Lois Lerner Admits-2010 She Was Told To Target Conservative Groups

[JoeB131]

Obamacare overturned itself. If I recall correctly, they are delaying more parts of it until 2015.

Quit while you're behind.

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Thanks for admitting Obamacare is collapsing of its own weight. If it weren't for Obama illegally delaying its implementation it would have been repealed already.

Not really.

And frankly, the amount being delayed is actually kind of small. The other important components- expanding medicaid and eliminating abuses by the insurance companies, are right on track.

And those things are going to be VERY popular and impossible to overturn.

 

[The Rabbi]

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Thanks for admitting Obamacare is collapsing of its own weight. If it weren't for Obama illegally delaying its implementation it would have been repealed already.

Not really.

And frankly, the amount being delayed is actually kind of small. The other important components- expanding medicaid and eliminating abuses by the insurance companies, are right on track.

And those things are going to be VERY popular and impossible to overturn.

Joe, every week yet another provision is being delayed. The exchanges are due to open in about 3 months. And they are nowhere prepared for this. IT will be total confusion and chaos, with of course skyrocketing costs for consumers.

 

[JoeB131]

[
Joe, every week yet another provision is being delayed. The exchanges are due to open in about 3 months. And they are nowhere prepared for this. IT will be total confusion and chaos, with of course skyrocketing costs for consumers.

Yeah, okay you guys have been predicting this for like three years now... and it hasn't happened yet.

 

[TemplarKormac]

[

Ha! Did you not read further on in the book that God restored all that Job had lost, all because he kept the faith? Or are you just cherry picking Joe?

Yeah, read Job 42:10-17


So what excuses do you have now, Joe?

Completely fucking irrelevent.

I don't know one parent who would lose a child who would be completely comforted by having another. Parents should not outlive their children. It's just not the way of things.

Not to mention poor Mrs. Job (who spends about half the book berating Job) is the one who had to have ten more kids in her 50's.... I don't think she was too thriled with God's idea of "Compensation".

(Keep in mind, the 10 Children of Job are described as being adults when Satan Drops a roof on them.)

The problem here is that God lets Satan do HORRIBLE things to Job. And to What Purpose? To make Satan a better person? Probably not. Because Satan goes from being an agent of God who can come and go as he pleases in Heaven to the ruler of Hell and adversary of God.

I wouldn't expect you to care for the life of a child, being someone who advocates the wanton slaughter of them for the sake of a so-called "choice." You have a lot of gall, Joe.

And it IS completely relevant. Because in the end, God restored all that job had lost. All of it. And you chose to ignore that part. This only speaks to how closed minded and stone hearted you can be. Now you are moving the goalposts. Why would an adversarial God go through the effort of restoring what he had taken away? Wouldn't that defeat the entire purpose of being adversarial? Oh, I see. Nevermind. Don't bother answering, your argument is toast.

Satan dared to challenge God by wanting to rise above God. He paid the price for his arrogance and was banished from the heavenly realm, along with one third of the angels in heaven. I know a lot more about my faith than you do sitting on the outside doling out judgement on people you hardly even know.

 

[JoeB131]

I wouldn't expect you to care for the life of a child, being someone who advocates the wanton slaughter of them for the sake of a so-called "choice." You have a lot of gall, Joe.

No, I just don't rate a Kidney-bean sized fetus as being the same thing as a baby. And neither does anyone else. And rankly, since neither one of us have a uterus, it's not like we should have any say in what people who do have them do with them.

And it IS completely relevant. Because in the end, God restored all that job had lost. All of it. And you chose to ignore that part. This only speaks to how closed minded and stone hearted you can be. Now you are moving the goalposts. Why would an adversarial God go through the effort of restoring what he had taken away? Wouldn't that defeat the entire purpose of being adversarial? Oh, I see. Nevermind. Don't bother answering, your argument is toast.

But God didn't "restore" his children, he gave him REPLACEMENT children. It's not really the same thing, is it? As anyone who has ever lost a child would no doubt explain to you, that's a hole in your heart that can never be filled. YOu can kind of see why God didn't feel a need to explain himself. Could you imagine Job's reaction if he had said, "Well, yeah, Job. Satan and I had this bet that if we killed your kids, you would totally curse me out. And guess what, you didn't. Wow. I won the bet."

I'm guessing not for much longer after that.

Satan dared to challenge God by wanting to rise above God. He paid the price for his arrogance and was banished from the heavenly realm, along with one third of the angels in heaven. I know a lot more about my faith than you do sitting on the outside doling out judgement on people you hardly even know.

Guy, i've dealt with religious twits all my life. And frankly, they all get really defensive if you point out what's in the bible.

In the Book of Job, three things about Satan-

1) He's called a "son of God"
2) He's allowed to come and go in Heaven as he pleases.
3) He only acts on God's authority.

Now, this is quite different from the modern notion of Satan, which is somewhat changed in the New Testament where he becomes a supervillian.

This video does a really good job of tracking how Satan changes as a fictional character in the bible and after.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-gbOnWj6Mw&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PLC767D1EB39788E5B]The Evolution of Satan in the Bible - YouTube[/ame]

 

[The Rabbi]

[
Joe, every week yet another provision is being delayed. The exchanges are due to open in about 3 months. And they are nowhere prepared for this. IT will be total confusion and chaos, with of course skyrocketing costs for consumers.

Yeah, okay you guys have been predicting this for like three years now... and it hasn't happened yet.

LOL! It's already happened!

 

[TemplarKormac]

I wouldn't expect you to care for the life of a child, being someone who advocates the wanton slaughter of them for the sake of a so-called "choice." You have a lot of gall, Joe.

No, I just don't rate a Kidney-bean sized fetus as being the same thing as a baby. And neither does anyone else. And frankly, since neither one of us have a uterus, it's not like we should have any say in what people who do have them do with them.

Then why do you consistently remark on it as if your opinion matters?

Oh by the way, if you ever dealt with biblical hermeneutics before, you'll know that Satan was not a son of God.

The Hebrew language is very complex, but in the end, it has inclusive and and exclusive versions of words. For example, the the Hebrew "gam" in this verse is exclusive and is translated to "also" in English. Had you a basic understanding of grammatical structure like I do, you would know that the term "also" is exclusive. It does not make the person part of the group, but that he may have come in accompaniment or apart from the main group. Simple, Joe.

One day the angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came with them.

Job 1:6

I cannot understand why you fall for these lies. But what really gets me is why you twist what the Bible says for your nefarious arguments. Only Mormons believe that Jesus and Satan were brothers (or that Satan was a son of God), last time I checked, the whole of Christianity are not Mormons. That was an exclamation from the Mormon prophets, as it also was an edict from the Mormon Church itself. In the Discourses of Brigham Young, on Pg.53-54 he lets it be known that Lucifer is the second son, the one known as "Son of the Morning." As you very well know, Mormonism is considered not to be part of the Christian faith. Don't get me wrong, Joe, I have nothing against them, but it is what it is. Anyway, guess what Joe? You stereotyped all of us based on what the Mormons believe. How narrow minded can you be, Joe? You know nothing of my faith. Nothing.

Bruce R. McConkie, in his work The Mortal Messiah, Vol.1, Pg.407-408 under the heading " Lucifer and the Law of Temptation" said this;

"Hence, there is -- and must be -- a devil, and he is the father of lies and of wickedness. He and the fallen angels who followed him are spirit children of the Father. As Christ is the Firstborn of the Father in the spirit, so Lucifer is a son of the morning, one of those born in the morning of preexistence. He is a spirit man, a personage, an entity, comparable in form and appearance to any of the spirit children of the Eternal Father. He was the source of opposition among the spirit hosts before the world was made; he rebelled in preexistence against the Father and the Son, and he sought even then to destroy the agency of man. He and his followers were cast down to earth, and they are forever denied mortal bodies. And he, here on earth, along with all who follow him -- both his spirit followers and the mortals who hearken to his enticements -- is continuing the war that commenced in heaven."

 

[depotoo]

Not really.

She just pointed out that Citizens United decision allowed this kind of fraud, and the FEC was powerless to stop it unless the IRS caught the fraud.

You guys are just upset the IRS caught the fraud.

YOu know, there isn't a constitutational right to a tax exemption, right?

yeah, they were so fraudulent, none got denied, just held for a year or so.

Most were told they needed additional documention to prove they were what they said they were, and most couldn't provide it.

Care to show me any hearing that stated that? Besides asking for improper documentation? Or where the IG report stated that?

 

[Papageorgio]

We have several omissions.

First, we do not know how many left wing groups were set aside for extra scrutiny.

Second, we do not know how many total groups applied for tax exempt status during the period in question. The timeframe must match up with the timeframe in which it is claimed right wing groups were targeted.

Third, we do not know what proportion of the applications were from right wing groups, and what proportion were from left wing groups.

Consequently, it is IMPOSSIBLE to know if right wing groups were targeted out of proportion to their representation.

That no one is even asking these questions indicates they are, once again, not the slightest bit interested in discerning the truth.


Truth is always the first casualty in partisan hackery.

We have the IRS admitting that they did so.

 

[Papageorgio]

Not really.

She just pointed out that Citizens United decision allowed this kind of fraud, and the FEC was powerless to stop it unless the IRS caught the fraud.

You guys are just upset the IRS caught the fraud.

YOu know, there isn't a constitutational right to a tax exemption, right?

yeah, they were so fraudulent, none got denied, just held for a year or so.

Most were told they needed additional documention to prove they were what they said they were, and most couldn't provide it.

Not true, they were being asked questions and additional information that other groups were not being asked to supply. They were not being treated equally.

 

[Papageorgio]

Most were told they needed additional documention to prove they were what they said they were, and most couldn't provide it.

Justify the IRS the asking for the content of members prayers of one organization and explain how that is not a breach of the 1st Amendment then you may gain a small bit of credibility.

Hey, I don't think Churches should be getting tax exemptions to start with.

We need to tax the fuck out of them and then apply the consumer fraud laws to them.

The issue is not what you think, the issue is due process and equal protection. If one group is treated differently than another group because of its belief system, then we have a violation, regardless of your emotional stance.

 

[candycorn]

Obamacare overturned itself. If I recall correctly, they are delaying more parts of it until 2015.

Quit while you're behind.

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Oh I see. This victory is by no means "small." When your beloved healthcare law can't get off the ground, it means it has failed miserably.

Apple used to sell for something like $4 a share. First there is no "victory". Secondly, once implemented (parts of it already have been to much success) fully it will be a success I predict since coverage will be extended to millions who have been barred from the health care system previously.

 

[candycorn]

Obamacare overturned itself. If I recall correctly, they are delaying more parts of it until 2015.

Quit while you're behind.

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Thanks for admitting Obamacare is collapsing of its own weight. If it weren't for Obama illegally delaying its implementation it would have been repealed already.

You must be talking about what happens to your sexual partner when you have what you call sex.

 

[TemplarKormac]

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Oh I see. This victory is by no means "small." When your beloved healthcare law can't get off the ground, it means it has failed miserably.

Apple used to sell for something like $4 a share. First there is no "victory". Secondly, once implemented (parts of it already have been to much success) fully it will be a success I predict since coverage will be extended to millions who have been barred from the health care system previously.

And Obamacare was supposed to be flawless. Ooops! And please provide to me proof of this "success" as a result of the implementation of the existing parts of Obamacare.

Guess you can't. Don't make predictions buddy, that crystal ball shoved up your backside is busted.

 

[The Rabbi]

That you have to take so much comfort in such a small "victory" is really sort of sad.

Oh I see. This victory is by no means "small." When your beloved healthcare law can't get off the ground, it means it has failed miserably.

Apple used to sell for something like $4 a share. First there is no "victory". Secondly, once implemented (parts of it already have been to much success) fully it will be a success I predict since coverage will be extended to millions who have been barred from the health care system previously.

Cisco used to sell for over a hundred dollars a share. So what?
If you define "success" as raising premiums and depressing full time employment then you are correct. Most of us have higher standards though.
As many people who were uninsured previously will be uninsured under Obamacare. Those picking up insurance will do so because the rest of us are paying for it.
No one has ever been barred from using health care.

 

[candycorn]

[
Joe, every week yet another provision is being delayed. The exchanges are due to open in about 3 months. And they are nowhere prepared for this. IT will be total confusion and chaos, with of course skyrocketing costs for consumers.

Yeah, okay you guys have been predicting this for like three years now... and it hasn't happened yet.

Gee, a conservative trying to envoke fear...

First it was women voting
Then it was ending segregation
Then it was the Patriot act
Lately it has been gay marriage

Each time it's happened and been overcome, the country has grown stronger.

Yes there will be confusion at the outset...there always is with any new program; a radio station changing it's format causes the same thing.

Can't wait for the gloom and doom posts during the transition period...

 

[The Rabbi]

[
Joe, every week yet another provision is being delayed. The exchanges are due to open in about 3 months. And they are nowhere prepared for this. IT will be total confusion and chaos, with of course skyrocketing costs for consumers.

Yeah, okay you guys have been predicting this for like three years now... and it hasn't happened yet.

Gee, a conservative trying to envoke fear...

First it was women voting
Then it was ending segregation
Then it was the Patriot act
Lately it has been gay marriage

Each time it's happened and been overcome, the country has grown stronger.

Yes there will be confusion at the outset...there always is with any new program; a radio station changing it's format causes the same thing.

Can't wait for the gloom and doom posts during the transition period...

Social Security-bankrupt
Medicare-bankrupt
Deficits-soaring
Patriot Act-widespread spying on Americans.
Tell me how it's all going to be OK. TGell me how Obamacare is in any way comparable to segregation.

 

[candycorn]

Yeah, okay you guys have been predicting this for like three years now... and it hasn't happened yet.

Gee, a conservative trying to envoke fear...

First it was women voting
Then it was ending segregation
Then it was the Patriot act
Lately it has been gay marriage

Each time it's happened and been overcome, the country has grown stronger.

Yes there will be confusion at the outset...there always is with any new program; a radio station changing it's format causes the same thing.

Can't wait for the gloom and doom posts during the transition period...

Social Security-bankrupt
Medicare-bankrupt
Deficits-soaring
Patriot Act-widespread spying on Americans.
Tell me how it's all going to be OK. TGell me how Obamacare is in any way comparable to segregation.

The conservative response to anything is to make you afraid of it because they long for the Leave it to Beaver days of the 1950's when times were simple enough for them to understand (to put it one way).

 

[candycorn]

Lets do an expirment

Rabbi; tell us specifically why YOU are opposed to same sex marriages. I mean, it doesn't threaten your marriage at all right? I mean, you're not going to run out and marry another man if the government says you can right? It can't be the sanctity of marriage since 1/2 of all Heterosexual marriages end in divorce; not counting the ones that don't get divorced and simply separate, have open/unfaithful marriages, etc...

So tell us, why are YOU opposed to SSM?

 

[eagle7_31]

Gee, a conservative trying to envoke fear...

First it was women voting
Then it was ending segregation
Then it was the Patriot act
Lately it has been gay marriage

Each time it's happened and been overcome, the country has grown stronger.

Yes there will be confusion at the outset...there always is with any new program; a radio station changing it's format causes the same thing.

Can't wait for the gloom and doom posts during the transition period...

Social Security-bankrupt
Medicare-bankrupt
Deficits-soaring
Patriot Act-widespread spying on Americans.
Tell me how it's all going to be OK. TGell me how Obamacare is in any way comparable to segregation.

The conservative response to anything is to make you afraid of it because they long for the Leave it to Beaver days of the 1950's when times were simple enough for them to understand (to put it one way).

Seems liberals love making stuff up or exagerating.