Punishment for Abortion?

[Anguille]

When a woman's body is carrying a living being her body is no longer hers alone. There's a heatbeat after 22 days from conception, it is a living being and someone needs to speak on its behalf, Lord knows the selfish woman won't. Women that abort are the most selfish, heartless and cowardly people on earth IMO and society should eradicate them.

Suppose a woman gives birth to a baby girl who eventually becomes a woman who has an abortion. Wouldn't it have been better than, for the first woman to have aborted?

"Women that abort are the most selfish, heartless and cowardly people on earth IMO and society should eradicate them."

Pretty strong words but at least you're no hypocrite. You call for death for any woman who aborts because you believe abortion is murder and murder calls for the death penalty. Do I have that right?

What about men who perform, assist or pay for an abortion? Death for them as well? Or just for the women?

 

[Dr Grump]

Unlike you I don't wish anything of the sort. Abortion is murder and all those that participate in it should be held accountable, that is my opinion. You don't value human life and you have said as much, I place you on the level of Wayne Williams, Dean Corll , John Wayne Gacy , Gary Ridgeway , Moses Sithole , Gerald Stano , Andrei Chikatilo, Bruno Ludke, Henry Lee Lucas and Pedro Alonso Lopez.

And I place you in the same category as those moonbats who walk around dribbling and banging their heads against the wall. But, hey, even ijits are allowed an opinion...

 

[Anguille]

The answer to the question floating around in MY mind - the one that you fools and flamers don't want to hear, which is why you never ask real questions - is that no one has suggested making abortion illegal, and the only people suggesting that there should be punishment for the "mothers" involved is YOU TWERPS, and you only do it as a lame-ass attempt to shut down abortion debate entirely. So no, there is no simple question involved in "What do you think the faux punishment made up by lying abortion supporters should be, if abortion was ever illegalized despite the fact that no one is advocating that?"

The simple question is, "Why can't you chickenshits ever address the REAL issues instead of hiding behind lies?"

What planet do you live on?

 

[Anguille]

First of all, many of our laws involve restricting what one can do with one's body, so I'd like to know where leftists got the odd notion that anyone is or has ever been entitled to complete autonomy in regards to "my own body". Second of all, abortion isn't about the woman's body at all, as leftists very well know, or would if they had a knowledge of biology beyond the second grade level. It's about the body of someone else entirely, ie. the baby, and the right to live shouldn't be like real estate: all about location, location, location.

Glad to know that you somehow think males are less capable of compassion for babies or objective morality, though.

It IS about the woman's body because that is where the parasite is gestating. And it will remain a parasite until it can live outside of the woman's body without feeding off of the woman. I love how all you Republicans think you are the be all end all when it comes to this issue. If you do not want/do not need to have an abortion, don't have one. But to think for one moment you can tell me what I can do with my body is highly arrogant and, thankfully, your fight to overturn Roe v Wade will never be won.

What grows inside a woman's body when she is pregnant is human life. When she gets an abortion she destroys this human life. You can duck and dodge and call it a 'parasite' . . . can you deny that it is human? Can you deny that it is alive? You want to support the destruction of this innocent human life, that's your choice. But stop being such a coward and call a spade a spade. Abortion destroys human life.

IMO, it is irrelevant whether a fetus is human life or not, A fetus inhabiting the body of a human who wishes to evict it has no right to continue trespassing. No such thing as squatter's rights when it comes to a person's body.

 

[Anguille]

And yet, no one has a problem with the generalizations made by others in this thread about pro-life folks?

Immie

What are you? Chopped liver?

YOU had a HUGE problem with the generalizations made about anti-choicers.

But you don't seem to like it if someone has a problem when it concerns pro choicers.

Excuse me?

I didn't have a problem with the generalizations made by either side. It was toronado that was complaining about the generalizations made about choicers, yet he ignores the ones that started it all.

Immie

Sorry, I misinterpreted one of your posts.

I take back what I said, except the part about you not being chopped liver.

 

[Smartt33]

I am not sure where exactly to post this.. I was thinking the healthcare forum, but this is more of a morality thing..

Assuming that abortion is made illegal.. What would the punishment be??

As often as rightwingers throw around words like murderers and baby killers.. Would you try and convict a young female for murder and then execute her for an abortion??

Is there really teeth behind your words or is it just a fear tactic??

I am curious..

First, if abortion was illegal, except in a life and death situation, it would not be a crime of murder, necessarily. It would be, for the Doctor, the performance of an illegal procedure. Punishment? That would not necessarily be a long jail sentence, but the Dr's license might be in danger.

For the pregnant woman, it would be having an illegal procedure performed, which might be costly in fines.

Both could face some kind of charges related to the human rights of the child. There is a possibility of some punishment related to taking the life of an unborn child.

Murder is a harsh word to use in some cases. However, abortion for convenience sake, in my opinion is taking the life of a person, willfully and in a premeditated action.

Just my thoughts.

So, if Abortion isn't murder, what is it? An accident?

As in taking an innocent life, it is murder. I was addressing the question. However, I never said it was not murder. I said, not necessarily murder. In life and death decisions, it might not be "charged" as a murder. I am not so sure that means it is nmot murder.

In the rest of the cases, It certainly could be called and charged as Murder. I was just trying to give room for at least making it illegal, and having consequences. I am sorry if I was not harsh enough.

Trying to say it as kindly as possible. I would otherwise be labeled a radical.

 

[Neser Boha]

Abortion is murder.

So you support the Doctor, the woman, and anyone else involved be charged with premeditated murder.

Yes.

Somebody should keep an eye on the likes of you ... delusional idiots that would have a live, intelligent human beings killed on the account of a fetus.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I am not sure where exactly to post this.. I was thinking the healthcare forum, but this is more of a morality thing..

Assuming that abortion is made illegal.. What would the punishment be??

As often as rightwingers throw around words like murderers and baby killers.. Would you try and convict a young female for murder and then execute her for an abortion??

Is there really teeth behind your words or is it just a fear tactic??

I am curious..

Well, in the cases where mommy chooses to abort a perfectly viable pre-born human being for such important reasons as "personal convenience," I suppose SOME punsihment might be in order.

Prison, maybe?

I realize that would be a terrible inconvenience. And that would be a bit ironic. But I'm not sure the personal convenience of the convicted criminal is ever that much of a valid basis for a decision by a Court about sentencing a convicted defendant.

Of course, we should also consider who ELSE might be in line for prosecution. It's not ALL about the mommy, necessarily.

Generally speaking, the pro-life movement simply advocates a return to the way things were before Roe v. Wade, when the sovereign states and the people in them were allowed to decide for themselves what position they wanted to take on abortion, rather than having the received wisdom from on high of a handful of lawyers in black dresses imposed on them. And I don't believe even the most strictly regulated states had prison time for women getting illegal abortions, although I think some of them did have prison time for the doctors performing them.

 

[AllieBaba]

That is so Christian of you.

You are for killing. You said as much above. Do you read what you post?

You're on this board supporting abortion, asshat. If I were you, I wouldn't start pointing fingers at anyone else for being "for killing". I'd say you're about a million deaths a year ahead of us on that scoreboard.

Yes, I am for the unabashed killing of fetuses. That is exactly what my posts are showing. It couldn't be that I'm for letting people decide for themselves, could it? Oh, I'm sorry, I'm talking to a Republican. Your idea of personal freedom is limited to members of your own party. Parish the thought that people be allowed to decide for themselves.

And your idea of freedom is to squash those who are most vulnerable.
That is the definitive quality of liberals.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Sunni Man wants to put women in prison. I asked him.

Please see my last response to your previous attempt to waste my time with this bullshit line.

Thanks for proving that you chickenshits are all about desperately avoiding a real debate, though.

Ummm.. The only one I see avoiding debate is you.. You have yet to asnwer the question and yet to make any kind of point what so ever.. Other than calling people names and throwing insults.. You have done nothing to add to this debate..

I will ask for it again.. What is your point of view on this issue??

This debate? What debate? The one about whether or not we've stopped beating our wives? The one where you tell us that we're evil, and then we're supposed to debate just HOW evil we really are? Idiot, please. You started out throwing insults by presenting a false premise, and if it makes you feel better to sit back and whine now because I just did more directly and honestly what you were doing anyway, go ahead. It's not like I came to this thread thinking, "Well, Majik is such a smart and contemplative person, I'm sure we'll have an enlightening discussion on the issue of abortion", and I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over the notion that someone without the wattage to light the flashlight on my keychain isn't going to admire me.

Call me when you have the cojones to ask my point of view on the issue of abortion, rather than the issue of your delusions about my position on abortion. If I wanted to debate your paranoid hallucinations, I'd be getting paid as your therapist.

 

[eagleseven]

Assuming that abortion is made illegal.. What would the punishment be??

I don't support any bans on abortion, but the logical charge would be either premeditated murder or voluntary manslaughter, depending upon the circumstances (as with any illegal killing). Punishments would include everything from several decades in prison, to the death penalty.

 

[Cecilie1200]

That's what Lonestar_Logic wants...I asked him.

Really? Do you even know who Lonestar_Logic is in real life, much less what qualifies him to represent all of the right wing, or even all of the mainstream pro-life movement? No? Then this is no answer, particularly when I wasn't addressing you in the first place.

I asked him...he answered. Quite clearly. Now, if you want to call him a liar, that's between you and him....but you did state that we need to ask...I did. Sorry your little complaint didn't work in my case.

I didn't ask you if you found one anonymous guy on the Internet who thought it. In actual fact, I didn't ask YOU at all. But since you feel compelled to answer, at least do me the courtesy of answering like a courageous, intelligent adult, not a dumbass leftist. That "all or nothing" bullshit you fools like to hide behind doesn't impress me. Unless YOU want to personally be held responsible for every half-assed, repugnant point of view held by some fringe lunatic on the Internet - or in a university somewhere, given the way you leftists work - you will answer a question about the right-wing with examples of the mainstream right-wing.

Any further attempt to say, "I know one guy on the Internet, so that means the whole right wing thinks this" will be ignored as it deserves. You have now come to the end of my patience with your willingness to look like a disingenuous poltroon in public. If you have no more intellectual pride than this, I have more intellectual pride than to dignify it.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Sunni Man wants to put women in prison. I asked him.

Please see my last response to your previous attempt to waste my time with this bullshit line.

Thanks for proving that you chickenshits are all about desperately avoiding a real debate, though.

You said we need to ask. I did. Sunni Man gave me his answer. You don't like that your suggestion blew up in your face....twice on this very thread.

You are now dismissed for intellectual cowardice. Come back when you grow a pair, figuratively speaking, and can quit dodging.

But thanks for yet again proving how terrified you fools truly are of real debate. FLUSH!

 

[Zoom-boing]

It IS about the woman's body because that is where the parasite is gestating. And it will remain a parasite until it can live outside of the woman's body without feeding off of the woman. I love how all you Republicans think you are the be all end all when it comes to this issue. If you do not want/do not need to have an abortion, don't have one. But to think for one moment you can tell me what I can do with my body is highly arrogant and, thankfully, your fight to overturn Roe v Wade will never be won.

What grows inside a woman's body when she is pregnant is human life. When she gets an abortion she destroys this human life. You can duck and dodge and call it a 'parasite' . . . can you deny that it is human? Can you deny that it is alive? You want to support the destruction of this innocent human life, that's your choice. But stop being such a coward and call a spade a spade. Abortion destroys human life.

IMO, it is irrelevant whether a fetus is human life or not, A fetus inhabiting the body of a human who wishes to evict it has no right to continue trespassing. No such thing as squatter's rights when it comes to a person's body.

Wow, just . . . . wow. Your casual disregard for human life astounds me.

It is totally relevant that what grows inside a woman's body is human life. THAT'S the point. If it was an artichoke we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I suppose you have to tell yourself it doesn't matter that it is, in fact, human life because you have to justify your position and choice somehow.

 

[Immanuel]

It IS about the woman's body because that is where the parasite is gestating. And it will remain a parasite until it can live outside of the woman's body without feeding off of the woman. I love how all you Republicans think you are the be all end all when it comes to this issue. If you do not want/do not need to have an abortion, don't have one. But to think for one moment you can tell me what I can do with my body is highly arrogant and, thankfully, your fight to overturn Roe v Wade will never be won.

What grows inside a woman's body when she is pregnant is human life. When she gets an abortion she destroys this human life. You can duck and dodge and call it a 'parasite' . . . can you deny that it is human? Can you deny that it is alive? You want to support the destruction of this innocent human life, that's your choice. But stop being such a coward and call a spade a spade. Abortion destroys human life.

IMO, it is irrelevant whether a fetus is human life or not, A fetus inhabiting the body of a human who wishes to evict it has no right to continue trespassing. No such thing as squatter's rights when it comes to a person's body.

At least you admit that is nothing more than opinion. All of us are entitled to hold incorrect opinions.

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

First, if abortion was illegal, except in a life and death situation, it would not be a crime of murder, necessarily. It would be, for the Doctor, the performance of an illegal procedure. Punishment? That would not necessarily be a long jail sentence, but the Dr's license might be in danger.

For the pregnant woman, it would be having an illegal procedure performed, which might be costly in fines.

Both could face some kind of charges related to the human rights of the child. There is a possibility of some punishment related to taking the life of an unborn child.

Murder is a harsh word to use in some cases. However, abortion for convenience sake, in my opinion is taking the life of a person, willfully and in a premeditated action.

Just my thoughts.

So, if Abortion isn't murder, what is it? An accident?

As in taking an innocent life, it is murder. I was addressing the question. However, I never said it was not murder. I said, not necessarily murder. In life and death decisions, it might not be "charged" as a murder. I am not so sure that means it is nmot murder.

In the rest of the cases, It certainly could be called and charged as Murder. I was just trying to give room for at least making it illegal, and having consequences. I am sorry if I was not harsh enough.

Trying to say it as kindly as possible. I would otherwise be labeled a radical.

Since murder is defined (more or less) as the unlawful taking of a human life and since as it stands today, abortion is lawful, abortion cannot be termed murder. As long as it is lawful it is not murder. However, just because it is lawful does not make it moral or right by any stretch of the imagination.

edit: not all taking of human life is considered murder. For instance, a state execution is not murder. Nor is the killing of an intruder in one's home when the victim believes (s)he is threatened.

Immie

 

[AllieBaba]

And it used to be legal to kill your slaves as well. And rape your wife.

Just because the legal definition changes only means those things were once legal. It doesn't mean they weren't rape, or murder.

 

[Christopher]

It IS about the woman's body because that is where the parasite is gestating. And it will remain a parasite until it can live outside of the woman's body without feeding off of the woman. I love how all you Republicans think you are the be all end all when it comes to this issue. If you do not want/do not need to have an abortion, don't have one. But to think for one moment you can tell me what I can do with my body is highly arrogant and, thankfully, your fight to overturn Roe v Wade will never be won.

What grows inside a woman's body when she is pregnant is human life. When she gets an abortion she destroys this human life. You can duck and dodge and call it a 'parasite' . . . can you deny that it is human? Can you deny that it is alive? You want to support the destruction of this innocent human life, that's your choice. But stop being such a coward and call a spade a spade. Abortion destroys human life.

IMO, it is irrelevant whether a fetus is human life or not, A fetus inhabiting the body of a human who wishes to evict it has no right to continue trespassing. No such thing as squatter's rights when it comes to a person's body.

No, most of the time the sperm was invited by the woman. If she did not want it, she should either not have sex or put up the proper no trespassing signs and fences in the form of practicing good birth control methods.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

When a woman's body is carrying a living being her body is no longer hers alone. There's a heatbeat after 22 days from conception, it is a living being and someone needs to speak on its behalf, Lord knows the selfish woman won't. Women that abort are the most selfish, heartless and cowardly people on earth IMO and society should eradicate them.

Suppose a woman gives birth to a baby girl who eventually becomes a woman who has an abortion. Wouldn't it have been better than, for the first woman to have aborted?

"Women that abort are the most selfish, heartless and cowardly people on earth IMO and society should eradicate them."

Pretty strong words but at least you're no hypocrite. You call for death for any woman who aborts because you believe abortion is murder and murder calls for the death penalty. Do I have that right?

What about men who perform, assist or pay for an abortion? Death for them as well? Or just for the women?

I made it pretty clear that anyone involved in murdering an unborn child should be held accountable.

 

[Cecilie1200]

What grows inside a woman's body when she is pregnant is human life. When she gets an abortion she destroys this human life. You can duck and dodge and call it a 'parasite' . . . can you deny that it is human? Can you deny that it is alive? You want to support the destruction of this innocent human life, that's your choice. But stop being such a coward and call a spade a spade. Abortion destroys human life.

IMO, it is irrelevant whether a fetus is human life or not, A fetus inhabiting the body of a human who wishes to evict it has no right to continue trespassing. No such thing as squatter's rights when it comes to a person's body.

At least you admit that is nothing more than opinion. All of us are entitled to hold incorrect opinions.

Immie

I do wish, though, that not so many people were eager to exercise their God-given right to be imbeciles.