Offical Impeachment Thread

[Flopper]

How can you charge Trump with crimes no one saw?

Bribery? Nope

Quid Pro Quo? Nope

Trump is not being legally charged with any crimes. He's being impeached. Articles of impeachment can include climes but most articles are not federal crimes. The most common articles are violation of oath of office, misuse of executive power, conduct unbecoming the office, and lying to congress.

Impeachment is a political process used to remove a president just as election is a political process for selecting a president. What this means is that all laws and regulation involving evidence and criminal court procedures do apply. The entire process is regulated by House and Senate rules and the constitution.

For example, the legal concept of hearsay applies in trials and related proceedings in court. It doesn’t apply and doesn’t make sense in the congressional impeachment inquiry, nor in any potential impeachment trial in the Senate.

Congress is not a court, and no rules of evidence apply to its activities, including impeachment. This is not a technical distinction: It’s a foundation part of the constitutional structure.

Why hearsay isn't a problem for Congress in impeachment hearings

 

[MarathonMike]

How can you charge Trump with crimes no one saw?

Bribery? Nope

Quid Pro Quo? Nope

Trump is not being legally charged with any crimes. He's being impeached. Articles of impeachment can include climes but most articles are not federal crimes. The most common articles are violation of oath of office, misuse of executive power, conduct unbecoming the office, and lying to congress.

Impeachment is a political process used to remove a president just as election is a political process for selecting a president. What this means is that all laws and regulation involving evidence and criminal court procedures do apply. The entire process is regulated by House and Senate rules and the constitution.

For example, the legal concept of hearsay applies in trials and related proceedings in court. It doesn’t apply and doesn’t make sense in the congressional impeachment inquiry, nor in any potential impeachment trial in the Senate.

Congress is not a court, and no rules of evidence apply to its activities, including impeachment. This is not a technical distinction: It’s a foundation part of the constitutional structure.

Why hearsay isn't a problem for Congress in impeachment hearings

Super. Then let's stretch the limits of the Constitution and the definition of 'hearsay' so that the minority Party will always just Impeach every sitting President from now on.

 

[beagle9]

How can you charge Trump with crimes no one saw?

Bribery? Nope

Quid Pro Quo? Nope

Trump is not being legally charged with any crimes. He's being impeached. Articles of impeachment can include climes but most articles are not federal crimes. The most common articles are violation of oath of office, misuse of executive power, conduct unbecoming the office, and lying to congress.

Impeachment is a political process used to remove a president just as election is a political process for selecting a president. What this means is that all laws and regulation involving evidence and criminal court procedures do apply. The entire process is regulated by House and Senate rules and the constitution.

For example, the legal concept of hearsay applies in trials and related proceedings in court. It doesn’t apply and doesn’t make sense in the congressional impeachment inquiry, nor in any potential impeachment trial in the Senate.

Congress is not a court, and no rules of evidence apply to its activities, including impeachment. This is not a technical distinction: It’s a foundation part of the constitutional structure.

Why hearsay isn't a problem for Congress in impeachment hearings

You say mis-use of office, executive power etc, but what about the mis-use of government in the ways in which the demoncrats are using it in order to make bogus claims against the President for purely partisan political reasons ?

A power struggle between groups is exactly what's going on here, and anyone with a second grade education can see this for what it is, and for what it has been since 2016.

If anything the swamp has been paraded out, and through this farce it has been shown just how bad things can get if powerful brainwashing goes on for way to long in America. It has been educational in that regard for sure.

 

[Faun]

The House didn't.

And.............LOL

he said that she heard that someone said that they had heard it from someone else.....

Only place this comedy will be looked at is a house full of Lunatic Libs.

Like Trump says, read the transcript.

"The other thing, There's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it..."​

So.............The President has the right to ask for cooperation of looking into corruption here are there......

Biden isn't immune to it...............Biden has a BIG MOUTH............and brags too much......joked about it..............

No law broken there............now Biden and son..........yeah that is well worth looking at.....Biden was never gonna be the Dem candidate.

The president does not have the right to break the law; and soliciting a foreign national to investigate a political rival breaks the law.

What planet are you on? Didn't watch the hearing today? Guess what. Others did. And that Sean Hannity brought an interesting video on Schiff revealed his true intentions, and his House of Cards may just become the Big House for Schiff. Oh, and the media? They willingly conspired with the DNC's talking point, just like I've been telling everyone around here. *sigh* To darn bad. Now, back to good guy Sean Hannity's words and recordings:

Tissue?

Hannity also reports that an FBI officer is under investigation for altering documents in the 2016 Russia Probe

Naughty, naughty.​

LOL

Well if Sean Hannity said so, then it must be true.

Spoiler

 

[kyzr]

I Say Pelosi Won't Allow A Vote
Unless She Has Votes To Defeat It

Disagree. Nancy knows where the energy is in her party. She has to have a vote on impeachment, but hope and pray that it fails. If impeachment passes then the show trial goes to the Senate where the democrats will look horrible in a presidential election year.

 

[flack]

Nunes DEVASTATES the democrats, the corrupt Deep State bureaucrats, and the fake news media.

Nunes whole lying rant reminded me that no one on Obama's White House Staff was ever charged indicted or convicted of any crime during the whole 8 years of the Obama Administration, and only one Clinton Cabinet member was charged with financial and ethics violations in his administration. The Trump White House has set a record as the most corrupt administration in the history of the country, and that was BEFORE the impeachment hearing started.

Every time Nunez said that Democrats have "been caught", I was reminded that the Clintons have never faced any charges after all of these investigations. Republicans investigated Obama for 8 years and found NOTHING. Republicans had the Congress up until January of this year and they didn't prosecute any Democrats, but a steady stream of Trump staffers were arrested, and either plead guilty or were found guilty of all charges.

Every time Nunes said "They're caught", I thought of Flynn, Manafort, Cohen, Stone, Gates and Papadopolous. If the Democrats are "caught", why aren't Democrats getting arrested or going to jail, like every one of Trump's staffers are in danger of doing, right now, with the exception of John Bolton.

You really can't see what is right before your eyes. The deep state, which the democrats are doing their best to protect, was there running interference for that whole lot of crooks. Why do you think they are so hard to get rid of Trump? Because he is dragging their whole sham out into the sunlight. From money laundering to pedophilia it is all coming out.

 

[flack]

actually, it's the DOJ's business to investigate biden, and they are. Not trump. you should learn your agencies better.

It's a pity Trump went to a foreign national to get help for an investigation into Biden rather than go to his own DoJ. He wouldn't be getting impeached if he had.

If there's no dirt on the Biden's, then what are you guys so worried about? Let Hunter testify.

I couldn't care less about Biden. Investigate him for all I care.

But Trump is still not legally allowed to solicit a foreign national to do it for him.

I want my president to uncover and investigate corruption in other nations before he sends my tax dollars to them...what is it that you find troubling about that?....

Then you should have elected one who sought to have Ukraine fight against corruption rather than look into a 3 year old rumor.

Rumor? Biden, himself, admitted to it on video tape. It's out there for all to see.

 

[kyzr]

How can you charge Trump with crimes no one saw?

Bribery? Nope

Quid Pro Quo? Nope

Trump is not being legally charged with any crimes. He's being impeached. Articles of impeachment can include climes but most articles are not federal crimes. The most common articles are violation of oath of office, misuse of executive power, conduct unbecoming the office, and lying to congress.

Impeachment is a political process used to remove a president just as election is a political process for selecting a president. What this means is that all laws and regulation involving evidence and criminal court procedures do apply. The entire process is regulated by House and Senate rules and the constitution.

For example, the legal concept of hearsay applies in trials and related proceedings in court. It doesn’t apply and doesn’t make sense in the congressional impeachment inquiry, nor in any potential impeachment trial in the Senate.

Congress is not a court, and no rules of evidence apply to its activities, including impeachment. This is not a technical distinction: It’s a foundation part of the constitutional structure.

Why hearsay isn't a problem for Congress in impeachment hearings

Your post was doing so well, up until the part where you said that "hearsay evidence" is allowable in the Senate. If democrats controlled the Senate I would agree, but the GOP runs the Senate and they can make the rules to benefit their case the same way Schiff made the House rules benefit democrats.

If the dems vote Articles of Impeachment out of the House, then the Senate will have the show trial of the century. The democrats will regret impeachment if it happens.

 

[flack]

"When you're trying to overturn 63 million votes and take down a sitting president, you better come up with something more than the fact that you don’t like him."

The votes aren't being "overturned". Pence will still be President.

Whether anyone likes him or not is moot. It's his criminal behaviour that is getting him impeached. He confessed on National TV and released the transcript of the call showing he really did ask for a "favour" in exchange for military aid. He repeated Russian propaganda lies about Crowstrike and the Bidens.

Then the story that the investigations didn't matter, it was the announcement on CNN, so Trump could falsely claim that Biden was corrupt. Trump is admitting he can't win this election unless he gets help and he cheats. He did it last time with Russia, and he barely eked out a win in the electoral college. He got clobbered in the midterms and in every election since his election.

Republican voter registrations are in minus terroritory, while Democratic registrations are surging. Trump is going to have a really, really hard time getting re-elected.

Trump will not be remove from office. What part of that don't you understand?

 

[flack]

WRONG! GOP ID has increased since the 2016 election while Dems have remained flat.

No, totally wrong. You did notice that your link showed the opposite of what you claimed, right?

1. Trends in party affiliation among demographic groups
---
The 8-percentage-point Democratic advantage in leaned partisan identification is wider than at any point since 2009, and a statistically significant shift since 2016, when Democrats had a 4-point edge (48% to 44%).
---

Worst for you is how the democratic advantage is much larger among the young. Party ID is essentially fixed by age 30. If it changes, it changes in the liberal direction, since individuals get more liberal as they age. Republicans only do well with old white men, the group that is shrinking the fastest.

Polls always slant democrat by 10%. Why they are always wrong.

 

[flack]

Was there an investigation into Biden? Nope

Did Ukraine get the aid? Yep

STFU liberals.

Win.....at....the.....polls.

Stop.....being....cvnts

Democrats did win at the polls, even with the Republican voter suppression. And Trump only got his votes with help from a massive Russian disinformation campaign. The Electoral College overturned the popular vote.

So stop with your crocodile tears about the will of the voters.

The EC does not overturn anything in this country. It's the way we've been voting damn near since the start of 1800's. The popular vote is worthless here.

It is amazing how many people don't know how this country works.

The stupid bitch doesn't realize there are 50 elections, not just one. Democracy ends at the State line.

.

 

[flack]

FISA WARRANT BOMBSHELL
Horowitz reportedly finds FBI lawyer falsified FISA doc; WaPo stealth-deletes Strzok connection

 

[RealDave]

It's a pity Trump went to a foreign national to get help for an investigation into Biden rather than go to his own DoJ. He wouldn't be getting impeached if he had.

If there's no dirt on the Biden's, then what are you guys so worried about? Let Hunter testify.

I couldn't care less about Biden. Investigate him for all I care.

But Trump is still not legally allowed to solicit a foreign national to do it for him.

I want my president to uncover and investigate corruption in other nations before he sends my tax dollars to them...what is it that you find troubling about that?....

Then you should have elected one who sought to have Ukraine fight against corruption rather than look into a 3 year old rumor.

Rumor? Biden, himself, admitted to it on video tape. It's out there for all to see.

The US along with other countries wanted to help the Ukraine but the Ukraine was loaded with corruption. No country wanted their help funneled into private pockets. The Prosecutor at that time was not cleaning up the corruption. So we told the Ukraine that we would not give them aid unless they replaced that prosecutor to show they are fighting that corruption. Other countries agrred & were with us in that demand.

Fast forward to Trump. Trump wanted to withhold aid unless the President of the Ukraine announced an investigation into Biden. Not corruption in general, but Joe Biden. Biden is Trumps number one adversary likely in 2020.

Any idiot can see the difference.

 

[RealDave]

So Trump used the power of his office to extort a foreign leader for personal gain. And we know even the Veep knew he was doing it. We know Giuliani was the mastermind (trump the nodding, drooling idiot, god bless him), and we know his hand picked bootlicker Sondland carried it out. We know they are so inept, that they got caught before they could carry it through.

What a gang of idiots. And it was all set into motion by a Ukrainian fugitive oligarch who just happens to be a Putin puppet.

So what was this personal gain of Trump's?

Trashing a political opponent. Come on ow, you can't be this fucking stupid.

 

[hadit]

You also realize that this other guy, Holmes, claim on the call he overheard (haha) with Sondland and Trump goes against what Sondland said, correct?

We're supposed to only believe anti Trumpers. Everyone else is lying.

 

[RealDave]

So Trump used the power of his office to extort a foreign leader for personal gain.

Yet, That Charge Crumbles Upon Cross Examination
With Every Witness Dem's Call

So Why Do You Keep Repeating
A Charge That Didn't Happen

You people are just stupid. Nearly every one who testified tie Trump to the quid pro quo.

THe Republicans have gone from no threat made, no quid pro quo, OK quid Pro Quo but it wasn't that bad.

 

[RealDave]

Ken Starr yesterday:

Ken Starr on the Sondland testimony: 'It's over'
November 20, 2019
Ken Starr, the former solicitor general who headed the investigation that led to the impeachment of former President Bill Clinton, called Wednesday's testimony by U.S. Ambassador to the European Union Gordon Sondland "obviously ... one of those bombshell days."

Speaking on Fox News, Starr agreed with the hosts that things now do not "look good for the president substantively." Sondland's testimony, Starr said, confirmed that there was a quid pro quo between Trump's administration and the Ukrainian government — which would be "bribery," in the jargon of impeachment. Sondland also said that the orders to push Kyiv to open an investigation into Trump's political rivals had come directly from the Oval Office.

Starr focused specifically on the question of Trump's alleged contempt, noting that Sondland had spoken "vehemently and bitterly about his lack of access to records to help him." Additionally, the Democrats' line of questioning made clear that Sondland's attempts to refresh his memory for the testimony had been denied by the administration, which could build the Democrats' case for obstruction.

"There will be articles of impeachment," Starr said. "I think we've known that, it was just confirmed today. Substantively, what we heard from the chairman just now is: It's over. We now know — this is his position — we now know that the president in fact committed the crime of bribery."



***Ken Starr gets the late night call***



Ken Starr this morning:

Ken Starr on impeachment hearings so far: We're 'nowhere close' to impeachable offenses

Funny. Starr was on Laura tonight, and he didn't seem to hold that view at all.

How many years was this Starr investigation?

 

[flack]

If there's no dirt on the Biden's, then what are you guys so worried about? Let Hunter testify.

I couldn't care less about Biden. Investigate him for all I care.

But Trump is still not legally allowed to solicit a foreign national to do it for him.

I want my president to uncover and investigate corruption in other nations before he sends my tax dollars to them...what is it that you find troubling about that?....

Then you should have elected one who sought to have Ukraine fight against corruption rather than look into a 3 year old rumor.

Rumor? Biden, himself, admitted to it on video tape. It's out there for all to see.

The US along with other countries wanted to help the Ukraine but the Ukraine was loaded with corruption. No country wanted their help funneled into private pockets. The Prosecutor at that time was not cleaning up the corruption. So we told the Ukraine that we would not give them aid unless they replaced that prosecutor to show they are fighting that corruption. Other countries agrred & were with us in that demand.

Fast forward to Trump. Trump wanted to withhold aid unless the President of the Ukraine announced an investigation into Biden. Not corruption in general, but Joe Biden. Biden is Trumps number one adversary likely in 2020.

Any idiot can see the difference.

Hang on Dave. It is going to get really bad for you around December 9-11. I feel for you.

 

[playtime]

And Trump isn’t leaving office...too bad so sad for you.

Trump's been waiting three years for you all to take him out. how's that been working out for you? too funny you don't see the irony in your own post.

He is a troll. He doesn’t know what the heck he is talking about. He doesn’t want to engage in a true discussion of the facts.

Like this:

Sondland testified Trump told him there is no quid pro quo.

haaaaaaaaaaa............ troll this asshole....



he admits it w/in 20 secs.

Which he corrected later, keep up!

lol - you are a liar.

in his first testimony he denied it. then he admitted it & not only did he admit it more than once & under oath - he implicated pence, pompeo, mick mulvaney, AND rick perry. sondland was not gonna take the fall; & i believe he used the words :

'EVERYONE KNEW, EVERYONE WAS IN THE LOOP'

 

[hadit]

Besides rightwingnuts, who said Dems are afraid of Biden being investigated?

Apparently all Dems, all who support this impeachment sham against President Trump simply for asking Ukraine to crack down on corruption. Why else would they be claiming this personally benefits President Trump? It only benefits him if Biden is guilty of corruption.

What's apparent is you're fucking brain-dead as virtually no Democrats are saying Biden can't or shouldn't be investigated. What we are saying is that Trump can't solicit a foreign national to investigate Biden.

Savvy?

Why can’t he
You presume it’s soley because Biden is a potential political rival. There are other reasons which include the fact that Biden’s son gravy train ride is self serving to the Biden’s and disadvantageous to the USA.

Biden is part of the crooked Clinton-Obama continuum.

Confidence in Trump economy at record high, with no hit from impeachment.

Another poll finds that public support for President Trump has not waned in the face of House impeachment hearings, and the approval for his handling of the economy has hit a new record high.

In today’s Gallup survey, 57% approve of the Trump economy. That, said the survey analysis, is “by one percentage point, his best as president.”

It comes as the stock market is hitting new highs, and unemployment is at a low for several groups.

Meanwhile, Gallup found that Trump’s approval rating is at a near high of 43% for the year. The last time he was at that level was before the Ukraine phone call emerged.

Most importantly, Republicans still have strong support for the president, at 90%.

This wasn’t how it was supposed to go.

Trump didn't create this economy. And we need to get rid of him before it's too late.

It really doesn't matter if he created it or not because he's taken steps to build on what he received instead of destroying it, as we were told ad nauseum he would. Now, what exactly do you think he's going to do to it if we don't get rid of him right now?