Paul Ryan and RINOs Are Playing Us For Idiots on Healthcare Bill

[Rob37]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Neither ObamaCare nor LyinRyan/trump care are insurance. Please read that as many times as is required to remember it.

"Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions."

Its not a dirty little secret to anyone but the RWNJs. This is how ALL insurance works, how it has always worked and how it will always work.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Paul Ryan and RINOs Are Playing Us For Idiots on Healthcare Bill


No doubt.
They've been doing it for seven years with their "repeal and replace" nonsense. Obviously they never bothered to get to the "replace" part and now their foolishness is unveiled.

 

[bendog]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

The gop doesn't have the votes to repeal it.

 

[Rob37]

Neither ObamaCare nor LyinRyan/trump care are insurance. Please read that as many times as is required to remember it.

"Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions."

Its not a dirty little secret to anyone but the RWNJs. This is how ALL insurance works, how it has always worked and how it will always work.

Luddly, you do not know how insurance is supposed to work.

 

[Rob37]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

The gop doesn't have the votes to repeal it.

They can substitute something through reconciliation that is not Obamacare lite. The current GOP proposal is ludicrous.

 

[bendog]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

The gop doesn't have the votes to repeal it.

They can substitute something through reconciliation that is not Obamacare lite. The current GOP proposal is ludicrous.

No they cannot repeal through reconciliation. They may amend spending/taxes. The basic insurance framework requires 60 votes to repeal.

 

[Rob37]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

The gop doesn't have the votes to repeal it.

They can substitute something through reconciliation that is not Obamacare lite. The current GOP proposal is ludicrous.

No they cannot repeal through reconciliation. They may amend spending/taxes. The basic insurance framework requires 60 votes to repeal.

Hence my prior statement about substituting something. Keep up, jackass!

 

[busybee01]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

There are also other factors that affect insurance. The cost of going to a doctor. When you have uninsured people and they have to go to the emergency room,
those costs are passed onto people can either pay or have insurance. People who have insurance are already paying a tax toi pay for people who cannot afford it. A repeal jut makes it a invisible tax.

I also suppose that those people who are young will get old. I also suppose that they will expect the young to subsidize them. We don't want to pay for it but we want the benefits. Who the hell are you to use stereotypes to attack older people? Things happen to people and sometimes it is not their fault.

The problem with people who have pre-existing conditions is that it sometimes is not their fault. Yet you want to punish them. I suppose youould be happy if we gave them a pill so they can die.

The fact is that the last election was not fought on issues. Neither Trump or Clinton talked about issues. The public has supported changing the law but not repealing it.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Neither ObamaCare nor LyinRyan/trump care are insurance. Please read that as many times as is required to remember it.

"Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions."

Its not a dirty little secret to anyone but the RWNJs. This is how ALL insurance works, how it has always worked and how it will always work.

Luddly, you do not know how insurance is supposed to work.

Here's your chance to educate me.

Fact is, Insurance makes a profit on those who do not use it. Therefore, those who do not use it, pay for those who do.

If you have FACTUAL info that disproves that, post it.

 

[Hum Dinger]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

You're classifying people as 'Young and Healthy' people that don't need health insurance vs. 'Old and sick' who do need health insurance is moronic.

To date, NO ONE LIVES FOREVER. Those people who are young and/or healthy now will, for the most part, be Old and/or Sick someday. At that time they will need the health insurance that they paid for when they were young and healthy, and the insurance paid for by the young healthy people at that time.

From a health care insurance perspective, the only significant group that does not need health care are those who die suddenly - and many of them will need some form of health care sometime before their untimely deaths.

So the entire basis for your argument is BULLSHIT.

 

[Care4all]

as with car insurance, those not in accidents pay for those in accidents and whatever profit the company makes,

 

[Rob37]

Neither ObamaCare nor LyinRyan/trump care are insurance. Please read that as many times as is required to remember it.

"Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions."

Its not a dirty little secret to anyone but the RWNJs. This is how ALL insurance works, how it has always worked and how it will always work.

Luddly, you do not know how insurance is supposed to work.

Here's your chance to educate me.

Fact is, Insurance makes a profit on those who do not use it. Therefore, those who do not use it, pay for those who do.

If you have FACTUAL info that disproves that, post it.

You are beyond Education, Luddly.

 

[Hum Dinger]

as with car insurance, those not in accidents pay for those in accidents and whatever profit the company makes,

There is no certainty that any person will ever have a car accident. There is certainty that everyone, except those who die suddenly, will need health insurance someday.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Neither ObamaCare nor LyinRyan/trump care are insurance. Please read that as many times as is required to remember it.

"Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions."

Its not a dirty little secret to anyone but the RWNJs. This is how ALL insurance works, how it has always worked and how it will always work.

Luddly, you do not know how insurance is supposed to work.

Here's your chance to educate me.

Fact is, Insurance makes a profit on those who do not use it. Therefore, those who do not use it, pay for those who do.

If you have FACTUAL info that disproves that, post it.

You are beyond Education, Luddly.

IOW, you're wrong and you know it.

Would you like to tell the other posters they are wrong as well? And then, tell them why they are wrong and you are right.

 

[Siete]

Obamacare; rising costs too expensive ..

 

[Rob37]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

You're classifying people as 'Young and Healthy' people that don't need health insurance vs. 'Old and sick' who do need health insurance is moronic.

To date, NO ONE LIVES FOREVER. Those people who are young and/or healthy now will, for the most part, be Old and/or Sick someday. At that time they will need the health insurance that they paid for when they were young and healthy, and the insurance paid for by the young healthy people at that time.

From a health care insurance perspective, the only significant group that does not need health care are those who die suddenly - and many of them will need some form of health care sometime before their untimely deaths.

So the entire basis for your argument is BULLSHIT.

Pure confused leftist tripe. Both you and that degenerate rat, Ludley, need to pay attention to this. Insurance ceases to be insurance when they are required to accept people into the risk pool regardless of degree of risk. If you have private insurance and your insurance company started covering every low life with a heart condition then you should be pissed because your premiums will increase because the risk of insurance payouts become much higher. However, if you allow market principles to govern, then the insurance company can deny high risk candidates, thereby insulating itself and its premium payers from undue risk of loss.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is your healthcare so you can choose your own coverage. The ACA removes the risk element, thereby taking choice away from individuals.

Insurance is good thing. It should be encouraged. But making it available to everyone? Moreover, making consumers by a product that will not benefit them due to high deductibles? This is antithetical to free market principles.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

You're classifying people as 'Young and Healthy' people that don't need health insurance vs. 'Old and sick' who do need health insurance is moronic.

To date, NO ONE LIVES FOREVER. Those people who are young and/or healthy now will, for the most part, be Old and/or Sick someday. At that time they will need the health insurance that they paid for when they were young and healthy, and the insurance paid for by the young healthy people at that time.

From a health care insurance perspective, the only significant group that does not need health care are those who die suddenly - and many of them will need some form of health care sometime before their untimely deaths.

So the entire basis for your argument is BULLSHIT.

Pure confused leftist tripe. Both you and that degenerate rat, Ludley, need to pay attention to this. Insurance ceases to be insurance when they are required to accept people into the risk pool regardless of degree of risk. If you have private insurance and your insurance company started covering every low life with a heart condition then you should be pissed because your premiums will increase because the risk of insurance payouts become much higher. However, if you allow market principles to govern, then the insurance company can deny high risk candidates, thereby insulating itself and its premium payers from undue risk of loss.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is your healthcare so you can choose your own coverage. The ACA removes the risk element, thereby taking choice away from individuals.

Insurance is good thing. It should be encouraged. But making it available to everyone? Moreover, making consumers by a product that will not benefit them due to high deductibles? This is antithetical to free market principles.

Well, you're still not understanding.

I'm gonna have lunch and watch the hearings. Maybe some other liberal can explain it to you.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

You're classifying people as 'Young and Healthy' people that don't need health insurance vs. 'Old and sick' who do need health insurance is moronic.

To date, NO ONE LIVES FOREVER. Those people who are young and/or healthy now will, for the most part, be Old and/or Sick someday. At that time they will need the health insurance that they paid for when they were young and healthy, and the insurance paid for by the young healthy people at that time.

From a health care insurance perspective, the only significant group that does not need health care are those who die suddenly - and many of them will need some form of health care sometime before their untimely deaths.

So the entire basis for your argument is BULLSHIT.

Pure confused leftist tripe. Both you and that degenerate rat, Ludley, need to pay attention to this. Insurance ceases to be insurance when they are required to accept people into the risk pool regardless of degree of risk. If you have private insurance and your insurance company started covering every low life with a heart condition then you should be pissed because your premiums will increase because the risk of insurance payouts become much higher. However, if you allow market principles to govern, then the insurance company can deny high risk candidates, thereby insulating itself and its premium payers from undue risk of loss.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is your healthcare so you can choose your own coverage. The ACA removes the risk element, thereby taking choice away from individuals.

Insurance is good thing. It should be encouraged. But making it available to everyone? Moreover, making consumers by a product that will not benefit them due to high deductibles? This is antithetical to free market principles.

Okay ... Rob37 I've read your comment and you have it completely backward and ACA did not change the basic way insurance works or "remove risk element" - whatever that means..

I would not call insurance a "good thing". Its more of a necessary evil.

 

[Rob37]

I have had it. The Republican proposed healthcare bill sucks. It relies upon all the same gimmicks and misunderstandings about insurance that is used in the ACA. That Ryan can go on TV and just flat out LIE about how their bill is the answer and that his injects free market principles back into healthcare is infuriating. I expect to be lied to be the Democrat scum. I do not expect a Republican to try to lie to me.

Insurance is risk allocation and pricing. A pool of people pay premiums based upon the likelihood of the occurrence of a condition precedent (which is something causing the need for healthcare in a HI policy). The most likely you are to use the insurance, the more you have to pay. You are insuring risk. Simple.

The Democrat scum, on the other hand, think incorrectly think that health insurance is insurance against not having healthcare. This simplistic and childish view ignores the fundamental nature of insurance. The Dems do not want insurance. The Dems want welfare.

The Dem plan, and now the Republican plan, relies upon young, healthy people paying premiums for coverage they will never use due to (1) their relative good health, and (2) the high premiums. Why would they buy and maintain this when they are not getting anything from it?

Of course, the dirty little secret in all this (or at least what gets little coverage) is that the healthy people are paying in premiums in order to subsidize coverage for older and unhealthy people with pre-existing conditions. Undoubtedly the young people would be much less willing to participate if it were put to them like this:

"We need for you to pay monthly premiums so we can subsidize the coverage and care of older, sick people. You will most likely never see one dime of coverage because the purported coverage you are paying for has such an insanely high deductible that it is like you have no insurance at all. Even if you do have coverage and qualify to use it for a catastrophic illness or accident, the $10K deductible will bankrupt you anyway. So, you know, you are not going to get ANYTHING for yourself for paying these premiums. But it will enable us to pay for treatment for old folks, most of which is necessary due to their lifestyle choices (poor diet, smoking, no exercise). So, when we say we are selling you insurance, we are really lying to you. It is all a big fraud, and you are the dupes. Ha ha ha!!! You have been Grubered.... right up the asshole!!!! HA HA HA HA HA!!!!"

Thus, these young people look at the ACA as largely a fraud upon them. They are correct too.

Also, getting back to the fundamental nature of insurance, risk allocation and valuation, the whole idea of covering pre-existing conditions does not comport with this, further evidencing the fact that neither the ACA no ACA-Light are anything but welfare bills. Moreover, to the extent that funding the subsides relies upon the utterly stupid and reckless practice of hoping that Millennials purchase a product they most likely will not use, the ACA is a pyramid scheme. It is a fucking disaster waiting to happen. It will fail, and it is, in fact, failing. It is such a fundamentally flawed law economically that one must seriously consider the cynical possibility that it is DESIGNED to fail in order to facilitate a transition to single payer, a complete government takeover of healthcare.

Based upon the foregoing basic flaws of the ACA, the law must be REPEALED. What blows my mind is that some Republicans, want to pass a replacement bill that retains these fundamental flaws. Republicans want to keep the preexisting condition coverage and the mandate. How Fucking asinine are they?!? This is like having a cancerous tumor but the doctor only wants to remove part of it.

Contrary to what Ryan says, their ACA Light bill does not put the market back in control of health insurance and healthcare. Moreover, it maintains its same dubious pyramid funding scheme. Wtf?!? This is not what voters meant when we said we want repeal. You do not tweak an already broken system.

I am mad as hell about this Republican healthcare bill. We need to defeat this thing. We need a clean repeal bill eliminating the ACA. Then we can talk about what, if any, replacement law we need.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

You're classifying people as 'Young and Healthy' people that don't need health insurance vs. 'Old and sick' who do need health insurance is moronic.

To date, NO ONE LIVES FOREVER. Those people who are young and/or healthy now will, for the most part, be Old and/or Sick someday. At that time they will need the health insurance that they paid for when they were young and healthy, and the insurance paid for by the young healthy people at that time.

From a health care insurance perspective, the only significant group that does not need health care are those who die suddenly - and many of them will need some form of health care sometime before their untimely deaths.

So the entire basis for your argument is BULLSHIT.

Pure confused leftist tripe. Both you and that degenerate rat, Ludley, need to pay attention to this. Insurance ceases to be insurance when they are required to accept people into the risk pool regardless of degree of risk. If you have private insurance and your insurance company started covering every low life with a heart condition then you should be pissed because your premiums will increase because the risk of insurance payouts become much higher. However, if you allow market principles to govern, then the insurance company can deny high risk candidates, thereby insulating itself and its premium payers from undue risk of loss.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is your healthcare so you can choose your own coverage. The ACA removes the risk element, thereby taking choice away from individuals.

Insurance is good thing. It should be encouraged. But making it available to everyone? Moreover, making consumers by a product that will not benefit them due to high deductibles? This is antithetical to free market principles.

Okay ... Rob37 I've read your comment and you have it completely backward and ACA did not change the basic way insurance works or "remove risk element" - whatever that means..

I would not call insurance a "good thing". Its more of a necessary evil.

Luddly, you are doomed.