Six veterans on Tim Walz’s and JD Vance’s military service: Letters to the Editor in Election 2024 forum and not Military forum.

Procrustes Stretched

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What can I do or say about this? I choose not to make it a partisan political attack or defense. I searched each of the 6 letters to see if any of these people would. I don't see that here. I do see some criticisms that go to what we know candidates and partisans have said. All six letters seem to have avoided what we mostly see here @ usmb and in the media in general.

I salute the patriotism, decency, virtue, and honor these six individuals display here.

But is about the election and campaigns.

Opinion - Letters to the Editor - August 18, 2024

Six veterans on Tim Walz’s and JD Vance’s military service

What do ‘stolen valor’ and ‘at war’ really mean? And what do veterans owe each other?

First of six
:

As a military veteran, I find it both disheartening and deeply disturbing to see the disparaging comments made by one set of fellow veterans aimed at others who served honorably, claiming that difficult personal decisions constitute “stolen valor” or even traitorous behavior.

I served as a commissioned officer for 42 years, almost 34 of which I spent on active duty. I did not serve in direct combat nor formally deploy, though I did take assignments in 13 locations — two of them overseas — and numerous trips to combat zones in the Balkans, Kuwait, Iraq and Afghanistan. My career was punctuated by many choices I had to make to balance my service with personal demands.

My colleagues and I served alongside countless National Guard members and reservists, without whom we could not have delivered lifesaving and rehabilitative care during numerous wars and humanitarian crises. I remain in awe of these soldier-citizens who balanced jobs and family and community responsibilities with the demands of national service. The injuries, illnesses and wounds they suffered — most of which were the result of training or strenuous military jobs and not direct combat — often changed their lives forever. Many lost their lives.

For any of us fellow veterans to find fault with personal decisions made by these dedicated public servants about how and when they served is beyond unfortunate.

I did not have the opportunity to work with the Republican vice-presidential candidate, despite helping to care for many of his fellow Marines. I am grateful for his service. I accompanied then-Rep. Tim Walz and members of the House Veterans’ Affairs Committee to visit Afghanistan during Operation Enduring Freedom. Mr. Walz’s work ethic, communication skills and grasp of the tactical to the strategic were remarkable. As a retired Army National Guard senior noncommissioned officer, he understood the military and military families.

The military branches have clear guidance about the characterization of service in uniform, regardless of the length of time served or the component in which one served. “Honorable” best describes what all of us aspire to achieve and ought to be the sole descriptor for those who do so.

Eric B. Schoomaker, Silver Spring

The writer is a retired lieutenant general who served as Army surgeon general and the commanding general for the U.S. Army Medical Command.


 
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Might as well give it up now, the dainty.

Some veterans choose to take it easy on Timmy. Others don’t.

He served during some war. He didn’t serve in any war. That’s just a fact.

Learn to cope with reality.

 
Honor without heroism

Although I was happy enough to serve in the military, I never would have volunteered for duty in Vietnam, unlike my boyhood friend Lee Herron. If I had received orders, I would have obeyed — but not as a “happy camper.”

I was unhappy about being sent to Okinawa in 1972, not because of fighting there but because it was an “unaccompanied” 12-month tour, and I was not permitted to take my wife and 1-year-old daughter. I was a Marine judge advocate, and when I arrived in Okinawa, JAG officers were still being sent from there to Vietnam for temporary duty, though I was neither asked nor ordered to go.

So unlike Lee, who volunteered for Vietnam and for front-line duty once there, I am no hero. But I am proud that I did serve honorably for three years in the Marine Corps. However, I purposely always make it clear that I did not serve in Vietnam. I am particularly offended and disgusted whenever someone falsely claims to have some military service that they did not have.

At least for now, it does not appear to me that comments made by either Sen. JD Vance or Gov. Tim Walz would come anywhere close to being classified as “stolen valor.” Both men served the allotted time required by their enlistment contracts. Neither man has claimed to have been in battle, and neither one claims to have received a medal for valor.

David Nelson, Houston
 
note: save

Might as well give it up now, the dainty.

Some veterans choose to take it easy on Timmy. Others don’t.

He served during some war. He didn’t serve in any war. That’s just a fact.

Learn to cope with reality.

Sad and pathetic post.

:th_Back_2_Topic_2:

Anyone interested in what transpired here can go back and read post #1/OP and put it all into context
 
Defining ‘stolen valor’

As a retired Navy captain, it saddens me that JD Vance is accusing Tim Walz of “stolen valor” apparently for not having personally served in Iraq. Mr. Vance is mistaken about the term, which actually means wearing combat ribbons although never having served in actual combat and pretending to be a combat veteran. Mr. Walz has never claimed to have served in Iraq, nor is his Army uniform decorated with combat ribbons he was never awarded. I respect both Mr. Vance and Mr. Walz for having served in the military and for earning the title of veteran.

It’s disingenuous for Mr. Vance to not only denigrate a fellow veteran for political gain but also to question the patriotism of a man who served as a U.S. Army command sergeant with more than two decades of honorable service to our county. Mr. Vance needs to apologize to Mr. Walz, and he owes our nation and the rest of our proud veterans an apology as well.

Reg Mitchell, Bethesda
 
note: save


Sad and pathetic post.

:th_Back_2_Topic_2:
I did post on topic, the dainty.

But, as usual, you once again have chosen not to do so.

Even in your own idiotic thread.

😂🤣

 
I did post on topic, the dainty.

But, as usual, you once again have chosen not to do so.

Even in your own idiotic thread.

😂🤣

stop trolling. Try and respect military veterans speaking of their service, and how they view the nasty, partisan bs you've engaged in spouting even now.

again
 
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The right to retire

Sen. JD Vance’s attack on the military record of Gov. Tim Walz is offensive to all veterans. As a Vietnam veteran, I learned that how, when, where — or even if — soldiers are sent into combat is a matter of pure chance, and that all of us soldiers endured the possibility of being called to this duty every day until our country permitted us to leave the military.

I served in combat but was permitted to leave after two years, which I did (with great relief). Mr. Walz was not called to combat for 24 years and had the right to resign before he was called, which he did. Mr. Vance and I could have extended our duties, but we chose not to. Mr. Walz and Mr. Vance both deserve a thank-you for their service.

No veterans who have honorably served our country should be judged for when or why they exercised their choice to leave the military when permitted to do so.

John Satorius, Minneapolis
 
What Mr. Walz should say

Indignant condemnations of anyone who criticizes Gov. Tim Walz’s decisions about and discussions of his military service misclassify those skeptics as attacking his military record in a general way. But the critics are targeting both the timing of Mr. Walz’s retirement from the National Guard and his potential suggestion that he faced personal danger in war. Mr. Walz’s critics may not have a leg to stand on, but they do have a toe.

So as a passionate Harris/Walz supporter — and as a mere combat-zone veteran who would never represent himself as a combat veteran — I hope Mr. Walz will stand forthrightly before reporters immediately, address all of these charges, apologize anywhere that might be necessary, take questions until the last questioner leaves, end this goofball sideshow and return to helping Vice President Kamala Harris save the republic.

Steven T. Corneliussen, Poquoson, Va.
 
Strength through truth

Like Gov. Tim Walz, I was a National Guard member. But like Sen. JD Vance, I served in a military public affairs unit.

Like Mr. Vance, I attended the Defense Information School at Fort Meade, Md., for my initial training. We took classes in news writing, photography and broadcasting. We learned how to interact with the media and support the objective of keeping the American public well informed. We trained to shoot with cameras, not guns, and became literal keyboard warriors. The motto of the school? “Strength through truth.”

Having gone through the same training, Mr. Vance should know that the best way to counter a misleading narrative is full and accurate disclosure. I offer my own experience in the hopes it will provide insight into what both Mr. Vance’s and Mr. Walz’s service experiences may have been like.

After completing my initial training, I returned home to Massachusetts and joined the ranks of the 65th Press Camp Headquarters. There, I learned that the “one weekend a month, two weeks a year” time commitment was the biggest lie I had ever been told. My unit mobilized to support humanitarian missions at home and training missions abroad, to help civil authorities during emergencies and to deploy in combat zones in the Middle East for a year in support of the fight against the so-called Islamic State. Through it all, my fellow soldiers and I held down civilian jobs, found ways to pay the bills, went to graduate school and tried to keep some semblance of normality with our families and friends.

As junior enlisted public affairs specialists, Mr. Vance and I likely spent our duty days in a very similar manner: writing news releases, taking photos, escorting the media and shamming — military jargon for the socially acceptable act of avoiding work and superiors — whenever possible. Neither of us was Rambo.

I am not criticizing or belittling Mr. Vance’s military service. I disagree with him on many issues, but I commend his decision to put his life at risk to keep the American public well informed.

I do, however, condemn his choice to criticize Mr. Walz. Going after the multidecade service of a fellow veteran is not productive nor in line with the core values of the U.S. military. The fact that an individual has volunteered to serve his or her country in any way, shape or form is good enough for me and should be good enough for my fellow POG — person other than grunt— Mr. Vance.

Samuel D. Keenan, Washington
 

What it means to be ‘at war’


A disappointing aspect of the flap over Gov. Tim Walz’s description of his military service is the failure of the media, including The Post, to explain what it means to “carry weapons of war at war.” This reflects a broader public failure to distinguish “war” from combat operations and to understand that the enemy gets a vote.

When I taught two generations of military officers at National Defense University and Air University, we studied the national security strategies issued by various presidents. Neither strategy documents nor joint doctrine uses the imprecise and misleading term “combat zone.”

What qualifies as a combat zone, after all? Did Northern Virginia on Sept. 10, 2001? Honolulu on Dec. 6, 1941? No, but those regions became combat zones the following days. What about the evening of 9/11? The men and women who patrolled the Potomac and Hudson by land, sea and air did not know if they were still in a combat zone, but they most assuredly carried weapons of war at war.

Despite the unfortunate American tendency to think of war in terms of “over there” and to assume that we will determine if and when combat operations take place, the armed forces after 9/11 did not share that illusion. They were (and still are, I hope) prepared for possible terrorist attacks, whether in the homeland or overseas. The base to which Mr. Walz deployed did not, as it turned out, become a “combat zone.” Other U.S. military bases did.

Whatever one’s political views, using imprecise terminology and sloppy language to discuss U.S. national security hurts us all.

Edwina S. Campbell, Sonoma, Calif.

The writer is a former U.S. Foreign Service officer and the author of multiple books about diplomacy.
 
I've started this thread knowing full well some few here would show up to troll it, all while ignoring the content, just seeking to make personal attacks on me. Fine. It comes with the territory.

What is so pathetic and sad a thing is this happens when I am not really commenting beyond the OP. I'm sharing the heartfelt views of military veterans who have all spoken about honor.

I think of this: "If someone is ill mannered by ignorance, let it pass rather than point it out." - Erasmus in his 1534 essay De Civitate

Thing is here, Liability (BackAgain), is not ignorant of what he is doing.

What can I do or say about this? I choose not to make it a partisan political attack or defense. I searched each of the 6 letters to see if any of these people would. I don't see that here. I do see some criticisms that go to what we know candidates and partisans have said. All six letters seem to have avoided what we mostly see here @ usmb and in the media in general.

I salute the patriotism, decency, virtue, and honor these six individuals display here.

But is about the election and campaigns.

Opinion - Letters to the Editor - August 18, 2024

Six veterans on Tim Walz’s and JD Vance’s military service

What do ‘stolen valor’ and ‘at war’ really mean? And what do veterans owe each other?




 
What can I do or say about this? I choose not to make it a partisan political attack or defense. I searched each of the 6 letters to see if any of these people would. I don't see that here. I do see some criticisms that go to what we know candidates and partisans have said. All six letters seem to have avoided what we mostly see here @ usmb and in the media in general.

I salute the patriotism, decency, virtue, and honor these six individuals display here.

But is about the election and campaigns.

Opinion - Letters to the Editor - August 18, 2024

Six veterans on Tim Walz’s and JD Vance’s military service

What do ‘stolen valor’ and ‘at war’ really mean? And what do veterans owe each other?

First of six
:

As a military veteran, I find it both disheartening and deeply disturbing to see the disparaging comments made by one set of fellow veterans aimed at others who served honorably, claiming that difficult personal decisions constitute “stolen valor” or even traitorous behavior.

I served as a commissioned officer for 42 years, almost 34 of which I spent on active duty. I did not serve in direct combat nor formally deploy, though I did take assignments in 13 locations — two of them overseas — and numerous trips to combat zones in the Balkans, Kuwait, Iraq and Afghanistan. My career was punctuated by many choices I had to make to balance my service with personal demands.

My colleagues and I served alongside countless National Guard members and reservists, without whom we could not have delivered lifesaving and rehabilitative care during numerous wars and humanitarian crises. I remain in awe of these soldier-citizens who balanced jobs and family and community responsibilities with the demands of national service. The injuries, illnesses and wounds they suffered — most of which were the result of training or strenuous military jobs and not direct combat — often changed their lives forever. Many lost their lives.

For any of us fellow veterans to find fault with personal decisions made by these dedicated public servants about how and when they served is beyond unfortunate.

I did not have the opportunity to work with the Republican vice-presidential candidate, despite helping to care for many of his fellow Marines. I am grateful for his service. I accompanied then-Rep. Tim Walz and members of the House Veterans’ Affairs Committee to visit Afghanistan during Operation Enduring Freedom. Mr. Walz’s work ethic, communication skills and grasp of the tactical to the strategic were remarkable. As a retired Army National Guard senior noncommissioned officer, he understood the military and military families.

The military branches have clear guidance about the characterization of service in uniform, regardless of the length of time served or the component in which one served. “Honorable” best describes what all of us aspire to achieve and ought to be the sole descriptor for those who do so.

Eric B. Schoomaker, Silver Spring

The writer is a retired lieutenant general who served as Army surgeon general and the commanding general for the U.S. Army Medical Command.


He lied This letter is meaningless
 
He lied This letter is meaningless
tyrone lame .jpg

He lied This letter is meaningless
 
stop trolling. Try and respect military veterans speaking of their service, and how they view the nasty, partisan bs you've engaged in spouting even now.

again
I have to call bullshit, Dante. Partisanship started this propaganda thread. You really aren't being clever when you feign neutrality. This isn't about military honor. You said so. It is about the election.
A bon mot pour vous, mon ami:
In this day and age only believe half of what you see and none of what you hear...
 
I have to call bullshit, Dante. Partisanship started this propaganda thread. You really aren't being clever when you feign neutrality. This isn't about military honor. You said so. It is about the election.
A bon mot pour vous, mon ami:
In this day and age only believe half of what you see and none of what you hear...

Veterans spoke of what is happening with attacks on Veterans by others including veterans. Every single letter addresses honor.


I've already written: I've started this thread knowing full well some few here would show up to troll it, all while ignoring the content, just seeking to make personal attacks on me. Fine. It comes with the territory.

What is so pathetic and sad a thing is this happens when I am not really commenting beyond the OP. I'm sharing the heartfelt views of military veterans who have all spoken about honor.

I think of this: "If someone is ill mannered by ignorance, let it pass rather than point it out." - Erasmus in his 1534 essay De Civitate

Thing is here, neither you nor Liability (BackAgain), is ignorant of what you are doing.
 
And yet again the dainty refuses to man up and post on topic in his own idiot fail thread.

I’ll assist him because, clearly, he isn’t up to the simple matter of posting on topic:


You know, after a certain point the topic SHOULD be “why can’t Walz be honest about his service?”

As I have noted in the past, I maintain he deserves some props for having served at all. But why does he lie about that service so frequently?

None of the dainty’s transparently fraudulent efforts to prop-up tiny Timmy would ever dare to address THAT question.
 

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