Rightwingers: what do you think of Bernie's plan for free tuition?

[BluesLegend]

This is a perfect example of why we need a guy 'like' Trump who can negotiate deals. There is a deal to be made here on funding college education but it would be a complex deal requiring protections to keep the damn politicians hands off it. Look politicians are corrupt and they corrupt programs, that seems to be their damn job. So you want to make a deal on fully funded college education fine I'll make a deal but I guarantee politicians will hate it.

1. Politicians in DC can't touch the program, it will be administered by an independent board protected from political influence, patronage, and interference.

2. Pricing will be fixed and leverage the purchasing power of the pool, colleges and universities if they wish to participate will agree to set pricing.

3. Funding will include building and operating citizen owned universities to help control costs, again shielded from political tampering and corruption by DC.

4. Will have to include government regulation and tax reform if you want these grads to have a job to work afterwards.

5. Funding a combination of means tested parent, business, state, and federal shared funding. State and Federal politicians can shut their lying corrupt mouths they don't get to touch the program, after all its our freaking money in the first place.

Just for starters, basically politicians can't touch the damn thing. There is a problem that needs to be solved. There's over $1 trillion dollars in government backed student loans on the books that's insane. Young people, those least able to afford and manage debt are starting off in life enslaved to ridiculous amounts of student loan debt. As a fiscal conservative that makes me want to hurl.

 

[LeftofLeft]

The estimated cost per year for the government providing free tuition would be about 60 billion. Bernie would place a tax on Wall Street speculation to pay for it.

Now before you all go into your rants about "liberal free lunch bullshit derp, derp, derp!" you should consider WHY this is a great idea. This isn't about giving individuals hand outs, this is about how higher education benefits the country as a whole. Plenty of intelligent people who cannot afford to go to college or are discouraged by the massive student debt that they would accumulate choose not to attend. Imagine the implications if we had an influx of people getting degrees in science, public policy, or business administration. Don't you think those educated people would bring a great deal of contribution to this country?

In sincerely think Free College Tuition should be on the table. Here is the issue with Sanders' plan: the basis and success for the plan cannot be solely on punishing a Wall Street practice. To be truly successful, there needs to be more skin in the game.

Wall Street, Big Corporations, Big Law, Big Government, Big Law, Big Energy, Big Activism, Big Union, and (of Course) Big Education, need to be involved. All should be provided incentives for having multiple programs that lead to free education. The Military provides Free Education. We should be looking to that model = The US Military gives Free Education in exchange for time commitment meeting an area of need.

 

[Obiwan]

We have rvenue of $3.1 trillion and we spend $3.6 trillion.
U.S. National Debt Clock Real Time

We take in over $3.1 trillion and we can't make ends meet....

Unreal.

Yeah and that's primarily because of tax cutting and bloated defense spending.

 

[Stephanie]

The estimated cost per year for the government providing free tuition would be about 60 billion. Bernie would place a tax on Wall Street speculation to pay for it.

Now before you all go into your rants about "liberal free lunch bullshit derp, derp, derp!" you should consider WHY this is a great idea. This isn't about giving individuals hand outs, this is about how higher education benefits the country as a whole. Plenty of intelligent people who cannot afford to go to college or are discouraged by the massive student debt that they would accumulate choose not to attend. Imagine the implications if we had an influx of people getting degrees in science, public policy, or business administration. Don't you think those educated people would bring a great deal of contribution to this country?

Sorry.....it is stupid. Giving money to people who may not be suited for college is a waste...by individuals seeking out their own way to college it is a selection process...otherwise you are taking money from people in the form of taxes to pay for some kid to study 17th century French poetry, coming out with no way to get a job and then ending up getting welfare because they can't support themselves....

And just using the words "public policy" shows you have no real concept of how the world works...........if you want to lower college costs...get student loans out of the hands of government.......that is what is jacking up college tuition well beyond any other expense.....

Exactly, they want to go full Socialist/communist like Bernie baby wants. they should take these people and do like China does. FORCE them into Manual labor fixing up all that infrastructure the Government was so kind to give us.

That is where it always ends up anyway...that and mass graves of those who disagree with them....

oh they have been good brainwashing people with the REAL results of Socialism and then comes with it Fascism. it's damn scary how many has bought into in it in day and age.

 

[PredFan]

It isn't free. SOMEONE is paying. That's the thing that liberals are too stupid to understand. No liberal is more ignorant than a Sanders supporter.

 

[Stephanie]

Are the university professors going to work for free?

are you freaking kidding. they should be the first to give up their salaries so Bernie can GIVE everyone FREEEEEEEEEEEEE college edumacations.

 

[NYcarbineer]

This will encourage even more ridiculous increases in the cost of tuition.

It will encourage even more degree inflation.

Limit the colleges that are eligible to use the free tuition on, based on their costs.

 

[NYcarbineer]

It isn't free. SOMEONE is paying. That's the thing that liberals are too stupid to understand. No liberal is more ignorant than a Sanders supporter.

So a tax exemption isn't free either, is it?

 

[Billy000]

It isn't free. SOMEONE is paying. That's the thing that liberals are too stupid to understand. No liberal is more ignorant than a Sanders supporter.

You people are so stupid. Like any government spending, it is paid for with revenue. In this case, a tax on Wall Street speculation.

 

[Obiwan]

This will encourage even more ridiculous increases in the cost of tuition.

It will encourage even more degree inflation.

Limit the colleges that are eligible to use the free tuition on, based on their costs.

Which would lead to using lower-ranked colleges and getting a degree that's practically useless. A complete waste of time and money.

 

[Freewill]

This will encourage even more ridiculous increases in the cost of tuition.

It will encourage even more degree inflation.

How?

You give the consumer free money to pay for products, the producers will find products to take all the money that is available.

You think Distribution of Studies is a waste of time and money now? Wait till the money is being paid by a Third Party not involved in the buying decision.

INcreased demand leads to higher prices.

Hey, I have an idea. Higher salaries to attract better teachers. Who could be against that?

And more research. Who could be against that?

And day care so that that more adult students can take advantage of the Free College. Who could be against that?

And gold plated door knobs on all the door handles! After all, it's free money! Just send the bill to the Government and they can print up more money!

Lol typically increased demand leads to lower prices, but I don't think that would happen here. You're talking about money that pays professors to do their job. It's not like the institutions are inclined to give these people big pay raises.

Please correct this post, you can't be serious. Increase demand ALWAYS leads to HIGHER prices. Maybe you are being sarcastic, you have to be.

As for wages:

For the rest of America wages have stagnated.

I don't buy your source at all. The reality is that part time work among professors is on the rise and their salaries have remained flat between 2002 and 2010.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/0...-college-tuition-costs-so-much.html?referrer=

How staff benefits and student services drive up college tuition Education Lab Blog Seattle Times

From you first link, which answers all the statements you have made.

In fact, public investment in higher education in America is vastly larger today, in inflation-adjusted dollars, than it was during the supposed golden age of public funding in the 1960s. Such spending has increased at a much faster rate than government spending in general. For example, the military’s budget is about 1.8 times higher today than it was in 1960, while legislative appropriations to higher education are more than 10 times higher.

In other words, far from being caused by funding cuts, the astonishing rise in college tuition correlates closely with a huge increase in public subsidies for higher education. If over the past three decades car prices had gone up as fast as tuition, the average new car would cost more than $80,000.

Some of this increased spending in education has been driven by a sharp rise in the percentage of Americans who go to college. While the college-age population has not increased since the tail end of the baby boom, the percentage of the population enrolled in college has risen significantly, especially in the last 20 years. Enrollment in undergraduate, graduate and professional programs has increased by almost 50 percent since 1995. As a consequence, while state legislative appropriations for higher education have risen much faster than inflation, total state appropriations per student are somewhat lower than they were at their peak in 1990. (Appropriations per student are much higher now than they were in the 1960s and 1970s, when tuition was a small fraction of what it is today.)

According to your source I will admit to being wrong in blaming the professors, although sources show otherwise professors don't seem to be the problem it is just colleges increasing administration to justify increase in costs.

From your link;

By contrast, a major factor driving increasing costs is the constant expansion of university administration. According to the Department of Education data, administrative positions at colleges and universities grew by 60 percent between 1993 and 2009, which Bloomberg reported was 10 times the rate of growth of tenured faculty positions.

Even more strikingly, an analysis by a professor at California Polytechnic University, Pomona, found that, while the total number of full-time faculty members in the C.S.U. system grew from 11,614 to 12,019 between 1975 and 2008, the total number of administrators grew from 3,800 to 12,183 — a 221 percent increase.

 

[strollingbones]

education should be free to all those willing to learn

 

[Obiwan]

education should be free to all those willing to learn

But a free education is available. All the Libs have to do is go down to the recruiting office and volunteer to go straighten out their Messiah's mess.

 

[Billy000]

How?

You give the consumer free money to pay for products, the producers will find products to take all the money that is available.

You think Distribution of Studies is a waste of time and money now? Wait till the money is being paid by a Third Party not involved in the buying decision.

INcreased demand leads to higher prices.

Hey, I have an idea. Higher salaries to attract better teachers. Who could be against that?

And more research. Who could be against that?

And day care so that that more adult students can take advantage of the Free College. Who could be against that?

And gold plated door knobs on all the door handles! After all, it's free money! Just send the bill to the Government and they can print up more money!

Lol typically increased demand leads to lower prices, but I don't think that would happen here. You're talking about money that pays professors to do their job. It's not like the institutions are inclined to give these people big pay raises.

Please correct this post, you can't be serious. Increase demand ALWAYS leads to HIGHER prices. Maybe you are being sarcastic, you have to be.

As for wages:

For the rest of America wages have stagnated.

I don't buy your source at all. The reality is that part time work among professors is on the rise and their salaries have remained flat between 2002 and 2010.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/0...-college-tuition-costs-so-much.html?referrer=

How staff benefits and student services drive up college tuition Education Lab Blog Seattle Times

From you first link, which answers all the statements you have made.

In fact, public investment in higher education in America is vastly larger today, in inflation-adjusted dollars, than it was during the supposed golden age of public funding in the 1960s. Such spending has increased at a much faster rate than government spending in general. For example, the military’s budget is about 1.8 times higher today than it was in 1960, while legislative appropriations to higher education are more than 10 times higher.

In other words, far from being caused by funding cuts, the astonishing rise in college tuition correlates closely with a huge increase in public subsidies for higher education. If over the past three decades car prices had gone up as fast as tuition, the average new car would cost more than $80,000.

Some of this increased spending in education has been driven by a sharp rise in the percentage of Americans who go to college. While the college-age population has not increased since the tail end of the baby boom, the percentage of the population enrolled in college has risen significantly, especially in the last 20 years. Enrollment in undergraduate, graduate and professional programs has increased by almost 50 percent since 1995. As a consequence, while state legislative appropriations for higher education have risen much faster than inflation, total state appropriations per student are somewhat lower than they were at their peak in 1990. (Appropriations per student are much higher now than they were in the 1960s and 1970s, when tuition was a small fraction of what it is today.)

According to your source I will admit to being wrong in blaming the professors, although sources show otherwise professors don't seem to be the problem it is just colleges increasing administration to justify increase in costs.

From your link;

By contrast, a major factor driving increasing costs is the constant expansion of university administration. According to the Department of Education data, administrative positions at colleges and universities grew by 60 percent between 1993 and 2009, which Bloomberg reported was 10 times the rate of growth of tenured faculty positions.

Even more strikingly, an analysis by a professor at California Polytechnic University, Pomona, found that, while the total number of full-time faculty members in the C.S.U. system grew from 11,614 to 12,019 between 1975 and 2008, the total number of administrators grew from 3,800 to 12,183 — a 221 percent increase.

Yes but none of this changes the fact that less college professors are working full time and are being paid flat. While the administrative costs do matter in the issue of rising cost of tuition, it doesn't change the fact that the primary reason for the higher costs is less government funding. These institutions depend on them. It says that in the very text you copied and pasted.

 

[Freewill]

education should be free to all those willing to learn

Oh gosh, not again, NOTHING in this life is FREE.

 

[CowboyTed]

This will encourage even more ridiculous increases in the cost of tuition.

It will encourage even more degree inflation.

How?

You give the consumer free money to pay for products, the producers will find products to take all the money that is available.

You think Distribution of Studies is a waste of time and money now? Wait till the money is being paid by a Third Party not involved in the buying decision.

INcreased demand leads to higher prices.

Hey, I have an idea. Higher salaries to attract better teachers. Who could be against that?

And more research. Who could be against that?

And day care so that that more adult students can take advantage of the Free College. Who could be against that?

And gold plated door knobs on all the door handles! After all, it's free money! Just send the bill to the Government and they can print up more money!

If you see how education is funded and how students get access, this is a very stupid quote...

The best universities outside the US are Government owned and run. Using state exams students gain access to courses, therefore best students do the best courses.

The government make sure that student debt is small.

 

[Freewill]

You give the consumer free money to pay for products, the producers will find products to take all the money that is available.

You think Distribution of Studies is a waste of time and money now? Wait till the money is being paid by a Third Party not involved in the buying decision.

INcreased demand leads to higher prices.

Hey, I have an idea. Higher salaries to attract better teachers. Who could be against that?

And more research. Who could be against that?

And day care so that that more adult students can take advantage of the Free College. Who could be against that?

And gold plated door knobs on all the door handles! After all, it's free money! Just send the bill to the Government and they can print up more money!

Lol typically increased demand leads to lower prices, but I don't think that would happen here. You're talking about money that pays professors to do their job. It's not like the institutions are inclined to give these people big pay raises.

Please correct this post, you can't be serious. Increase demand ALWAYS leads to HIGHER prices. Maybe you are being sarcastic, you have to be.

As for wages:

For the rest of America wages have stagnated.

I don't buy your source at all. The reality is that part time work among professors is on the rise and their salaries have remained flat between 2002 and 2010.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/0...-college-tuition-costs-so-much.html?referrer=

How staff benefits and student services drive up college tuition Education Lab Blog Seattle Times

From you first link, which answers all the statements you have made.

In fact, public investment in higher education in America is vastly larger today, in inflation-adjusted dollars, than it was during the supposed golden age of public funding in the 1960s. Such spending has increased at a much faster rate than government spending in general. For example, the military’s budget is about 1.8 times higher today than it was in 1960, while legislative appropriations to higher education are more than 10 times higher.

In other words, far from being caused by funding cuts, the astonishing rise in college tuition correlates closely with a huge increase in public subsidies for higher education. If over the past three decades car prices had gone up as fast as tuition, the average new car would cost more than $80,000.

Some of this increased spending in education has been driven by a sharp rise in the percentage of Americans who go to college. While the college-age population has not increased since the tail end of the baby boom, the percentage of the population enrolled in college has risen significantly, especially in the last 20 years. Enrollment in undergraduate, graduate and professional programs has increased by almost 50 percent since 1995. As a consequence, while state legislative appropriations for higher education have risen much faster than inflation, total state appropriations per student are somewhat lower than they were at their peak in 1990. (Appropriations per student are much higher now than they were in the 1960s and 1970s, when tuition was a small fraction of what it is today.)

According to your source I will admit to being wrong in blaming the professors, although sources show otherwise professors don't seem to be the problem it is just colleges increasing administration to justify increase in costs.

From your link;

By contrast, a major factor driving increasing costs is the constant expansion of university administration. According to the Department of Education data, administrative positions at colleges and universities grew by 60 percent between 1993 and 2009, which Bloomberg reported was 10 times the rate of growth of tenured faculty positions.

Even more strikingly, an analysis by a professor at California Polytechnic University, Pomona, found that, while the total number of full-time faculty members in the C.S.U. system grew from 11,614 to 12,019 between 1975 and 2008, the total number of administrators grew from 3,800 to 12,183 — a 221 percent increase.

Yes but none of this changes the fact that less college professors are working full time and are being paid flat. While the administrative costs do matter in the issue of rising cost of tuition, it doesn't change the fact that the primary reason for the higher costs is less government funding. These institutions depend on them. It says that in the very text you copied and pasted.

That is a problem with the administration of the college. College administrators, according to you link, are now demanding 7 figure wages. WTF do they do to earn that money?

 

[Billy000]

education should be free to all those willing to learn

Oh gosh, not again, NOTHING in this life is FREE.

Including tax cuts.

 

[Billy000]

Lol typically increased demand leads to lower prices, but I don't think that would happen here. You're talking about money that pays professors to do their job. It's not like the institutions are inclined to give these people big pay raises.

Please correct this post, you can't be serious. Increase demand ALWAYS leads to HIGHER prices. Maybe you are being sarcastic, you have to be.

As for wages:

For the rest of America wages have stagnated.

I don't buy your source at all. The reality is that part time work among professors is on the rise and their salaries have remained flat between 2002 and 2010.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/0...-college-tuition-costs-so-much.html?referrer=

How staff benefits and student services drive up college tuition Education Lab Blog Seattle Times

From you first link, which answers all the statements you have made.

In fact, public investment in higher education in America is vastly larger today, in inflation-adjusted dollars, than it was during the supposed golden age of public funding in the 1960s. Such spending has increased at a much faster rate than government spending in general. For example, the military’s budget is about 1.8 times higher today than it was in 1960, while legislative appropriations to higher education are more than 10 times higher.

In other words, far from being caused by funding cuts, the astonishing rise in college tuition correlates closely with a huge increase in public subsidies for higher education. If over the past three decades car prices had gone up as fast as tuition, the average new car would cost more than $80,000.

Some of this increased spending in education has been driven by a sharp rise in the percentage of Americans who go to college. While the college-age population has not increased since the tail end of the baby boom, the percentage of the population enrolled in college has risen significantly, especially in the last 20 years. Enrollment in undergraduate, graduate and professional programs has increased by almost 50 percent since 1995. As a consequence, while state legislative appropriations for higher education have risen much faster than inflation, total state appropriations per student are somewhat lower than they were at their peak in 1990. (Appropriations per student are much higher now than they were in the 1960s and 1970s, when tuition was a small fraction of what it is today.)

According to your source I will admit to being wrong in blaming the professors, although sources show otherwise professors don't seem to be the problem it is just colleges increasing administration to justify increase in costs.

From your link;

By contrast, a major factor driving increasing costs is the constant expansion of university administration. According to the Department of Education data, administrative positions at colleges and universities grew by 60 percent between 1993 and 2009, which Bloomberg reported was 10 times the rate of growth of tenured faculty positions.

Even more strikingly, an analysis by a professor at California Polytechnic University, Pomona, found that, while the total number of full-time faculty members in the C.S.U. system grew from 11,614 to 12,019 between 1975 and 2008, the total number of administrators grew from 3,800 to 12,183 — a 221 percent increase.

Yes but none of this changes the fact that less college professors are working full time and are being paid flat. While the administrative costs do matter in the issue of rising cost of tuition, it doesn't change the fact that the primary reason for the higher costs is less government funding. These institutions depend on them. It says that in the very text you copied and pasted.

That is a problem with the administration of the college. College administrators, according to you link, are now demanding 7 figure wages. WTF do they do to earn that money?

This isn't a compelling reason not to have the government fund tuition. If we need to curb the wages of college administrators, then we will. Again, all of this depends on government funding.

 

[Freewill]

education should be free to all those willing to learn

Oh gosh, not again, NOTHING in this life is FREE.

Including tax cuts.

OMG is that an interesting statement. The only way it can be true is if you really believe that all our money belongs to the government. A tax cut is the same as the cost of a car being reduced.