Occupy Wall Street: The Movement Grows

[CrusaderFrank]

The point being missed here is that just like the American Revolution, change only comes when the wealthy want it. The 1% has two factions, the greedy Wall Street types, and the Patriotic Millionaires.

"Recently members of the group calling themselves “Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength” sent a letter to Pres. Barack Obama, Harry Reid (Majority Leader in the U. S. Senate), and John Boehner (Speaker of the U. S. House of Representatives). What made the letter notable was that it requested that “you increase taxes on incomes over $1,000,000”—the letter then being signed by a long list of millionaires."

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Here is a link to Patriotic Millionaires a quiet group that knows how to twist arms in hardball politics. “Patriotic Millionaires” | Dissident Voice The Republicans and the Tea Party are going to come out of this like Torries after the American Revolution - assimilate or leave. The Democratic Party in my opinion will get slapped into the middle of next week. The result will be an America that serves all legal CITIZENS.

Sure, Komrade, sure

 

[Si modo]

"Mom and apple pie"? Damn. You ask me to waste my fucking time explaining the obvious to you. I do, and you still claim 'efficiency' has no meaning.

I didn't say it had no meaning. A "mom and apple pie" phrase is one nobody is going to disagree with. Ask anyone -- I don't care who -- if they approve of efficiency in government, and they're going to say yes. Who is going to say, "No, I think the government should waste the taxpayers' money?" That's not true however of "small government" or "big government."

You did not waste your time and I did read what you wrote. I pointed out that your preference for a small government doesn't extend to the military, after letting you confirm this yourself. Is that not a valid conclusion? Well, let's see, you do say a bit more.

With respect to my preference that the DOD has priority funding, that is true. With respect to my desire that all government is smaller and more efficient, with the latter comes the former. So, my priority assignment to the DOD is not inconsitent with my 'smaller and more efficient government' demand. Not at all.

Well, what I originally asked is if you would want to see our overseas commitments pared back and our military reduced in size. I took your answer for a "no," but come to think of it you didn't explicitly say that. So let me try again.

Given all of our military commitments at this time, not just the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but also all of the U.S. military bases in foreign countries around the world and our enormous navy, air force, and army, do you think we should cut any of this back, i.e. end the wars, close military bases, or change/reduce our current military missions, or do you think they should be kept as they are, or increased?

....

Yes, I do think some can be cut back.

Again, with an approach to a free market, the fair playing field is a given.

All of the above would be realized.

So what you're saying is that these things:

High wages
Full employment
Easy opportunities to start small businesses and succeed at it
Access to higher education that is affordable for everyone
Access to medical care that is affordable for everyone

will all arise as a result of a freer market? Can you explain how that works? Because historically, it doesn't look to me like it works that way at all. Generally speaking, a free market (if you mean one in which the government doesn't interfere with business) has led to slack employment, low wages, monopolies, and higher education that was affordable only for the wealthy. Not to mention our travesty of a health-care system.

....

As I said before, I realize the need for some regulations to prevent some of those problems you mentioned.

We have too many regulations and they make some of those problems much worse.

The best metaphor I can produce that would explain what I mean is Le Chatlier's principle: When a system in equilibrium is fucked with by an external influence, there is a new value for the equilibrium as the system adjusts to account for that influence. That applies to the market. Right now, it's a mess - thank you government.

....

With our bloated regulations, some may. We need to pare those regulations down so that we can approach that fair playing field described above.

So (setting aside your husband's ex -- I doubt she's any worse than MY ex, so I sympathize), it's your belief, again, that regulations give those who have more power to infringe people's rights their ability to do so.

....

Not always, but generally, yes. The more regs, the more some game it, and game it well.

.... Would you say that the railroad industry was more or less regulated by the government in the early 1900s than it is today?

Honestly, I know little abut the railroad, but what I do know is that in a country this size, it may be a rather dated service. It's a good local service to have, though. And, for the most part, they are government entities.

 

[flacaltenn]

The point being missed here is that just like the American Revolution, change only comes when the wealthy want it. The 1% has two factions, the greedy Wall Street types, and the Patriotic Millionaires.

"Recently members of the group calling themselves “Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength” sent a letter to Pres. Barack Obama, Harry Reid (Majority Leader in the U. S. Senate), and John Boehner (Speaker of the U. S. House of Representatives). What made the letter notable was that it requested that “you increase taxes on incomes over $1,000,000”—the letter then being signed by a long list of millionaires."

​

​

Here is a link to Patriotic Millionaires a quiet group that knows how to twist arms in hardball politics. “Patriotic Millionaires” | Dissident Voice The Republicans and the Tea Party are going to come out of this like Torries after the American Revolution - assimilate or leave. The Democratic Party in my opinion will get slapped into the middle of next week. The result will be an America that serves all legal CITIZENS.

Sure, Komrade, sure

I see they already have those WWII type propaganda posters out. The "know your enemy" kindof deal.. Gee I wonder if Lebron James is the greedy Wall St type or a Patriotic type.

Do you physically have to WORK on Wall Street? Or just own a lot of stuff? Just trying to figure out which side to join..

 

[Synthaholic]

The fact that this thread is growing fast shows the Right is terrified of #OWS!!!

Find your own at Occupy Together | Home

 

[Big Fitz]

Yeah... and today I drive by the infestation of occupados and what do I see?

A Shrine to FDR
"Bring the troops home" sign
"Revolution Evolution" Sign carried by a burnt out hippie looking doofus with hair down his back and ratty fatigues looking stoned and disoriented.

And then the dumbasses decided to bring public opinion on their side by blocking traffic causing mayhem for the little guy by making them miss connecting buses and trains and lots of taxis racking up extra fares stuck in traffic.

Good job! Growing the movement by making the lives of little people harder while the jags and the Mercedes and Acuras just cleared downtown quickly and went on unaffected.

Once again, the idiot left hurts the ones they claim to help.

I couldn't help but hear the bastardized lyrics to Elenor Rigby:

Ahhhh look at all the stupid people
Aahhh look at all the stupid people

Elenor Rigby shouting and protesting
wall street bankers who aren't even there
nobody cares

Look at her standing
and shouting dumb slogans
that make little sense to the rest
boy she is dense.

All the stupid people
Where do they all come from
All the stupid people
Where do they all belong?

Ahhhhh! Look at all the stupid people!
Aahhhh! Look at all the stupid people!

 

[Dot Com]

Here's another if that one went over yopur head

 

[Big Fitz]

Here's another if that one went over yopur head

So can you answer the question no Occupado can?

You want to change from Capitalism, yes?

Change TO what, and what are the logistics are for you to achieve this goal?

 

[Stephanie]

The fact that this thread is growing fast shows the Right is terrified of #OWS!!!

What are we suppose to be scared of? Dying of laughter?

 

[frazzledgear]

The fact that this thread is growing fast shows the Right is terrified of #OWS!!!

Find your own at Occupy Together*|*Home

These losers are scary but not for the reasons you think.

First of all this is being organized, funded and paid for by several different leftwing organizations. People involved in that have been interviewed on tv so let's not pretend this is any kind of "grass roots" bullshit.

This is mob mentality and nothing less. For people claiming to be part of something larger, they are a REMARKABLY inarticulate group of people unable to give a coherent answer to a question. Not just one or two people but SCORES of them with serious problems trying to string 5 words into a coherent sentence! The reason is because many of them are being paid to be there. If you are being paid to be there, then its pretty damn hard to come up with a different and valid sounding reason to explain why they would be parked outside, shitting in public, creating health hazards and wasting precious and scarce city resources. And THAT is what they sound like. "Uh well it seemed like it might be, well I know someone who thought it might be...it isn't fair about the housing, banks did that and those rich Wall Street bankers..uh. You know."

They clearly have NO intention of becoming part of the political process and have no intention of leaving even when the weather changes. Instead the organizers of the "Parasites R Us" mobs who are paying so many of these people are actually seeking donations from leftwing extremist organizations and -oh this one is precious -CORPORATE donations to help the mob get through the winter by destroying New York City's budget and eventually forcing the shut down of vital services.

Trying to compare these paid for mobs, HUNDREDS of whom have been arrested (compared to the ZERO at Tea Parties) -with Tea Parties is ludicrous on its face. Sure the Tea Parties started as public demonstrations -not useless dunces who seek to become entrenched smelly mobs shitting in public and creating a health risk for others as well as exhibiting their own filthy hygiene -but they QUICKLY moved to become PART of the political process and JOIN the political process - and not remain OUTSIDE of it.

These mobs want no part of becoming part of the process. What little I can make out from their rambling gibberish is they essentially want everything the rich have -but without working for it of course. In fact they don't want to work for ANYTHING -they demand it just be GIVEN to them. These are people who not only exist as parasites on the rest of us -they WANT to be parasites. They should check the polls on how these mobs are actually viewed by voters -of BOTH parties as well as independents. Not much sympathy out there for them AT ALL -while the majority of Americans STILL say they trust the Tea Party more than politicians from EITHER party! Most Democrats will NOT give verbal support to these mobs because they KNOW it is hazardous to their own careers to do so.

Obama is proving to be true moron when it comes to political smarts after all - convinced his key to re-election is by proving he has no intention of getting off that far left radical extremist agenda of his. Whoever told him that is a winning strategy for re-election should be fired. The only other Democrats to give public support are those like Pelosi from some of the furthest leftwing extremist safe districts where they will pay no political price for giving public support to leftwing extremists mobs. The rest will not touch these people with a ten foot pole -and wisely so. These are extremists and radicals who want to destroy our entire system -not be a part of it. These people are ANTI-AMERICAN and don't kid yourself otherwise. I couldn't care less if they sit out there all winter except for the fact they enjoy wasting the precious resources of the city -which will result in harming real people, those who need those vital services the most. Oh yeah, real "noble" of them there, isn't it? Their belief they are actually accomplishing something positive is pure fantasy -except for ONE thing. They are helping make sure Obama is a one term President.

No one except other far leftwing radical extremists really identifies with these people and since they have made it pretty clear they do not intend nor want to become part of the political process, then they have shot their wad. THIS is it. Oh wow that will sure get candidates on the ballot they want, right? ROFL There is a reason these people are largely a homogeneous group. And HEY has CNN and MSNBC run a hostile hit piece about how these mobs are all YOUNG WHITE PEOPLE and therefore it must mean they are all RACISTS and we can just ignore their RACIST demands? I think it is highly significant racially that these are all white people and young too! No older people, no blacks to speak of, no Hispanics to speak of -just mobs of young white people. If nothing else, it absolutely proves just how RACIST they really are because clearly blacks do NOT feel welcome there, do they? And truthfully leftwing mobs ARE inherently scary because it is a FACT leftwingers are far more likely to resort to violence and then claim their.....PASSION excuses and even justifies resorting to violence! Leftwing extremists are always on the edge of violence -UNLIKE the Tea Parties.

Bad news for the parasites -change doesn't come from squatting and shitting in public for weeks and months and turning NYC into a toilet. After a while no one cares and eventually the apathy turns to animosity as they refuse to become part of the system and work for the changes they claim they want to see. What, they expect it to happen by MAGIC? No, NATURALLY they expect OTHER people to do it FOR them like everything else in life! ROFL -of course they do. Otherwise it just sounds like too much.....work, doesn't it? These mobs have no problem squandering the limited resources of the city, no problem forcing the city to pay millions it doesn't have in overtime which WILL result in cutting back or possibly canceling vital services and they don't care that the people who will be hurt the worse for it won't be the rich they waste their lives envying -but those who rely on those services the most. These people want to pretend they represent something important but without actually doing anything of any real substance or import. It doesn't mean I have to join them in that dumb delusion. These people are NOTHING like the Tea Party people who had very specific and well articulated complaints about government overreach and out of control spending. Ooh, now that's scary, isn't it? While these individuals cannot answer a simple question about why they are even there. All they know is "rich-bad". Imagine if the Tea Party had been holding signs with well known liberals and Democrats' heads on spiked with blood dripping down their faces. Tea Parties were peaceful, ZERO arrests, cleaned up after themselves upon disbanding. Oh but when leftwing extremists get arrested by the HUNDREDS, shit all over a city in public, waste scarce and precious resources protecting everyone else in the city from THEM -why that just shows how....PASSIONATE they are, right? So its ok when THEY hold signs advocating violence against very real PRIVATE CITIZENS, right? Its ok when THEY disrupt the lives of everyone else and prevent them from getting to work easily and its ok when they SHIT everywhere and lack any attempt at personal hygiene, creating a very real health hazard for everyone else. Because whatever leftwing extremists do is FINE WITH OTHER EXTREMISTS who hold EVERYONE else to a different standard. Like no one else has noticed the double standard, right? ROFL

I don't care how long these people want to waste their lives doing nothing of substance and nothing of import while pretending they are being so "noble" and all. What a joke.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Hating the rich makes everyone richer. Just look at...er, um.....well, name a Progressive Utopia where they're better off? Cuba? No Korea?

 

[MikeK]

These losers are scary but not for the reasons you think.

First of all this is being organized, funded and paid for by several different leftwing organizations. People involved in that have been interviewed on tv so let's not pretend this is any kind of "grass roots" bullshit.

This is mob mentality and nothing less.[...]

(Excerpt)

An inchoate, seemingly rudderless administration coupled with a sinking economy and civil unrest is a recipe for an anarchical response. Weakness, vacillation and erosion of institutional authority are an invitation to anarchical thuggery, which looks like welcome strength when compared to feebleness and arbitrariness.

It should be no surprise, then, that the Occupy Wall Street uprisings are happening. After all, such mob uprisings have historical precedent. Anarchy followed by tyranny occurs whenever weakness and a power vacuum, perceived or real, exists.

(Close)

Read more here: Articles: The American Revolution of 2012

Basically the writer is saying this could have been prevented if Obama had done what he led us to believe he would do, beginning with investigations and prosecutions of those Wall Street elements which are responsible for the collapse of our economy (see the video, Inside Job). The problem is Obama is a Wall Street puppet. Wall Street sponsored him and Wall Street owns him.

But Wall Street does not own the Mob.

 

[Stephanie]

These losers are scary but not for the reasons you think.

First of all this is being organized, funded and paid for by several different leftwing organizations. People involved in that have been interviewed on tv so let's not pretend this is any kind of "grass roots" bullshit.

This is mob mentality and nothing less.[...]

(Excerpt)

An inchoate, seemingly rudderless administration coupled with a sinking economy and civil unrest is a recipe for an anarchical response. Weakness, vacillation and erosion of institutional authority are an invitation to anarchical thuggery, which looks like welcome strength when compared to feebleness and arbitrariness.

It should be no surprise, then, that the Occupy Wall Street uprisings are happening. After all, such mob uprisings have historical precedent. Anarchy followed by tyranny occurs whenever weakness and a power vacuum, perceived or real, exists.

(Close)

Read more here: Articles: The American Revolution of 2012

Basically the writer is saying this could have been prevented if Obama had done what he led us to believe he would do, beginning with investigations and prosecutions of those Wall Street elements which are responsible for the collapse of our economy (see the video, Inside Job). The problem is Obama is a Wall Street puppet. Wall Street sponsored him and Wall Street owns him.

But Wall Street does not own the Mob.

Then HOW COME the Ows aren't calling for the prosecution of the OBAMA if he is a puppet of wall street?
The only puppets I see are the dummies OCCUPYING some imaginary boogyman.

 

[Katzndogz]

The sad stories about college grads not finding work are UNPERSUASIVE. If they got a degree what was it IN. I know hundreds of college grads that can't find work. They have degrees in niche social movements. One woman who applied for a job with me had a degree in Indigenous Basket Weaving and Pottery. My husband's daughter graduated with a degree Women's Studies and a minor in Comparative Religion. She eventually took a low paying job as a secretary. Two of her roommates, one with a degree in Building and Design and another in Nanotechnology, got recruited by major companies and got signing bonuses. One grad I know with a degree in Architecture got recruited by a firm in China and left about two years ago.

If someone wants to skate through college with fluff classes and lots of partying, they can be assured of being resentful. When they should be blaming themselves.

 

[Si modo]

The sad stories about college grads not finding work are UNPERSUASIVE. If they got a degree what was it IN. I know hundreds of college grads that can't find work. They have degrees in niche social movements. One woman who applied for a job with me had a degree in Indigenous Basket Weaving and Pottery. My husband's daughter graduated with a degree Women's Studies and a minor in Comparative Religion. She eventually took a low paying job as a secretary. Two of her roommates, one with a degree in Building and Design and another in Nanotechnology, got recruited by major companies and got signing bonuses. One grad I know with a degree in Architecture got recruited by a firm in China and left about two years ago.

If someone wants to skate through college with fluff classes and lots of partying, they can be assured of being resentful. When they should be blaming themselves.

Exactly. It takes both hard work AND smart work, because that is what the market supports.

 

[Uncensored2008]

At the end of the day, when you take away all the smoke and mirrors from the righties, the vast majority of these OWS folks DON'T want a free ride, DON'T shit on cars, and ARE NOT hippies.

The vast majority are union goons who want government money to cover the amount THEY LOST investing in the same Wall Street firms they now protest.

The message of OWS is, and has always been, "Gimmee Gimmee Gimmee"

What they are saying - and even the most disingenuous of righties know this, but would never admit it - is that, unfettered capitalism (ie, we must make the most money possible by screwing over everybody else, and we don't care how we do it), doesn't work.

The days of a Wall Streeter's bottom line of only making as much money as possible and the fallout be damned are over. The days where a CEO gets paid a multi-million dollar bonus even if the share price of his compnay crashes, or the company issues a profit warning, are over. The days where I can jump through loop holes while fucking over everybody else while I buy my new $500,000 porsche are over.

That is what they are talking about. Most of those folk just want the Wall St guys to behave. Don't think it is that much to ask.

You somehow think if you regulate Wall St, the whole system will come tumbling down. Well, I can tell you this for a fact, it almost came tumbling down when they had NO regulation.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Unfettered capitalism is what drove South and Central American banana republics...

What an insanely stupid claim.

 

[Uncensored2008]

While I do think the DOD has ample room to increase efficiency and eliminate waste, if you recall, I have strong neocon leanings. So, the DOD would be covered in needing to increase efficiency and eliminate waste, I still do want our defense budget to be a priority in funding. We, the USA, cannot afford to lose defense supremacy, especially now that our politicians have lost our supremacy in most other areas.

One of the things you and I have clashed on in the past, as a Libertarian and Neocon are BOUND to clash over, is my desire to reduce defense spending by 90%

HOWEVER, though I stand by my desire; I also view defense spending to be the priority. In fact, it is one of the very few legitimate functions of government. I want all troops out of Iraq, Japan, Germany, Korea, etc. I thought Afghanistan was necessary and masterfully by Bush - UNTIL he failed to bring everyone home after three months. If the Taliban return, bomb them to rubble again. Nation building and occupation is for fools.

Absolutely. That's what a free market does. I do not advocate for no regulations, but I do advocate for keeping it to just a few. The bloated regulations we have now have made the playing field LESS fair.

Well said.

Of course. For example, individuals can infringe on my rights and there are consequences when they do. Just as I must accept the consequences of my actions.

Ditto.

 

[Katzndogz]

The point being missed here is that just like the American Revolution, change only comes when the wealthy want it. The 1% has two factions, the greedy Wall Street types, and the Patriotic Millionaires.

"Recently members of the group calling themselves “Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength” sent a letter to Pres. Barack Obama, Harry Reid (Majority Leader in the U. S. Senate), and John Boehner (Speaker of the U. S. House of Representatives). What made the letter notable was that it requested that “you increase taxes on incomes over $1,000,000”—the letter then being signed by a long list of millionaires."

​

​

Here is a link to Patriotic Millionaires a quiet group that knows how to twist arms in hardball politics. “Patriotic Millionaires” | Dissident Voice The Republicans and the Tea Party are going to come out of this like Torries after the American Revolution - assimilate or leave. The Democratic Party in my opinion will get slapped into the middle of next week. The result will be an America that serves all legal CITIZENS.

Is there anything more stupid or idiotic than this? Really. Isn't this the HEIGHT of manipulation.

IF these millionaires are so serious about increasing taxes on the wealthy, you just have to ask if they take advantage of every loophole themselves? Do they claim every deduction they are entitlted to. How much is the separate check they write the Treasury Department every year.

They do none of that. They are moved for some emotion that causes them to assuage their guilt at being wealthy by raising taxes on everyone else. They will take advantage of every loophole, they will scour the accounting for deductions and no they won't write a separate check to the Treasury.

 

[MikeK]

[ Then HOW COME the Ows aren't calling for the prosecution of the OBAMA if he is a puppet of wall street?

Because Obama has not engaged in any categorical and prosecutable criminal activity, such as banking fraud, insider trading, Fraudulent Reporting and many other crimes. And if you'd like to know the specifics of some of the major criminal activites perpetrated by certain Wall Street entities you can obtain quite an education by simply watching the video, Inside Job. If you want more information about that video just Google up, Inside Job. I promise you'll be impressed by what you'll learn from this video.

The only puppets I see are the dummies OCCUPYING some imaginary boogyman.

"It often takes a great deal of intelligence to see that which is right before our eyes." (Edmond Duranty)

That's why.

 

[MikeK]

The sad stories about college grads not finding work are UNPERSUASIVE. If they got a degree what was it IN. I know hundreds of college grads that can't find work. They have degrees in niche social movements. One woman who applied for a job with me had a degree in Indigenous Basket Weaving and Pottery. My husband's daughter graduated with a degree Women's Studies and a minor in Comparative Religion. She eventually took a low paying job as a secretary. Two of her roommates, one with a degree in Building and Design and another in Nanotechnology, got recruited by major companies and got signing bonuses. One grad I know with a degree in Architecture got recruited by a firm in China and left about two years ago.

If someone wants to skate through college with fluff classes and lots of partying, they can be assured of being resentful. When they should be blaming themselves.

Even if your biased theory were substantive the fact remains that someone with a college education who cannot find some kind of job, even as secretary or retail sales associate, etc., is a clear indication of severe economic problems. The simple fact is there are no jobs and anyone who says there are is blowing smoke.