CDZ POLL: The "Is It Racist" Quiz

[usmbguest5318]

Which comments are racist?

Generally speaking, people are racist; comments aren't racist. Remarks can indicate a person has racist leanings or is a racist, but no single comment is, by itself, a probative indicator of one's being thus. Some remarks are more probative in that regard than are others.

At the end of the day, I doubt that many folks in the U.S. will attest to being racist; consequently, in determining whether any given individual is a racist, observers must use one's statements -- what one has said, how one said them, the circumstances in which one said them, what be the foreseeable implications of the statements, etc. -- to determine the nature and extent to which one is a racist. That said, slightly racist and overwhelmingly racist are both racist.

That is why I think intent plays an important role.

I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean by that.

Words are just words without intent of the person that makes a comment racist.

There is always a lot of yelling over books written in another era suddenly being declared racist. Like Tom Sawyer. But that wasn’t the authors intent. It was the way it was then.

There is always a lot of yelling over books written in another era suddenly being declared racist. Like Tom Sawyer. But that wasn’t the authors intent. It was the way it was then.

In those bygone eras, the overwhelming majority of everyone who was not a member of a group that was the object of racism was racist, regardless of whether they intended to be, knew better, didn't know better, whatever. Intent is somewhat important, and I "get" what you're saying, but there is also an objective reality that is racism.

My ancestors had slaves, a few of whom they treated quite well, as well as they'd have treated anybody, but that they did does not take away from the fact they were nonetheless racists.

A couple years ago, I went to the wedding of my best friend's daughter. At the reception, I went to speak with my friend's mother. She was there because she wasn't given an option of not being there, and let me tell ya, she was not at all pleased that her granddaughter had wed a Latino. Does she think herself a racist or intend to be one? I'm sure she doesn't; she thinks her views and reasons for being pissed that there's a Latino in her family are perfectly justified. She isn't intending to be a racist, she just is. I suspect people from those bygone years were much the same.

 

[Coyote]

Yeah, I can see that. For some it plays into their already-held racism, justifying it in a way.

But on its own, I don't think it's racist, it's just more mindless conspiracy crap. Calling them all racist is a broad brush that just makes people more defensive.
.

IMHO the birther stuff was about his eligibility to be president.

I would disagree...the reason being....despite clear evidence countering it, it persisted. No other president has been subjected to that sort of ongoing delegitimization or demeaningly referred to as “ the Kenyan imposter”...when you choose to believe it...I have to wonder what is behind that belief.

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

There was no secrecy...that is the whole point.

No secrecy? Really?
he wouldn't even release his birth certificate.
I guess people saying Trump is hiding something in his taxes are racist?
Even IF there wasn't secrecy like you falsely claimed, how is that racism?
Paetisans can't make up reasons not to like the opposition?
Is that really where we are at now? White people can only dislike a black man for his skin color? Smh...

It was released. Then they invented a demand for the long form. That is what I mean...it did not matter what evidence.

Like I falsely claimed? I call B. S. On that. Show me another president who had to show his birth certificate in the total absence of evidence to the contrary. What made Obama different? Well...his race for one.

Trump and taxes....false equivalency....presidential candidates have been routinely releasing their taxes for years. How many have released a birth certificate?

 

[Coyote]

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

Being a conspiracy theorist nut job does not make someone racist.

And by the way, sometimes a conspiracy theorist nut job is right.

I agree, that doesn’t mean someone is racist...but I suspect a high proportion of racists buy into it.

Then why did you pick that option?

Because of what I said above. I am open to discussion on it and if I am met with a better argument I will change it.

The thing is, you don’t know why people don’t believe the evidence but are making assumption and deciding they are racist.

That is true...point taken.

 

[Coyote]

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

Being a conspiracy theorist nut job does not make someone racist.

And by the way, sometimes a conspiracy theorist nut job is right.

I agree, that doesn’t mean someone is racist...but I suspect a high proportion of racists buy into it.

Then why did you pick that option?

Because of what I said above. I am open to discussion on it and if I am met with a better argument I will change it.

You are getting hammered with it as we speak

It is a discussion. Not a competition.

 

[Coyote]

I agree, that doesn’t mean someone is racist...but I suspect a high proportion of racists buy into it.

Sterotyping?

I don’t think so. Why would that belief persist in the face of major evidence to the contrary? Compare that persistence to McCain, who had a short lived Birther controversy over Panama. Evidence was accepted in one case but not the other.

So? Being a political hack is racist now?

Is that what you think?

Thats what i took from your post

I don’t understand what you mean exactly...

 

[Coyote]

If I am met with better arguments I don’t have a problem with changing my mind so I changed my vote. Believing in birther crap isn’t in and of itself racist nor is that statement racist. The fact that it likely attracts a dispraportionate amount of racists doesn’t make it racist.

 

[Tilly]

The fact that it likely attracts a dispraportionate amount of racists doesn’t make it racist.

How do you know it ‘likely attracts a disproportionate amount of racists’, though?

 

[Coyote]

The fact that it likely attracts a dispraportionate amount of racists doesn’t make it racist.

How do you know it likely attracts a disproportionate amount of racists, though?

Well....I would have to do some research to be sure, so it is my opinion but I think it is a well grounded opinion. Racists would never accept a black president, that is a given. They would be far more likely to latch onto any conspiracy theory that delegitimization a president then people who just don't like Obama because he is Obama. They would also be more likely to stick to that claim even in the presence of evidence to the contrary.

 

[Tilly]

The fact that it likely attracts a dispraportionate amount of racists doesn’t make it racist.

How do you know it likely attracts a disproportionate amount of racists, though?

Well....I would have to do some research to be sure, so it is my opinion but I think it is a well grounded opinion. Racists would never accept a black president, that is a given. They would be far more likely to latch onto any conspiracy theory that delegitimization a president then people who just don't like Obama because he is Obama. They would also be more likely to stick to that claim even in the presence of evidence to the contrary.

Well people in general do seem to have a tendency to believe what they want to believe. Look at all the endless unfounded allegations of racism against Trump.

 

[JoeMoma]

IMHO the birther stuff was about his eligibility to be president.

I would disagree...the reason being....despite clear evidence countering it, it persisted. No other president has been subjected to that sort of ongoing delegitimization or demeaningly referred to as “ the Kenyan imposter”...when you choose to believe it...I have to wonder what is behind that belief.

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

There was no secrecy...that is the whole point.

No secrecy? Really?
he wouldn't even release his birth certificate.
I guess people saying Trump is hiding something in his taxes are racist?
Even IF there wasn't secrecy like you falsely claimed, how is that racism?
Paetisans can't make up reasons not to like the opposition?
Is that really where we are at now? White people can only dislike a black man for his skin color? Smh...

It was released. Then they invented a demand for the long form. That is what I mean...it did not matter what evidence.

Like I falsely claimed? I call B. S. On that. Show me another president who had to show his birth certificate in the total absence of evidence to the contrary. What made Obama different? Well...his race for one.

Trump and taxes....false equivalency....presidential candidates have been routinely releasing their taxes for years. How many have released a birth certificate?

What also made Obama different was that he spend several years of his childhood growing up in Kenya and he had published a book in which had a statement about the author being born in Kenya. Sometimes it only takes a couple of bits of truth to get a conspiracy theory going.

 

[Coyote]

I would disagree...the reason being....despite clear evidence countering it, it persisted. No other president has been subjected to that sort of ongoing delegitimization or demeaningly referred to as “ the Kenyan imposter”...when you choose to believe it...I have to wonder what is behind that belief.

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

There was no secrecy...that is the whole point.

No secrecy? Really?
he wouldn't even release his birth certificate.
I guess people saying Trump is hiding something in his taxes are racist?
Even IF there wasn't secrecy like you falsely claimed, how is that racism?
Paetisans can't make up reasons not to like the opposition?
Is that really where we are at now? White people can only dislike a black man for his skin color? Smh...

It was released. Then they invented a demand for the long form. That is what I mean...it did not matter what evidence.

Like I falsely claimed? I call B. S. On that. Show me another president who had to show his birth certificate in the total absence of evidence to the contrary. What made Obama different? Well...his race for one.

Trump and taxes....false equivalency....presidential candidates have been routinely releasing their taxes for years. How many have released a birth certificate?

What also made Obama different was that he spend several years of his childhood growing up in Kenya and he had published a book in which had a statement about the author being born in Kenya. Sometimes it only takes a couple of bits of truth to get a conspiracy theory going.

But see...there again...what is the "truth"? He did not spend any of his childhood in Kenya.

 

[JoeMoma]

Maybe the secrecy or the fact that his publisher published that?
You can't just make up intent. You can't just make up racism..
That's why that claim gets laughed at more every day...

There was no secrecy...that is the whole point.

No secrecy? Really?
he wouldn't even release his birth certificate.
I guess people saying Trump is hiding something in his taxes are racist?
Even IF there wasn't secrecy like you falsely claimed, how is that racism?
Paetisans can't make up reasons not to like the opposition?
Is that really where we are at now? White people can only dislike a black man for his skin color? Smh...

It was released. Then they invented a demand for the long form. That is what I mean...it did not matter what evidence.

Like I falsely claimed? I call B. S. On that. Show me another president who had to show his birth certificate in the total absence of evidence to the contrary. What made Obama different? Well...his race for one.

Trump and taxes....false equivalency....presidential candidates have been routinely releasing their taxes for years. How many have released a birth certificate?

What also made Obama different was that he spend several years of his childhood growing up in Kenya and he had published a book in which had a statement about the author being born in Kenya. Sometimes it only takes a couple of bits of truth to get a conspiracy theory going.

But see...there again...what is the "truth"? He did not spend any of his childhood in Kenya.

I stand corrected, it was Indonesia that he spent part of his childhood in a Muslim nation.

 

[blackhawk]

Everything that you don't like or agree with is now racist dumb yes but that is just the moronic world we now live in.

 

[Mac1958]

Does racism even have a meaning anymore?

No, it really doesn't, sadly, and that's the problem. The word has been so badly over-used for perceived political advantage that it has become diluted and trivialized into near-meaninglessness.
.

 

[Mac1958]

Context is needed...I think the birther crap is racist...I think criticism of Obamacare is not.

I don't see the birther crap as racist. No one is saying that he is inferior because they're pretending he's Kenyan or that Kenya is inferior.

They're just playing partisan politics, trying to discredit him and his agenda and Democrats and whatever the hell else they're trying to discredit.
.

Birtherism is partisan politics, but what it does is plays into some people's racism. They could have conjured up any number of batshit conspiracies. Say he's running a child sex ring out of the basement of a pizza shop, or something. What they went with was him being born in an African nation. It conveniently would disqualify him for office while at the same time playing into his being "different".

Yeah, I can see that. For some it plays into their already-held racism, justifying it in a way.

But on its own, I don't think it's racist, it's just more mindless conspiracy crap. Calling them all racist is a broad brush that just makes people more defensive.
.

IMHO the birther stuff was about his eligibility to be president.

I would disagree...the reason being....despite clear evidence countering it, it persisted. No other president has been subjected to that sort of ongoing delegitimization or demeaningly referred to as “ the Kenyan imposter”...when you choose to believe it...I have to wonder what is behind that belief.

It's perfectly okay to wonder, absolutely. And perfectly reasonable. The problem is that so many choose NOT to wonder and immediately scream RACISM.
.

 

[JoeB131]

All but the first one. You can make some legit reasons why you don't like ObamaCare.

Unless you are a Republican who thought that RomneyCare was just fine until the black guy did it. Then you really are racist.

If you think that ObamaCare is bad because we should have done something like SIngle Payer or a Public Option instead of hoping insurance companies wouldn't screw people over again, like they totally did, that's not racist, that's pragmatic.

All the other statements, totally racist.

 

[JoeB131]

No, it really doesn't, sadly, and that's the problem. The word has been so badly over-used for perceived political advantage that it has become diluted and trivialized into near-meaninglessness.

No, the problem is, nobody wants to confront the elephant in the room. They think that if they aren't attending Klan Rallies, they aren't racist, really. But they try to pretend that racism in this country isn't pervasive and part of our everyday lives.

It's the problem of overt racism, which everyone is rightly disgusted at, and subtle racism we all kind of tolerate in terms of how business, the justice system, the media, etc all operate.

I use the great example of the 2005 resume study.

They sent out resumes with identical qualifications to a bunch of job listings. There was only one difference.

Half the resumes had traditional white names like "Greg" and "Emily".

The other half of them had traditionally black names like "Jamal" and "Lakeisha".

Guess which resumes got call backs?

Now, were those HR people going to Neo-Nazi rallies after work singing a happy chorus of the Horst Wessel Lied? Nope. But were they still kind of racist? Yup.

 

[Mac1958]

All but the first one. You can make some legit reasons why you don't like ObamaCare.
All the other statements, totally racist.

Excellent, thank you.

The reason for the thread, right there.
.

 

[cnelsen]

Everybody practices nepotism. But when white people do it, you call it racism. That makes you the racist.

 

[JoeB131]

Excellent, thank you.

The reason for the thread, right there.

That you are full of yourself? Yes, we get that.

Most other people, saw how a large section of the country completely lost it when Obama got elected.

Now, here's the thing. This is the second time I've seen that in my lifetime.

In 1983, Chicago elected a black man, Harold Washington, to be Mayor, and the folks in the White Neighborhoods completely lost their minds!

Including most of the folks I grew up with.

These same people lost their minds again when Obama got elected.