OSHA Mandate Headed for Supreme Court

[Harpy Eagle]

Some Christian churches

That is not what you said, but thanks for clarifying

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I'm not even sure if what he says is true. I'm pretty sure that Catholic churches will recognize a couple as married even if they didn't have a Catholic wedding. I don't think they have to get married all over again if, say, the convert to Catholicism 10 years after he got married.

You are correct.

 

[Blues Man]

I am consistent. I don't think a business owner should refuse to serve any CLASS or CATEGORY of humans. So to use my former examples, I would have a problem with Christian bakers or florists who would not serve gay customers for anything. Or black or white owners who would not serve black or whites for anything.

But you have no problem, do you, if businesses refuse to serve the unvaccinated, even though the vaccines suck at eliminating transmission. Right? You are calling me out for what YOU do not oppose.

The unvaccianted is not a class of people.

People of all races color creeds and sexual orientations choose to be unvaccinated.

YOU choose to be un vaccinated. If a business owner chooses deny you servitude you should have no problem because you say you don't think anyone should be FORCED to serve you because that would be YOU making them a SLAVE.

You can't have it both ways

 

[SweetSue92]

The unvaccianted is not a class of people.

People of all races color creeds and sexual orientations choose to be unvaccinated.

YOU choose to be un vaccinated. If a business owner chooses deny you servitude you should have no problem because you say you don't think anyone should be FORCED to serve you because that would be YOU making them a SLAVE.

You can't have it both ways

First, I said no one should be refused service based on their CLASS or CATEGORY. So refusing service blanket style for vaccine status is wrong, just as it is for sexual orientation or race.

Also, religion is a choice as well. So by your standards, a business owner is cool to say "No Muslims in my shop". Right?

 

[Blues Man]

That is not what you said, but thanks for clarifying

First, I said no one should be refused service based on their CLASS or CATEGORY. So refusing service blanket style for vaccine status is wrong, just as it is for sexual orientation or race.

Also, religion is a choice as well. So by your standards, a business owner is cool to say "No Muslims in my shop". Right?

But it's Ok to refuse service for gay couples.

That's a class that is legally protected.

The unvaccinated isn't.

And I'm the one saying that a business owner has to abide by public accommodation laws you're the one saying that a business owner can refuse service for whatever reason they want like " I think it's a sin so I can't bake that cake."

Baking a cake for 2 people isn't a public health concern, unvaccinated people are.

So once again your comparison fails.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

But it's Ok to refuse service for gay couples.

In my personal opinion, yes. and for any other reason to include vaccines.

That's a class that is legally protected.

Protected classes violate the Equal Protection clause of the US Constitution

And I'm the one saying that a business owner has to abide by public accommodation laws you're the one saying that a business owner can refuse service for whatever reason they want like " I think it's a sin so I can't bake that cake.

Public accommodation laws are a violation of personal rights and were only made up to have a method to enforce anti-discrimination laws on private entities, in violation of the Constitution.

 

[Blues Man]

In my personal opinion, yes. and for any other reason to include vaccines.



Protected classes violate the Equal Protection clause of the US Constitution



Public accommodation laws are a violation of personal rights and were only made up to have a method to enforce anti-discrimination laws on private entities, in violation of the Constitution.

Which is exactly my point.

The people whining about being denied service because of vaccine status are the same ones that say a business owner should be able to deny service to anyone or that an employer should be able to fire anyone for any reason.

Except when it's them.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

And I'm the one saying that a business owner has to abide by public accommodation laws you're the one saying that a business owner can refuse service for whatever reason they want like " I think it's a sin so I can't bake that cake."

They never refused to bake the gay couple a cake, they refused to decorate it for a gay wedding. They felt that was forced participation in what the Bible and their faith considers a sin.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I wouldn't "force" anyone to do anything.

The law is the law and if you own a business you are subject to that law. I had to accommodate all kinds of people when I ran my business. It had nothing to do with my personal opinions of their behavior.

Tell me would you be OK with a "Christian" landlord evicting all gay couples or hetero couples who were living together in sin?

Apples and oranges really. First of all there is a constitutional conflict here. The Constitution guarantees government will not support religion or prohibit the free exercise thereof. When government allows a law suit or brings a suit of their own against a business owner because of their religious practices, they are prohibiting the free exercise thereof which is a clear constituional violation.

When they do the same of any other people such as race, it's not a constitutional issue, it's a violation of state and perhaps federal law issue.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It is not the government's job to worry about such things. Let me ask you this, if you found out that your favorite store decided to not hire anyone but white males between 25-45, would you still shop there? I know that I would not, and I think most people are like me and thus the market place would take care of the problem.

To be honest I don't think most white people would care one way or another.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I lost about $20,000 related to TRUMP PLAGUE... because he was so inept in managing it....

Trump kills 800,000 people, causes 65 million people to get laid off and lose their jobs, causes 165,000 businesses to close, and you want to keep praising him.

Ahhh, remember the good old days when a Republican President fucked up, and Republicans wouldn't be caught having a drink with the guy?

View attachment 578481

Except no President can control a microorganism except in the heads of micro-minded leftists. We all know how much you lie and this time no different. Our evidence Trump is not responsible for anything covid is more people died from covid under your incompetent fool so Trump had zero to do with it. But I also understand you're a leftist, and as such, a born hypocrite. You're going to make up your own fantasy stories in your fantasy head.

 

[Blues Man]

They never refused to bake the gay couple a cake, they refused to decorate it for a gay wedding. They felt that was forced participation in what the Bible and their faith considers a sin.

The cake isn't part of the wedding ceremony.
But then you should have no problem with a business owner not letting you in if you're not vaccinated.

 

[Blues Man]

Apples and oranges really. First of all there is a constitutional conflict here. The Constitution guarantees government will not support religion or prohibit the free exercise thereof. When government allows a law suit or brings a suit of their own against a business owner because of their religious practices, they are prohibiting the free exercise thereof which is a clear constituional violation.

When they do the same of any other people such as race, it's not a constitutional issue, it's a violation of state and perhaps federal law issue.

Tell me where it says baking a cake is part of the practice of any religion.

If you don't want to make wedding cakes for gay people then you shouldn't make them for anyone.

If you don;t want to make cakes for people doing shit you think is a sin then you shouldn't have a bakery at all.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Except Trump didn't have great success. A lot of viruses were wasted because Trump didn't have a plan to distribute them once they were manufactured. You had people doing things like illegally jumping the line to get their shots while people who needed the shots went without. It was a clusterfuck, pretty much like anything else Trump has ever run.

Then again, this is a guy who went bankrupt selling Steaks and Vodka.

I wish I was as bankrupt as Trump. I'd love to have a life sleeping with the most beautiful women in the world and traveling on my own private jet. Nobody was jumping any line unless the outlet allowed them to. WTF did you want Trump to do, monitor lines at all the places of distribution?

In any case the vaccines went out, but it was the Democrat led Congress that was the problem:

Experts say significant logistical problems have arisen as well in administering the vaccines once they have been delivered to states.

As of 20 January, more than 35 million vaccines had been distributed across the US, but less than half of these had been put into people's arms.
Public health professor at George Washington University, Dr Leana Wen said: "The federal government seemed to have ceded its responsibility at the point the vaccines were given to the states.

"The state and local health departments have been asking for months for additional funding, and have not been given the funding that they need," she added.
Local authorities have said this delay affected the setting up vaccine centres, and hiring staff to work in them.

Some feel a more targeted approach is needed, with the government providing funding to local authorities, depending on their needs.

A long-delayed pandemic aid package was eventually agreed by Congress at the end of December. It provided $8.75 billion to states to assist with vaccination efforts.

Covid-19: Was US vaccine rollout a 'dismal failure' under Trump?

Biden says the initial vaccine rollout has been a failure, as he pledges 100 million shots in his first 100 days.

www.bbc.com

I guess creating another phony impeachment was more important than attending to this problem that was known well before the vaccines were even out. Could it be this was done deliberately to try and make Trump look bad? It certainly seems that way. But you know the motto of the Communists: Party first--country second.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Tell me where it says baking a cake is part of the practice of any religion.

If you don't want to make wedding cakes for gay people then you shouldn't make them for anyone.

If you don;t want to make cakes for people doing shit you think is a sin then you shouldn't have a bakery at all.

Baking the cake for the gays was not the problem as I already stated, but decorating it was and was against their religion. In fact, the baker was chosen by the couple because they were already customers of his, and they knew of his religious values. That's why they went to that bakery in the first place. The baker knew they were gay and served them many times.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The cake isn't part of the wedding ceremony.
But then you should have no problem with a business owner not letting you in if you're not vaccinated.

I don't if refusing service because of vaccination status is covered in the US Constitution.

 

[Blues Man]

Baking the cake for the gays was not the problem as I already stated, but decorating it was and was against their religion. In fact, the baker was chosen by the couple because they were already customers of his, and they knew of his religious values. That's why they went to that bakery in the first place. The baker knew they were gay and served them many times.

Where does it say in the bible that putting white frosting on a cake is a sin?

I looked I can't find it anywhere in the King James version of the Bible.

Sure the church can say gay marriage is a sin but nowhere in the bible does it say decorating a cake for any reason is a sin.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Where does it say in the bible that putting white frosting on a cake is a sin?

I looked I can't find it anywhere in the King James version of the Bible.

Sure the church can say gay marriage is a sin but nowhere in the bible does it say decorating a cake for any reason is a sin.

They even offered to frost it. But what they refused to do is name the groom and groom, putting a happy wedding message on it, and putting a toy of two guys holding hands on top of the cake. It doesn't have to be word for word in the Bible, and saying something stupid like that makes you look foolish because there were no cakes during biblical times. If the owner felt decorating the cake was helping to celebrate what the Bible says is a sin, then the owner has every right according to our Constitution to deny doing that.

 

[Blues Man]

I don't if refusing service because of vaccination status is covered in the US Constitution.

Vaccine were not in widespread human use when the Constitution was written.

So I guess you think the first amendment doesn't apply to electronically recorded speech or writing .

If you believe that a business owner can deny service to anyone for any reason then you should have no problem with being denied service if you aren't vaccinated.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Vaccine were not in widespread human use when the Constitution was written.

So I guess you think the first amendment doesn't apply to electronically recorded speech or writing .

If you believe that a business owner can deny service to anyone for any reason then you should have no problem with being denied service if you aren't vaccinated.

Vaccines may have not been out back then, but where in the Constitution does it say government has the power to force citizens into medical treatment of any kind?