Public Schools & Teachers WTF

[Samson]

a lot of the problem is comparing apples to oranges. if you separate out american whites they do better than the worldwide white average. if you separate out american blacks they do much much better than the worldwide black average.

I figured blacks and white were equals, not apples and oranges, but I suppose you're right in a sense since blacks were targeted more by the liberal programs that so destroyed them.

So its not that blacks are oranges but rather they are victims of liberal programs.

Which "liberal programs" would those be?

Which ones do black leaders complain about?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Because of Bush and the No Child Left Behind law.

Cheating by teachers and administrators in the 55,000-student Atlanta ...



Paper reports standardized test insecurity among states in U.S.​

Associated Press
Posted: Sunday, September 30, 2012

ATLANTA — The federal government has no standards to protect the integrity of the achievement tests it requires in tens of thousands of public schools, and test security among the states is so inconsistent that Americans can’t be sure those all-important test scores are legitimate, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.

The newspaper surveyed the 50 state education departments and found that many states do not use basic test security measures designed to prevent cheating. And nearly half the states, the newspaper found, make almost no attempt to screen test results for irregularities.

That kind of lax oversight contributed to the cheating scandal that swept Atlanta schools in 2009, the newspaper said in a story that appeared online Saturday. Evidence of widespread cheating is now emerging in Philadelphia, Columbus, Ohio, El Paso, Texas, and other cities around the country. The Journal-Constitution reported earlier this year that it had found patterns of suspicious changes in test scores in nearly 200 school districts nationwide.

---
A teacher at a Phoenix elementary school, for example, told a colleague that she’d used red and green M&Ms during a test to nudge students toward the right answers. If she set a red M&M on a child’s desk, that signaled the pupil had the wrong answer and should do the problem over again. If she put a green one on the desk, that meant the child had the right answer and should move on.

---

Paper reports standardized test insecurity among states in U.S. | The Eagle | Bryan/College Station, Texas - The Eagle

 

[Samson]

Because of Bush and the No Child Left Behind law.

ATLANTA — The federal government has no standards to protect the integrity of the achievement tests it requires in tens of thousands of public schools, and test security among the states is so inconsistent that Americans can’t be sure those all-important test scores are legitimate, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.

You think the feds should have spelled-out instructions for teachers how not to cheat?

 

[JakeStarkey]

I think the feds should not have been setting standards.

And our broken legislatures reached out with greedy hands for the fed money.

Samson, quit being a dope. Every administrator and teacher needs to go to jail who cheats: every one.

 

[IanC]

a lot of the problem is comparing apples to oranges. if you separate out american whites they do better than the worldwide white average. if you separate out american blacks they do much much better than the worldwide black average.

I figured blacks and white were equals, not apples and oranges, but I suppose you're right in a sense since blacks were targeted more by the liberal programs that so destroyed them.

So its not that blacks are oranges but rather they are victims of liberal programs.

really? do all countries in the world have 'liberal programs' that victimize blacks? because something is definitely holding them down. fortunately the american 'liberal programs' seem to hold them down to a lesser extent than most places elsewhere.

 

[IanC]

Because of Bush and the No Child Left Behind law.

ATLANTA — The federal government has no standards to protect the integrity of the achievement tests it requires in tens of thousands of public schools, and test security among the states is so inconsistent that Americans can’t be sure those all-important test scores are legitimate, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.

You think the feds should have spelled-out instructions for teachers how not to cheat?

lol

the feds may not have laid out instructions on how not to cheat but they certainly laid out guidelines on how you will be punished for low performance of your students. a rather strong incentive for cheating, so I am not all that surprised it has popped up with increasing frequency.

 

[Too Tall]

The problem is the American public:

trying to excuse failure is too stupid and perfectly liberal. The Americans most in support of change are black parents whose kids go to worthless hip-hop ghetto schools!! Who is the enemy of voucher schools and charter schools that don't make excuses for failure???? Liberal unions of course!!!

Did you see Waiting For Superman???

You think teachers would prefer to maintain the quality of ghetto schools, would prefer to teach in them rathern than better schools? Unions are not the enemy of anything that improves the quality of the job for teachers. Keeping schools in bad condition is not something teachers or unions support. Try to use some critical thinking skills. Possibly you didn't get any because you didn't pay attention in school. Possibly you hate the American school system because you were a failure in it: which is your fault and no one else's. Take responsibility for your own failures and stop hating all teachers and all of the American school system because you were miserable in it.

The reason schools in America are not performing is because of the social problems in America--which is much of what I mean by 'the American public' being the problem. The schools expend at least half their time, engery, and focus on dealing with social problems. In schools like those you mention, it is more like 90%. Change the society so the social problems are reduced, find other ways to deal with them, etc., and schools can go back to focusing on education. I know that one reason schools in Europe and Asia do better is because traditional values in the family are stronger and remain intact. And don't throw in yet another myth, that it is feminism that has ruined the American family: women in Europe are just as liberated as American women: I've lived in Europe; feminism is just as strong there as in the States. Europeans have adapted to women being free and equal and have still maintained strong family units. The problem is not unions, the problem is not liberalism (Europeans are far more liberal than Americans), the problem is not Unions. The problem is American social ills.

You do have a point. What percentage of the population in Europe and/or Asia have a population where 40% of the children are born to single mothers?

 

[editec]

US schools have mostly always had standardized testing.

They were called ACHIEVEMENT TESTS and even waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in the 50's they were standardly given.

What IS different now is that the FEDERAL GOVERMENT is paying (or not paying) money to the school based on the aggregate outcomes of those tests.

That is basically the ONLY difference, far as I can see.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The "golden handcuffs" is the term given to indicate the co-option of employees through better than average salaries and perks given by employers.

In this case, the federal government has golden handcuffed the educational administrators from fed to local levels. The administrators will not change because it is their standard of living that changes.

The only way to break it is the creation of more private schools.

 

[Samson]

US schools have mostly always had standardized testing.

They were called ACHIEVEMENT TESTS and even waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in the 50's they were standardly given.

What IS different now is that the FEDERAL GOVERMENT is paying (or not paying) money to the school based on the aggregate outcomes of those tests.

That is basically the ONLY difference, far as I can see.

I assume by "the only difference" you mean in the context of standardized testing....just for whites, who volunteered to take the tests (before Federally mandated integration)....before there were no "Individuals with Disabilities" Federally mandated into the school system....and there was no Federal Free and Reduced Lunch program.

Yeah, the ONLY difference......

 

[Samson]

The "golden handcuffs" is the term given to indicate the co-option of employees through better than average salaries and perks given by employers.

I thought it was called a "Cash Bonus" for performance that met or exceeded employer expectations.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The "golden handcuffs" is the term given to indicate the co-option of employees through better than average salaries and perks given by employers.

I thought it was called a "Cash Bonus" for performance that met or exceeded employer expectations.

That is one benign explanation but not the only one.

 

[Trajan]

those effing honkey bastards!!!

just another example of southern strategy former dems cum republicans keepin' da potential bruddas down....

 

[Trajan]

Because of Bush and the No Child Left Behind law.

Cheating by teachers and administrators in the 55,000-student Atlanta ...



Paper reports standardized test insecurity among states in U.S.​

Associated Press
Posted: Sunday, September 30, 2012

ATLANTA — The federal government has no standards to protect the integrity of the achievement tests it requires in tens of thousands of public schools, and test security among the states is so inconsistent that Americans can’t be sure those all-important test scores are legitimate, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.

The newspaper surveyed the 50 state education departments and found that many states do not use basic test security measures designed to prevent cheating. And nearly half the states, the newspaper found, make almost no attempt to screen test results for irregularities.

That kind of lax oversight contributed to the cheating scandal that swept Atlanta schools in 2009, the newspaper said in a story that appeared online Saturday. Evidence of widespread cheating is now emerging in Philadelphia, Columbus, Ohio, El Paso, Texas, and other cities around the country. The Journal-Constitution reported earlier this year that it had found patterns of suspicious changes in test scores in nearly 200 school districts nationwide.

---
A teacher at a Phoenix elementary school, for example, told a colleague that she’d used red and green M&Ms during a test to nudge students toward the right answers. If she set a red M&M on a child’s desk, that signaled the pupil had the wrong answer and should do the problem over again. If she put a green one on the desk, that meant the child had the right answer and should move on.

---

Paper reports standardized test insecurity among states in U.S. | The Eagle | Bryan/College Station, Texas - The Eagle

oh but of course

I mean I knew it had to be a republican ( white!!! too I bet) fault somewhere..( proof of whiteness to come)..



man are you challenged or what?


you go to one of those schools Jake, you sound like you got very short changed too....

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

You do have a point. What percentage of the population in Europe and/or Asia have a population where 40% of the children are born to single mothers?

True enough, the devil liberal has destroyed the American family and made the job of schools much much harder. The schools however can't work much much harder because they too are controlled by the devil liberal's unions.

Unions want to produce easier jobs and higher pay, not better students. This is how they drove 30 million manufacturing jobs offshore.

We all know its true so why not make unions illegal again???

 

[psikeyhackr]

Is there a simple table somewhere showing what ideas a child is supposed to UNDERSTAND at what age? I said "understand" not memorize. That is the trouble with most testing that I have submitted to. I could memorize and regurgitate without understanding squat if I wanted to.

The only test I ever cheated on was a history test. I regarded it as useless crap that I didn't want to take anyway. I never cheated on a math test and got A's in that.

So I have mixed feelings about this Atlanta cheating. What evidence is there that the kids in districts that do well on these tests actually UNDERSTAND much?

Our educators can't create or even talk about creating a National Recommended Reading List but even those who don't cheat on this testing system complain about it. If the schools are producing dumb kids who can pass stupidly designed tests then how is that worse than cheating on stupidly designed tests?

psik

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

What evidence is there that the kids in districts that do well on these tests actually UNDERSTAND much?

too stupid!! they obviously understand a lot more than kids who don't do well on the tests!!

 

[JakeStarkey]

you go to one of those schools Jake

I went to a lower middle-class Anglo-Hispanic school in southern California.

This is not just a GOP issue, but also a Dem issue, who supported the assholes who rammed the equivalent through Texas and then nationally.

Anyone who has served on school boards in the last twenty years (and I have as member and board president) has seen what the NCLB debacle has caused in public education.

The only salvation has been the parents and teachers lifting mountains to make sure the students are taught proplery.

 

[American_Jihad]

Homeschooling

 

[Trajan]

you go to one of those schools Jake

I went to a lower middle-class Anglo-Hispanic school in southern California.

This is not just a GOP issue, but also a Dem issue, who supported the assholes who rammed the equivalent through Texas and then nationally.

Anyone who has served on school boards in the last twenty years (and I have as member and board president) has seen what the NCLB debacle has caused in public education.

The only salvation has been the parents and teachers lifting mountains to make sure the students are taught proplery.