flacaltenn
Diamond Member
- Jun 9, 2011
- 67,573
- 22,962
Uhhh... Ok. I guess I missed that.Did you read anything about the father once being a member of a terrorist organization?He moved back to Libya with the wife. The kids were still in England but were back and forth. So Fox was spinning it that the whole family was talking terrorism over breakfast everyday. CNN was saying Dad was suspicious the bomber son had bad ideas and wouldn't give him back his passport. So the bomber son said he was going to Mecca. Dad gave him the passport back and the kid returned to England and blew up children and parents. I don't know which, if either, is true. Now that England is not sharing info, who knows how we'll find out. Anyone up for a trip to Libya and Manchester?What have you learned about the father?From what I was hearing this a.m., the whole family may have been in on it. Could be a bunch of gossip.
I'm only asking because you think it could be gossip.
I gave you the statement that Libyans BELIEVE the father was associated with an Al Queda friendly Libyan fighting group opposing Quadafy. Which is the reason they probably had to flee when they did . But I've NOTHING about the timing of all that.
Did I quote a post of yours by mistake?
I'm going to look for another coyote post I can agree with. Wish me luck.
It's all good.
My original question stands: Why has this looking into vetting been delayed? Nothing has stopped Trump from doing so. If making us safer were his intention, it would be well underway If there are ways to make us safer, as you suggest, I'm all for it. I'm sure these people are asked why they want to come here and a few billion other questions. They are gone over with a fine tooth comb. But only the very best agents can sometimes see into a person's soul. Do we interview them? We should if we don't (and I don't mean just at customs when they fly in). I'm all for careful. I'd be all for safe zones. These are all solutions we've discussed before. But the ban is stupid.So a permanent ban on Muslims then? Just get it over with and give them safe zones?It's a long thread, you probably didn't read this so I'll post it again:Travel ban from Libya and better background vetting in the long term WOULD have identified problems with the suicide bomber in Manchester. Clearly a day after, his Dad in Libya helped his radicalization and is now in custody by the Libyan. Most likely at the time this dirtbag entered the UK --- there was no serious way to VALIDATE his background and citizen records from Libya. THAT's the point. The "ban" is a temporary measure to figure out how to vet these folks.
MOST of whom don't want to be British or American or French -- they just want to stay alive or in the very rare cases like this one -- take advantage of chaos and wreek havoc and death....
I am patiently waiting for the Trump administration to start looking into this better background vetting. His ban was stopped. No one would stop him writing an EO (if he even needed one) tasking the intelligence services with better ways to vet our refugees. Since second generation ones seem to be fairly common, it could be someone from Belgium or France or Germany, not just the M.E. or North Africa.
He wrote that EO initially in January. It is now the end of May. If it had gone into effect, the ban would now be over. Where is the important part of this, the "what the hell is going on" part? There was no reason to wait and if that were his intent, Trump would have moved forward with it. If safety and better vetting were his actual goal.
There is nothing the "intel agencies" could provide in a war-torn govt with no access to records or local law enforcement. Or even a TRUSTED govt or local law enforcement. The stream of refugees includes many without ANY travel documents. And as you know from seeing the numerous spammers that hit USMB daily with "Cheap Fake Documents and Passports" --- even HAVING a travel document is not enough. In addition, ISIS and the 43 other combatant groups in the war zones now have ACCESS to issue genuine Iraqi, Yemen, or Syria documents.
What I see Trump doing -- that SHOULD have happened 4 or 6 ago -- is to put an emphasis on creating "Safe Areas" in the war zones. The entire world failed to do that and stem the largest humanitarian crisis of our lifetime. NATO, the UN, the Arab League and the G8 are complicit in IGNORING the priority of providing safe harbor and travel to non-coms in these areas. It's disgusting..
Like I said, the majority of that refugee flow dont WANT to be Americans, Brits or Belgiums. They want to LIVE. And the world should have acted to not create refugee camps. But to secure and FUND the building of PERMANENT infrastructure in those zones. So that millions don't have to live day to day in camp squalor.
But instead, here we are -- watching the Manchester bombing and the issues all over Europe and arguing over whether we should do the same thing. Don't think so. There is a class of refugee that it KNOWN to us as high priority rescue material. And those are the Afghanis, Iraqis, Somalians, Libyans, etc that HELPED US in our efforts when we were in their countries. THOSE people probably INTEND to be Americans if they ask to come. But it's NOT a solution to allow large numbers of people who have no intention of living an American style life relocate here without INTENSE scrutiny.
Did I say that? Probably the time for "safe zones" has passed. Makes me angry. But NOW instead of just a place to go -- it requires clean rebuilding of cities in area PROTECTED from the 43 warring factions in the region.
To answer the question of can we stop terrorism in THIS country. The partial answer is -- It's easier if you don't attempt to absorb refugees with NO INTENTION of becoming Americans. So at the least -- maybe "asking them" WHY they want to come here might be allowed? Ya think ???
We're playing with fire. Because ISIS may look impotent as the "junior varsity team". But they've stolen and acquired enough vicious technology and materials in Iraq and Syria. And it's a matter of time until they figure out how to use them and bring them here. And it won't be driving trucks into people and suicide belts and backpacks.
signing out for the night.
Ever been to Israel? They have a GENUINE security threat. DAILY. And I've had very interesting trips there on business where SEVERAL security interviewers "got into my soul" in 5 minutes or less. It can be done..
Most of the Fed govt is slow as Molasses. Trump didn't appreciate "how hard" all this stuff was. State Dept renewed Mohammed Attahs VISA AFTER he flew a plane into the WTC. You don't expect MIRACLES --- do you?