Questions on Decriminalization/Legalization movement

[MarcATL]

As long as you do not have children or pets, there nothing prohibitive about smoking pot while confined. No going out in public while it's in your system. deadly force against a pot user is always acceptable.

Should that argument apply to consuming alcohol too? How about cigarettes and/or cigars?

There has to be a price paid for breaking the law.

It's not just about stabbing sprees, although more incidents would occur if pot was decriminalized/made legal. I personally don't know anyone harmed by schizophrenic, but I'm sure such cases exist. What about the burden on society from all the pot related car accidents? Don't you think legalizing pot lead to more of them?

I didn't even go into the degeneration of our youth...

Sure there should be a price to pay for breaking the law, but shouldn't we have SENSIBLE laws to begin with?

By your own admission you have no facts to back up your claims, why are you clinging to such bogus notions?

Can you PRODUCE any accidents that stemmed directly from pot use? Any at all!?!?

If so, please do.

If you can't, then that should tell you something.

 

[thanatos144]

so why are you avoiding my simple little question i asked you a while back?...

When did you stop beating your wife?

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You're evading my question also, thanatos. Do you seriously not grasp the difference between someone harming themselves and someone harming someone else? There no beating your wife component in that, there's only an are you seriously that clueless component to that.

Resume evading.

It is a non question because junkies don't just hurt themselves


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[thanatos144]

Of course pot is addictive! If it wasn't people wouldn't be smoking it all their fucking lives! I can't believe people don't see this. Maybe if you all put down the bong you will be able to think.

Are salt and pepper addictive? Is sugar addictive? Are milk and butter addictive?

Also, smoking marijuana is not the only way to enjoy it, nor is the best way. And if marijuana is legalized you will soon see plentiful evidence of that. Ingesting THC via the digestive system rather than via the lungs produces a less intense but more euphoric and much longer-lasting effect.

Edible marijuana products are presently available everywhere they are legal, such as medical marijuana dispensaries. In fact, if marijuana were legal smoking it would eventually be the least common means of enjoying it.

You should know that humans are not the only animals who enjoy the effects of marijuana. Here is just one example: How do i protect my outdoor grow from deer?

Only a fool doesn't think food isn't addictive

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[MarcATL]

It's not just about stabbing sprees, although more incidents would occur if pot was decriminalized/made legal. I personally don't know anyone harmed by schizophrenic, but I'm sure such cases exist.

I never said it's a non issue. I don't know where you got that from. The fact is Pot makes mentally unstable people more dangerous to society. It is a big issue in that regard.

If the # of accidents is to be our criteria on whether or not a substance should be illegal, are you willing to prohibit alcohol as well given that it is responsible for tens of thousands of deaths - far more than marijuana - each year from people behind the wheel?

If you're consistent, I can respect that

.

The whole point of smoking weed is to get high. A person can drink alcohol responsibly. It is true that there are a significant amount of alcohol and pot related automobile deaths. So is your plan to make things worse by legalizing weed and having more people drive stoned.

i dont know how many parties i went too were the people there were sitting in the living room smoking pot with maybe a beer or two or something else .....and how many Frat parties i went to where they had a Keg of Beer in the back and just about everyone was getting buzzed.....guess which one the cops got called too every time, because of the noise and sometimes because of the fights that broke out?.....

I'm not sure the difference in those scenarios was really pot versus alcohol though

i was sure Kaz.....at the one where there was a houseful of people sitting around smoking and casually drinking with some music on as compared to a Frat party with a nice big Keg in the back yard and everyone there filling their belly with beer and getting louder by the hour.....parties dominated by Alcohol get loud and sometimes violent and the Cops were always called by the neighbors....and there was always people under 21 too to make matters worse....

Common sense dictates that in the alcohol vs. weed parties, the alcoholic parties had worse results. Read often loud and/or violent where the cops had to be called.

Fact: Alcohol is an inhibitor

Fact: Weed is a tranquilizer

Get it?

 

[thanatos144]

I never said it's a non issue. I don't know where you got that from. The fact is Pot makes mentally unstable people more dangerous to society. It is a big issue in that regard.


.

The whole point of smoking weed is to get high. A person can drink alcohol responsibly. It is true that there are a significant amount of alcohol and pot related automobile deaths. So is your plan to make things worse by legalizing weed and having more people drive stoned.

I'm not sure the difference in those scenarios was really pot versus alcohol though

i was sure Kaz.....at the one where there was a houseful of people sitting around smoking and casually drinking with some music on as compared to a Frat party with a nice big Keg in the back yard and everyone there filling their belly with beer and getting louder by the hour.....parties dominated by Alcohol get loud and sometimes violent and the Cops were always called by the neighbors....and there was always people under 21 too to make matters worse....

Common sense dictates that in the alcohol vs. weed parties, the alcoholic parties had worse results. Read often loud and/or violent where the cops had to be called.

Fact: Alcohol is an inhibitor

Fact: Weed is a tranquilizer

Get it?

You act like they are different parties when in fact they're not

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[emilynghiem]

As long as you do not have children or pets, there nothing prohibitive about smoking pot while confined. No going out in public while it's in your system. deadly force against a pot user is always acceptable.

Should that argument apply to consuming alcohol too? How about cigarettes and/or cigars?

There has to be a price paid for breaking the law.

It's not just about stabbing sprees, although more incidents would occur if pot was decriminalized/made legal. I personally don't know anyone harmed by schizophrenic, but I'm sure such cases exist. What about the burden on society from all the pot related car accidents? Don't you think legalizing pot lead to more of them?

I didn't even go into the degeneration of our youth...

Sure there should be a price to pay for breaking the law, but shouldn't we have SENSIBLE laws to begin with?

By your own admission you have no facts to back up your claims, why are you clinging to such bogus notions?

Can you PRODUCE any accidents that stemmed directly from pot use? Any at all!?!?

If so, please do.

If you can't, then that should tell you something.

1. I read of a train wreck attributed to pot. and someone on USMB posted about knowing personally of a loss to a death from a car crash.

2. from my experience with people's perceptions and research, including msgs here, I don't find it productive to debate why people do or do not believe in dangers attributed to pot.

3. What I do find helpful is being equally accommodating of beliefs "either way" and not passing judgments on people just because they believe pot is harmful or not harmful.
And urging advocates to work toward a position on reform that DOES NOT RELY on proving or disproving it one way or another, but respects all views equally either for or against.

I agreed to let go my judgments of people who don't see harm or addiction with pot.
So I ask the same of others, not to judge people like me who are concerns with ill effects.

Can't we work toward a policy that INCLUDES correcting "any and all abuses across the board" and not making that the basis of arguments or conditions for or against legalization.

If all people AGREED that ALL abuses and addictions should be treated before they become dangerous, REGARDLESS which particular ones we believe to be more or less dangerous if at all to the public,
wouldn't that do more to resolve that argument so it doesn't have to get in the way of reforms?

 

[KevinWestern]

It is a non question because junkies don't just hurt themselves


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The act of smoking in the privacy of your own home is not harming anyone else.

Driving while intoxicated while high? That's illegal. Stealing while high? That's illegal. Stabbing while high? That's illegal. Raping while high? That's illegal.

Get the point?

 

[Katzndogz]

Drunks will sober up in a few hours. Pot stays in the system for weeks. If Trayvon Martin had not had his judgment impaired by pot he might be alive today.

 

[KevinWestern]

Drunks will sober up in a few hours. Pot stays in the system for weeks. If Trayvon Martin had not had his judgment impaired by pot he might be alive today.

Katz - the "high" lasts only an hour or two. It might be detectable in your system for weeks, but your thinking is certainly not altered for that long.

Come on, lol.

 

[ozro]

The chemical compounds that "drug tests" look for in regards to marijuana do not detect the chemical that makes one "high".

The most easily detectable cannaboid is cannabidol, that's what they look for.

Cannabidol is stored in fat tissues, and does not make a human "high".

As an aside;
Urine "drug tests" are wrong a third of the time. Additionally they are easily manipulated to "pass".

Drug testing was nothing more than a cheap trick by Reagan to create jobs. Just more parlour tricks...

 

[MarcATL]

1. I read of a train wreck attributed to pot. and someone on USMB posted about knowing personally of a loss to a death from a car crash.

2. from my experience with people's perceptions and research, including msgs here, I don't find it productive to debate why people do or do not believe in dangers attributed to pot.

3. What I do find helpful is being equally accommodating of beliefs "either way" and not passing judgments on people just because they believe pot is harmful or not harmful.
And urging advocates to work toward a position on reform that DOES NOT RELY on proving or disproving it one way or another, but respects all views equally either for or against.

I agreed to let go my judgments of people who don't see harm or addiction with pot.
So I ask the same of others, not to judge people like me who are concerns with ill effects.

Can't we work toward a policy that INCLUDES correcting "any and all abuses across the board" and not making that the basis of arguments or conditions for or against legalization.

If all people AGREED that ALL abuses and addictions should be treated before they become dangerous, REGARDLESS which particular ones we believe to be more or less dangerous if at all to the public,
wouldn't that do more to resolve that argument so it doesn't have to get in the way of reforms?

1. That's anecdotal at best, and the fact that it is, should also tell you (and others) something.

2. Actually, finding out the WHY of any issue is very productive as it leads to the motive/s of the arguer and gives insight into where they are coming from, and therefore how to engage them. Or even if engaging them makes sense.

3. We all make and pass judgments on others on almost a constant basis, it's just human nature. Respecting or not respecting the other's views isn't necessarily tied to judging them. It's tied mostly to their actual beliefs and how they came by them.

4. I'm not of the belief that weed is harmless, however, I'm not of the delusion that it's more harmful than alcohol, in fact, I believe that alcohol is THE gateway drug if any such a thing exists, and have caused way more harm to our society than anything I could think of. I just created a thread on finding out what are the benefits of it actually
(See: http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/346832-what-are-the-benefits-of-consuming-alcohol.html)

5. I'm not against policies that includes rectification, but not at the expense of waiting for that BEFORE we legalize.

6. I don't think anyone in this thread or any other have ever argued against any form of abuse NOT to be dangerous. However, it seems that some people, and I include yourself in that group, seem to be of the belief that weed, just by it's nature is automatically a such a dangerous drug that lends itself to the abuse you speak of. And, that being the case, I vehemently disagree with that position.

 

[Harry Dresden]

The whole point of smoking weed is to get high. A person can drink alcohol responsibly. It is true that there are a significant amount of alcohol and pot related automobile deaths. So is your plan to make things worse by legalizing weed and having more people drive stoned.

i was sure Kaz.....at the one where there was a houseful of people sitting around smoking and casually drinking with some music on as compared to a Frat party with a nice big Keg in the back yard and everyone there filling their belly with beer and getting louder by the hour.....parties dominated by Alcohol get loud and sometimes violent and the Cops were always called by the neighbors....and there was always people under 21 too to make matters worse....

Common sense dictates that in the alcohol vs. weed parties, the alcoholic parties had worse results. Read often loud and/or violent where the cops had to be called.

Fact: Alcohol is an inhibitor

Fact: Weed is a tranquilizer

Get it?

You act like they are different parties when in fact they're not

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how would you know? you have never been to a party that was mostly pot.....i doubt if you have ever seen a joint .....but i bet you sucked up that beer.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Drunks will sober up in a few hours. Pot stays in the system for weeks. If Trayvon Martin had not had his judgment impaired by pot he might be alive today.

oh geezus........Katz why dont you go talk about something you know about.....i dont know what that is....but you are pretty stupid when it comes to Pot....

 

[thanatos144]

Common sense dictates that in the alcohol vs. weed parties, the alcoholic parties had worse results. Read often loud and/or violent where the cops had to be called.

Fact: Alcohol is an inhibitor

Fact: Weed is a tranquilizer

Get it?

You act like they are different parties when in fact they're not

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how would you know? you have never been to a party that was mostly pot.....i doubt if you have ever seen a joint .....but i bet you sucked up that beer.....

Bunch of people getting high and eating doritoes is not a party.

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[MarcATL]

You act like they are different parties when in fact they're not

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how would you know? you have never been to a party that was mostly pot.....i doubt if you have ever seen a joint .....but i bet you sucked up that beer.....

Bunch of people getting high and eating doritoes is not a party.

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But a bunch of people talking loudly, behaving badly, and vomiting over one another is...?

 

[Rocko]

the whole point of smoking weed is to get high.

to say the whole point of using marijuana is to get "high" is technically erroneous and imparts a negative impression.

Marijuana is not a stimulant, so it doesn't make one "high." marijuana is a tranquilizer, which causes euphoric relaxation, which is a desirable, non-frivolous effect. Overdoing this effect produces the condition commonly known as being "stoned," or "baked."

a person can drink alcohol responsibly. It is true that there are a significant amount of alcohol and pot related automobile deaths. So is your plan to make things worse by legalizing weed and having more people drive stoned.

if marijuana is legalized are you going to run right out, buy some, smoke it, and get behind the wheel? Or do you think most others will?

Some will. But this inclination can be effectively limited with public education, which is the way cigarette smoking was substantially reduced without effecting a single arrest.

The way to solve all the problems presently associated with marijuana is to start telling the truth about it and educating the public with the facts.

Non-frivolous effect wtf?

 

[Rocko]

As long as you do not have children or pets, there nothing prohibitive about smoking pot while confined. No going out in public while it's in your system. deadly force against a pot user is always acceptable.

Doesn't it stay in your system for weeks?

you are not high for weeks Rocko.....you are not high even the next day.....Rock you ever smoke Pot?....or are you like Katz....clueless.....

I smoked a few times when I was younger. I laughed my ass off, but it wasn't for me..I've always been a health nut, my body is my temple and I respect my body too much to do something I know is bad for me.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I think the main point that I've learned from this thread is that there are people out there who know almost nothing about pot. Now, are those the people we should listen to when reviewing our legal policies on pot?

 

[Rocko]

I never said it's a non issue. I don't know where you got that from. The fact is Pot makes mentally unstable people more dangerous to society. It is a big issue in that regard.


.

The whole point of smoking weed is to get high. A person can drink alcohol responsibly. It is true that there are a significant amount of alcohol and pot related automobile deaths. So is your plan to make things worse by legalizing weed and having more people drive stoned.

Rock....why do guys come home from work and drink a few beers?......why do they drink watching a game?.....

Having a few isn't necessarily bad for you, as a matter of fact drinking two cups of red wine at night is good for the heart, some say. The fact is smoking any amount of pot, for anyone, is bad.

 

[Rocko]

First of all, if you stab someone and it's not self defense you're going to jail. There's already a law designed to prevent that. We don't need another "layer" of law.

As I mentioned, why am I - a hardworking, taxpaying American - not allowed to smoke marijuana in the comfort of my own home? Again, if I break the law while smoking I'll be content with going to jail. The laws still apply. But to smoke peacefully? Why is that prohibited?

The benefit from granting people like you the freedom to smoke a joint doesn't outweigh the harm caused to society by mentally ill people smoking. Besides smoking pot is bad for everyone. Yes it does have a few medicinal purposes, and should be used in those rare circumstances, but by in large it's harmful to everyone.

Rocko....would you be for banning Alcohol and Cigarettes because of the harmful effects they have on everyone?......

No, because can be consumed responsibly and cigarettes mainly only effect people who smoke and doesn't effect behavior the way weed does.