Libertarians know. Do you?

[gipper]

They love to bitch about Bush invading Iraq but always seem to forget that the asshole Obama fought the war for three years, left before the job was finished and then reintroduced troops. Nothing about him bombing Libya for no damn reason and escalating the war in Afghanistan.

If he didn't withdraw troops from Iraq or escalate in Afghanistan (both of which he promised to do in his campaign), you guys would have been the first to bitch about it.

Here's the reality. There is no difference between D and R on foreign policy. The Zionists say "Jump" and we say, "How High?" We stick our dicks in the hornet's nest and then complain about getting stung. And when some angry kid shoots up a nightclub or straps a bomb onto himself, we crap ourselves that the Muslims are going to get us all!!!!

So after Trump gets impeached and Pence gets voted out, we will still have exactly the same policies.

I don't know who you mean by "you guys" because I am a non interventionist Conservative.

For being a stupid Liberal you got something right for once. I guess even an old blind hog will find an acorn every once in awhile. There is not much difference in the foreign policies of the Democrats and Republicans. They are both parties of interventionism.

The minor difference is that the stupid Democrats do all the interventionism things while projecting weakness. The Republicans do it while projecting strength.

Liberals are as confused about interventionism like they are confused about fiscal irresponsibility. If Republican do either one of those thing the filthy Liberals will bitch about but if the Democrats do it then it is OK.

Joe has admitted he wants the elites to tell him how he should live. He likes it this way. He does well in an Orwellian world.

Sadly...we have too many Americans just like him.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

Bullshit. There's plenty of libertarians, and I count myself among them, who believe that the function of government is to protect the rights of the citizens, and, to that end, we're perfectly willing to contribute. We don't like contributing to moral initiatives that have nothing to do with the protection of actual rights, and we don't believe that any citizen has the right to wealth earned by another citizen.

Accuracy requires some nuance. Learn it.

so again- you are all for civilization, you just don't want to pay for it.

Sorry, man, social welfare IS civilization.

sorry you don't get that.

You're defeating your own argument. If civilization is defined simply as social welfare, and libertarians are against social welfare, then where are you getting that they want to live in civilization?

 

[Seawytch]

If you are not dedicated to the destruction of empire and the dismantling of American militarism, then you cannot count yourself as a member of the left. It is not a side issue. It is the issue. Militarists and war profiteers are our greatest enemy. They use fear, bolstered by racism, as a tool in their efforts to abolish civil liberties, crush dissent and ultimately extinguish democracy. To produce weapons and finance military expansion, they ruin the domestic economy by diverting resources, scientific and technical expertise and a disproportionate share of government funds. They use the military to carry out futile, decades-long wars to enrich corporations such as Lockheed Martin, General Dynamics, Raytheon and Northrop Grumman. War is a business. And when the generals retire, guess where they go to work? Profits swell. War never stops. Whole sections of the earth live in terror. And our nation is disemboweled and left to live under what the political philosopher Sheldon Wolin calls “inverted totalitarianism.” Libertarians seem to get this. It is time the left woke up.

Written by Chris Hedges and well done I say. The real enemy is indeed within. When will the American people wake up?


The Real Enemy Is Within

Look, everyone, Gipper brought the LIbertarian Crazy.

Libertarians are children who want to live in civilization and don't want to contribute to it.

I always thought libertarians were just Republicans that liked to smoke pot....

 

[Flash]

[

So true.

I find that most cons KNOW Bush was a terrible president. Conversely, I find most liberals think BO was a great president. Very strange.

I voted for Bush in 2000 because his campaign mantra was that the US should not be in the business of nation building. Besides Al Gore was an idiot. Bush didn't live up to his conservative rhetoric. Not only in regards to interventionism but for fiscal responsibility.

In 2004 there was no difference between Bush and Kerry when it came to Afghanistan and Iraq. Kerry voted to provide congressional support for the invasion. He only bitched about it in the Moon Bat Primaries to get the Moon Bat nomination.

At the end of the day there is no difference of substance between the Republicans and the Democrats.

The Democrats promise bad government and always deliver bad government.

The Republicans promise good government but usually deliver the same bad government that we would have got if the filthy Democrat had been elected. That goes for both foreign and domestic policies.

 

[Stratford57]

Tucked deep inside the 2018 National Defense Authorization Act, under a category entitled, “Countering Russian Aggression,” $4.6 billion is casually set aside for the so-called European Deterrence Initiative (EDI) to “reassure NATO allies and enhance the U.S. deterrent and defense postures in Europe.” It’s 3 times more than last year!
US Congress to spend $4.6 bn for ‘reassuring NATO allies’ as anti-Russia hysteria mounts

And last year it was 3 times more than the year before and so on and on. "Russia is an enemy" also contributes a lot to the pockets of those who want more conflicts on this Earth. BTW, McCain is one of them.

McCain released his own new defense budget: five years – five trillion dollar defense budget; a lot of that is aimed at Russia. It is great for the American military-industrial complex, which is what keeps John McCain in office. So that is one of the reasons he does this. One of the reasons why he cannot stand Donald Trump and he could not stand to have any change in Washington’s anti-Russia policies… If anyone is hurting American democracy, it’s people like John McCain
‘John McCain passed dossier to make Trump look bad; now he’s trying to save his hide’

 

[Norman]

Why the heck has the national defense been turned into national offense? Last time I checked EU is not a part of America.

Make AMERICA great again, Europe better pay for it's own defense budget. In fact, they are losing their mind over Trump as the free services paid by American tax payer are no longer available.

And yes, they can have protection against Russia - but it won't come free. If they are not willing to pay to defend themselves against the threat, why the hell should we?

 

[Flash]

The minor difference is that the stupid Democrats do all the interventionism things while projecting weakness. The Republicans do it while projecting strength.

No, they don't. They get us into wars with no forethought.

We got rolled by two impoverished third world countries, and we were begging Obama to get us out of there. That's not strength, buddy!

Strength would be if we started a draft, raised taxes and rationed goods until the war was won. That's how Democrats USED to fight wars.

You are very confused Moon Bat.

What forethought did that idiot Obama put into bombing Libya or that disastrous escalation of Afghanistan that did nothing but get Americans killed? He sure hell didn't think about what would happen if he withdrew troops from Iraq before the country was stabilized, did he? Look what happen with that vacuum with ISIS. Dumbass, wasn't he?

Democrats got us into WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Democrats idiots that I bet all Moon Bat like you voted for supported the invasion of Iraq. Gore, Kerry and that shithead Clinton.

I added up the number of Americans killed under Democrat wars since WWI and it was over a million. The Republicans a few thousands so don't give us that Moon Bat bullshit about the Democrats being the party of peace.

I think both parties are wrong with interventionism. I had the intellectual and moral courage to live by my conviction by stop being a Republican because of the hypocrisy. When are you going to do the same and stop supporting Democrats that are the same? I don't think you are smart enough to do that, are you?

 

[Flash]

[QU

I always thought libertarians were just Republicans that liked to smoke pot....

I embrace many of the Libertarian ideas on non interventionism, fiscal responsibility and personal liberties but I don't do drugs and I don't accept the idea that a woman has the right to kill her child for the sake of convenience.

Republicans are big government progressives just like the Democrats, just not quit as bad.

If these Moon Bats were not so confused they would understand that when Republicans win they get 95% of what they would have got if the Democrat won.

 

[JoeB131]

You're defeating your own argument. If civilization is defined simply as social welfare, and libertarians are against social welfare, then where are you getting that they want to live in civilization?

I'm saying that social welfare is an ASPECT of civilization. You know, as opposed to just letting the wolves pick off the weak and sick.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

[QU

I always thought libertarians were just Republicans that liked to smoke pot....

I embrace many of the Libertarian ideas on non interventionism, fiscal responsibility and personal liberties but I don't do drugs and I don't accept the idea that a woman has the right to kill her child for the sake of convenience.

Republicans are big government progressives just like the Democrats, just not quit as bad.

If these Moon Bats were not so confused they would understand that when Republicans win they get 95% of what they would have got if the Democrat won.

I agree with your post about 95%, everything but this..."but I don't do drugs" I do not do drugs either (though some would argue that beer is a drug) but I have never found the fact that I do not do something as a reason to not let others do it. If I can sit in my house and have a nice Christmas ale or two, there is no reason that some other person should not be able to sit in theirs and have a few hits off their bong, even if I do not choose to join in.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

You're defeating your own argument. If civilization is defined simply as social welfare, and libertarians are against social welfare, then where are you getting that they want to live in civilization?

I'm saying that social welfare is an ASPECT of civilization. You know, as opposed to just letting the wolves pick off the weak and sick.

Okay, if that's your position, and your view on social welfare is not letting the wolves pick off the weak and sick, then you're equating social welfare with protection from outside threats.

I've yet to meet the libertarian that's against police, firefighters, and military protection.

Where libertarians disagree is when you start to define protecting people as giving them other peoples' money.

 

[JoeB131]

What forethought did that idiot Obama put into bombing Libya or that disastrous escalation of Afghanistan that did nothing but get Americans killed?

The problem with Obama's escalation in Afghanistan is that it relied on the Afghans to step up to the plate. Clearly, they didn't. Kind of the same thing in Libya. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

He sure hell didn't think about what would happen if he withdrew troops from Iraq before the country was stabilized, did he? Look what happen with that vacuum with ISIS. Dumbass, wasn't he?

Here was the thing. We didn't want to be in Iraq because we were LIED to about why we were there. The Iraqis didn't want us there because we had already done enough damage, thank you much. So Obama was supposed to force an agreement to do something neither we nor the Iraqis wanted to do?

Seriously, how does that work.

You also let the Iraqis off the hook way too easily. They could have maintained the peace we bought for them if the Shi'ites had kept sharing power and oil revenues with the Sunnis. They didn't. That's on them, not Obama.

Democrats got us into WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Democrats idiots that I bet all Moon Bat like you voted for supported the invasion of Iraq. Gore, Kerry and that shithead Clinton.

Well, first in 2003, i was still a Republican. I wish I could say the fact Bush lied us into war is what turned me on him. But, no, it was when he fucked up the economy and l lost half of everything I spent a lifetime working for.

I added up the number of Americans killed under Democrat wars since WWI and it was over a million. The Republicans a few thousands so don't give us that Moon Bat bullshit about the Democrats being the party of peace.

Well, first, your math sucks. Let me help you out.

United States military casualties of war - Wikipedia

WWI - 116,516
WWII - 405,399
Korea - 36,516
Vietnam- 58,209
TOTAL- 616,640

So not nearly a million, and some of those happened under Republican stewardship.

I don't think either party is a party of peace. But most of those wars were necessary. They were facing a real honest to god existential threat to US Interests.

I think both parties are wrong with interventionism. I had the intellectual and moral courage to live by my conviction by stop being a Republican because of the hypocrisy. When are you going to do the same and stop supporting Democrats that are the same? I don't think you are smart enough to do that, are you?

Here's the thing, buddy, we've never gone to war without a big yahoo from both sides and the people. The only people who lost their jobs over Iraq were the people who had the good sense to oppose it.

 

[JoeB131]

Where libertarians disagree is when you start to define protecting people as giving them other peoples' money.

Yes, you are definitely the party of "I've got mine, fuck you!" The real world doesn't work like that. The real world, you don't let people starve because hungry people get angry and desperate and do irrational things.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

The minor difference is that the stupid Democrats do all the interventionism things while projecting weakness. The Republicans do it while projecting strength.

No, they don't. They get us into wars with no forethought.

We got rolled by two impoverished third world countries, and we were begging Obama to get us out of there. That's not strength, buddy!

Strength would be if we started a draft, raised taxes and rationed goods until the war was won. That's how Democrats USED to fight wars.

You are very confused Moon Bat.

What forethought did that idiot Obama put into bombing Libya or that disastrous escalation of Afghanistan that did nothing but get Americans killed? He sure hell didn't think about what would happen if he withdrew troops from Iraq before the country was stabilized, did he? Look what happen with that vacuum with ISIS. Dumbass, wasn't he?

Democrats got us into WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Democrats idiots that I bet all Moon Bat like you voted for supported the invasion of Iraq. Gore, Kerry and that shithead Clinton.

I added up the number of Americans killed under Democrat wars since WWI and it was over a million. The Republicans a few thousands so don't give us that Moon Bat bullshit about the Democrats being the party of peace.

I think both parties are wrong with interventionism. I had the intellectual and moral courage to live by my conviction by stop being a Republican because of the hypocrisy. When are you going to do the same and stop supporting Democrats that are the same? I don't think you are smart enough to do that, are you?

You say that you are not a Republican, when was the last time you voted for a non-Repub for president?

 

[gipper]

[QU

I always thought libertarians were just Republicans that liked to smoke pot....

I embrace many of the Libertarian ideas on non interventionism, fiscal responsibility and personal liberties but I don't do drugs and I don't accept the idea that a woman has the right to kill her child for the sake of convenience.

Republicans are big government progressives just like the Democrats, just not quit as bad.

If these Moon Bats were not so confused they would understand that when Republicans win they get 95% of what they would have got if the Democrat won.

Agree with most of that, but for the comment about abortion. No true libertarian agrees with abortion. Nothing limits the liberty of the individual more than murdering them in the womb.

 

[gipper]

What forethought did that idiot Obama put into bombing Libya or that disastrous escalation of Afghanistan that did nothing but get Americans killed?

The problem with Obama's escalation in Afghanistan is that it relied on the Afghans to step up to the plate. Clearly, they didn't. Kind of the same thing in Libya. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

He sure hell didn't think about what would happen if he withdrew troops from Iraq before the country was stabilized, did he? Look what happen with that vacuum with ISIS. Dumbass, wasn't he?

Here was the thing. We didn't want to be in Iraq because we were LIED to about why we were there. The Iraqis didn't want us there because we had already done enough damage, thank you much. So Obama was supposed to force an agreement to do something neither we nor the Iraqis wanted to do?

Seriously, how does that work.

You also let the Iraqis off the hook way too easily. They could have maintained the peace we bought for them if the Shi'ites had kept sharing power and oil revenues with the Sunnis. They didn't. That's on them, not Obama.

Democrats got us into WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Democrats idiots that I bet all Moon Bat like you voted for supported the invasion of Iraq. Gore, Kerry and that shithead Clinton.

Well, first in 2003, i was still a Republican. I wish I could say the fact Bush lied us into war is what turned me on him. But, no, it was when he fucked up the economy and l lost half of everything I spent a lifetime working for.

I added up the number of Americans killed under Democrat wars since WWI and it was over a million. The Republicans a few thousands so don't give us that Moon Bat bullshit about the Democrats being the party of peace.

Well, first, your math sucks. Let me help you out.

United States military casualties of war - Wikipedia

WWI - 116,516
WWII - 405,399
Korea - 36,516
Vietnam- 58,209
TOTAL- 616,640

So not nearly a million, and some of those happened under Republican stewardship.

I don't think either party is a party of peace. But most of those wars were necessary. They were facing a real honest to god existential threat to US Interests.

I think both parties are wrong with interventionism. I had the intellectual and moral courage to live by my conviction by stop being a Republican because of the hypocrisy. When are you going to do the same and stop supporting Democrats that are the same? I don't think you are smart enough to do that, are you?

Here's the thing, buddy, we've never gone to war without a big yahoo from both sides and the people. The only people who lost their jobs over Iraq were the people who had the good sense to oppose it.

Wrong. NONE of those wars were necessary and nearly all of them were set up, by the political elite you so love, to enrich favored corporations, banks, and the extremely wealthy.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Congress controls both the purse strings and the right to declare war. If congress abdicates those responsibilities to the Executive branch then they are responsible for what follows.

There is no political party that is less responsible than the other.

 

[gipper]

What forethought did that idiot Obama put into bombing Libya or that disastrous escalation of Afghanistan that did nothing but get Americans killed?

The problem with Obama's escalation in Afghanistan is that it relied on the Afghans to step up to the plate. Clearly, they didn't. Kind of the same thing in Libya. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

He sure hell didn't think about what would happen if he withdrew troops from Iraq before the country was stabilized, did he? Look what happen with that vacuum with ISIS. Dumbass, wasn't he?

Here was the thing. We didn't want to be in Iraq because we were LIED to about why we were there. The Iraqis didn't want us there because we had already done enough damage, thank you much. So Obama was supposed to force an agreement to do something neither we nor the Iraqis wanted to do?

Seriously, how does that work.

You also let the Iraqis off the hook way too easily. They could have maintained the peace we bought for them if the Shi'ites had kept sharing power and oil revenues with the Sunnis. They didn't. That's on them, not Obama.

Democrats got us into WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Democrats idiots that I bet all Moon Bat like you voted for supported the invasion of Iraq. Gore, Kerry and that shithead Clinton.

Well, first in 2003, i was still a Republican. I wish I could say the fact Bush lied us into war is what turned me on him. But, no, it was when he fucked up the economy and l lost half of everything I spent a lifetime working for.

I added up the number of Americans killed under Democrat wars since WWI and it was over a million. The Republicans a few thousands so don't give us that Moon Bat bullshit about the Democrats being the party of peace.

Well, first, your math sucks. Let me help you out.

United States military casualties of war - Wikipedia

WWI - 116,516
WWII - 405,399
Korea - 36,516
Vietnam- 58,209
TOTAL- 616,640

So not nearly a million, and some of those happened under Republican stewardship.

I don't think either party is a party of peace. But most of those wars were necessary. They were facing a real honest to god existential threat to US Interests.

I think both parties are wrong with interventionism. I had the intellectual and moral courage to live by my conviction by stop being a Republican because of the hypocrisy. When are you going to do the same and stop supporting Democrats that are the same? I don't think you are smart enough to do that, are you?

Here's the thing, buddy, we've never gone to war without a big yahoo from both sides and the people. The only people who lost their jobs over Iraq were the people who had the good sense to oppose it.

If only leftists like you would come to realize that the government we have today is a criminal operation.

It use to be that many Democrats were naturally suspicious of and fully against corporatism and militarism, but as Hedges points out, they have been duped by the D Party and it's followers in the DNCMSM.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

Where libertarians disagree is when you start to define protecting people as giving them other peoples' money.

Yes, you are definitely the party of "I've got mine, fuck you!" The real world doesn't work like that. The real world, you don't let people starve because hungry people get angry and desperate and do irrational things.

Feeding starving people I'm fine with, I'm actually a pretty charitable person. What I'm not fine with is the threat of imprisonment being used to take people's stuff by force and give it to other people, especially when a lot of those people to whom it gets redistributed aren't in danger of starvation, and when a lot of those people are idle for no good reason.

And before you start implying that I'm being racist or making shit up, understand this: I spent my late teen years and early 20's doing a lot of drugs and running with some highly questionable individuals. In that time, I met a lot of people, of all shapes, sizes and colors, who were on food stamps and hadn't dropped a job app in time out of mind. Moral reasons aside, that's what I don't like about the government taking that charitable role. They turn it into a one-size-fits-all scenario with a single organization in charge of keeping track of all of the "needy", and their results tend to be wasteful and inaccurate.

 

[Flash]

[QU

I always thought libertarians were just Republicans that liked to smoke pot....

I embrace many of the Libertarian ideas on non interventionism, fiscal responsibility and personal liberties but I don't do drugs and I don't accept the idea that a woman has the right to kill her child for the sake of convenience.

Republicans are big government progressives just like the Democrats, just not quit as bad.

If these Moon Bats were not so confused they would understand that when Republicans win they get 95% of what they would have got if the Democrat won.

Agree with most of that, but for the comment about abortion. No true libertarian agrees with abortion. Nothing limits the liberty of the individual more than murdering them in the womb.

Years go the right of abortion was in the Libertarian Party platform. However, since then they have pretty much come around to understanding that the right of a child to live is greater than the right of a mother to kill the child for her convenience.