"Sacrifice" for your country

[Procrustes Stretched]

I do not believe most Americans look for free shit from the government

Some do surely but not most.

As far as sacrifice goes why the fuck should anyone sacrifice anything for country? You just happened to be born on this particular patch of dirt it's not like you had a choice in the matter.

All that is required of anyone is they obey the laws of the land in which they choose to live and that is all.

What would you fight for?

A shit hole like Venezuela, Kenya, or some other country, has become where you are guaranteed few if any rights?

*****SMILE*****

You know if I could have served in WII I would have but every "war" since then has been unjust and unnecessary we now use war as a tool in games of brinkmanship and brave men and women like my Dad are used as pawns their lives thrown away by fucking politicians for political ends.

You still posting as some sort of a national treasure, and an expert on war?



"Who love you baby?"

 

[Clementine]

Ok. So according tonthe righties, these things ain't sacrafices .

-military service
-child killed during military service
-public service, elected position or not .


So tell us . What does count as "sacrifice "????

That is according to a few individuals.

Generally, a sacrifice is something you choose to give up to benefit others. Military service is a choice and people enter into it knowing it could potentially cost them their lives. Military service means that a person must be willing to not only put their life on the line, but be willing to endure separations from family. Yes, that is a sacrifice on both the service member and family's part. It's a choice they make and it's for the good of the country over their personal comfort.

Losing a child is just one of the most difficult things anyone can face, no matter how the loss occurs. But, if your child is willing to make a sacrifice for their country, it means you may suffer because of it.

Public service isn't necessarily a sacrifice For those in elected offices, it's a job. They don't have to worry about being sent into harm's way. They make good money.

Taxes are a forced sacrifice. We pay too much because of irresponsible spending. The government forces us to part with an increasing percent of our hard earned money. Giving to charity, which studies show that more Repubs than Dems do, is a sacrifice that people choose to make. Having taxes taken and the money wasted is just a stupid thing done by politicians.

 

[Conservative65]

They havent.......they just make tons.of money in the govt.....

Actually, the facts are the Clintons made little money while employed in government service

.

They had free room and board, free air and ground transportation and were waited on hand and foot as Governor of Arkansas.. Throw in $400,000 and expenses for 8 years in the White House and they did pretty good.

Someone ran the numbers several years ago and determined that while the salary for President is $400,000, the benefits of being President would cost that person over 10 million dollars/year is they had to provide the same things to themselves.

View attachment 84584

I bet it's a lot higher than that.

How much does it cost to transport his circus around the world for these important face to face conferences that he should be able to do by teleconference?

Every time he takes his circus somewhere in AF1 it costs millions.

*****SMILE*****

It was at least 10 years ago when I read the number.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

This country isn't the same country as when Lee Greenwood wrote that song.

Part of the problem is that people think the government should force others to pay for the 'supposed rights' they have.

Too many able bodied people today believe they have the right to be feed, sheltered, clothed, and now they demand healthcare, cell phones, computer access, and other things,... by forcing others to pay for it. My response to this type of thinking is...

"Yes you have the right to be feed and you also have the right to starve make a choice."

*****SMILE*****

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

That is according to a few individuals.

Generally, a sacrifice is something you choose to give up to benefit others. Military service is a choice and people enter into it knowing it could potentially cost them their lives. Military service means that a person must be willing to not only put their life on the line, but be willing to endure separations from family. Yes, that is a sacrifice on both the service member and family's part. It's a choice they make and it's for the good of the country over their personal comfort.

Losing a child is just one of the most difficult things anyone can face, no matter how the loss occurs. But, if your child is willing to make a sacrifice for their country, it means you may suffer because of it.

Public service isn't necessarily a sacrifice For those in elected offices, it's a job. They don't have to worry about being sent into harm's way. They make good money.

Taxes are a forced sacrifice. We pay too much because of irresponsible spending. The government forces us to part with an increasing percent of our hard earned money. Giving to charity, which studies show that more Repubs than Dems do, is a sacrifice that people choose to make. Having taxes taken and the money wasted is just a stupid thing done by politicians.

Throwing the volunteer military under the bus now? Wonder of wonders, you people never cease to amaze

 

[Damaged Eagle]

I do not believe most Americans look for free shit from the government

Some do surely but not most.

As far as sacrifice goes why the fuck should anyone sacrifice anything for country? You just happened to be born on this particular patch of dirt it's not like you had a choice in the matter.

All that is required of anyone is they obey the laws of the land in which they choose to live and that is all.

What would you fight for?

A shit hole like Venezuela, Kenya, or some other country, has become where you are guaranteed few if any rights?

*****SMILE*****

You know if I could have served in WII I would have but every "war" since then has been unjust and unnecessary we now use war as a tool in games of brinkmanship and brave men and women like my Dad are used as pawns their lives thrown away by fucking politicians for political ends.

What makes you think either WWI or WWII were just wars, or any war prior to that for that matter, where people were not used as pawns to have their lives thrown away by politicians for political/corporate ends?

*****SMILE*****

 

[Conservative65]

This country isn't the same country as when Lee Greenwood wrote that song.

Part of the problem is that people think the government should force others to pay for the 'supposed rights' they have.

Too many able bodied people today believe they have the right to be feed, sheltered, clothed, and now they demand healthcare and other things,... by forcing others to pay for it. My response to is...

"Yes you have the right to be feed and also have the right to starve make a choice."

*****SMILE*****

A source I found stated that in 2013, just over 1/3 of the country used some form of means tested social welfare. That doesn't include Social Security and programs where those that receive had to actually put into it. When you include those people, the number of Americans receiving a "government check" was damn near 49%. Like you, I'm concerned with those that deal with funding food, clothing, and shelter, the means tested programs. I'm trying to find out how many of that 1/3 use multiple programs but I'm having trouble find a source. Any help?

 

[Skull Pilot]

I do not believe most Americans look for free shit from the government

Some do surely but not most.

As far as sacrifice goes why the fuck should anyone sacrifice anything for country? You just happened to be born on this particular patch of dirt it's not like you had a choice in the matter.

All that is required of anyone is they obey the laws of the land in which they choose to live and that is all.

What would you fight for?

A shit hole like Venezuela, Kenya, or some other country, has become where you are guaranteed few if any rights?

*****SMILE*****

You know if I could have served in WII I would have but every "war" since then has been unjust and unnecessary we now use war as a tool in games of brinkmanship and brave men and women like my Dad are used as pawns their lives thrown away by fucking politicians for political ends.

View attachment 84614

What makes you think either WWI or WWII were just wars, or any war prior to that for that matter, where people were not used as pawns to have their lives thrown away by politicians for political/corporate ends?

*****SMILE*****

WWII was a fight against a real existential threat to the nation. Don't tell me you think Korea, Nam , the Gulf war etc were in response to the same level of threat as WWII

 

[Damaged Eagle]

This country isn't the same country as when Lee Greenwood wrote that song.

Part of the problem is that people think the government should force others to pay for the 'supposed rights' they have.

Too many able bodied people today believe they have the right to be feed, sheltered, clothed, and now they demand healthcare and other things,... by forcing others to pay for it. My response to is...

"Yes you have the right to be feed and also have the right to starve make a choice."

*****SMILE*****

A source I found stated that in 2013, just over 1/3 of the country used some form of means tested social welfare. That doesn't include Social Security and programs where those that receive had to actually put into it. When you include those people, the number of Americans receiving a "government check" was damn near 49%. Like you, I'm concerned with those that deal with funding food, clothing, and shelter, the means tested programs. I'm trying to find out how many of that 1/3 use multiple programs but I'm having trouble find a source. Any help?

My problem with the system is that if we need to provide more than the three basics (food, shelter, and clothing) we're going beyond any general welfare concept. If they have a chow hall, basic barracks room, and dungarees provided by the government they have been provided for. If that sounds like boot camp that really is to bad. The able bodied ones need to get a job and work on a skill that pays or settle for what's provided.

*****SMILE*****

 

[Damaged Eagle]

I do not believe most Americans look for free shit from the government

Some do surely but not most.

As far as sacrifice goes why the fuck should anyone sacrifice anything for country? You just happened to be born on this particular patch of dirt it's not like you had a choice in the matter.

All that is required of anyone is they obey the laws of the land in which they choose to live and that is all.

What would you fight for?

A shit hole like Venezuela, Kenya, or some other country, has become where you are guaranteed few if any rights?

*****SMILE*****

You know if I could have served in WII I would have but every "war" since then has been unjust and unnecessary we now use war as a tool in games of brinkmanship and brave men and women like my Dad are used as pawns their lives thrown away by fucking politicians for political ends.

View attachment 84614

What makes you think either WWI or WWII were just wars, or any war prior to that for that matter, where people were not used as pawns to have their lives thrown away by politicians for political/corporate ends?

*****SMILE*****

WWII was a fight against a real existential threat to the nation. Don't tell me you think Korea, Nam , the Gulf war etc were in response to the same level of threat as WWII

The war with Japan was justified possibly... though the US was looking for ways to pick a fight with Japan.....

What made our involvement in Europe, where we threw the first punch, justified?

*****SMILE*****

 

[DGS49]

Sooo, let's talk about a "sacrifice" for the public good.

Let's say you are a farmer, and a plague of locusts is moving in on the area where you live. The local "mayor" says to you, "The only way to stop the plague is for you to set fire to your crop and kill them."

You agree to do it. It is a sacrifice.

Let's say your town has been taken over by outlaws. You have a 12-year-old son who is mature and small for his age. the mayor asks if you will "volunteer" your son to try to get a message out to the outside world by climbing over a wall and running away. You agree, and tell your son to do it. He does. he gets killed in the attempt. You have sacrificed your son to the cause.

Now, let's say you have an adult son, of legal age and financially emancipated. If he elects to join the military service it is ENTIRELY his decision, even if you encouraged or "ordered" him to do it. It is entirely HIS sacrifice, not yours. You cannon sacrifice something or someone over which you do not have ownership.

The Kahn's are bereaved. They are sad. They have experienced the ultimate loss. But they "sacrificed" nothing.

And by the way, what did William Jefferson Clinton ever "sacrifice" for the United States? What did he do when he was called to serve?

Fucking low-life douchebag.

 

[whitehall]

"Ask not what your Country can do for you but what you can do for your Country". It seems like ages ago when a president would risk saying that and equally amazing it was a democrat. My has the democrat party changed.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No, that's not it. I'm just saying I haven't saw anything to indicate that he would be giving up his present income and would think the Presidency would enhance greatly the $3 billion value he placed on his "Trump" brand. With his news conference in Scotland a month ago he told that his kids did the work and that would continue. It wouldn't be like Pete Rozelle suspending Joe Namath until he unloaded his holding in Bachelor's III. Heck Trump has to be as rich as JFK was and JFK was able to donate all his political career income to charity. Do you consider that a sacrifice?

Unless he has some sort of thing going where he gets a check from his companies just because, I'm assuming he's going to be dedicating all of his time to the presidency.

Most of the people know they will likely be making the big bucks after they leave the White House. I can't see Trump doing that nor can I see that as his ultimate goal.

So why does he want to be President anyway, especially with such successful money making businesses?

If Hillary gets in, I can see the Clinton foundation growing like a marijuana plant.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Did they have any debt?

According to Hillary they did.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I read several years ago the list of benefits that the President gets for being President. The total of all benefits, without the salary counted was equated to what it would cost a corporation to provide the same to a CEO. It was over $10 million/year. I think Clinton's salary was $200K and it didn't go to $400K until Bush43. Either way, if you don't have to pay for living expenses, etc. out of that $200K, that amount has the ability to provide a lot more than if you do.

Imagine if you made that kind of money with no living expenses. Hell, almost every dime of it would be invested if that were me. It's like what some in the military do. They just send home the check and have somebody put it somewhere until the solder is out of the service.

 

[TooTall]

Actually, the facts are the Clintons made little money while employed in government service

.

They had free room and board, free air and ground transportation and were waited on hand and foot as Governor of Arkansas.. Throw in $400,000 and expenses for 8 years in the White House and they did pretty good.

Someone ran the numbers several years ago and determined that while the salary for President is $400,000, the benefits of being President would cost that person over 10 million dollars/year is they had to provide the same things to themselves.

View attachment 84584

I bet it's a lot higher than that.

How much does it cost to transport his circus around the world for these important face to face conferences that he should be able to do by teleconference?

Every time he takes his circus somewhere in AF1 it costs millions.

*****SMILE*****

It was at least 10 years ago when I read the number.

Obama has spent more than 10 million on his vacations.

 

[Conservative65]

This country isn't the same country as when Lee Greenwood wrote that song.

Part of the problem is that people think the government should force others to pay for the 'supposed rights' they have.

Too many able bodied people today believe they have the right to be feed, sheltered, clothed, and now they demand healthcare and other things,... by forcing others to pay for it. My response to is...

"Yes you have the right to be feed and also have the right to starve make a choice."

*****SMILE*****

A source I found stated that in 2013, just over 1/3 of the country used some form of means tested social welfare. That doesn't include Social Security and programs where those that receive had to actually put into it. When you include those people, the number of Americans receiving a "government check" was damn near 49%. Like you, I'm concerned with those that deal with funding food, clothing, and shelter, the means tested programs. I'm trying to find out how many of that 1/3 use multiple programs but I'm having trouble find a source. Any help?

My problem with the system is that if we need to provide more than the three basics (food, shelter, and clothing) we're going beyond any general welfare concept. If they have a chow hall, basic barracks room, and dungarees provided by the government they have been provided for. If that sounds like boot camp that really is to bad. The able bodied ones need to get a job and work on a skill that pays or settle for what's provided.

*****SMILE*****

That taxpayers are providing anything at all goes beyond the general welfare concept because general welfare =/= social welfare. It's high time the freeloaders start doing for themselves.

 

[Conservative65]

I read several years ago the list of benefits that the President gets for being President. The total of all benefits, without the salary counted was equated to what it would cost a corporation to provide the same to a CEO. It was over $10 million/year. I think Clinton's salary was $200K and it didn't go to $400K until Bush43. Either way, if you don't have to pay for living expenses, etc. out of that $200K, that amount has the ability to provide a lot more than if you do.

Imagine if you made that kind of money with no living expenses. Hell, almost every dime of it would be invested if that were me. It's like what some in the military do. They just send home the check and have somebody put it somewhere until the solder is out of the service.

Same here.

All that was given to the Clintons and Hillary expects us to believe she and Bill were "dead broke".

 

[Conservative65]

.

They had free room and board, free air and ground transportation and were waited on hand and foot as Governor of Arkansas.. Throw in $400,000 and expenses for 8 years in the White House and they did pretty good.

Someone ran the numbers several years ago and determined that while the salary for President is $400,000, the benefits of being President would cost that person over 10 million dollars/year is they had to provide the same things to themselves.

View attachment 84584

I bet it's a lot higher than that.

How much does it cost to transport his circus around the world for these important face to face conferences that he should be able to do by teleconference?

Every time he takes his circus somewhere in AF1 it costs millions.

*****SMILE*****

It was at least 10 years ago when I read the number.

Obama has spent more than 10 million on his vacations.

While still getting paid $400,000/year salary.

 

[Fang]

I pay taxes, but that's no "sacrifice" because it is required by law.

I went into the military service for three years and served 18 months in Vietnam. Was that a "sacrifice"? Not for me, actually. I needed a break from the world to get my head right. I came out with money in the bank, a pile of maturity, the GI bill, and my life was better for the experience and even the tangibles I got.

If my adult son joins the Marine Corps and gets killed overseas, what is my "sacrifice"?

Nothing.

It is a LOSS, certainly, but a sacrifice is something that YOU give up voluntarily. You cannot give up the life of an adult son. That is HIS sacrifice, not yours.

Most Americans sacrifice nothing for their country. In fact, they look to their Country to give them free stuff. Free education, college grants and loans, welfare, housing assistance, food stamps, subsidized flood insurance, a "cake"job with good pay, fantastic benefits and only a little bit of work to do (I've been there, so don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about).

Politicians like to think that they are making a sacrifice by entering into "Public Service," but for most of them, it is simply a way to feed their egos, adopt a lifestyle they like, and pretend to be benefitting their fellow Americans. If a successful businessman takes a 90% pay cut and walks away from a successful business in order to run for and hold a public office, THAT IS A SACRIFICE. If he spends millions on his own campaign - in an attempt to do something good for the overall society - then those millions are also a sacrifice.

What has HRC or Barry ever sacrificed for their country?

Not a fucking thing. they used government employment to enrich themselves and feed their enormous egos. Not that there's anything wrong with that; most politicians are the same, but I really don't want to hear about most of them being public servants and sacrificing for the country. it's all BS.