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You care about nothing but yourself. If you believe that these peoples who had the misfortune of living adjacent to the Soviet Union brought the oppression you wish for your own country on themselves, then you are obviously a low-life scumbag with serious intellectual and mental issues.[]We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?
I thought not.
I'm upset that 3000 Americans were killed on 9/11 by people that Reagan armed and aided.
And, no, I don't give a fuck about Poles, Czechs or anyone else, most of whom brought their misery on themselves. If they couldn't free themselves, it certainly wasn't our problem. And the eventual fall of the USSR had nothing to do with the assholes we armed in Afghanistan. The Communist puppet regime in Kabul outlasted the Berlin Wall and even the USSR.
I care about AMERICANS.
[]We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?
I thought not.
I'm upset that 3000 Americans were killed on 9/11 by people that Reagan armed and aided.
And, no, I don't give a fuck about Poles, Czechs or anyone else, most of whom brought their misery on themselves. If they couldn't free themselves, it certainly wasn't our problem. And the eventual fall of the USSR had nothing to do with the assholes we armed in Afghanistan. The Communist puppet regime in Kabul outlasted the Berlin Wall and even the USSR.
I care about AMERICANS.
We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?So what if some of the support Reagan provided the Pakistanis made its way to Bin Laden; war is a messy business, if one becomes paralyzed by fears of what will happen after the war you ends up losing the war. We fight one war at a time.
Or you recognize that in a fight, you are backing the wrong side.
We knew in 1979 the people we were backing in Afghanistan weren't Jeffersonian democrats, they were Islamic fanatics who hated ALL modernity and westernization. They weren't fighting the Soviets because they "hated communism and loved freedom", they were fighting the Soviets because they were bringing in modernity and teaching girls how to read.
And we armed these nutjobs anyway, and as a result, bin Laden became a hero to that MINORITY of Muslims who cling to the 11th century.
But dammit, we were beating communism, and that was the important thing. And so what if the USSR is now dozens of squabbling countries today like the Ukraine that are undergoing constant civil war, that's a lot better than a single partner we could do business with.
I thought not.
We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?Or you recognize that in a fight, you are backing the wrong side.
We knew in 1979 the people we were backing in Afghanistan weren't Jeffersonian democrats, they were Islamic fanatics who hated ALL modernity and westernization. They weren't fighting the Soviets because they "hated communism and loved freedom", they were fighting the Soviets because they were bringing in modernity and teaching girls how to read.
And we armed these nutjobs anyway, and as a result, bin Laden became a hero to that MINORITY of Muslims who cling to the 11th century.
But dammit, we were beating communism, and that was the important thing. And so what if the USSR is now dozens of squabbling countries today like the Ukraine that are undergoing constant civil war, that's a lot better than a single partner we could do business with.
I thought not.
That troll constantly says that Reagan funded Al Qaeda. He's just a liar.
Osama bin Laden explained the origin of the term in a videotaped interview with Al Jazeera (journalist) Tayseer Alouni in October 2001: "The name 'al-Qaeda' was established a long time ago by mere chance. The late Abu Ebeida El-Banashiri established the training camps for our mujahedeen against Russia's terrorism. We used to call the training camp al-Qaeda. The name stayed."
"A variety of sources — CNN journalist Peter Bergen, Pakistani ISI Brigadier Mohammad Yousaf, and CIA operatives involved in the Afghan program, such as Vincent Cannistraro — deny that the CIA or other American officials had contact with the Afghan Arabs (foreign mujahideen) or Bin Laden, let alone armed, trained, coached or indoctrinated them."
"But Bergen and others argue that there was no need to recruit foreigners unfamiliar with the local language, customs or lay of the land since there were a quarter of a million local Afghans willing to fight; that Arab Afghans themselves had no need for American funds since they received several hundred million dollars a year from non-American, Muslim sources; that Americans could not have trained mujahideen because Pakistani officials would not allow more than a handful of them to operate in Pakistan and none in Afghanistan; and that the Afghan Arabs were almost invariably militant Islamists reflexively hostile to Westerners whether or not the Westerners were helping the Muslim Afghans."
"According to Peter Bergen, known for conducting the first television interview with Osama bin Laden in 1997, the idea that "the CIA funded bin Laden or trained bin Laden ... a folk myth. There's no evidence of this. ... Bin Laden had his own money, he was anti-American and he was operating secretly and independently. ... The real story here is the CIA didn't really have a clue about who this guy was until 1996 when they set up a unit to really start tracking him."
Osama was of the ARAB-Afghans. ie. Of the foreign Arabs who showed up in Afghan to help out the local Muslim Afghans fighting against the USSR. This conflict is not over either. It now continues in Chechnya for offensive jihad-build-up purposes."
We did not train, fund, or materielize a young Osama bin laden. - Reader comments for The Investigative Project on Terrorism
Liberals hate Reagan for liberating Eastern Europe from Soviet Communism which to them is their Mecca Oz and Nirvana all at once. Think of it, a life where you have no freedom and the government tells you who you are and what you'll do 24/7/365
Sent from my Chinese Supercomputer made from XBox parts Bush sent to China
You care about nothing but yourself. If you believe that these peoples who had the misfortune of living adjacent to the Soviet Union brought the oppression you wish for your own country on themselves, then you are obviously a low-life scumbag with serious intellectual and mental issues.[]We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?
I thought not.
I'm upset that 3000 Americans were killed on 9/11 by people that Reagan armed and aided.
And, no, I don't give a fuck about Poles, Czechs or anyone else, most of whom brought their misery on themselves. If they couldn't free themselves, it certainly wasn't our problem. And the eventual fall of the USSR had nothing to do with the assholes we armed in Afghanistan. The Communist puppet regime in Kabul outlasted the Berlin Wall and even the USSR.
I care about AMERICANS.
But then we already knew that.
the mujahideen was waging war; BACKED BY US BEFORE REAGAN TOOK OFFICE; and the Taliban DIDNT EXIST UNTIL THE CLINTON YEARS.
libs are losers who lie to themselves
Joe get over it. Reagan showed that communists like you are failures
tapatalk post
Joe get over it. Reagan showed that communists like you are failures
tapatalk post
Reagan put the Maytag Man on the unemployment line.
George Will
1988: Reagan Abandoned, Mocked by Hardline Conservatives
Edit event
As the end of President Reagan’s final term approaches, conservatives and hardliners have radically changed their view of him. They originally saw him as one of their own—a crusader for good against evil, obstinately opposed to communism in general and to any sort of arms reduction agreement with the Soviet Union in specific. But recent events—Reagan’s recent moderation in rhetoric towards the Soviets (see December 1983 and After), the summits with Soviet Premier Mikhail Gorbachev (see November 16-19, 1985 and October 11-12, 1986), and the recent arms treaties with the Soviets (see Early 1985 and December 7-8, 1987) have soured them on Reagan.
Hardliners had once held considerable power in the Reagan administration (see January 1981 and After and Early 1981 and After), but their influence has steadily waned, and their attempts to sabotage and undermine arms control negotiations...Attempts by administration hardliners to get “soft” officials such as Secretary of State George Shultz fired do not succeed. Conservative pundits such as George Will and William Safire lambast Reagan, with Will accusing him of “moral disarmament” and Safire mocking Reagan’s rapport with Gorbachev: “He professed to see in Mr. Gorbachev’s eyes an end to the Soviet goal of world domination.”
It will not be until after the collapse of the Soviet Union and the tearing down of the Berlin Wall (see November 9, 1989 and After) that conservatives will revise their opinion of Reagan, in the process revising much of history in the process. [Scoblic, 2008, pp. 143-145]
December 7-8, 1987: Reagan, Gorbachev Sign Arms Reduction Treaty
Edit event
Gorbachev and Reagan sign the INF treaty...Altogether, some 80 percent of Americans support the treaty.
Unable to Continue Longer-Range Negotiations - Reagan wants to build on the INF agreement to reopen the similarly moribund START negotiations (see May 1982 and After), but recognizes that there is not enough time left in his administration to accomplish such a long-term goal. Instead, he celebrates his status as the first American president to begin reducing nuclear arms by scheduling a visit to the Soviet Union.
Conservative Opposition - Hardline conservatives protest Gorbachev’s visit to Washington, and the signing of the treaty, in the strongest possible terms. When Reagan suggests that Gorbachev address a joint session of Congress, Congressional Republicans, led by House member Dick Cheney (R-WY—see 1983), rebel. Cheney says: “Addressing a joint meeting of Congress is a high honor, one of the highest honors we can accord anyone. Given the fact of continuing Soviet aggression in Afghanistan, Soviet repression in Eastern Europe, and Soviet actions in Africa and Central America, it is totally inappropriate to confer this honor upon Gorbachev. He is an adversary, not an ally.”
Conservative Paul Weyrich of the Free Congress Committee is more blunt in his assessment of the treaty agreement: “Reagan is a weakened president, weakened in spirit as well as in clout, and not in a position to make judgments about Gorbachev at this time.” Conservative pundit William F. Buckley calls the treaty a “suicide pact.”
Fellow conservative pundit George Will calls Reagan “wildly wrong” in his dealings with the Soviets. Conservatives gather to bemoan what they call “summit fever,” accusing Reagan of “appeasement” both of communists and of Congressional liberals, and protesting Reagan’s “cutting deals with the evil empire” (see March 8, 1983). They mount a letter-writing campaign, generating some 300,000 letters, and launch a newspaper ad campaign that compares Reagan to former British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain. Senators Jesse Helms (R-NC) and Steven Symms (R-ID) try to undercut the treaty by attempting to add amendments that would make the treaty untenable; Helms will lead a filibuster against the treaty as well.
Senate Ratification and a Presidential Rebuke - All the protests from hardline opponents of the treaty...
...
[Scoblic, 2008, pp. 142-145]
We understand that you're upset, especially with Reagan, about your defeat in the Cold War, but have you ever thought to consider the plight of the Poles, Czechs and the host of others who were oppressed by your comrades?
I thought not.
That troll constantly says that Reagan funded Al Qaeda. He's just a liar.
Osama bin Laden explained the origin of the term in a videotaped interview with Al Jazeera (journalist) Tayseer Alouni in October 2001: "The name 'al-Qaeda' was established a long time ago by mere chance. The late Abu Ebeida El-Banashiri established the training camps for our mujahedeen against Russia's terrorism. We used to call the training camp al-Qaeda. The name stayed."
"A variety of sources CNN journalist Peter Bergen, Pakistani ISI Brigadier Mohammad Yousaf, and CIA operatives involved in the Afghan program, such as Vincent Cannistraro deny that the CIA or other American officials had contact with the Afghan Arabs (foreign mujahideen) or Bin Laden, let alone armed, trained, coached or indoctrinated them."
"But Bergen and others argue that there was no need to recruit foreigners unfamiliar with the local language, customs or lay of the land since there were a quarter of a million local Afghans willing to fight; that Arab Afghans themselves had no need for American funds since they received several hundred million dollars a year from non-American, Muslim sources; that Americans could not have trained mujahideen because Pakistani officials would not allow more than a handful of them to operate in Pakistan and none in Afghanistan; and that the Afghan Arabs were almost invariably militant Islamists reflexively hostile to Westerners whether or not the Westerners were helping the Muslim Afghans."
"According to Peter Bergen, known for conducting the first television interview with Osama bin Laden in 1997, the idea that "the CIA funded bin Laden or trained bin Laden ... a folk myth. There's no evidence of this. ... Bin Laden had his own money, he was anti-American and he was operating secretly and independently. ... The real story here is the CIA didn't really have a clue about who this guy was until 1996 when they set up a unit to really start tracking him."
Osama was of the ARAB-Afghans. ie. Of the foreign Arabs who showed up in Afghan to help out the local Muslim Afghans fighting against the USSR. This conflict is not over either. It now continues in Chechnya for offensive jihad-build-up purposes."
We did not train, fund, or materielize a young Osama bin laden. - Reader comments for The Investigative Project on Terrorism
Um, your proof and evidence to call somebody a lying fuck is just a comment made by a person making a comment at another site. Just like we do here. And if you read the whole page you will find some pretty harsh and negative stuff about Reagan.
That troll constantly says that Reagan funded Al Qaeda. He's just a liar.
Osama bin Laden explained the origin of the term in a videotaped interview with Al Jazeera (journalist) Tayseer Alouni in October 2001: "The name 'al-Qaeda' was established a long time ago by mere chance. The late Abu Ebeida El-Banashiri established the training camps for our mujahedeen against Russia's terrorism. We used to call the training camp al-Qaeda. The name stayed."
"A variety of sources — CNN journalist Peter Bergen, Pakistani ISI Brigadier Mohammad Yousaf, and CIA operatives involved in the Afghan program, such as Vincent Cannistraro — deny that the CIA or other American officials had contact with the Afghan Arabs (foreign mujahideen) or Bin Laden, let alone armed, trained, coached or indoctrinated them."
"But Bergen and others argue that there was no need to recruit foreigners unfamiliar with the local language, customs or lay of the land since there were a quarter of a million local Afghans willing to fight; that Arab Afghans themselves had no need for American funds since they received several hundred million dollars a year from non-American, Muslim sources; that Americans could not have trained mujahideen because Pakistani officials would not allow more than a handful of them to operate in Pakistan and none in Afghanistan; and that the Afghan Arabs were almost invariably militant Islamists reflexively hostile to Westerners whether or not the Westerners were helping the Muslim Afghans."
"According to Peter Bergen, known for conducting the first television interview with Osama bin Laden in 1997, the idea that "the CIA funded bin Laden or trained bin Laden ... a folk myth. There's no evidence of this. ... Bin Laden had his own money, he was anti-American and he was operating secretly and independently. ... The real story here is the CIA didn't really have a clue about who this guy was until 1996 when they set up a unit to really start tracking him."
Osama was of the ARAB-Afghans. ie. Of the foreign Arabs who showed up in Afghan to help out the local Muslim Afghans fighting against the USSR. This conflict is not over either. It now continues in Chechnya for offensive jihad-build-up purposes."
We did not train, fund, or materielize a young Osama bin laden. - Reader comments for The Investigative Project on Terrorism
Um, your proof and evidence to call somebody a lying fuck is just a comment made by a person making a comment at another site. Just like we do here. And if you read the whole page you will find some pretty harsh and negative stuff about Reagan.
Wow, are you REALLY so ignorant that you can't see the comment from Peter Bergin, an acknowledged expert on the subject? Why are you posting?
Um, your proof and evidence to call somebody a lying fuck is just a comment made by a person making a comment at another site. Just like we do here. And if you read the whole page you will find some pretty harsh and negative stuff about Reagan.
Wow, are you REALLY so ignorant that you can't see the comment from Peter Bergin, an acknowledged expert on the subject? Why are you posting?
Many Muslims from other countries assisted the various mujahideen groups in Afghanistan. Some groups of these veterans became significant players in later conflicts in and around the Muslim world. Osama bin Laden, originally from a wealthy family in Saudi Arabia, was a prominent organizer and financier of an all-Arab Islamist group of foreign volunteers; his Maktab al-Khadamat funnelled money, arms, and Muslim fighters from around the Muslim world into Afghanistan, with the assistance and support of the Saudi and Pakistani governments.[39] These foreign fighters became known as "Afghan Arabs" and their efforts were coordinated by Abdullah Yusuf Azzam.
Mujahideen forces caused serious casualties to the Soviet forces, and made the war very costly for the Soviet Union. In 1989 the Soviet Union withdrew its forces from Afghanistan. Many districts and cities then fell to the mujahideen; in 1992 the DRA's last president, Mohammad Najibullah, was overthrown. - Mujahideen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
On 3 July 1979, Carter signed a presidential finding authorizing funding for anticommunist guerrillas in Afghanistan.[2] Following the Soviet intervention in Afghanistan in December Operation Storm-333 and installation of a more pro-Soviet president, Babrak Karmal, Carter announced, "The Soviet invasion of Afghanistan is the greatest threat to peace since the Second World War".[12]
President Reagan greatly expanded the program as part of the Reagan Doctrine of aiding anti-Soviet resistance movements abroad. To execute this policy, Reagan deployed CIA Special Activities Division paramilitary officers to equip the Mujihadeen forces against the Red Army. Although the CIA and Texas Congressman Charlie Wilson have received the most attention for their roles, the key architect of the strategy was Michael G. Vickers, a young CIA paramilitary officer working for Gust Avrakotos, the CIA's regional head who had a close relationship with Wilson. Vicker's strategy was to use a broad mix of weapons, tactics, logistics, along with training programs, to enhance the rebels' ability to fight a guerilla war against the Soviets.
[13][14] Reagan's program assisted in ending the Soviet's occupation in Afghanistan.[15][16] A Pentagon senior official, Michael Pillsbury, successfully advocated providing Stinger missiles to the Afghan resistance, according to recent books and academic articles.[17]
The program relied heavily on the Pakistani President Mohammad Zia ul-Haq, who had a close relationship with Wilson. His Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) was an intermediary for funds distribution, passing of weapons, military training and financial support to Afghan resistance groups.[18] Along with funding from similar programs from Britain's MI6 and SAS, Saudi Arabia, and the People's Republic of China,[19] the ISI armed and trained over 100,000 insurgents between 1978 and 1992[citation needed]. They encouraged the volunteers from the Arab states to join the Afghan resistance in its struggle against the Soviet troops based in Afghanistan.[18]
According to Peter Bergen, writing in Holy War, Inc., no Americans trained or had direct contact with the mujahideen.[20] The skittish CIA had fewer than 10 operatives in the region because it "feared it would be blamed, like in Guatemala".[21] Civilian personnel from the U.S. Department of State and the CIA frequently visited the Afghanistan-Pakistan border area during this time, and the US contributed generously to aiding Afghan refugees.
The U.S.-built Stinger antiaircraft missile, supplied to the mujahideen in very large numbers beginning in 1986, struck a decisive blow to the Soviet war effort as it allowed the lightly armed Afghans to effectively defend against Soviet helicopter landings in strategic areas. The Stingers were so renowned and deadly that, in the 1990s, the U.S. conducted a "buy-back" program to keep unused missiles from falling into the hands of anti-American terrorists. This program may have been covertly renewed following the U.S. intervention in Afghanistan in late 2001, out of fear that remaining Stingers could be used against U.S. forces in the country.[22] - Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"No Americans trained or had direct contact with the mujahideen"
Nothing is as black and white as you people try and portray it -- plausible deniability
