Once again bullying was the root cause

[WheelieAddict]

I don't disagree that bullying is a problem. I wouldn't call it the root cause though.

Why not?

Kids go through a massive emotional upheaval at High School. When kids get bullied, some of them can't deal with that.

If there were less a culture of bullying, then perhaps this kid would feel less inclined to seek out the "dark side" so to speak.

I don't disagree. Bullying is a real problem in schools. I don't think it is the root cause of school shootings though.

Then what is?

Online youth radicalization - Wikipedia

Okay, that's nice. I can read wikipedia. But I'm not debating with wikipedia.

So you take the bits out of there that you think are relevant, and you tell me what you think, not what wikipedia thinks.

Young people today grow up with the internet as a significant source of information and socialization. Vulnerable individuals can find friends with groups that have violent ideologies.

As an example before the internet if a young inexperienced person trying to find themselves had a misguided inclination for nazism a group would be hard to find. Today it's only a few clicks away, and extremist ideologies actively recruit young people to their cause online.

I'm not saying this is the whole cause, just as bullying may play a factor but isn't the whole cause either. It just isn't a simple blame one thing problem.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Why not?

Kids go through a massive emotional upheaval at High School. When kids get bullied, some of them can't deal with that.

If there were less a culture of bullying, then perhaps this kid would feel less inclined to seek out the "dark side" so to speak.

I don't disagree. Bullying is a real problem in schools. I don't think it is the root cause of school shootings though.

Then what is?

Online youth radicalization - Wikipedia

Okay, that's nice. I can read wikipedia. But I'm not debating with wikipedia.

So you take the bits out of there that you think are relevant, and you tell me what you think, not what wikipedia thinks.

Young people today grow up with the internet as a significant source of information and socialization. Vulnerable individuals can find friends with groups that have violent ideologies.

As an example before the internet if a young inexperienced person trying to find themselves had a misguided inclination for nazism a group would be hard to find. Today it's only a few clicks away, and extremist ideologies actively recruit young people to their cause online.

I'm not saying this is the whole cause, just as bullying may play a factor but isn't the whole cause either. It just isn't a simple blame one thing problem.

Yes, they can.

Now, why would they go out and seek such groups? Because they're vulnerable. Why are they vulnerable? Bullying perhaps? Almost certainly.

 

[WheelieAddict]

I don't disagree. Bullying is a real problem in schools. I don't think it is the root cause of school shootings though.

Then what is?

Online youth radicalization - Wikipedia

Okay, that's nice. I can read wikipedia. But I'm not debating with wikipedia.

So you take the bits out of there that you think are relevant, and you tell me what you think, not what wikipedia thinks.

Young people today grow up with the internet as a significant source of information and socialization. Vulnerable individuals can find friends with groups that have violent ideologies.

As an example before the internet if a young inexperienced person trying to find themselves had a misguided inclination for nazism a group would be hard to find. Today it's only a few clicks away, and extremist ideologies actively recruit young people to their cause online.

I'm not saying this is the whole cause, just as bullying may play a factor but isn't the whole cause either. It just isn't a simple blame one thing problem.

Yes, they can.

Now, why would they go out and seek such groups? Because they're vulnerable. Why are they vulnerable? Bullying perhaps? Almost certainly.

No not certainly. There are plenty of other things. Parents divorce, losing a loved one, being cheated on, etc. There are plenty of things that could hurt a young person emotionally and make them angry besides bullying.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

You know what I find disturbing?

I find it disturbing that after the incident, the accused social media accounts have been closed down, unavailable to public inspection.

Why is it only people in authority positions can analyze this evidence and create a paradigm of reality for the population?

Because they can't have non-professionals pointing out the flaws in their determinations

 

[frigidweirdo]

Then what is?

Online youth radicalization - Wikipedia

Okay, that's nice. I can read wikipedia. But I'm not debating with wikipedia.

So you take the bits out of there that you think are relevant, and you tell me what you think, not what wikipedia thinks.

Young people today grow up with the internet as a significant source of information and socialization. Vulnerable individuals can find friends with groups that have violent ideologies.

As an example before the internet if a young inexperienced person trying to find themselves had a misguided inclination for nazism a group would be hard to find. Today it's only a few clicks away, and extremist ideologies actively recruit young people to their cause online.

I'm not saying this is the whole cause, just as bullying may play a factor but isn't the whole cause either. It just isn't a simple blame one thing problem.

Yes, they can.

Now, why would they go out and seek such groups? Because they're vulnerable. Why are they vulnerable? Bullying perhaps? Almost certainly.

No not certainly. There are plenty of other things. Parents divorce, losing a loved one, being cheated on, etc. There are plenty of things that could hurt a young person emotionally and make them angry besides bullying.

Yes, there are.

How many of them could we change, could we prevent from happening?

 

[Rustic]

But the nation will hold vigils and marches denouncing assault rifles, semi-auto pistols, all guns, Dimocrat politicians will make speeches and write new gun laws and proclaim the NRA a terrorist group.

But there won't be marches or speeches denouncing the root cause of why a fellow student goes off the deep end.


Santa Fe High School student claims students and coaches 'emotionally bullied' suspected shooter

Blaming bullying as the root cause is as stupid as blaming guns as the root cause. It's just not that simple.

I know the root cause, but leftists don't wanna hear it.

a) Taking God out of schools

b) Taking discipline out of schools and the home.

There ya go.

Which god should be in schools, and why should religion be a public schools responsibility?

Christianity is not a religion, it’s a faith.
Religions are fuck ups made by man....

I wholeheartedly agree religions are constructs of man and are imperfect. How do you teach god in school without religion being a factor though?

It should up to the parents, certainly not the state...

 

[Rustic]

Um, no, the root cause was he was able to get guns and shoot people.

Jesus you're an idiot. The gun was the METHOD not the cause.

Too many retards allowed to vote.

The gun was the CAUSE. Without the gun, no one would be dead. Sane people do not murder someone because they are bullied. This kid should not have had access to guns. IT IS THE GUN. It is the proliferation of guns that is the problem.

Shit for brains, people kill people, firearms have no control over people most people learn and understand that in grade school. Gun Control has never been about guns, it’s always been about control... fuck ups like yourself wanting to control people you disagree with. So shut the fuck up

 

[Rustic]

But the nation will hold vigils and marches denouncing assault rifles, semi-auto pistols, all guns, Dimocrat politicians will make speeches and write new gun laws and proclaim the NRA a terrorist group.

But there won't be marches or speeches denouncing the root cause of why a fellow student goes off the deep end.


Santa Fe High School student claims students and coaches 'emotionally bullied' suspected shooter

Blaming bullying as the root cause is as stupid as blaming guns as the root cause. It's just not that simple.

But denying that bullying is part of the problem would be a hell of a lot more stupid.

I don't disagree that bullying is a problem. I wouldn't call it the root cause though.

Why not?

Kids go through a massive emotional upheaval at High School. When kids get bullied, some of them can't deal with that.

If there were less a culture of bullying, then perhaps this kid would feel less inclined to seek out the "dark side" so to speak.

I don't disagree. Bullying is a real problem in schools. I don't think it is the root cause of school shootings though.

Vaccinations, medications, The break up of the traditional American family and social media make for a perfect storm of fucked up kids. It never used to be this way guns have always been here, it’s never been about the guns.

 

[JoeB131]

I have guns and am able to shoot people too. How come I haven't killed anyone?

You mean, "Yet"?

What promise do I have that at some point you won't lose your shit and start shooting people?

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, we found out today that the first person he shot was a girl he had been hitting on for months and she turned him down.

Texas school shooter killed girl who turned down his advances and embarrassed him in class, her mother says

One of Pagourtzis' classmates who died in the attack, Shana Fisher, "had 4 months of problems from this boy," her mother, Sadie Rodriguez, wrote in a private message to the Los Angeles Times on Facebook. "He kept making advances on her and she repeatedly told him no."

Pagourtzis continued to get more aggressive, and she finally stood up to him and embarrassed him in class, Rodriguez said. "A week later he opens fire on everyone he didn't like," she wrote. "Shana being the first one." Rodriguez didn't say how she knew her daughter was the first victim.

The gunman repeatedly taunted students during the attack, according to another harrowing account posted to Facebook by one survivor's mother.



But remember, this poor child was a victim of "Bullying", not an asshole who could just get a gun and start shooting people.

 

[Pop23]

Root cause?

It appears the OP is correct

Bullying leads to depression, obviously

Depression leads to counseling

Counseling leads to medication

Medication puts these individuals into suicidal/homicidal states of mind

They commit suicide or murder.

Seems a natural progression.

Problem is, in today’s politally charged world few care

Dead kids is the acceptable norm for advancing political views.

Keep it up, nothing gets solved while more kids die.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Usage of Psychotropic drugs
Male gender
Fatherless childhood, unsupervised / bad upbringing.
Insular social life, lack of proper social interaction, exposure to bullying.

These are the most common denominators and therefore the cause of school shootings.

Using your "logic" the gun is THE common denominator. The others are variables, and the conditions of each run from severe to slight.

Yeah, well, if it isn't guns, it will be bombs, or mowing down people with vehicles, or mass stabbing attacks, or chemical / poison attacks, or pressure cooker bombs, etc.

Someone who is crazy enough and determined to kill, will find a way to do it, especially if they are willing to give their own lives in the process. This is a social ill we are talking about. The Internet and social media getting have not made people more connected and peaceful, contrary to popular belief.

That said, I do believe that gun owners should be held responsible and liable, at least in civil court, if their child uses their gun without their permission to commit murder.

Using a gun is all about power, creating panic and watching it. Using a knife might provide the same entertainment, but it is more likely than a gun to be overpowered and beaten to death.

Knives are intensely personal.

Knifes are risky, and cowards prefer sniping which is personal too, and allows the perp. greater targets in shorter time.

 

[JoeB131]

Root cause?

It appears the OP is correct

Bullying leads to depression, obviously

Depression leads to counseling

Counseling leads to medication

Medication puts these individuals into suicidal/homicidal states of mind

They commit suicide or murder.

Seems a natural progression.

Problem is, in today’s politally charged world few care

Dead kids is the acceptable norm for advancing political views.

Keep it up, nothing gets solved while more kids die.

You still haven't provided any proof that this kid was on any medications.

Much less that he was taking them.

 

[Rustic]

Oh, we found out today that the first person he shot was a girl he had been hitting on for months and she turned him down.

Texas school shooter killed girl who turned down his advances and embarrassed him in class, her mother says

One of Pagourtzis' classmates who died in the attack, Shana Fisher, "had 4 months of problems from this boy," her mother, Sadie Rodriguez, wrote in a private message to the Los Angeles Times on Facebook. "He kept making advances on her and she repeatedly told him no."

Pagourtzis continued to get more aggressive, and she finally stood up to him and embarrassed him in class, Rodriguez said. "A week later he opens fire on everyone he didn't like," she wrote. "Shana being the first one." Rodriguez didn't say how she knew her daughter was the first victim.

The gunman repeatedly taunted students during the attack, according to another harrowing account posted to Facebook by one survivor's mother.



But remember, this poor child was a victim of "Bullying", not an asshole who could just get a gun and start shooting people.

Lol
So, you’re blaming the firearms.
You need to get out more bro, your mothers basement does not cut it anymore.
There is no such thing as “bullying” Political correctness has made you into a pussy apparently...

 

[Rustic]

Usage of Psychotropic drugs
Male gender
Fatherless childhood, unsupervised / bad upbringing.
Insular social life, lack of proper social interaction, exposure to bullying.

These are the most common denominators and therefore the cause of school shootings.

Using your "logic" the gun is THE common denominator. The others are variables, and the conditions of each run from severe to slight.

Yeah, well, if it isn't guns, it will be bombs, or mowing down people with vehicles, or mass stabbing attacks, or chemical / poison attacks, or pressure cooker bombs, etc.

Someone who is crazy enough and determined to kill, will find a way to do it, especially if they are willing to give their own lives in the process. This is a social ill we are talking about. The Internet and social media getting have not made people more connected and peaceful, contrary to popular belief.

That said, I do believe that gun owners should be held responsible and liable, at least in civil court, if their child uses their gun without their permission to commit murder.

Using a gun is all about power, creating panic and watching it. Using a knife might provide the same entertainment, but it is more likely than a gun to be overpowered and beaten to death.

Knives are intensely personal.

Knifes are risky, and cowards prefer sniping which is personal too, and allows the perp. greater targets in shorter time.

...and better yet bombs and vehicles, much preferred over firearms by crazy people all over the world.

 

[Rustic]

Root cause?

It appears the OP is correct

Bullying leads to depression, obviously

Depression leads to counseling

Counseling leads to medication

Medication puts these individuals into suicidal/homicidal states of mind

They commit suicide or murder.

Seems a natural progression.

Problem is, in today’s politally charged world few care

Dead kids is the acceptable norm for advancing political views.

Keep it up, nothing gets solved while more kids die.

You still haven't provided any proof that this kid was on any medications.

Much less that he was taking them.

You have not proven he wasn’t on them... so there is that

 

[Pop23]

Root cause?

It appears the OP is correct

Bullying leads to depression, obviously

Depression leads to counseling

Counseling leads to medication

Medication puts these individuals into suicidal/homicidal states of mind

They commit suicide or murder.

Seems a natural progression.

Problem is, in today’s politally charged world few care

Dead kids is the acceptable norm for advancing political views.

Keep it up, nothing gets solved while more kids die.

You still haven't provided any proof that this kid was on any medications.

Much less that he was taking them.

Not yet. The investigation has not gotten to that point yet.

If it’s like most others though, it follows the same script. And they were.

Desperate are you?

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Oh, we found out today that the first person he shot was a girl he had been hitting on for months and she turned him down.

Texas school shooter killed girl who turned down his advances and embarrassed him in class, her mother says

One of Pagourtzis' classmates who died in the attack, Shana Fisher, "had 4 months of problems from this boy," her mother, Sadie Rodriguez, wrote in a private message to the Los Angeles Times on Facebook. "He kept making advances on her and she repeatedly told him no."

Pagourtzis continued to get more aggressive, and she finally stood up to him and embarrassed him in class, Rodriguez said. "A week later he opens fire on everyone he didn't like," she wrote. "Shana being the first one." Rodriguez didn't say how she knew her daughter was the first victim.

The gunman repeatedly taunted students during the attack, according to another harrowing account posted to Facebook by one survivor's mother.



But remember, this poor child was a victim of "Bullying", not an asshole who could just get a gun and start shooting people.

She did more than turn him down. She embarrassed him in class. In public. Had she thought that he might fight back by blowing her head off, she might have chosen her words more carefully.

Victims have always fought back against bullies. At one time it was fists on the playground and victims were taught how to kick ass.

We have denied the victim all other alternatives. Don't be surprised that they kill.

 

[OldLady]

Oh, we found out today that the first person he shot was a girl he had been hitting on for months and she turned him down.

Texas school shooter killed girl who turned down his advances and embarrassed him in class, her mother says

One of Pagourtzis' classmates who died in the attack, Shana Fisher, "had 4 months of problems from this boy," her mother, Sadie Rodriguez, wrote in a private message to the Los Angeles Times on Facebook. "He kept making advances on her and she repeatedly told him no."

Pagourtzis continued to get more aggressive, and she finally stood up to him and embarrassed him in class, Rodriguez said. "A week later he opens fire on everyone he didn't like," she wrote. "Shana being the first one." Rodriguez didn't say how she knew her daughter was the first victim.

The gunman repeatedly taunted students during the attack, according to another harrowing account posted to Facebook by one survivor's mother.



But remember, this poor child was a victim of "Bullying", not an asshole who could just get a gun and start shooting people.

Domestic violence. I remember my half brother cried so hard he puked and this went on for weeks after his girlfriend split up with him. The pain is real. Remember it from when you were that age? The shooter was depressed, he was unsocial, this girl rejected him in a humiliating way. But instead of crying or eating a quart of Haagen Daas every night, he SHOOTS her? Okay, something sure is wrong here. We are raising our kids in such a culture of approved violence via media and entertainment that kids think of killing as an option.

The culture has to change and it begins with NOT having such violence steeped movies, tv shows, video games, popular music....that needs to get a hard look. It is only step one-- a serious dialogue about respect for human life needs to be had EVERYWHERE by EVERYONE. Just look at some of the pea brains here who speak loosely about shooting this guy or hanging this guy or killing all this group or that. Not that they would, but that they even flap their gums about it is an indicator of where popular culture has taken us. Somebody needs to hit the brakes hard.

 

[there4eyeM]

Young people can be psychologically prepared, instructed, to deal with "bullying". Inoculation to protect the young from many dangers, whether religious, ideological, psychological or other, can be provided. Certainly, it should come from parents, but there is no reason that schools should not provide instruction. In fact, too few people seem to understand how the mind functions, how perception works, how information must be analyzed. This should be basic education.