No One Voted to Destroy Social Security

[Kat]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

 

[owebo]

Let me put this in perspective of the Tribal pissing match that this thread was about.
SS is untouchable, NOT because it can't be fixed, tuned and managed. Or converted to a true entitlement program for the needy. It can't be touched because the truth of it's mismanagement and how it's been ignored would light off a revolution of awareness in the American people.

Why do you think it is that B.H.Obama doesn't DEFEND his massive debts that are being run up? Because HONESTLY -- a large fraction of his debt is the recent SS shortfalls that he helped to start early with his '09 "tax breaks" for folks who pay NOTHING to the Fed other than FICA taxes. He doesn't want to draw attention to the fact that now yearly deficits of $30 or $60Bill in FICA revenue is a large part of his debt contribution.

Because even the slow learners would have to ask why the taxpayers are paying for the SS shortfalls when they've been told that there are $$TRills in SS TF "assets". And that those deficits are being paid NOW for by the VICTIMS of the original theft. Instead of being invested or used to reduced debt or used to defer costs when the working people were being OVERCHARGED for Soc Sec for 30 years or more.

It's all political posturing because they fucked it up. And nobody wants to FOCUS on fixing it for the future.

It will be interesting to see Trumps take on the secret Clinton 3-lock box....Trump simply doesn't give a fuck as long as it's in the best interest of the people....and in this case, the t Utah is about the only thing left in the 3-lock box....on top of IOU's of IOU's for IOU's.......

Don't know where on the priorities that is with this clown. It'll cost him political capital just to MENTION SS. And frankly, the time has passed to avert the crisis that they TOLD US was coming for decades. The time to FIX stuff was when their were surpluses that could have been invested in ideas to defer costs. Those suggestions were KILLED by partisan bickering and an unwillingness to confront the theft.

As an example -- IF the surplus had been used to buy back EXISTING BONDS from the marketplace, that would have reduced the overall Fed debt and put us $TRILLs ahead in our ability to cover the shortfall. A REAL investment of the overcharges.

OR -- the proposal in 2001 was to allow some volunteers to opt out a SMALL FRACTION of their contributions (all covered by the surplus money coming from workers wallets) in exchange for greatly FUTURE benefits paid to them. That fantastic idea was DOA because of tribal bickering.. And propaganda. And the smearing like the OP of this thread.

What political capital? He could give a flying fuck about political capital since it took none for him to be POTUS....see what I mean? I think that if the people,are getting fucked, he is going to lay it all out for everyone to see, then ask what he wants us to do about it....

He simply does not give a fuck, so imwoildmexpect a bold discussion, then bold action....

What have we got to lose?

 

[owebo]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

 

[JoeTheEconomist]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

 

[owebo]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

Takers....

 

[Kat]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

But how much is being pulled constantly from someone's pay? A LOT.

 

[flacaltenn]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

 

[Kat]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

Really sad. And if this is the case, WHY are they still forcing people to pay into SS?

 

[Lakhota]

Let me put this in perspective of the Tribal pissing match that this thread was about.
SS is untouchable, NOT because it can't be fixed, tuned and managed. Or converted to a true entitlement program for the needy. It can't be touched because the truth of it's mismanagement and how it's been ignored would light off a revolution of awareness in the American people.

Why do you think it is that B.H.Obama doesn't DEFEND his massive debts that are being run up? Because HONESTLY -- a large fraction of his debt is the recent SS shortfalls that he helped to start early with his '09 "tax breaks" for folks who pay NOTHING to the Fed other than FICA taxes. He doesn't want to draw attention to the fact that now yearly deficits of $30 or $60Bill in FICA revenue is a large part of his debt contribution.

Because even the slow learners would have to ask why the taxpayers are paying for the SS shortfalls when they've been told that there are $$TRills in SS TF "assets". And that those deficits are being paid NOW for by the VICTIMS of the original theft. Instead of being invested or used to reduced debt or used to defer costs when the working people were being OVERCHARGED for Soc Sec for 30 years or more.

It's all political posturing because they fucked it up. And nobody wants to FOCUS on fixing it for the future.

It will be interesting to see Trumps take on the secret Clinton 3-lock box....Trump simply doesn't give a fuck as long as it's in the best interest of the people....and in this case, the t Utah is about the only thing left in the 3-lock box....on top of IOU's of IOU's for IOU's.......

Don't know where on the priorities that is with this clown. It'll cost him political capital just to MENTION SS. And frankly, the time has passed to avert the crisis that they TOLD US was coming for decades. The time to FIX stuff was when their were surpluses that could have been invested in ideas to defer costs. Those suggestions were KILLED by partisan bickering and an unwillingness to confront the theft.

As an example -- IF the surplus had been used to buy back EXISTING BONDS from the marketplace, that would have reduced the overall Fed debt and put us $TRILLs ahead in our ability to cover the shortfall. A REAL investment of the overcharges.

OR -- the proposal in 2001 was to allow some volunteers to opt out a SMALL FRACTION of their contributions (all covered by the surplus money coming from workers wallets) in exchange for greatly FUTURE benefits paid to them. That fantastic idea was DOA because of tribal bickering.. And propaganda. And the smearing like the OP of this thread.

We are where we are! Do you want to abolish Social Security? If so, what would you want to replace it with?

Still no answer to my "specific" questions...

 

[flacaltenn]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

Really sad. And if this is the case, WHY are they still forcing people to pay into SS?

This is NOT impossible to fix for future generations. The partisan pissing just has to STOP. And the problem laid on the table. Can't rely on importing workers to boost the FICA income. And MOST OF ALL -- the govt expansion and spending increases HAVE TO STOP...

 

[owebo]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

Really sad. And if this is the case, WHY are they still forcing people to pay into SS?

Democrats turned it into a tax now, which is why I have no problem killing it....

 

[JoeTheEconomist]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

But how much is being pulled constantly from someone's pay? A LOT.

Agreed. The problem is that every penny of that "LOT" is used to pay benefits of existing retirees. For every dollar diverted away from SS has to be replaced by a dollar of a different tax. The question becomes on whom.

 

[flacaltenn]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

But how much is being pulled constantly from someone's pay? A LOT.

Agreed. The problem is that every penny of that "LOT" is used to pay benefits of existing retirees. For every dollar diverted away from SS has to be replaced by a dollar of a different tax. The question becomes on whom.

Just stop SPENDING. Cut the waste. Slash the agencies back to manageable and responsible proportions. No "tax" required.

If it becomes an entitlement for needy seniors, The size of the pool will be a third of what it currently is. MUCH more easily supportable by EXISTING (reduced) FICA taxes. Others not entitled, get a SUBSTANTIAL tax for the entirety of their working lives. Maybe with the provisions that they HAVE a portable retirement account that get PERSONALLY funded.

 

[regent]

It was Bush that put forward the plan to privatize Social Security.

 

[WillReadmore]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

But how much is being pulled constantly from someone's pay? A LOT.

Agreed. The problem is that every penny of that "LOT" is used to pay benefits of existing retirees. For every dollar diverted away from SS has to be replaced by a dollar of a different tax. The question becomes on whom.

Just stop SPENDING. Cut the waste. Slash the agencies back to manageable and responsible proportions. No "tax" required.

If it becomes an entitlement for needy seniors, The size of the pool will be a third of what it currently is. MUCH more easily supportable by EXISTING (reduced) FICA taxes. Others not entitled, get a SUBSTANTIAL tax for the entirety of their working lives. Maybe with the provisions that they HAVE a portable retirement account that get PERSONALLY funded.

Congress can cut spending any time they want. It doesn't require some new excuse. Suggesting "just stop spending" doesn't work. Someone has to actually find spending to cut and then get congress to agree.

Means testing isn't all that easy, as determining someone's wealth isn't easy.

Everyone already needs investments toward retirement. It's not as if SS is enough. And, people raid their 401k and other such accounts on a regular basis. Plus, it hasn't been that long since people had their homes stolen.

 

[WillReadmore]

It was Bush that put forward the plan to privatize Social Security.

Well, he put forward what Repubs think of as a plan.

That is, it was a general idea for which there never was a plan.

It's kind of like their health care "plan" - kill what we have and then try to figure out what to do next. Hilarious, if these were SNL spoofs.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

And noone has, the election is over. You can Stop with the bullshit, throw granny off the cliff stuff. Your scare tactics no longer have impsct, people caught on.

What these Nazis are planning is even worse than just throwing granny off the cliff.

I heard this shit in the 80s, the 90s,.the 2000s and it has never happened

Why do NaziCons keep threatening to do it?

Because something needs to happen.

You jerks on the left don't realize that Social Security does not even benefit those who need it the most.

An average paycheck of 1000/month.

That's security.

Are you kidding me? Without that $1000 a month they're screwed.

Yes they would be.

And most who are getting it paid into it.

My point is that it does not benefit those who need it the most.

Done right, it could be more than 1000/month.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It was Bush that put forward the plan to privatize Social Security.

Well, he put forward what Repubs think of as a plan.

That is, it was a general idea for which there never was a plan.

It's kind of like their health care "plan" - kill what we have and then try to figure out what to do next. Hilarious, if these were SNL spoofs.

Nobody is suggesting killing it.

And any change has to be phased in very slowly.

People who get it now deserve it (for the most part).

 

[Kat]

What do you do with the millions of elderly already on SS?

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

Really sad. And if this is the case, WHY are they still forcing people to pay into SS?

Democrats turned it into a tax now, which is why I have no problem killing it....

Not exactly sure what you mean. I just do not want it taken from people getting and needing it now........like my mom for example. Many people.

 

[owebo]

The ones who paid in? Give them what's theirs....

From whom would you take the money? There is only $2.8 trillion in the system today. The system has accrued benefits owed of $30 trillion - well that is only the ones that paid in.

There is NOTHING "in the system today".. Other than phony bookkeeping and fairy tales. Every SS deficit $ is a new bond on the backs of future taxpayers.

Existing retirees and those close to retirement should not be affected in any way. It's too late to "fix" the boom. We are in the crisis we warned about for 4 decades. All efforts should be underwriting either a stably funded future UNIVERSAL program or turn Soc Sec into a welfare entitlement in the future. Which is what most of the proposals do anyways.

It is IMMORAL to tell a roofer to work til they are 68 or 70 years to receive benefits. Folks making those kind of suggestions don't have an ounce of sense or a heart.

Really sad. And if this is the case, WHY are they still forcing people to pay into SS?

Democrats turned it into a tax now, which is why I have no problem killing it....

Not exactly sure what you mean. I just do not want it taken from people getting and needing it now........like my mom for example. Many people.

People who put money in should get every cent back.

It should be ended so that no one contributes any longer.

All the ancillary liberal leaches who never paid into the system should be cut off immediately and a repayment plan created for them to return the money.

I want to be fair to the people who were fooled.....