More Strong Evidence for Evolution: Anatomical Vestiges

[Fort Fun Indiana]

What good does it do a person?

Haha, I don't play this game.

Go ahead and assert it does no good and argue why.

Then we will scrutinize your point.

And, go.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

It's the entire basis of biology. And biology is the entire basis of medicine.

No it isn't. It might have been placed on a pedestal to be worshipped as such, but biology does not need evolution. If one denied evolution it would have no impact on practical biology, one could do the work without issues.

When someone refuses to accept and doesnt even understand these simple facts, they ask dumb questions, like,

"Why should evolution be taught in science class?"

As we see here.

A belief in evolution is no more relevant to the study of the animal kingdom than atheism is relevant to physics.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Haha, I don't play this game.

Go ahead and assert it does no good and argue why.

Then we will scrutinize your point.

And, go.

OK so you can't tell me what good it does a person to believe evolution, OK.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No it isn't

It of course is the entire basis of biology, as anyone who has taken biology-- and any biologist -- would attest.

It's how we understand physiology... it's how we understand modifying cells to acheive certain behaviors, in an effort to prolong our lives... it's how we know how to study certain animals to better understand the human body...

I really don't have to do any work to dispel this ridiculous claim.

In fact, highlighting it does a lot of work to discredit you from the start.

If this is what we can expect from the bottom of the barrel you are now drawing from, I don't think any more effort is required on my part.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

A belief in evolution is no more relevant to the study of the animal kingdom than atheism is relevant to physics.

Like this.

I can just highlight this and let it embarrass itself.

It's your fault you are now in this position, by the way. So don't get irritated with me.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

It of course is the entire basis of biology, as anyone who has taken biology-- and any biologist -- would attest.

It's how we understand physiology... it's how we understand modifying cells to acheive certain behaviors, in an effort to prolong our lives... it's how we know how to study certain animals to better understand the human body...

I really don't have to do any work to dispel this ridiculous claim.

In fact, highlighting it does a lot of work to discredit you from the start.

If this is what we can expect from the bottom of the barrel you are now drawing from, I don't think any more effort is required on my part.

Tell me then, what is ridiculous about this:

Take spinal surgery, there is absolutely nothing taught in an evolution class that enables a surgeon to perform better.

Standing upright for creation​

Trust me if you needed surgery on your spine, this is the man you'd want to operate on you:

Richard Porter was Professor of Orthopaedic Surgery at the University of Aberdeen, Scotland, from 1990–95 (in universities in the UK and many British Commonwealth countries, the title ‘Professor’ is given only to the highest rank of university lecturers).

Then he was Director of Education and Training for the Royal College of Surgeons of Edinburgh from 1995–97.

and

He has published over 120 papers in peer-reviewed journals (50% on spinal disorders), mostly as senior author. He is the author of five textbooks and over 30 contributory chapters. In 2001 Edinburgh University awarded him a D.Sc. degree for research on spinal stenosis, and he was awarded the Syme professorship for work on congenital talipes (formerly called ‘club foot’). Retired for the last five years, he still continues with research and writing.

[Update: we were sorry to learn that Professor Porter died on 20 July 2005, aged 70. His obituary in the British Medical Journal noted both his extensive contributions to spinal research, including scoliosis, osteoporosis and club feet, his medical inventions, TV documentaries about him, and sponsoring overseas doctors.

Yet here is what he has to say about the "value" of evolution:

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Take spinal surgery, there is absolutely nothing taught in an evolution class that enables a surgeon to perform better.

Ah yes, the tired chatlatan's tactic.

Take one medical procedure in a vacuum and ask what evolution has to do with it.

As if children graduate High school and enter spine surgery school for a couple years and then start performing spine surgery. With, of course, all the relevant information having also been discovered in sheltered vacuum over the last 150 years.

It's absurd and can be ignored as a bad faith distraction.

As I will now do.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Ah yes, the tired chatlatan's tactic.

Your quick adoption of ad-hominem in this discussion shows that your argument is weak.

Take one medical procedure in a vacuum and ask what evolution has to do with it.

Would you like more examples of respected, competent medical professionals like him?

As if children graduate High school and enter spine surgery school for a couple years and then start performing spine surgery.

It's absurd and can be ignored as a bad faith distraction.

As I will now do.

Calling a view "absurd" the person stating that view a "charlatan" is not ignoring, it's evasion, attack the person not their argument.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Your quick adoption of ad-hominem in this discussion shows that your argument is weak.

Would you like more examples of respected, competent medical professionals like him?

Calling a view "absurd" the person stating that view a "charlatan" is not ignoring, it's evasion, attack the person not their argument.

he cant answer simple questions put to him what do you expect from the troll?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Your quick adoption of ad-hominem in this discussion shows that your argument is weak.

That isn't ad hominem.

First, I was talking about a tactic, not you.

Second, it was an argued conclusion.

You don't know what that term means and should stop using it immediately. It's not helping your arguments or your credibility both to use it incorrectly and to try to use it to disqualify points that undermine your arguments.

I feel confident giving you this friendly advice, as you are losing your arguments so badly.

 

[scruffy]

We learn a great deal about brains by studying evolution. One of the giants in the field is Glenn Northcutt, whom I had the pleasure of studying under for a while. For example the human retina has a dozen distinct layers of cells and connections, some specialized for motion, some for color, some for edges, etc. The old model of X and Y cells turns out to be completely inadequate. Since it was derived mainly from cats.

Our superior colliculi are somewhat lacking compared to birds, since we have frontal vision, but we have an independent vergence system that birds don't have. Our eye movements are quite fascinating, and there's a large fraction of the population with treatable nystagmus and pendular myopia and stuff like that. The artificial vision types still can't touch our retinas, the gain control alone is pretty astounding if you know about cameras.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

he cant answer simple questions put to him what do you expect from the troll?

I'm struggling to recall a single evolution devotee that I've ever debated online, who did not resort to ad-hominem, attack the person rather than their argument. I've debated this subject for some thirty+ years on many different boards and every single time the evolutionists eventually start insulting.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I'm struggling to recall a single evolution devotee that I've ever debated online, who did not resort to ad-hominem, attack the person rather than their argument.

And here we get treated to Act III. It always comes, after the fight is lost.

You encounter this often because

1) you don't know what ad hominem is

2) your tactics are specious and dishonest

3) you don't have any better tactics or lines of arguments, since evolution is a fact

As one expects from someone of faith when all the evidence contradicts the faith based belief, you blame the world for being mean and dishonest and for not listening to you; else the faith based beliefs must come into question.

Which isnt going to happen.

. Lift the curtain of faith, and you will find you encounter this because of your own flawed and dishonest tactics.

 

[abu afak]

https://nap.nationalacademies.org/resource/11876/Evolution%20Brochure.pdf

National Academy of Sciences

Why Is Evolution Important?​

The discovery and understanding of the processes of evolution represent one of the most powerful achievements in the history of science. Evolution successfully explains the diversity of life on Earth and has been confirmed repeatedly through observation and experiment in a broad spectrum of scientific disciplines.​

Evolutionary science provides the foundation for modern biology. It has opened the door to entirely new types of medical, agricultural, and environmental research, and has led to the development of technologies that can help prevent and combat disease. Regrettably, effective science education in our schools is being undermined by efforts to introduce non-scientific concepts about evolution into science classrooms.​

[......]

https://nap.nationalacademies.org/resource/11876/Evolution%20Brochure.pdf

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