals to react to this phenomenon by taking the position that our welfare state’s only real defect is that it is insufficiently generous,..."


No...not insanity, although one could make that argument.
Voegeli explains it as a different twist of their psyche.




1. "....while the welfare state was growing constantly, liberals were insisting constantly it wasn’t big enough or growing fast enough..... the welfare state is a permanent work-in-progress, and its liberal advocates believe that however many resources it has, it always needs a great deal more.

2. [We are left with] two of the journalist’s standard questions:
What is the liberal disposition regarding the growth of the welfare state? ....
Why do liberals feel that no matter how much we’re doing through government programs to alleviate and prevent poverty, whatever we are doing is shamefully inadequate?




3. [From a policy perspective,] Progressives of a century ago, followed by New Deal and Great Society liberals, worked to transform a republic where the government had limited duties and powers into a nation where there were no grievances the government could or should refrain from addressing, and where no means of responding to those grievances lie outside the scope of the government’s legitimate authority.




4. If we make ...an effort to understand committed liberals as they understand themselves—then we have to understand them as people who, by their own account, get up every morning asking, “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?” ....the question of liberal compassion,....

a. Empathetic kindness is “what binds us together, and . . . how we’ve always moved forward, based on the idea that we have a stake in each other’s success.” [These are the] Arguments and rhetoric that work—that impress voters and intimidate opponents—are used again and again.




5. [But] disciplining government according to “measured provable performance and effective spending” ought to be a “completely philosophically neutral objective.” Skinflint conservatives want government to be thrifty for obvious reasons, but ... liberals’ motivations should be even stronger.

a. ‘You [Liberals] ought to be the most offended of anybody if a dollar that could help a poor person is being squandered in some way.’"
Current Issue

Do the right care if it's running well? They care if they profit out of it, they don't care if lives are lost, in fact they seem to encourage people getting themselves killed for the cause of making more rich people richer.

marxist doubletalk/class envy

the evil rich.....

 

[eagle1462010]

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

What makes one electrician better than another? Some would say the better electrician is the one that does the better work. Others might say the better electrician is the one who makes the most money. I'm sure you've seen people make more money by doing poor work than they do by doing good work. By changing the fuse, that electrician will keep getting called back, until the house burns down of course. But by that time he'll have made more money than the electrician who actually fixes the problem, and never gets called back.

Which is a matter of ethics and the morality of that person.

I'll fix the problem the first time, and do it correctly..........Even if I could make more money doing the opposite FOR THE SHORT TERM...........because the bad electrician will only gain for a while..........as the one that does the job right for a reasonable price will get other jobs as HAPPY CUSTOMERS tell others about the service rendered by the one doing the job correctly.

 

[eagle1462010]

It is the repair by an INCOMPETENT ELECTRICIAN...........and the only solution is hiring a REAL ELECTRICIAN to repair the fault...............unless you want your house to burn down.

What makes one electrician better than another? Some would say the better electrician is the one that does the better work. Others might say the better electrician is the one who makes the most money. I'm sure you've seen people make more money by doing poor work than they do by doing good work. By changing the fuse, that electrician will keep getting called back, until the house burns down of course. But by that time he'll have made more money than the electrician who actually fixes the problem, and never gets called back.

I am just looking for an electrician to get these shorts outta my azz....

Crack problems and wedgies are not OHMISH.....

 

[NYcarbineer]

Conservatives got more than they bargained for when they decided to destroy the American middle class.

 

[frigidweirdo]

And the republicans are any better? No, they're not. They don't even bother trying to fix the problem. The problem is good for them. They're like the electrician who always does a shoddy job, so he gets called out time and time and time again.

Who says I agree with them lock stock and barrel........If they are a shitty electrician then they are a shitty electrician........Doesn't matter on the party.[/QUOTE]

But the parties are shoddy. Right to the core.

 

[eagle1462010]

Conservatives got more than they bargained for when they decided to destroy the American middle class.

and here is the proof..........a scam artist electrician...........who will repeatedly tell you the problem is fixed only to see the fuse blow again................

Supporting a party that has added more to the welfare rolls and then saying they fixed it..................

Ignoring the underlying problem all together.

 

[Brucethethinker]

And republicans think with what? Not their brains either....

Not all republicans, but the republican philosophy is more logical. A liberal will do something because it feels good. Conservatives and republicans do things because it creates the result they want. Not 100% of course, but in general I believe it's true.

 

[frigidweirdo]

marxist doubletalk/class envy

the evil rich.....

In certain countries like in Scandinavia, govt is run for the people. In the US it is run for the rich.

Is that rich envy, or just seeing the blatant bull that goes on in US govt?

 

[PoliticalChic]

William Voegeli spoke at Hillsdale College in October, analyzing why, with inordinate growth and very little in results of solving poverty, "liberals do not seem all that concerned about whether the machine they’ve built, and want to keep expanding, is running well.

For inflation-adjusted, per capita federal welfare state spending to increase by 254 percent from 1977 to 2013, without a correspondingly dramatic reduction in poverty, and for liberals to react to this phenomenon by taking the position that our welfare state’s only real defect is that it is insufficiently generous,..."


No...not insanity, although one could make that argument.
Voegeli explains it as a different twist of their psyche.



1. "....while the welfare state was growing constantly, liberals were insisting constantly it wasn’t big enough or growing fast enough..... the welfare state is a permanent work-in-progress, and its liberal advocates believe that however many resources it has, it always needs a great deal more.

2. [We are left with] two of the journalist’s standard questions:
What is the liberal disposition regarding the growth of the welfare state? ....
Why do liberals feel that no matter how much we’re doing through government programs to alleviate and prevent poverty, whatever we are doing is shamefully inadequate?




3. [From a policy perspective,] Progressives of a century ago, followed by New Deal and Great Society liberals, worked to transform a republic where the government had limited duties and powers into a nation where there were no grievances the government could or should refrain from addressing, and where no means of responding to those grievances lie outside the scope of the government’s legitimate authority.




4. If we make ...an effort to understand committed liberals as they understand themselves—then we have to understand them as people who, by their own account, get up every morning asking, “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?” ....the question of liberal compassion,....

a. Empathetic kindness is “what binds us together, and . . . how we’ve always moved forward, based on the idea that we have a stake in each other’s success.” [These are the] Arguments and rhetoric that work—that impress voters and intimidate opponents—are used again and again.




5. [But] disciplining government according to “measured provable performance and effective spending” ought to be a “completely philosophically neutral objective.” Skinflint conservatives want government to be thrifty for obvious reasons, but ... liberals’ motivations should be even stronger.

a. ‘You [Liberals] ought to be the most offended of anybody if a dollar that could help a poor person is being squandered in some way.’"
Current Issue

Do the right care if it's running well? They care if they profit out of it, they don't care if lives are lost, in fact they seem to encourage people getting themselves killed for the cause of making more rich people richer.

"[Democrat] GOV. LAMM ASSERTS ELDERLY, IF VERY ILL, HAVE 'DUTY TO DIE'
DENVER, March 28— Elderly people who are terminally ill have a ''duty to die and get out of the way'' instead of trying to prolong their lives by artificial means, [Democrat] Gov. Richard D. Lamm of Colorado said Tuesday."
GOV. LAMM ASSERTS ELDERLY IF VERY ILL HAVE DUTY TO DIE - NYTimes.com

 

[PoliticalChic]

liberals... “What can I do today so that there’s a little less suffering in the world?”

Liberals think with their heart, not their brain. They use their brains for some things, but not for political thought. The welfare programs exist for one purpose, to get liberals/demonrats elected. If poverty were to end, look at all the votes the liberal/demonrats would lose? It would be a disaster. Liberal programs exist not to end poverty, but to increase it, and thereby increase the political power of the left.

Great point.

I hope you have the time to follow this thread....by this afternoon, I will cover that in detail.