Post Office to stop Saturday Delivery

[Dubya]

why not just relieve them of the burden the republicans saddled them with

right, because running an org. whose wages and benefits consume four of every five operating dollars ( non unionized fedex- 32%, and unionized ups 52%) is the gop's fault...

or Amtrack, another federally subsidized wreck, needing 16 bucks to make a hamburger they sell for $9.50, yea, its the gop....

Amtrak is very profitable in my area and I don't know of it being expensive in a club car, which I've only used once coming back from Charlotte during modern times and earlier as a child.

It's in rural red areas of the country where Amtrak loses money. It makes money in the Northeast Corridor and we pay your way, so either pay for it yourself or shut it down in your areas.

The USPS just gets loans to stay in operation, so they raise the rates for postage and pay back the loans. Essentially, it's a private business, but Congress keeps it in operation because it's in the Constitution to have it.

As usual, you are looking at one side of a balance sheet.

The United States Postal Service (USPS), also known as the Post Office and U.S. Mail, is an independent agency of the United States government responsible for providing postal service in the United States. It is one of the few government agencies explicitly authorized by the United States Constitution. The USPS traces its roots to 1775 during the Second Continental Congress, where Benjamin Franklin was appointed the first postmaster general. The cabinet-level Post Office Department was created in 1792 from Franklin's operation and transformed into its current form in 1971 under the Postal Reorganization Act.

The USPS employs over 574,000 workers and operates over 260,000 vehicles.[4] The USPS is the operator of the largest vehicle fleet in the world.[5] The USPS is legally obligated to serve all Americans, regardless of geography, at uniform price and quality. The USPS has exclusive access to letter boxes marked "U.S. Mail" and personal letterboxes in the United States, but still competes against private package delivery services, such as UPS and FedEx.

The USPS has not directly received taxpayer-dollars since the early 1980s with the minor exception of subsidies for costs associated with the disabled and overseas voters. Since the 2006 all-time peak mail volume,[6] after which Congress passed the Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act",[7] (which mandated $5.5 billion per year to be paid into an account to pre-fund retiree health-care, 75 years into the future, a requirement unique among organizations and businesses in the U.S.[8]), revenue dropped sharply due to recession-influenced[9] declining mail volume,[10] prompting the postal service to look to other sources of revenue while cutting costs to reduce its budget deficit.[11]

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USPS

 

[Harry Dresden]

why not just relieve them of the burden the republicans saddled them with

right, because running an org. whose wages and benefits consume four of every five operating dollars ( non unionized fedex- 32%, and unionized ups 52%) is the gop's fault...

or Amtrack, another federally subsidized wreck, needing 16 bucks to make a hamburger they sell for $9.50, yea, its the gop....

Traj.....thats bullshit ......if you knew how much money the Middle and upper management in the PO wasted annually on things that they start internally and every worker knows its not going to work, and then stop, when THEY realize it dont work and then,spend money to put it back the way it was......basically the middle management is great at fixing things that are not broke,and ignoring things that are broke....

 

[Harry Dresden]

They shoudl be allowed to fund their retirement program the same way other entities do.

Why are they singled out in this way by the republican party?

becasue they don't want their benefits and pension thrown into the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC) when they go bust, I'd want their plans maximized and funded totally, OR they can just get off the gov. tit and give up their monopoly.

Audits show that, at the end of fiscal 2009, the PO had contributed enough funds to cover all but 1 percent of future pension obligations to its current workers. ......

 

[Cowman]

I see some people never worked in a business that sends mail. It's not all spam.

 

[thereisnospoon]

How about just not forcing them to do what no private or public entity has to do which is fund its retirement for decades RIGHT NOW

How about you shutting up?
The pension fund complaint is a smoke screen.
First class volume is down 25% since 2000.
The USPS just reported another One billion dollar loss for Q4 of 2012.

 

[thereisnospoon]

They shoudl be allowed to fund their retirement program the same way other entities do.

Why are they singled out in this way by the republican party?

How about dumping the pension entirely because regardless of how it's funded, it's unsustainable.
RUn it like a 401k. Only let each worker contribute up to 5% of their gross earnings and have the government match it. Put the money in an individual account for each worker. When they reach age 65 they can access their account after paying taxes on the money.

 

[thereisnospoon]

how many places in this country cant go on line due to lack of accesss?

Everyone who is willing to pay for one, has a telephone land line. Dial up internet access is low cost or is free.
Not everyone requires broadband internet.

 

[Political Junky]

I can't wait until cons figure out how much it'll cost to send their letter by Fed Ex or UPS.

 

[Dubya]

How about just not forcing them to do what no private or public entity has to do which is fund its retirement for decades RIGHT NOW

How about you shutting up?
The pension fund complaint is a smoke screen.
First class volume is down 25% since 2000.
The USPS just reported another One billion dollar loss for Q4 of 2012.

So what? It isn't unusual for a business to lose money and the USPS is a business. You think the USPS is the government and it isn't. It's been an independent agency from the government for 42 years this July 1. If other businesses had the pension requirements like the USPS, they'd be losing money too, or be bankrupt. That doesn't sound like a smoke screen.

I'm sure the USPS also has problems with the rising costs of health care and that isn't a smoke screen, because many of the corporations in America are in the same boat. Rising health care costs are a problem that Congress has failed to act on and it does hurt the business in a competitive market place.

The USPS has had problems from this Great Recession, so it is another victim that was profitable and now isn't. It isn't going to recover all it's lost when times get better, because the changes in using the USPS have a habitual nature. Once people or businesses adapt to cut postage costs, there is little reason to change what they are doing during better times.

The USPS obviously has problems with advances in technology replacing some of the services it's offered in the past.

Personally, I think right-wingers act like they own the Post Office and they are against unions to the point that they just like to bitch. Even with the Constitution requiring the Post Office to exist, I have enough sense to know I don't own it and it's up to the Post Office to solve their own problems. They may have to work out a system to charge you rednecks more to use the service and not have mail delivered for the same price everywhere in America.

 

[Dubya]

The source of the Post Office's financial woes isn't the internet, though permission to modernize would likely help. The real source is the fact that, in 2006, the Congress passed the Post Office Enhancement and Accountability Act which forces the USPS to, without additional revenue, to fund the next 75 years of employee retirement and health care within a 10 year window. This was a deliberate poison pill, whose real objectives were to privatize the functions currently fulfilled by the Post Office, break up the largest union shop in the nation, and provide funds for Bush's war by the selling off of the Post Office's considerable assets - real estate, vehicles, machinery etc... Another factor to consider is, the Post Office is the largest single employer of veterans.

We've posted a petition on the Whitehouse website, asking President Obama to bring this fact to light and ask the Congress to repeal this act. Though the Executive Branch, doesn't wield the power to repeal this egregious act, the President can, ans should use his bully pulpit to motivate constituents to contact their representatives in congress. Please cut and paste the following into your browser. wh.gov/pGZL

Thank you...

I covered that in post #161:

The USPS has not directly received taxpayer-dollars since the early 1980s with the minor exception of subsidies for costs associated with the disabled and overseas voters. Since the 2006 all-time peak mail volume,[6] after which Congress passed the Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act",[7] (which mandated $5.5 billion per year to be paid into an account to pre-fund retiree health-care, 75 years into the future, a requirement unique among organizations and businesses in the U.S.[8]), revenue dropped sharply due to recession-influenced[9] declining mail volume,[10] prompting the postal service to look to other sources of revenue while cutting costs to reduce its budget deficit.[11]

Source: United States Postal Service - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

....and I also pointed out the concern of the right-wing was union busting.

It's my understanding USPS was showing a profit before the Great Recession. I think there is more than one cause of the Post Office's financial woes with the recession and the Accountability and Enhancement Act being the most recent. Before that FedEx and the transition to online banking were factors. In package delivery, there are three major competitor with UPS being added to the list. The internet has added online shopping which requires package delivery, but it's also allowed services like online banking that has cut down mail volume. The business model for the USPS is to provide mail service throughout the United States at a uniform price, while the competition can focus on more profitable markets and ignore other areas that aren't profitable. The extra costs for health care and fuel are financial woes.

USPS - Employees 546,000 (2012 Career Employees)
FedEx - Employees 300,000 (2012)
UPS - Employees 398,300 (December 2011)

United States Postal Service - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
FedEx - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
United Parcel Service - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There is obviously enough demand for these service to allow the Scab FedEx to incorporated in 1997. If Americans want to fight for the working class, they need to find a way to get corporations like FedEx and major retailers like Walmart to become union jobs. The workers in America are going to have to pressure the government to bring back those outsourced jobs and this nonsense that paying a living wage is causing the outsourcing has to end. The government has sovereignty over our market and it doesn't have to allow any foreign product to be sold here. We need a fair trade and not a free trade policy in America. We need the workers to demand a living wage and the people using the service, be it fast food or any necessary job to totally pay for the service they are purchasing. Enough of allowing a business to pay substandard wages and using social services to subsidize the business that underpays them! If society needs a clerk to check out of the supermarket or any retailer, then they should directly pay for that service and the service that they need should be paid a living wage. A person working any full time job should make enough money to put themselves at least at the poverty level.

 

[Cowman]

I can't wait until cons figure out how much it'll cost to send their letter by Fed Ex or UPS.

Especially since FedEx and UPS are not equipped to handle the type of standard letter fare that the USPS operates with.

FedEx and UPS deal strictly in Parcels and Flat sized envelopes... not hundreds of millions of envelopes of varying sizes.

As somebody who deals with USPS, FedEx and UPS on a daily basis, I know the strengths and weaknesses of each, and I know for a fact that USPS is a powerful service for businesses that still send and receive letters.

And let me tell you, if you don't think that many businesses send non spam mail, you people are idiots. Checks, invoices, notifications. You name it. Shit loads of legitimate mail gets sent every day.

 

[candycorn]

I can't wait until cons figure out how much it'll cost to send their letter by Fed Ex or UPS.

Especially since FedEx and UPS are not equipped to handle the type of standard letter fare that the USPS operates with.

FedEx and UPS deal strictly in Parcels and Flat sized envelopes... not hundreds of millions of envelopes of varying sizes.

As somebody who deals with USPS, FedEx and UPS on a daily basis, I know the strengths and weaknesses of each, and I know for a fact that USPS is a powerful service for businesses that still send and receive letters.

And let me tell you, if you don't think that many businesses send non spam mail, you people are idiots. Checks, invoices, notifications. You name it. Shit loads of legitimate mail gets sent every day.

Wait til you want to send a pkg to your kid in the military overseas via FX or UPS. You will beg for the USPS rates.

 

[candycorn]

This does bring up an interesting example of liberals v. the knuckle draggers on the right. The overarching sentiment on the left is "Yeah...time to realize times have changed and accept the rollback of the USPS". Bring up accepting times have changed in reference to the 2nd amendment and it is tantamount to suggesting treason.

 

[Political Junky]

The Post Master just said, on TV, that the USPS will begin delivering packages on Sunday soon.

 

[Harry Dresden]

The Post Master just said, on TV, that the USPS will begin delivering packages on Sunday soon.

it will never happen Junky......they are going to have a hard enough time having people come in and deliver just parcels on Sat......this PMG is not one of the brighter PMG's we have had to work under.....since he has been in charge the place is going under.....

 

[Trajan]

why not just relieve them of the burden the republicans saddled them with

right, because running an org. whose wages and benefits consume four of every five operating dollars ( non unionized fedex- 32%, and unionized ups 52%) is the gop's fault...

or Amtrack, another federally subsidized wreck, needing 16 bucks to make a hamburger they sell for $9.50, yea, its the gop....

Traj.....thats bullshit ......if you knew how much money the Middle and upper management in the PO wasted annually on things that they start internally and every worker knows its not going to work, and then stop, when THEY realize it dont work and then,spend money to put it back the way it was......basically the middle management is great at fixing things that are not broke,and ignoring things that are broke....

Are you challenging the figures, IF you find figures in contrast fine , please post them, if I am wrong, I am wrong.......

As to the rest of your post, I am sorry Harry, you're making an agreement in mitigation, it doesn't matter, approx. 77% of operating budget is pay and benefits, it's not working. Not anymore, I also heard some numbers on per capita service, back in the day, 1880s there was 1 post office for every 53k people, today, 1 for every 15k......with the advent/advance of transportation, even considering volume, thats kind of nuts.

 

[Harry Dresden]

right, because running an org. whose wages and benefits consume four of every five operating dollars ( non unionized fedex- 32%, and unionized ups 52%) is the gop's fault...

or Amtrack, another federally subsidized wreck, needing 16 bucks to make a hamburger they sell for $9.50, yea, its the gop....

Traj.....thats bullshit ......if you knew how much money the Middle and upper management in the PO wasted annually on things that they start internally and every worker knows its not going to work, and then stop, when THEY realize it dont work and then,spend money to put it back the way it was......basically the middle management is great at fixing things that are not broke,and ignoring things that are broke....

Are you challenging the figures, IF you find figures in contrast fine , please post them, if I am wrong, I am wrong.......

As to the rest of your post, I am sorry Harry, you're making an agreement in mitigation, it doesn't matter, approx. 77% of operating budget is pay and benefits, it's not working. Not anymore, I also heard some numbers on per capita service, back in the day, 1880s there was 1 post office for every 53k people, today, 1 for every 15k......with the advent/advance of transportation, even considering volume, thats kind of nuts.

do you think they are going to tell you how much money they blow doing the pointless things that they do inside the PO?....i have seen things that every worker including the supervisors knew would not work,and you knew it was costing money to convert things over.....and then when it did not work and was costing them even more money.....they then would spends tons of money converting it back.....i have seen this kind of shit for years.....and its because they dont have to answer to anyone but themselves.....i also notice Management NEVER talks about their pay and Benefits.....they have people walking around with clipboards doing absolutely nothing to improve the mail flow or delivery or the problems the workers have to deal with on a regular basis.....and these people are making like 75-85 grand a year.....doing nothing....

back in the day, 1880s there was 1 post office for every 53k people, today, 1 for every 15k.

you do you realize the mail volume in the 1880's is piss compared to what it is now right?...and from what i understand each zip code is supposed to have a PO serving that Community....

 

[Political Junky]

The Post Master just said, on TV, that the USPS will begin delivering packages on Sunday soon.

it will never happen Junky......they are going to have a hard enough time having people come in and deliver just parcels on Sat......this PMG is not one of the brighter PMG's we have had to work under.....since he has been in charge the place is going under.....

Thanks to congress who insisted they fund their pension fund 75 years in advance. Cons want to privatize everything.

 

[Harry Dresden]

The Post Master just said, on TV, that the USPS will begin delivering packages on Sunday soon.

it will never happen Junky......they are going to have a hard enough time having people come in and deliver just parcels on Sat......this PMG is not one of the brighter PMG's we have had to work under.....since he has been in charge the place is going under.....

Thanks to congress who insisted they fund their pension fund 75 years in advance. Cons want to privatize everything.

why are you not mentioning how the Democrats or the President are not doing a dam thing to stop this?......a few shop stewards from my local sent a letter to Diane Feinstein getting on her about this.....it seems her husband is making millions on all these Postal office closings.....she never once mentioned that in her reply.....nice huh?......yea its just the Republicans......

 

[thereisnospoon]

I can't wait until cons figure out how much it'll cost to send their letter by Fed Ex or UPS.

Hey sock puppet....This is not a political issue. Now is it one of ideology.
This issue is one of fiscal reason.
That being the fact that USPS First Class volume is down 25% in the last few years.
The fact is the USPS is a poorly run business. It runs a deficit for many reasons.
One is the USPS has too many people employed who do not directly handle or process mail.
The USPS does not charge enough to send pieces of mail over long distances.
Mail delivery charges should be applied to the distance the piece travels.
Bulk mail rates should be eliminated. All who use the service should pay full price. Advertising pieces should be charged an additional fee to use the USPS. After all the advertiser benefits from the USPS, they should PAY the USPS a little more for the service.