P F Tinmore, et al,
I started where the allegations started on the anti-Israeli site called "ItisApartheid.Org"; with the List of Israeli Violations. So, you want to start at a different place. That is OK with me. Just remember, the official determinations, decisions, orders and decrees made before May 1948, could not have been made by the Jewish People, the Jewish Agency or the State of Israel. The Jewish Immigrants exercised no sovereignty or legislative authority; the Jewish Agency was an Article 4 Mandate Invention for coordination purposes --- a public body (an agency operating as a component of a government process - but not an official government activity itself) for the purpose of providing advise to the Mandatory and fostering cooperation between the Article 6 Jewish Immigrants and the Mandatory on social, economic and issues affecting the responsibility for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 1917 Balfour Declaration.
I was trying to limit my reply to the parameters of your comment in Posting #82 with regards to "Israeli Crimes." Israeli crimes cannot truly exist prior to mid-night 14/15 May 1948. But I did follow your logic and have no problem with it. It merely expands my commentary.
(COMMENT)
Before I rant on the timeline, and the interpretation of certain events, again I would be remiss if I did not mention the first Palestine Arab Congress (PAC)(AKA: Arab National Congress) (27 January to 10 February 1919), the outcomes of which are not in the on-line archive of the UN Information System on the Question of Palestine (UNISPAL) listing. (I'm sure they have it, I just don't see it in the white or dark side of the net.) The importance of the PAC is that it concluded in time to make the Paris Peace Conference. The PAC did submit it through quasi- Diplomatic channels by Cable to the Paris Peace Conference. I can only speculate why it was not presented at the same time as the Jewish Presentation (or maybe it was and just was not taken seriously). In any event --- you can hardly find any reference to the PAC Cable relative to the Paris Peace Conference, yet quite clearly see the Jewish presentation. The Paris Peace Conference was heavily influenced by the presence of the BIG FOUR:
The BIG FOUR were not the only Principle Allied Powers, but they were the backbone behind the leadership of the Allied Powers and the Council for the League of Nations. And that may be the key behind the reason the PAC Cable was so easily dismissed. The PAC (viewed as composed of characters that were less then helpful to the allies during the war) send what was interpreted as "demands" to the Allied Powers. Included in these demands were items that simply could not be considered:
- President of the United States, Woodrow Wilson;
- Prime Minister of Great Britain, David Lloyd George;
- Prime Minister of France, Georges Clemenceau;
- Prime Minister of Italy, Vittorio Emanuele Orlando.
This was, of course, impossible as it would abrogate the Sykes-Picot Accords and interfere with the promises made to Arab-Bedouin Princes that did provide active combat assistance to the Allied Powers during the War. Additionally, the Arab-Ottoman included a demand that All foreign treaties (meaning those treaties concluded by the Allied Powers) affecting the entire region were to be set aside and voided. This was framed as if the PAC had been victorious in the War against the Ottoman Empire and the Turkish Army of the Central Powers. One can only imagine what the BIG FOUR must have thought when reviewing the PAC Demands (no wonder the Arabs sent it by cable). The entire purpose of The Paris Peace Conference was to allow the Allied victors to set the peace terms for the defeated Central Powers; not to acquiesce to the PAC.
- That the Allied Powers renounce the Balfour Declaration.
- The recognition of a Regional "Arab Union."
- The independence of a greater Syria that would include the Mandate for Palestine.
The important sequence of events that are relevant to the challenge that: --- --- The Mandate for Palestine was invalid: (Short Answer: It was not.)
The Balfour Declaration, while not a specific topic, was discussed in the reference frame of "national aspirations" of both the Arab and the Jewish in what culminated into a Arab-Jewish Treaty know as the Faisal (Arab)-Weizmann (Jewish) Agreement. The first official Arab rejection of the Balfour Declaration comes with the feeder arrangements into the Paris Peace Agreement, in that same year (JAN) 1919; just over a month later --- February 1919. As the Ottoman Empire had unconditionally surrendered
- 08/10/1922
The Palestine Order in Council
- Definition of boundaries, formation of districts,
- Grant of pardon & Remission of fines,
- Judicial and Legislative Authority --- creation of Ordinances,
- Nationality, Citizenship, voting and elections, etc.
- 07/24/1922
Mandate for Palestine
- Approved by LoN
- Political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home,
- Development of self-governing institutions,
- Safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine.
- Establishment of the Jewish national home and the interests of the Jewish population in Palestine.
- 04/25/1920
(1) Syria, Mesopotamia, Palestine mandates ---- (2) San Remo Convention
- The terms of the mandates in respect of the above territories will be formulated by the Principal Allied Powers and submitted to the Council of the League of Nations for approval.
- Turkey hereby undertakes, in accordance with the provisions of Article [132 of the Treaty of Sevres] to accept any decisions which may be taken in this connection.
- 04/28/1919
League of Nations covenant - Peace Treaty of Versailles, Peace Conference
- Provisional Recognition to Certain Communities
- Administrative advice and assistance by a Mandatory until such time as they are able to stand alone.
- 02/03/1919
- Five individual Treaties are made:
- A. Each treaty is named for districts around Paris.
- B. Germany = Versailles
- C. Austria = St. Germain
- D. Hungary = Trianon
- E. Bulgaria = Neuilly
- 01/03/1919
- Arabs and the Jewish people working out the consummation of their national aspirations,
- Established and maintained in their respective territories.
- 11/02/1917
Balfour Declaration
- Declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations,
- Intent to establish in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people
- 05/16/1916
- That France and Great Britain are prepared to recognize and protect an independent Arab states or a confederation of Arab states, under the suzerainty of an Arab chief.
[Armistice of Mudros, (Oct. 30, 1918)], the matter was then placed in the hands of the Allied Powers.
It was for the BIG FOUR and the Allied Powers to decide what the best course of action was to take; and not the PAC. The decision on the course of action to take relative to the Jewish Homeland Issue and Palestine, were essentially made before the Covenant. The Mandate was approved by the Council of the League of Nations. It did not require review and approval of the PAC. The Actions taken by the Mandatory, appointed by the Council of the League of Nations, were reported to and reviewed by the Council. The Council had the authority to alter or amend the Mandate, or to approve such changes to the course of action as they may find necessary. The Mandate was not a stone table that could not be altered. Remembering that in the beginning, the intent was to establish a Jewish National Home. The protection to the former enemy indigenous population was in the area of civil and religious rights --- nothing more. At that time, they had not other special protections that were expressly articulated. The establishment of the Jewish National Home (a concept) was a principle goal expressly mandated.
(PERSONALLY)
- "1. The first ground of invalidity of the Mandate is that by endorsing the Balfour Declaration
- The San Remo Convention approved the outline to the Mandate. It was approved by the Council of the League of Nations. That makes it valid.
- "2. The second ground of invalidity of the Mandate is that it violated, in spirit and in letter, Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations,
- The spirit and intent of the Article 22 Clauses is defined by the authors and NOT the PAC or and derivative Arab organization. There is no specific reference to Palestine in Article 22. It is more likely that if there was a specific terrirtory in mind -- it would have been Trans-Jordan, a carve-out and set aside for the promises made the the Bedouin Chiefs.
- "... The third ground of invalidity of the Mandate lies in the fact that its endorsement and implementation of the Balfour Declaration conflicted with the assurances and pledges given to the Arabs during the First World War by Great Britain and the Allied Powers.
- The pledges made to the Arab Chiefs were (eventually) engaged and rendered in the form of two Kingdoms that because independent. There was not other specific promises made to the Arabs. Prince Faisal and Prince Abdullah each received their independent Kingdoms as promised. What pledges were made --- were made to the Arabs on the side of the allies. NOT Arabs like:
Hajj Amin al-Husseini A Commission Officer in the Ottoman ArmyPrime Minister All Palestine Government
Ahmed Hilmi Pasha A General Officer in the Ottoman Army
I think the Arab and the PAC did not do the Palestinian Arab any good in the very beginning by attempting to make demands of the Allied Powers.
Most Respectfully,
RThe Jewish Immigrants exercised no sovereignty or legislative authority; the Jewish Agency was an Article 4 Mandate Invention for coordination purposes --- a public body (an agency operating as a component of a government process - but not an official government activity itself) for the purpose of providing advise to the Mandatory and fostering cooperation between the Article 6 Jewish Immigrants and the Mandatory on social, economic and issues affecting the responsibility for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 1917 Balfour Declaration.
Like I say, the Jewish Agency was part of the Mandate. After the mandate folded the Jewish Agency had no legitimacy in Palestine.
After the mandate left, Israel was created. The agency had nothing to do with Palestine.
