Question for those that support sanctuary cities/states.

[Humorme]

Sometimes I wish they would make the guy post something relevant instead of the same litany every few days. Monotonous posts don't change any minds; they are not entertaining; those repetitive postings never educate nor enlighten.

I am not the one who is resorting to fallacy.

Sometimes I wish they would make the guy post something relevant instead of the same litany every few days. Monotonous posts don't change any minds; they are not entertaining; those repetitive postings never educate nor enlighten.

I am not the one who is resorting to fallacy.

All you've done is to resort to fallacies. You're not relevant lib bot.


View attachment 170685

The Only trolls are the ones with no argument and only propaganda.

It is the considered opinion that nine out of every 10 posters who have read more than half a dozen of your posts agree that YOU, danielpalos are THE consummate Troll.

This idiocy that someone is causeless and clueless because they disagree with you is an insult that should be banned on this site as well as all others you participate on.

You never provide anything other than a few words taken out of context from a source and NO explanation. When it comes to the interpretation of what your sources mean, you need to reference the men who wrote your source material. In this instance, let me do it for you:

"On every question of construction (of the Constitution) let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed." (Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823, The Complete Jefferson, p. 322)

The ONLY reason you try to pass off such quotes as propaganda is that they disprove your position of a government God that relies only on popular vote to make its point. If anyone on this board is causeless and clueless, then danielpalos, you should look in a mirror. You can then see a shining example of that individual of which you accuse others.

This is the federal doctrine:

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises,

to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States;​

but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Everything underlined is the objective of the federal doctrine, not the republican doctrine.

Only the right wing has nothing but fallacy instead of valid arguments.

How do you get Your version, with the federal doctrine? Congress has the Power to pay the Debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States.

 

[danielpalos]

to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States;

All or none, right wingers.

 

[KissMy]

Trump asking Congress for another $18 Billion for 1st phase of border wall that he promised Mexico would pay for. Plus Trump already spent many $Billions more keeping more undocumented workers in prison while deporting fewer.

 

[Humorme]

Trump asking Congress for another $18 Billion for 1st phase of border wall that he promised Mexico would pay for. Plus Trump already spent many $Billions more keeping more undocumented workers in prison while deporting fewer.

You probably missed my questions earlier in this thread. I think, based upon the scenarios I posted on this thread, and some I didn't, this wall deal is a big hoax and a pretext to take away your Rights.

 

[charwin95]

85% of our crops will rot in the field without illegally migrant workers. They deserve sanctuary in all 50 states.

LOL, less than 50% of field workers are illegals, how do you then suppose over 85% of our crops will rot? SMFH
Many crops can be harvested with machines, its the up front expense to the farmer as to why he doesn't purchase them and not hire manual labor.

Not sure where got the 50% but I know farmers that owns very large farms in Delano, Bakersfield and Arizona area and most or all are Illegals. Some has green cards but they are all Hispanics.
Machine operators are also illegals.

Wages rise on California farms. Americans still don't want the job

To keep crops from rotting in the field, farmers say they need Trump to let in more temporary workers

 

[charwin95]

85% of our crops will rot in the field without illegally migrant workers. They deserve sanctuary in all 50 states.

LOL, less than 50% of field workers are illegals, how do you then suppose over 85% of our crops will rot? SMFH
Many crops can be harvested with machines, its the up front expense to the farmer as to why he doesn't purchase them and not hire manual labor.

You have to include packing houses, slaughter houses (feed market), and restaurants. Without all these illegal workers, our economy will take a nose dive. The farmers will only be able to salvage about 15% of their crop.

Look what happened in Alabama.

LOL, the slaughter houses had people lined up to work there when Bush raided them and got rid of all the illegal workers. Restaurants would lose buss boys, but guess what, young 16 - 20 year old's would take those jobs.

Those days without an illegal 10 or so years ago blew up in their faces. Our economy wouldn't notice them being gone. Farmers would lose some, it wouldn't be an 85% loss, at best a 20% loss.

Alabama? some farmers claiming losses, yet produce costs did not change nor were there produce shortages in the markets. gofigure

That’s funny. There are slaughterhouse here and I don’t see anyone but Hispanics.
Oh yes guarantee you 100% they will be missed if those illegals are gone.
I don’t see 16 or even 25 yo white boys or girls working in restaurants as buss boys here. They don’t even work at McDonald’s. Kids are not the same like it used to be. Get that straight.

Did you research what happened in Alabama?

Where are you getting your opinions?

 

[charwin95]

As i posted several times here. I know tons of businesses and business owners and farmers. These where I based my facts and opinions when it come to this topic.

The economy is booming. Without these illegals the economy will not be this good especially here in California the 6th largest economy of the world. That’s a fact.

California Crops Rot as Immigration Crackdown Creates Farmworker Shortage

 

[Liquid Reigns]

85% of our crops will rot in the field without illegally migrant workers. They deserve sanctuary in all 50 states.

LOL, less than 50% of field workers are illegals, how do you then suppose over 85% of our crops will rot? SMFH
Many crops can be harvested with machines, its the up front expense to the farmer as to why he doesn't purchase them and not hire manual labor.

Not sure where got the 50% but I know farmers that owns very large farms in Delano, Bakersfield and Arizona area and most or all are Illegals. Some has green cards but they are all Hispanics.
Machine operators are also illegals.

Wages rise on California farms. Americans still don't want the job

To keep crops from rotting in the field, farmers say they need Trump to let in more temporary workers

Well which is it, most or all are illegals, yet some have green cards? I'll bet some are even US Citizens. SMFH So what if they are all Hispanic in Southern CA and AZ. PEW research gave the % number, its easy enough to look up.

As to your second link, the farmers need to use the tools they have allowed for them, namely the H2A visa, they choose not to use it. If they don't like it then they need to lobby to get it changed, but until it is they are stuck with using it, or take the chance at being caught if they knowingly hire illegals.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

As i posted several times here. I know tons of businesses and business owners and farmers. These where I based my facts and opinions when it come to this topic.

The economy is booming. Without these illegals the economy will not be this good especially here in California the 6th largest economy of the world. That’s a fact.

California Crops Rot as Immigration Crackdown Creates Farmworker Shortage

The farmers have brought it on themselves if they are not using the H2A visa as there is no limit on the amount of workers they can bring in.

Your opinion is not factual and basing what you claim as facts on the few people you know isn't a large enough pool to make a claim on.

So lets look at your link

It’s unclear exactly how widespread the labor shortage is for farmers throughout the country, which would have a bigger impact on prices consumers pay. Ultimately, drought and flooding have a more significant impact on farms. Low oil prices could also offset any impact of the worker shortage.

What? Its unclear how widespread the labor shortage is? Drought and flooding have a bigger impact? Oil prices can offset worker shortages?

Looks like opinions are like assholes, everyone has one. I suggest you don't claim opinion as fact as it always comes back to bite you.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

85% of our crops will rot in the field without illegally migrant workers. They deserve sanctuary in all 50 states.

LOL, less than 50% of field workers are illegals, how do you then suppose over 85% of our crops will rot? SMFH
Many crops can be harvested with machines, its the up front expense to the farmer as to why he doesn't purchase them and not hire manual labor.

You have to include packing houses, slaughter houses (feed market), and restaurants. Without all these illegal workers, our economy will take a nose dive. The farmers will only be able to salvage about 15% of their crop.

Look what happened in Alabama.

LOL, the slaughter houses had people lined up to work there when Bush raided them and got rid of all the illegal workers. Restaurants would lose buss boys, but guess what, young 16 - 20 year old's would take those jobs.

Those days without an illegal 10 or so years ago blew up in their faces. Our economy wouldn't notice them being gone. Farmers would lose some, it wouldn't be an 85% loss, at best a 20% loss.

Alabama? some farmers claiming losses, yet produce costs did not change nor were there produce shortages in the markets. gofigure

That’s funny. There are slaughterhouse here and I don’t see anyone but Hispanics.
Oh yes guarantee you 100% they will be missed if those illegals are gone.
I don’t see 16 or even 25 yo white boys or girls working in restaurants as buss boys here. They don’t even work at McDonald’s. Kids are not the same like it used to be. Get that straight.

Did you research what happened in Alabama?

Where are you getting your opinions?

So are you assuming because they are Hispanics then they are also illegals? Sure seems you are associating there heritage to them being illegally here. SMFH

Up here in Northern California white boys and girls are working as bus boys and dishwashers in local restaurants. I have 2 McDonalds within 2 miles of where I live, the people working in them have every color of skin tone one could imagine, and they all speak English without accents. :SHRUG:

Maybe you should actually research the subject verse reading headlines and basing your opinion off things you don't seem to adept at truly knowing.

 

[KissMy]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

 

[gallantwarrior]

How should illegal immigration be controlled? It seems that the mindset of the sanctuary city/state crowd is that once a person arrives illegally (or over stays a visa), that person should be welcomed to stay, establish permanent residence, become legally employed, receive government services, acquire a driver’s license, enroll children into public schools, and eventually seek citizenship and have the right to vote. In other words, the illegal immigrant is to be granted all the rights, benefits and protections as legal immigrants. How can we control immigration if we don’t treat illegal immigration as a crime and allow illegal immigrants to simply blend into our society? Also, if you believe we should have open boarders making all immigrants legal, just say so!

Illegals here should be treated exactly as their countries of origin would treat anyone illegally entering and staying in those countries would be treated.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

The new Ford aircraft carrier was 13 billion dollars F.Y.I.


Edit my apologies misread your post ...yup it will cost 5 aircraft carriers , still cheaper then over 70 billion a year every year on illegals

 

[Humorme]

How should illegal immigration be controlled? It seems that the mindset of the sanctuary city/state crowd is that once a person arrives illegally (or over stays a visa), that person should be welcomed to stay, establish permanent residence, become legally employed, receive government services, acquire a driver’s license, enroll children into public schools, and eventually seek citizenship and have the right to vote. In other words, the illegal immigrant is to be granted all the rights, benefits and protections as legal immigrants. How can we control immigration if we don’t treat illegal immigration as a crime and allow illegal immigrants to simply blend into our society? Also, if you believe we should have open boarders making all immigrants legal, just say so!

Illegals here should be treated exactly as their countries of origin would treat anyone illegally entering and staying in those countries would be treated.

So you are advocating that our laws should regress to the standards of a third world nation?

 

[Humorme]

As i posted several times here. I know tons of businesses and business owners and farmers. These where I based my facts and opinions when it come to this topic.

The economy is booming. Without these illegals the economy will not be this good especially here in California the 6th largest economy of the world. That’s a fact.

California Crops Rot as Immigration Crackdown Creates Farmworker Shortage

Georgia has had the same problem for years:

Georgia's Harsh Immigration Law Costs Millions in Unharvested Crops

Migrant workers still in need

"Crops went untended as the season's harvest began, and more than $1 million a day vanished as the human-fueled agricultural harvest machine of migrant labor in the United States stalled."

Ben Carson's Immigrant Visa Idea Favored By Farmers As Nation's Crops Rot

It's been an issue in Alabama for years as well and some say this is a problem nationwide (and has been for as long as the crackdowns have been going on):

Alabama Illegal Immigrant Crackdown Destroys Farm Business

Crops rot while Trump-led immigration backlash idles farm work

 

[Liquid Reigns]

As i posted several times here. I know tons of businesses and business owners and farmers. These where I based my facts and opinions when it come to this topic.

The economy is booming. Without these illegals the economy will not be this good especially here in California the 6th largest economy of the world. That’s a fact.

California Crops Rot as Immigration Crackdown Creates Farmworker Shortage

Georgia has had the same problem for years:

Georgia's Harsh Immigration Law Costs Millions in Unharvested Crops

Migrant workers still in need

"Crops went untended as the season's harvest began, and more than $1 million a day vanished as the human-fueled agricultural harvest machine of migrant labor in the United States stalled."

Ben Carson's Immigrant Visa Idea Favored By Farmers As Nation's Crops Rot

It's been an issue in Alabama for years as well and some say this is a problem nationwide (and has been for as long as the crackdowns have been going on):

Alabama Illegal Immigrant Crackdown Destroys Farm Business

Crops rot while Trump-led immigration backlash idles farm work

If they used the H2A visa, then there would be no problems for them, they would have all the labor they need since there are no annual caps for the H2A nor is there a limit to how many a single farmer can bring in.

 

[KissMy]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

The new Ford aircraft carrier was 13 billion dollars F.Y.I.

Edit my apologies misread your post ...yup it will cost 5 aircraft carriers , still cheaper then over 70 billion a year every year on illegals

That is a total LIE! Illegals don't get welfare! So we won't save a dime! Trump is throwing away $70 billion that we need to use to replace water & sewer lines.

We need to force Trump to stick to that $4 billion promise so we can cut down on the $2 Billion we spend on Border Patrol every year!

 

[Wyatt earp]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

The new Ford aircraft carrier was 13 billion dollars F.Y.I.

Edit my apologies misread your post ...yup it will cost 5 aircraft carriers , still cheaper then over 70 billion a year every year on illegals

That is a total LIE! Illegals don't get welfare! So we won't save a dime! Trump is throwing away $70 billion that we need to use to replace water & sewer lines.

ER cost, schooling cost, jail cost, low wages...it all adds up



Use your common sense and brains please and thank you

 

[Wyatt earp]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

The new Ford aircraft carrier was 13 billion dollars F.Y.I.

Edit my apologies misread your post ...yup it will cost 5 aircraft carriers , still cheaper then over 70 billion a year every year on illegals

That is a total LIE! Illegals don't get welfare! So we won't save a dime! Trump is throwing away $70 billion that we need to use to replace water & sewer lines.

Btw I thought Obama's 800 billion dollar stimulus was supposed to pay for that?

 

[Humorme]

Trump initially said he could build a wall for $4 billion & Mexico would pay for it.. It will only take a $Billion worth of concrete. How is it now suddenly $18 Billion for a down payment? They say it will cost $70 Billion when done. That is a complete outrage!!! That would buy 5 aircraft carriers! Mexico's GDP is only $1 Trillion.

This is like Bush / Cheney saying the $5 Trillion War would only cost $40 billion!

The new Ford aircraft carrier was 13 billion dollars F.Y.I.

Edit my apologies misread your post ...yup it will cost 5 aircraft carriers , still cheaper then over 70 billion a year every year on illegals

That is a total LIE! Illegals don't get welfare! So we won't save a dime! Trump is throwing away $70 billion that we need to use to replace water & sewer lines.

We need to force Trump to stick to that $4 billion promise so we can cut down on the $2 Billion we spend on Border Patrol every year!

The reality is that the math says the wall will cost more to build and maintain than any perceived savings. What is worse, it's not going to stop people from crossing the border.

Trump is a businessman, so why would he get involved in a financial clusterphuck that only hurts the working class and middle class? Well, how come his tax breaks were permanent for big business, but temporary for the workers?

We are only seeing business react to the temporary stimulus that Trump was able to seem to create (but that is an illusion.) Everything is looking good for the moment, but it will come at a price one day and the rich are arranging it so that the working class will pay for it.