Republicns You're Foolish Rejectin Th Demcrat Deal On Corporat Taxes!

JimofPennsylvan

Platinum Member
Jun 6, 2007
862
506
Republicans ought to pursue the deal President Obama and the Democrats are offering on reforming the corporate tax code, if the terms are set right it isn't a bad deal and most importantly it helps America a lot! This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending. Republicans this is why it is a good deal and it is not because it will create a lot of infrastructure construction jobs this writer is with you the Federal government has to get out of the job creation business because their terrible at it they waste too much money the 2009 stimulus legislation is a perfect example and it would still be a good deal even if the unemployment rate was five and a half percent or lower; it is a good deal because across the nation states need money to spend on road and bridge construction and public transportation. In states across the country the government is woefully failing in its duty to maintain and build needed roads, bridges and public transportation!


This writer is from southeastern Pennsylvania so I am well familiar with the states of Pennsylvania and New Jersey and the public in my community is inundated with news reports how these states aren't and don't know how to fulfill their transportation infrastructure needs. Maybe I am wrong but my sense of things is that this need exists across the nation and state capitols from coast to coast are loath to raise taxes because their publics don't want it. This corporate tax code deal is the magic elixir that gets this country out of this transportation infrastructure crisis for the next decade! On a related note Congressman Gerlach, Meehan, Fitzpatrick, LoBiondo and Pitts you're from my region you know crystal clearly of your district's "desperate" transportation infrastructure needs; you are derelict in your duty as Congressional representatives in not coming out in favor of this deal which could bring crucial help for this problem, you're all acting like a bunch of bums!


Let's look at why the Republicans are against this deal. They want to lower the "top" personal income tax rates with the corporate tax rate because they say a lot of small business declare their income and pay taxes under the personal income tax code so it would be unfair to lower income taxes for corporate businesses and not non-corporate businesses. This is a very immature and unwise stance this position that let us not help a huge number of people unless we can help everyone is so small minded help these corporate businesses now and fix the small businesses tax problem later. Plus not only do we help corporate tax filers with this deal this change would incentivize these businesses to create jobs in the U.S. instead of outside the U.S. so a lot of ancillary benefits would fall to many ordinary Americans as a result of this change because they would receive the benefit of a job! Further, reform of the corporate tax code will likely significantly lower the tax rate on foreign earned profits which currently gets parked by corporations outside the U.S. to avoid paying taxes on this money this change will result in these foreign profits returning to the U.S. and creating economic activity in the U.S. a valuable benefit.


Further, you Republicans against this deal are missing an opportunity to help small businesses compared to the situation as it exists today. By this I mean, these small businesses that pay under the individual tax code pay high tax rates on "all" their income if the corporate tax code was changed as the Democrats offer than a small business owner will be able to shield some of his profits from the full force of federal taxation and use it to build his business and prosper! For example, let us say a small business owner who pays taxes under the individual tax code has a net income of $475,000.00 today that filer has to subject that whole amount of money to the full force of the federal individual income tax rates. If the tax code was changed as proposed by the Democrats this small business owner could reorganize as a corporation and pay his taxes under the corporate tax code he could pay 223,000 of the 475K as a salary to himself which would require him to pay individual income tax rates on this money. But this is the kicker he could leave the $252,000 in the corporation not pay it to himself as a dividend and save quite a lot of money which he could reinvest in the business. This is so because under the change the business owner would only pay a tax rate of 28%, the new corporate tax rate, on these monies where if he declared everything under the individual tax code he would pay 33% on the first 176 K and 35% on the next $51,000 and 39.6 on the next $25,000. President Obama is never going to agree to lower the top tax on the wealthy from 39.6 % which he just achieved this year so at the earliest assuming the Republicans win the White House in 2016 is they can lower all rates in 2017 if they take this Democrat they can in the interim help small business as described otherwise they get nothing for these businesses, this is basic common sense Republicans take the deal it helps the people you want to help!


Lastly, the Republicans rationale for rejecting this deal has real shortcomings their rationale is that it doesn't help small businesses that file under the individual income tax code, most of these taxpayers are wealthy Americans. For taxpayers making under $100,000 per year which is the majority of citizens in America it is hard to feel sympathy for these taxpayers when we are struggling so financially; it isn't good politics Republicans to be so identified as champions for the wealthy in America! On a little different topic, why don't the Republicans in this deal only agree to divert the extra revenue created by closing the corporate tax loopholes not going to reducing rates for transportation infrastructure spending for "ten" years that way when they hopefully get the White House in 2016 they can then pass legislation diverting these monies coming in after ten years to lowering individual tax rates in 2023, that way they are achieving their goal it is just not at the ideal time table and in the grand scheme of things ten years isn't a big deal!
 
This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending.

Why does this "deal" require a bribe? If the Democrats acknowledge that reforming the corporate tax code is the right thing to do for the economy (I agree) why does it need to be conditioned on additional spending programs? Why not just do it because it's the right thing to do and any additional revenue be used for deficit reduction? I don't think the Republicans are acting any more mature on this "deal" since they are adding conditions of their own.

To me this is just another example of our politics getting in the way of doing what is proper and just, I think the American People should be the adult in the room and just tell BOTH parties to do the right thing sans the bribery.
 
At least refund our science programs back to 2010 levels. Something's shouldn't of been cut with that cluster fuck.

Cutting the corporate is a good idea.
 
Republicans ought to pursue the deal President Obama and the Democrats are offering on reforming the corporate tax code

Have I got a deal for you! No one would lie and say that, would they?

The "deal" is a death trap with what it does to our companies competitiveness in foreign markets and regarding capital gains taxes. If it's from Obama, Reid and Pelosi, you know it's pfishing...
 
At least refund our science programs back to 2010 levels. Something's shouldn't of been cut with that cluster fuck.

Cutting the corporate is a good idea.

Why not just leave R&D to the private sector? After all the private sector has a FAR better track record of efficiently allocating R&D resources than federal government does. Remember in order to fund a government "program" the money must first be extracted from the productive economy.
 
I still dont get why small companys have to pay 40% WTF is all that about? any one know?
 
I still dont get why small companys have to pay 40% WTF is all that about? any one know?

IMHO it's at least partially the result of the fact that small companies don't have the resources to buy influence (or legions of accountants and lawyers), thus they are essentially defenseless against the manipulation of the tax & regulatory regime which is essentially being written by their larger competitors that do. The whole point of the exercise is that if you are a big corporation (or special interest group) with deep pockets and strong political connections why not use them to write the rules in a way that you can wield government as a club to keep the little guy from being able to compete with you, saves all the trouble of building a better mouse trap.

The bright side is that even in an environment as twisted as this one, despite the odds, the little guy sometimes does win (a testament to the American Entrepreneur?), but alas too often they then grow up one to become just another of the gub'mint club wielding big bullies.
 
Republicans ought to pursue the deal President Obama and the Democrats are offering on reforming the corporate tax code, if the terms are set right it isn't a bad deal and most importantly it helps America a lot! This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending. Republicans this is why it is a good deal and it is not because it will create a lot of infrastructure construction jobs this writer is with you the Federal government has to get out of the job creation business because their terrible at it they waste too much money the 2009 stimulus legislation is a perfect example and it would still be a good deal even if the unemployment rate was five and a half percent or lower; it is a good deal because across the nation states need money to spend on road and bridge construction and public transportation. In states across the country the government is woefully failing in its duty to maintain and build needed roads, bridges and public transportation!


This writer is from southeastern Pennsylvania so I am well familiar with the states of Pennsylvania and New Jersey and the public in my community is inundated with news reports how these states aren't and don't know how to fulfill their transportation infrastructure needs. Maybe I am wrong but my sense of things is that this need exists across the nation and state capitols from coast to coast are loath to raise taxes because their publics don't want it. This corporate tax code deal is the magic elixir that gets this country out of this transportation infrastructure crisis for the next decade! On a related note Congressman Gerlach, Meehan, Fitzpatrick, LoBiondo and Pitts you're from my region you know crystal clearly of your district's "desperate" transportation infrastructure needs; you are derelict in your duty as Congressional representatives in not coming out in favor of this deal which could bring crucial help for this problem, you're all acting like a bunch of bums!


Let's look at why the Republicans are against this deal. They want to lower the "top" personal income tax rates with the corporate tax rate because they say a lot of small business declare their income and pay taxes under the personal income tax code so it would be unfair to lower income taxes for corporate businesses and not non-corporate businesses. This is a very immature and unwise stance this position that let us not help a huge number of people unless we can help everyone is so small minded help these corporate businesses now and fix the small businesses tax problem later. Plus not only do we help corporate tax filers with this deal this change would incentivize these businesses to create jobs in the U.S. instead of outside the U.S. so a lot of ancillary benefits would fall to many ordinary Americans as a result of this change because they would receive the benefit of a job! Further, reform of the corporate tax code will likely significantly lower the tax rate on foreign earned profits which currently gets parked by corporations outside the U.S. to avoid paying taxes on this money this change will result in these foreign profits returning to the U.S. and creating economic activity in the U.S. a valuable benefit.


Further, you Republicans against this deal are missing an opportunity to help small businesses compared to the situation as it exists today. By this I mean, these small businesses that pay under the individual tax code pay high tax rates on "all" their income if the corporate tax code was changed as the Democrats offer than a small business owner will be able to shield some of his profits from the full force of federal taxation and use it to build his business and prosper! For example, let us say a small business owner who pays taxes under the individual tax code has a net income of $475,000.00 today that filer has to subject that whole amount of money to the full force of the federal individual income tax rates. If the tax code was changed as proposed by the Democrats this small business owner could reorganize as a corporation and pay his taxes under the corporate tax code he could pay 223,000 of the 475K as a salary to himself which would require him to pay individual income tax rates on this money. But this is the kicker he could leave the $252,000 in the corporation not pay it to himself as a dividend and save quite a lot of money which he could reinvest in the business. This is so because under the change the business owner would only pay a tax rate of 28%, the new corporate tax rate, on these monies where if he declared everything under the individual tax code he would pay 33% on the first 176 K and 35% on the next $51,000 and 39.6 on the next $25,000. President Obama is never going to agree to lower the top tax on the wealthy from 39.6 % which he just achieved this year so at the earliest assuming the Republicans win the White House in 2016 is they can lower all rates in 2017 if they take this Democrat they can in the interim help small business as described otherwise they get nothing for these businesses, this is basic common sense Republicans take the deal it helps the people you want to help!


Lastly, the Republicans rationale for rejecting this deal has real shortcomings their rationale is that it doesn't help small businesses that file under the individual income tax code, most of these taxpayers are wealthy Americans. For taxpayers making under $100,000 per year which is the majority of citizens in America it is hard to feel sympathy for these taxpayers when we are struggling so financially; it isn't good politics Republicans to be so identified as champions for the wealthy in America! On a little different topic, why don't the Republicans in this deal only agree to divert the extra revenue created by closing the corporate tax loopholes not going to reducing rates for transportation infrastructure spending for "ten" years that way when they hopefully get the White House in 2016 they can then pass legislation diverting these monies coming in after ten years to lowering individual tax rates in 2023, that way they are achieving their goal it is just not at the ideal time table and in the grand scheme of things ten years isn't a big deal!

If I am going to read all that, I better be getting paid. :cool:
 
This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending.

Why does this "deal" require a bribe? If the Democrats acknowledge that reforming the corporate tax code is the right thing to do for the economy (I agree) why does it need to be conditioned on additional spending programs? Why not just do it because it's the right thing to do and any additional revenue be used for deficit reduction? I don't think the Republicans are acting any more mature on this "deal" since they are adding conditions of their own.

To me this is just another example of our politics getting in the way of doing what is proper and just, I think the American People should be the adult in the room and just tell BOTH parties to do the right thing sans the bribery.

A tax loophole, deduction, credit is also a bribe. Closing them means the special interests who paid campaign money to their pet Congress critter to put that loophole in the tax code for them will cut off funds to their pet if that loophole goes away.

That's why their pets are opposing the closing of the loopholes.

We need to ban all tax expenditures for this very reason. Take away the ability to give a special interest a tax break, you eliminate a lot of the rampant, wide open corruption we have in our American Politboro today.
 
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I still dont get why small companys have to pay 40% WTF is all that about? any one know?

IMHO it's at least partially the result of the fact that small companies don't have the resources to buy influence (or legions of accountants and lawyers), thus they are essentially defenseless against the manipulation of the tax & regulatory regime which is essentially being written by their larger competitors that do. The whole point of the exercise is that if you are a big corporation (or special interest group) with deep pockets and strong political connections why not use them to write the rules in a way that you can wield government as a club to keep the little guy from being able to compete with you, saves all the trouble of building a better mouse trap.

The bright side is that even in an environment as twisted as this one, despite the odds, the little guy sometimes does win (a testament to the American Entrepreneur?), but alas too often they then grow up one to become just another of the gub'mint club wielding big bullies.

See what is weird is like 50%? of all companys in the USA is small bussiness, how come Obama is not smart enough to figure that out? Hell I thought he was for the workers? guess he is just for big bussiness/wall street and the poor. He sucks more every day...
 
The solutions to our problems are very simple. But the Democrats and Republicans screw it all up by adding riders to the solutions.

In this case, the Democrats want to close loopholes. Great! That is the simplest and best solution. But then the Democrats screw it all up by wanting to add extra spending to the extra revenues such a solution would generate. The Republicans screw it all up by demanding it be revenue neutral.

Screw that. Close the loopholes, lower the tax rate a little, use any extra revenues remaining to pay down the debt.
 
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I still dont get why small companys have to pay 40% WTF is all that about? any one know?

IMHO it's at least partially the result of the fact that small companies don't have the resources to buy influence (or legions of accountants and lawyers), thus they are essentially defenseless against the manipulation of the tax & regulatory regime which is essentially being written by their larger competitors that do. The whole point of the exercise is that if you are a big corporation (or special interest group) with deep pockets and strong political connections why not use them to write the rules in a way that you can wield government as a club to keep the little guy from being able to compete with you, saves all the trouble of building a better mouse trap.

The bright side is that even in an environment as twisted as this one, despite the odds, the little guy sometimes does win (a testament to the American Entrepreneur?), but alas too often they then grow up one to become just another of the gub'mint club wielding big bullies.

See what is weird is like 50%? of all companys in the USA is small bussiness, how come Obama is not smart enough to figure that out? Hell I thought he was for the workers? guess he is just for big bussiness/wall street and the poor. He sucks more every day...

President Obama is well aware of the scope of small business and he's not unique in the way he treats them, it's not a Democrat or Republican thing, it's a both parties do it thing. It all boils down to who stuffs the most greenbacks in the kitty come campaign time. Small business does fight back somewhat (Chamber of Commerce) but they're still bringing knives to a gunfight when it comes to going up against the giant multi-nationals, banks, labor unions, etc..,
 
A tax loophole, deduction, credit is also a bribe. Closing them means the special interests who paid campaign money to their pet Congress critter to put that loophole in the tax code for them will cut off funds to their pet if that loophole goes away.

That's why their pets are opposing the closing of the loopholes.
Completely agree, it is a bribe along with a healthy dose of social engineering (in most cases).


We need to ban all tax expenditures for this very reason. Take away the ability to give a special interest a tax break, you eliminate a lot of the rampant, wide open corruption we have in our American Politboro today.
I Agree on your proposal with respect to taking away the ability to give a special interest a tax break but I object to the term tax expenditure since it operates on the assumption that the money belonged to government in the first place and that they are somehow being benevolent in allowing the people that earned to keep it, lets call this practice by it's real name TAX FAVORITISM.
 
This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending.

Why does this "deal" require a bribe? If the Democrats acknowledge that reforming the corporate tax code is the right thing to do for the economy (I agree) why does it need to be conditioned on additional spending programs? Why not just do it because it's the right thing to do and any additional revenue be used for deficit reduction? I don't think the Republicans are acting any more mature on this "deal" since they are adding conditions of their own.

To me this is just another example of our politics getting in the way of doing what is proper and just, I think the American People should be the adult in the room and just tell BOTH parties to do the right thing sans the bribery.
All legislation is the result of deal making. First the congressmen must make deals with the lobbyist that support them. Then deals are made within the party. Finally deals have to be made with the opposition. This is why most legislation is filled with pork, overly long, and contains ambiguous sections that will require regulations and interpretation by the courts.
 
This is the Democrat deal that they will agree to close loopholes in the corporate tax code to lower overall corporate tax rates to 28% for non-manufacturing corporations and 25% for manufacturing corporations as long as the closing of loopholes generates significant revenue that will be used on infrastructure spending.

Why does this "deal" require a bribe? If the Democrats acknowledge that reforming the corporate tax code is the right thing to do for the economy (I agree) why does it need to be conditioned on additional spending programs? Why not just do it because it's the right thing to do and any additional revenue be used for deficit reduction? I don't think the Republicans are acting any more mature on this "deal" since they are adding conditions of their own.

To me this is just another example of our politics getting in the way of doing what is proper and just, I think the American People should be the adult in the room and just tell BOTH parties to do the right thing sans the bribery.
All legislation is the result of deal making. First the congressmen must make deals with the lobbyist that support them. Then deals are made within the party. Finally deals have to be made with the opposition. This is why most legislation is filled with pork, overly long, and contains ambiguous sections that will require regulations and interpretation by the courts.

Agreed, however many people seem to think that just because it's "business as usual" that it's moral, just and rational. Personally I don't know how politicians can stand the sight of themselves in the mirror, one suspects that like the vampires they resemble so closely in methods & practices that they cast no reflection.
 
I still dont get why small companys have to pay 40% WTF is all that about? any one know?
Corporate taxes need to come down; both sides agree on this. The debate is going to be about the various writeoffs. A serious effort to revise the code to simply these tax writeoffs would greatly benefit small businesses.
 

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