Liberals value education:FALSE

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Standardized testing is no measure of anything other than can a teacher teach only to a test? And if there is history on it that disqualifies it for me. History doesn't teach any skills.

"Teaching to the test" is one of the most misunderstood phrases in education.

So, you don't think we should teach to the test? Classes have certain standards of what they are supposed to learn in a class. The standardized tests are based on those standards to assess if they learn the information or skills necessary. For example, one of my standards is to have students calculate compound interest. I know the test I give them will have several problems on it. There will likely be a question on the standardized test on it, so they better learn it.

I guess if you want to do away with standardized tests, I can just teach whatever I want in my math class, and then when they take the test, I can put things on the test that I never taught. That will make them really appreciate me as a teacher when they fail.

How would you like to learn German and then be tested on French? It is the same concept.

 

[ABikerSailor]

In first grade the children get a quick lesson on addition, subtraction, multiplication and division but are dedicated hand held computers to come up with the right math answers. .........

If that is done anywhere it is sure as hell not the norm.

Can't tell you that. All I can say is the calculators were given to 6 year olds by the system. I think it's as wrong as hell, too.

I didn't get to use a calculator until I got into High School algebra. We were allowed 1 calculator, single function only, no formulas or funky keys that would help you solve the equations.

And yeah...............you SHOULD get the basics of math down before you're allowed to use a calculator.

 

[Jackson]

Standardized testing should not be put in the hands of a private firm. It should be the teachers of the local district who create the test.

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

If they agree to my terms then big deal. If I have money to pay they will strongly consider it. I wouldn't be the first parent to ask this. I would not ask that the class be stopped just that MY kids not be included. That doesn't hurt the school or me.

That's not how it works, for example at our oldest's school students are required to stand for the national anthem and say the pledge, they then have daily prayer which the student is required to remain silent during. Nobody is exempt and all follow the rule

The Catholic schools here have many students who opt out of Religion class. They get study hall. I don't know of anyone they forced to take Religion. There are many students who aren't Catholic but attend one of the many Catholic schools in my area. They also do not have to attend Wednesday Mass or religious pageants or presentations. It is no big deal.

No idea, our children do not attend Catholic schools

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You know, I never had to take a standardized test when I was in school, and I ended up with a pretty decent education. In the 6th grade science, our final was that we had to draw the Tree of Life, all the way from the starting blocks of Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen and Nitrogen, going all the way up through the single cell organisms, to fungus and algae, and then over to one side with the plants, and the other side with the animals, knowing family, phylum and genus for each thing we'd studied that year. I remember the first day of class, the teacher put "CHON" up on the blackboard and told us that was the first answer to the final. I also studied algebra and geometry (really liked geometry), as well as human physiology and other subjects.

But then again, I was educated in Montana. When I married my ex wife, we started to compare schools on occasion, and the stuff I'd learned in middle school in Montana was some of the same stuff she studied as a Junior in high school in Tennessee.

Take out the standardized tests, and actually teach what the books say to teach.

You just have no idea what a standardized test is. That is the problem.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You know, I never had to take a standardized test when I was in school, and I ended up with a pretty decent education. In the 6th grade science, our final was that we had to draw the Tree of Life, all the way from the starting blocks of Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen and Nitrogen, going all the way up through the single cell organisms, to fungus and algae, and then over to one side with the plants, and the other side with the animals, knowing family, phylum and genus for each thing we'd studied that year. I remember the first day of class, the teacher put "CHON" up on the blackboard and told us that was the first answer to the final. I also studied algebra and geometry (really liked geometry), as well as human physiology and other subjects.

But then again, I was educated in Montana. When I married my ex wife, we started to compare schools on occasion, and the stuff I'd learned in middle school in Montana was some of the same stuff she studied as a Junior in high school in Tennessee.

Take out the standardized tests, and actually teach what the books say to teach.

You just have no idea what a standardized test is. That is the problem.

Actually, I graduated in 1982, before the tests came out.

 

[Jackson]

You know, I never had to take a standardized test when I was in school, and I ended up with a pretty decent education. In the 6th grade science, our final was that we had to draw the Tree of Life, all the way from the starting blocks of Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen and Nitrogen, going all the way up through the single cell organisms, to fungus and algae, and then over to one side with the plants, and the other side with the animals, knowing family, phylum and genus for each thing we'd studied that year. I remember the first day of class, the teacher put "CHON" up on the blackboard and told us that was the first answer to the final. I also studied algebra and geometry (really liked geometry), as well as human physiology and other subjects.

But then again, I was educated in Montana. When I married my ex wife, we started to compare schools on occasion, and the stuff I'd learned in middle school in Montana was some of the same stuff she studied as a Junior in high school in Tennessee.

Take out the standardized tests, and actually teach what the books say to teach.

You just have no idea what a standardized test is. That is the problem.

Actually, I graduated in 1982, before the tests came out.

I was teaching in 82 and the tests were there long before that.

 

[Unkotare]

In first grade the children get a quick lesson on addition, subtraction, multiplication and division but are dedicated hand held computers to come up with the right math answers. .........

If that is done anywhere it is sure as hell not the norm.

Can't tell you that. ....

Then you would admit your statement was far too categorical?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Standardized testing should not be put in the hands of a private firm. It should be the teachers of the local district who create the test.

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You know, I never had to take a standardized test when I was in school, and I ended up with a pretty decent education. In the 6th grade science, our final was that we had to draw the Tree of Life, all the way from the starting blocks of Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen and Nitrogen, going all the way up through the single cell organisms, to fungus and algae, and then over to one side with the plants, and the other side with the animals, knowing family, phylum and genus for each thing we'd studied that year. I remember the first day of class, the teacher put "CHON" up on the blackboard and told us that was the first answer to the final. I also studied algebra and geometry (really liked geometry), as well as human physiology and other subjects.

But then again, I was educated in Montana. When I married my ex wife, we started to compare schools on occasion, and the stuff I'd learned in middle school in Montana was some of the same stuff she studied as a Junior in high school in Tennessee.

Take out the standardized tests, and actually teach what the books say to teach.

You just have no idea what a standardized test is. That is the problem.

Actually, I graduated in 1982, before the tests came out.

I was teaching in 82 and the tests were there long before that.

I was a student starting in 1966 and they had standardized tests all throughout my years in school. You probably had no idea you were taking them.

 

[Jackson]

Standardized testing should not be put in the hands of a private firm. It should be the teachers of the local district who create the test.

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

It cost the jobs of teachers in Atlanta.

 

[Unkotare]

In first grade the children get a quick lesson on addition, subtraction, multiplication and division but are dedicated hand held computers to come up with the right math answers. .........

If that is done anywhere it is sure as hell not the norm.

Can't tell you that. All I can say is the calculators were given to 6 year olds by the system. I think it's as wrong as hell, too.

I didn't get to use a calculator until I got into High School algebra. We were allowed 1 calculator, single function only, no formulas or funky keys that would help you solve the equations.

And yeah...............you SHOULD get the basics of math down before you're allowed to use a calculator.

It is essential that kids learn, at least by the time they reach high school, how to make a calculator spell "boobs" when turned upside down.

 

[Unkotare]

Standardized testing should not be put in the hands of a private firm. It should be the teachers of the local district who create the test.

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

 

[Jackson]

Standardized testing should not be put in the hands of a private firm. It should be the teachers of the local district who create the test.

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

 

[Jackson]

Then the teachers could water down the test to make themselves look good. It should be in the hands of a private firm and the proctor to overwatch the class should not be the teacher. They should never see the test, matter of fact.

Horror stories abound when teacher give their own tests. They have made copies and kept them for teaching, walked around and told students to change wrong answers, changed answers.

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

Some vision-impaired students are allowed accommodations.

 

[Jackson]

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

Some vision-impaired students are allowed accommodations.

Not this one.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Teachers have done that with the standardized tests as well.

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

Was it possible that student was a special education student with an IEP which allowed him or her to have a reader on those tests?

 

[Jackson]

That is what I meant. The teachers should not be part of the evaluation.

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

Was it possible that student was a special education student with an IEP which allowed him or her to have a reader on those tests?

No. He was in a regular classroom with no psych on him and without the help of specialized teachers. But that didn't change the facts that he needed to have an accurate score for evaluations later that year.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That is funny! I test my students on reading, math, science and language arts all at the same time. I test juniors but don't teach a single one of them.

Cheating is cheating, and the quickest way to get fired. You don't think that the companies that produce these tests have not figured out a way to tell that people are cheating? Please!

You don't think there will always be some ahead of those ways and manage to cheat anyway? Please!

Not if they aren't even in the room and don't see the tests.

I was in one classroom where the teacher read the reading passage and questions to the student!! I asked what are you doing???!!!! The answer from the teacher, "Well he can't read it. I read everything to him!"

Was it possible that student was a special education student with an IEP which allowed him or her to have a reader on those tests?

No. He was in a regular classroom with no psych on him and without the help of specialized teachers. But that didn't change the facts that he needed to have an accurate score for evaluations later that year.

Uh, excuse me, but that doesn't mean a thing! Are you a certified teacher? If not, why are you even commenting on things about which you do not know, i.e. special education?

I teach six classes a day and I have special education students in all of them. I have one class that has a special education collaborating teacher.