"Silence Patton" and Follow-Up Book Shed Crucial Light on End of WWII and the Cold War

[Deadstick]

Bullshit. Without Lend lease ,the Krauts would have rolled over the crazy Russkies. Should have let them do it ,and then we could have nuked the Krauts.

Thats just Bullshit, and just why would you have wanted the Nazis to murder more soviet citizens unless you are deranged or a Nazi?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

If you are interested in WWII and the Cold War and you have not seen Robert Orlando's documentary Silence Patton: First Victim of the Cold War, I recommend that you see it. I also recommend that you read Orlando's follow-up book The Tragedy of Patton, which documents and expands on the information presented in the documentary.

If you want to understand the disturbing facts about how the Soviets ended up controlling Eastern Europe and half of Germany after WWII, Silence Patton explains them in a clear, cogent manner. The George S. Patton Historical Society has warmly endorsed the documentary and the book.

If you have Amazon Prime, you can watch the documentary for free. It is available for rent or purchase on Amazon if you don't have Prime. It is also available on Vimeo and YouTube.

Incidentally, the documentary shows that, no, Patton was not murdered by U.S. or Communist intelligence agents, but that his death was a tragic accident, contrary to the outlandish tale told by Douglas Bazata. However, the documentary also shows there was definitely an effort to silence Patton by smearing him as a mentally unstable person and as a Nazi sympathizer.

The documentary does not focus on the issue of how Patton died, although it does discuss it. It focuses on the Roosevelt administration's horrible mishandling of the final months of the war in Europe, which resulted in the handing over of Eastern Europe and half of Germany to the Soviets.

Knowingly or not, FDR was a Stalin sock puppet. FDR prosecuted the war for the maximum benefit of the USSR

 

[Deadstick]

No, what doomed them was that most of them threw in with Hitler during the war.

You think anyone really cared about Hungary after Hungary joined the Axis?

They love rewriting history or excusing Nazis, when the Hungarians had a so called uprising in 1956 many were former Nazi people, the Soviets crushed their arses and rightly so, it was the price of siding with Hitler.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, sheesh. First off, in previous threads, you praised Stalin, and Mao. Second, the Soviets would have collapsed in weeks if FDR had not given them truly massive amounts of weapons and supplies.

Except they fought the Germans to a standstill in 1941 without a single scrap of Lend Lease getting to them.
There were single battles in Russia that were bigger than the entire 'Western Front".
Stalin was holding Hitler back while the Western allies were dicking around in North Africa and Sicily.

Again, the Soviets would have folded in weeks if FDR had not come to their rescue. FDR deprived our forces in the Pacific of considerable firepower and supplies because he was giving so much aid to the Soviets.

The only thing we needed in the Pacific were warships, and by 1943, we had plenty of them. FDR made the correct decision that Hitler was the more immediate threat. What FDR couldn't do until 1944 was open up a meaningful second front, which the Soviets BEGGED us to do.

Wrong. You didn't bother to watch the documentary or read the book, did you? No, of course. Because you won't read anything that contradicts your Marxist-Maoist-Communist view of history.

I don't need to. We have Pattons OWN WRITINGS that show he was an "anti-Semite" and contemporary news accounts of how badly he was treating people who stayed in Concentration camps for months after the war ended. Oh, also, Ike sacked him from his command.

He wanted to rearm non-Nazi German soldiers to ensure that Eastern Europe did not end up enslaved by the Soviets. What was "crazy" about keeping 60 million people from falling under Soviet tyranny?

Oh, that's right: You think Stalin was a great leader and that the Soviet Union was a decent place to live. I forgot. My bad.

Which non-Nazis were those, guy? Here's the thing. The Germans fought for Hitler down to the last old man and little boy. My first cousin, once removed, was in the Wehrmacht and died. The Germans were tired of war, the British were tired of war, even the Americans were tired of war at that point, and crazy-ass Patton wanted to start a new one.

I honestly don't care that the 60 million assholes in Eastern Europe who threw in with Hitler despite Hitler's desire to exterminate them had to have Stalin's boot on their neck. Served them right.

No, you are not a capitalist. You certainly don't talk like one.

I run a business for profit. Technically makes me a capitalist. I'm just not a crazy nut who thinks we should all work until we fucking die so a few rich assholes can ride dressage horses. That's ACTUALLY how you get Communists.

Huh, well, how does she feel about your effusive praise of Mao Tse-Tung, one of the worst mass murderers in human history? How does she feel about your infamous claim that Red China was less oppressive than Free China (Taiwan)?

My wife respects Mao more than I do. Like most Chinese who grew up there, Mao is revered like George Washington. Probably a little more so, because America is having an honest conversation about what a slave-raping bastard George was. She didn't enjoy my joke that Mao was secretly a cat. (The Mandarin word for cat is "mao").

I, on the other hand, have said that Mao was a ruthless bastard. But you had to be a ruthless bastard to do what he did, which is to unify a battered and fragmented China and make her powerful enough to avoid domination from outside powers.

And, FYI, there are many scholars who have pointed out that FDR's draconian sanctions against Japan and his refusal to accept any of Japan's reasonable peace offers enabled the militarists to proceed with the attack on Pearl Harbor.

Any quack scholar who says that should be forced to walk around his campus with a dunce cap. The only "reasonable" peace offer would be for Japan to stop trying to conquer China.

I've asked you this before, and you've always ducked it: What do you think we would do if a foreign nation imposed sanctions that would literally collapse our economy in 1-2 years and if that nation refused all of our concessions to get the sanctions lifted? What do you think any nation would do under those circumstances?

Well, first, it's hard to imagine any country having the ability to collapse our economy with sanctions. But if we were doing something so bad that a country was willing to give up lucrative trade with us, we should probably rethink what we were doing.

I realize that since you are pro-communist and Marxist, you rabidly, blindly hate the WWII-era Japanese, and that you know little or nothing about the moderate elements in the Japanese government who tried very hard to avoid war with the U.S.

They were? Did any of them go to inbred shithead Hirohito and tell him, "Hey, you know, invading China is probably a bad idea, we should not do that."

I certainly don't approve of what the Japanese did. I certainly wish they had not bombed Pearl Harbor. But I can also certainly understand that FDR's actions made it impossible for the Japanese moderates to prevent the attack.

This is far cry from your truly obscene, fringe views on Mao Tse-Tung and Red China and on Stalin and the Soviet Union.

Actually, my view is the view of most Chinese and Russians, respectively. Mao is still revered in China today. Stalin, despite decades of "destalinization," is one of the most revered figures in Russian history (only topped by a Saint who saved the country in the Middle Ages and the guy who freed the Serfs).

Yes, I do believe OJ is innocent, and I bet you've done as little research on the OJ case as you have on most other issues that you discuss. Why don't you try tackling some of my articles on the subject, starting with my articles on the blood-DNA evidence and the Bruno Magli shoe evidence?

Uh, his blood was at the scene, her blood was in his car and house. He was guilty as a cat in a goldfish bowl, the only reason he got off was a mostly black jury in LA wanted to stick it to the LAPD for Rodney King and everything else they were ticked off about. Understandable sentiments, I suppose, but wasted on the wrong guy.

 

[JoeB131]

Knowingly or not, FDR was a Stalin sock puppet. FDR prosecuted the war for the maximum benefit of the USSR

More Fantasies.

Russians did most of the heavy lifting in the war, and to the victor go the spoils. Frankly, Stalin could have kept a lot more than he did. He didn't keep Finland, he didn't keep Eastern Austria (as long as Austria was a neutral state), he didn't keep Yugoslavia (which largely liberated itself), and he didn't keep Manchuria and Mongolia.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

More Fantasies.

Russians did most of the heavy lifting in the war, and to the victor go the spoils. Frankly, Stalin could have kept a lot more than he did. He didn't keep Finland, he didn't keep Eastern Austria (as long as Austria was a neutral state), he didn't keep Yugoslavia (which largely liberated itself), and he didn't keep Manchuria and Mongolia.

Your love of the CCP and now “Uncle Joe” Stalin is duly noted

Patton called the final disposition of Europe a loss for the USA and Brits because it left great European capitals in the hands of the descendants of Genghis Khan

The Germans would have gladly surrendered their entire nation to Patton, but Stalin’s sock puppet FDR slowed our advance

Sucks that Eastern Europe had to suffer under Soviet Communism for decades, while you applaud it

 

[there4eyeM]

Military leadership is a special skill. It does not necessarily go along with strong "humanist" characteristics. The faulty results of WWII have almost nothing to do with Patton.
Any attempts to portray Stalin as any better than Hitler are ridiculous. Both men and their regimes were hideous and choosing between them more a matter of desperation than preference. It was very easy to hate the Nazis. For some reason, Stalinism did not elicit the same responses, at least not at the time. In any event, it was putting ideology and personality cult above everything that makes the two so similar and equally appalling.

 

[San Souci]

Thats just Bullshit, and just why would you have wanted the Nazis to murder more soviet citizens unless you are deranged or a Nazi?

Because the fuckin' Bolsheviks were just as bad. Should have let them destroy each other. Japan? Should never have embargoed them. They would have killed Mao.

 

[JoeB131]

Your love of the CCP and now “Uncle Joe” Stalin is duly noted

Patton called the final disposition of Europe a loss for the USA and Brits because it left great European capitals in the hands of the descendants of Genghis Khan

The Germans would have gladly surrendered their entire nation to Patton, but Stalin’s sock puppet FDR slowed our advance

Sucks that Eastern Europe had to suffer under Soviet Communism for decades, while you applaud it

As opposed to what? Before the war, they were various dictatorships of the fascist variety or corrupt monarchies. Which is why they all threw in with Hitler.

Even Poland stopped being a democracy in the 1930s, being ruled by a junta of Colonels.

 

[there4eyeM]

As opposed to what? Before the war, they were various dictatorships of the fascist variety or corrupt monarchies. Which is why they all threw in with Hitler.

Even Poland stopped being a democracy in the 1930s, being ruled by a junta of Colonels.

It must be admitted that Stalin drove many into the arms of Hitler.

 

[JoeB131]

It must be admitted that Stalin drove many into the arms of Hitler.

Oh, I don't disagree.

In fact, I think the main reason why the west gave hitler so much rope was because they were terrified of Stalin.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

As opposed to what? Before the war, they were various dictatorships of the fascist variety or corrupt monarchies. Which is why they all threw in with Hitler.

Even Poland stopped being a democracy in the 1930s, being ruled by a junta of Colonels.

As opposed to pushing the USSR back to its June 1941 boundary. Stalin used his FDR sock puppet to keep Eastern Europe

 

[JoeB131]

As opposed to pushing the USSR back to its June 1941 boundary. Stalin used his FDR sock puppet to keep Eastern Europe

Actually, he kept Eastern Europe because there wasn't jack shit we could do about it.

They had twice as many men in Europe and MUCH shorter supply lines.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Actually, he kept Eastern Europe because there wasn't jack shit we could do about it.

They had twice as many men in Europe and MUCH shorter supply lines.

There was plenty we could have done starting with taking all of Germany

 

[fncceo]

The Brits and French would never have permitted the US

They were in no position to prevent it.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Of course they were. We would have needed their lands, cooperation, etc. They would not have give it.

fncceo thinks we would have gone to war with France and the UK.

 

[fncceo]

Of course they were. We would have needed their lands, cooperation, etc. They would not have give it.

fncceo thinks we would have gone to war with France and the UK.

While it's foolish to speculate on alternative history, at the end of the War in Europe, the US had nearly twice as many troops on the ground as England and France combined, with significantly more, and better, aircraft, tanks, and munitions.

Unless Churchill and DeGaulle were mad (or more mad than DeGaulle is repudiated to have been), they would not have made a military move to prevent a US determined to prevent Soviet expansionism.

Besides, neither Churchill nor DeGaulle were politically aligned with The Soviets.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

While it's foolish to speculate on alternative history, at the end of the War in Europe, the US had nearly twice as many troops on the ground as England and France combined, with significantly more, and better, aircraft, tanks, and munitions.

Unless Churchill and DeGaulle were mad (or more mad than DeGaulle is repudiated to have been), they would not have made a military move to prevent a US determined to prevent Soviet expansionism.

Besides, neither Churchill nor DeGaulle were politically aligned with The Soviets.

Sure they would. They had countries and a continent to rebuild, not a mission to attack the Soviets.

 

[fncceo]

Sure they would. They had countries and a continent to rebuild, not a mission to attack the Soviets.

In fact, The Brits had a plan on the table to use Allied Forces to go to war against the Soviets in 1945.

Operation Unthinkable - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It never went forward for many reasons, not the least of which was a belief that we couldn't be counted on to participate.

 

[JoeB131]

There was plenty we could have done starting with taking all of Germany

Not really. The Soviets were in a much better position than we were in in terms of number of troops, supply lines, etc. By March, 1945, the Allies had barely crossed the Rhine, but the Soviets were already in East Prussia and Silesia, right on Berlin's doorstep.

In fact, The Brits had a plan on the table to use Allied Forces to go to war against the Soviets in 1945.

It never went forward for many reasons, not the least of which was a belief that we couldn't be counted on to participate.

That and it was batshit crazy. There's a reason that the British sacked Churchill before the war was even completely over.