Zone1 Mormons are fine, but I have to call BS on the golden plates story.

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

The Gentiles as a people have never heard the voice of Jesus Christ.

Neither have the followers of the Church of Jesus Christ from Salt Lake City.

 

[onefour1]

Neither have the followers of the Church of Jesus Christ from Salt Lake City.

True, as a people we have not heard the direct voice of Jesus Christ as a people. However, God the Father and Jesus Christ did appear to the prophet Joseph Smith on an individual basis and he personally did hear his voice (see Joseph Smith - History 1).

 

[BS Filter]

The Gentiles as a people have never heard the voice of Jesus Christ. Jesus was only sent to preach unto the house of Israel.

I suggest that you read the New Testament.

 

[BS Filter]

True, as a people we have not heard the direct voice of Jesus Christ as a people. However, God the Father and Jesus Christ did appear to the prophet Joseph Smith on an individual basis and he personally did hear his voice (see Joseph Smith - History 1).

According to Joseph Smith.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

True, as a people we have not heard the direct voice of Jesus Christ as a people. However, God the Father and Jesus Christ did appear to the prophet Joseph Smith on an individual basis and he personally did hear his voice (see Joseph Smith - History 1).

... which version of the visit are you using?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I've read a fair amount on the various major religions and I have to say, the story of Angel Moroni and the Golden Plates is the most suspect of all the stories I've read. Is there a Mormon out there who can better explain or defend why he or she believes these plates exist and were given to the Prophet Joseph to transcribe the Book of Mormon? This is not a knock on Mormons I have friends who are Mormons and they are very nice people and do lots of good things in the community and have good families. It's the Golden Plates story that just sounds like pure fantasy to me.

all the witness never recanted even though some left the church.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

all the witness never recanted even though some left the church.

That is true. Did any actually see the plates, or did they handle them covered by a cloth or linen?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

That is true. Did any actually see the plates, or did they handle them covered by a cloth or linen?

I don't know I am not up on all the lore from the Church of Jesus Christ of latter-day saints.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

According to Joseph Smith.

LOL if God chooses to speak to an individual all you will ever have is their word it happened, he doesn't speak to them with an audience.

 

[onefour1]

That is true. Did any actually see the plates, or did they handle them covered by a cloth or linen?

The Testimony of Three Witnesses

The Testimony of Eight Witnesses

 

[BS Filter]

LOL if God chooses to speak to an individual all you will ever have is their word it happened, he doesn't speak to them with an audience.

Their word better line up with Scripture or they're a false prophet. Joseph Smith is a false prophet.

 

[onefour1]

I suggest that you read the New Testament.

I've read it more than 10 times.

 

[BS Filter]

I've read more than 10 times.

Then you know that Paul said the gentiles are grafted in and receive the blessings of Abraham just as the Jews. We are all one in Jesus Christ. Do you understand what that means. It means the Father sees one perfect man, Jesus Christ. Jesus and His Church are one.

 

[onefour1]

Then you know that Paul said the gentiles are grafted in and receive the blessings of Abraham just as the Jews. We are all one in Jesus Christ. Do you understand what that means. It means the Father sees one perfect man, Jesus Christ. Jesus and His Church are one.

I agree with that but the other sheep of which Jesus spoke of and who would see him and hear his voice were not the Gentiles. True, God does love all mankind and the Gentiles were to have the gospel preached unto them, and Paul along with the other apostles were to teach that gospel to the Gentiles. But the Gentiles, as a people, were not preached to personally by Jesus Christ and thus they were not spoken to directly as a people personally by Jesus Christ.

 

[BS Filter]

I agree with that but the other sheep of which Jesus spoke of and who would see him and hear his voice were not the Gentiles. True, God does love all mankind and the Gentiles were to have the gospel preached unto them, and Paul along with the other apostles were to teach that gospel to the Gentiles. But the Gentiles, as a people, were not preached to personally by Jesus Christ and thus they were not spoken to directly as a people personally by Jesus Christ.

It doesn't mean anything.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

I agree with that but the other sheep of which Jesus spoke of and who would see him and hear his voice were not the Gentiles. True, God does love all mankind and the Gentiles were to have the gospel preached unto them, and Paul along with the other apostles were to teach that gospel to the Gentiles. But the Gentiles, as a people, were not preached to personally by Jesus Christ and thus they were not spoken to directly as a people personally by Jesus Christ.

Are the LDS leadership going to come down on the T of the LGBT in the Bishop's handbook shortly?

They failed spectacularly in demonizing the children of LGB parents.

 

[onefour1]

Are the LDS leadership going to come down on the T of the LGBT in the Bishop's handbook shortly?

They failed spectacularly in demonizing the children of LGB parents.

I don't decide what the leadership of the church will do but if God brings you into this world as male or female, would you think that he would find it ok to try and change that? God, in the Bible, has clearly spoken out against LGB. For references see:

Homosexual Behavior​

• See also Chastity; Sexual Immorality
• bring them out unto us, that we may know them, Gen. 19:5.
• Thou shalt not lie with mankind … it is abomination, Lev. 18:22 (20:13).
• There shall be no … sodomite of the sons of Israel, Deut. 23:17.
• declare their sin as Sodom, Isa. 3:9 (2 Ne. 13:9).
• men … burned in their lust one toward another, Rom. 1:27.
• nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 1 Cor. 6:9.
• them that defile themselves with mankind, 1 Tim. 1:10.
• as Sodom and Gomorrha … going after strange flesh, Jude 1:7.
• See also Gen. 13:13; 18:20; Ezek. 16:50; 2 Tim. 3:3; 2 Pet. 2:10; 2 Ne. 9:40.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

I don't decide what the leadership of the church will do but if God brings you into this world as male or female, would you think that he would find it ok to try and change that? God, in the Bible, has clearly spoken out against LGB. For references see:

Homosexual Behavior​

• See also Chastity; Sexual Immorality
• bring them out unto us, that we may know them, Gen. 19:5.
• Thou shalt not lie with mankind … it is abomination, Lev. 18:22 (20:13).
• There shall be no … sodomite of the sons of Israel, Deut. 23:17.
• declare their sin as Sodom, Isa. 3:9 (2 Ne. 13:9).
• men … burned in their lust one toward another, Rom. 1:27.
• nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 1 Cor. 6:9.
• them that defile themselves with mankind, 1 Tim. 1:10.
• as Sodom and Gomorrha … going after strange flesh, Jude 1:7.
• See also Gen. 13:13; 18:20; Ezek. 16:50; 2 Tim. 3:3; 2 Pet. 2:10; 2 Ne. 9:40.

Or maybe God brought LGBTQ+ as LGBTQ+? They are God's creation, thus they are deserved to be loved as we love ourselves.

 

[BS Filter]

Or maybe God brought LGBTQ+ as LGBTQ+? They are God's creation, thus they are deserved to be loved as we love ourselves.

Agree they are God's creation. The sin is changing God's creation. God created them male and female. Period.

 

[onefour1]

Or maybe God brought LGBTQ+ as LGBTQ+? They are God's creation, thus they are deserved to be loved as we love ourselves.

Then why would God teach against his own creation? Doesn't fly. Homosexual acts were considered an ABOMINATION in the eyes of God.

abom·i·na·tion ə-ˌbä-mə-ˈnā-shən

Synonyms of abomination
1
: something regarded with disgust or hatred : something abominable
considered war an abomination

2
: extreme disgust and hatred : LOATHING
a crime regarded with abomination

Before coming to this earth, those spirits who came to earth were those who fought valiantly in the war in heaven. Those who sided with Satan were denied the opportunity of receiving a body of flesh and bones. I do not believe that anyone was created by God to defy God. Only those who give themselves over to false teachings and practices of their own free will and choice after coming to this earth engage in such practices. God doesn't make us that way. He would be a hypocrite to make us as an ABOMINATION. It is we, as weak and faithless souls who choose to place ourselves in abominable situations and to desire them. Just as a smoker teaches himself to smoke and love nicotine or a drug addict who subjects himself to heroin. God doesn't make them that way but they use their own free will and choice to do that which is negatively looked upon as bad. God loves all mankind but heaven would not be heaven if wicked and abominable people were allowed to enter therein. We all make mistakes, but Jesus suffered for those mistakes so that we might repent of them and receive forgiveness. He loved us that much. But if we ignore his gift of repentance and forgiveness and persist in our evil and wicked ways, we will receive the reward of justice because we refused his mercy. To love others does not mean that one should accept the bad and evil practices of others. We should teach against them and try to reform them. Just as a father should not accept that his son goes out and robs others of their property, neither should our Father in heaven accept the evil practices of his children but call them unto repentance and forgive them if they change their ways. A loving father would not accept the evil practices of his son but seek to reform him and have him change into a good being. Acceptance of evil in not love.