Snowden vs. Manning.

[Oddball]

I think the main difference between the two - the only difference - is one learned from the mistakes of the other.

Both felt they were acting on strong moral principles.

Both betrayed information - one betrayed classified information, one betrayed Top Secret information.

One released information indiscrimminantly, one with more discrimmination.

Either both are heros or both are traiters.

Manning took an oath to protect the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic....I don't know what oath Snowden took.

From that angle, Manning could well have the better case.

 

[Lakhota]

Snowden's whistleblowing gives us a chance to roll back what is tantamount to an 'executive coup' against the US constitution.

In my estimation, there has not been in American history a more important leak than Edward Snowden's release of NSA material – and that definitely includes the Pentagon Papers 40 years ago. Snowden's whistleblowing gives us the possibility to roll back a key part of what has amounted to an "executive coup" against the US constitution.

Daniel Ellsberg: Edward Snowden, Saving Us From the United Stasi of America | Alternet

 

[mudwhistle]

Both betrayed the trust of the government while working in some very sensitive areas. Both put on display how really seriously the government has hid information about what they are up.

One, conservatives wanted to see put to death.
One, conservatives hail as a hero.

One, stayed in their country to face the music.
One, fled.

Manning revealed secrets while Snow basically blew the whistle on what was going on in a program we already knew about.

Manning was a soldier and needs to be locked up, but where Snow is concerned......well, it's too early to make a judgment on him. Seems to me he's just said what I've been saying all along, only he signed a none disclosure agreement. If I was in his position I would have just quit.

I hear this guy even released the Abu Gharab photos, so you should love his ass.

 

[blackhawk]

How about everyone admit the truth the left supports Manning because his politics seem to lean left the right backs Snowden because his appear to lean right.

 

[Coyote]

How about everyone admit the truth the left supports Manning because his politics seem to lean left the right backs Snowden because his appear to lean right.

ding ding ding....we have a winner!

I think you just nailed it

 

[Oddball]

How about everyone admit the truth the left supports Manning because his politics seem to lean left the right backs Snowden because his appear to lean right.

I support them both.

Too much sneaky KGB shit going on in the District of Criminals...We need more people to roll on those dickweeds.

 

[Coyote]

Both Manning and Snowden bring up an interesting question: when is it "whistle blowing" and when is it "treason"?

 

[alan1]

I think the main difference between the two - the only difference - is one learned from the mistakes of the other.

Both felt they were acting on strong moral principles.

Both betrayed information - one betrayed classified information, one betrayed Top Secret information.

One released information indiscrimminantly, one with more discrimmination.

Either both are heros or both are traiters.

One released classified information.
One released a process.
Two different things.
The founding fathers wrote this,

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Mr Snowden revealed that the government was violating the fourth amendment. A basis for our liberty being violated by a government that was purposefully created to prevent such action.

 

[Lakhota]

Greenwald: Snowden Has 'Way, Way More Than Just Some Slides' | TPM LiveWire

The Guardian's Glenn Greenwald: 'There's a lot more coming' | TPM LiveWire

 

[Oddball]

Another four bits for Spamahontas!

 

[mudwhistle]

Both Manning and Snowden bring up an interesting question: when is it "whistle blowing" and when is it "treason"?

Nether is treason.

Treason is giving aid and comfort to the enemy.

Manning revealed secrets that were used to embarrass the country.

Snowden can't embarrass the Obama Administration any more than they already have themselves.

 

[Coyote]

I think the main difference between the two - the only difference - is one learned from the mistakes of the other.

Both felt they were acting on strong moral principles.

Both betrayed information - one betrayed classified information, one betrayed Top Secret information.

One released information indiscrimminantly, one with more discrimmination.

Either both are heros or both are traiters.

One released classified information.
One released a process.
Two different things.
The founding fathers wrote this,

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Mr Snowden revealed that the government was violating the fourth amendment. A basis for our liberty being violated by a government that was purposefully created to prevent such action.

Snowden released Top Secret material - whether it's a process or specifics, it makes no difference - it was Top Secret. Manning released a far lower level of classified material, though more indiscriminately. Both felt the government was committing grave wrongs that the public had a right to know.

Whether the government was violating anything or not remains to be seen.

 

[Lakhota]

John Bolton says it's treason.

 

[mudwhistle]

I think the main difference between the two - the only difference - is one learned from the mistakes of the other.

Both felt they were acting on strong moral principles.

Both betrayed information - one betrayed classified information, one betrayed Top Secret information.

One released information indiscrimminantly, one with more discrimmination.

Either both are heros or both are traiters.

One released classified information.
One released a process.
Two different things.
The founding fathers wrote this,

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Mr Snowden revealed that the government was violating the fourth amendment. A basis for our liberty being violated by a government that was purposefully created to prevent such action.

Snowden released Top Secret material - whether it's a process or specifics, it makes no difference - it was Top Secret. Manning released a far lower level of classified material, though more indiscriminately. Both felt the government was committing grave wrongs that the public had a right to know.

Whether the government was violating anything or not remains to be seen.

We already knew about the NSA data mining program.

What the current administration is doing is much, much more extensive and intrusive, and there is probable cause to believe the information gathered has been used against political opponents, political advocates, journalists, Supreme Court justices, the list goes on and on.

I wonder how they found out about the details of Gen. Petreaus's affair?
How did they know that Ted Nugent had improperly tagged a kill during a hunting trip?
How did they come up with all of these stories about Mitt Romney?

The Obama Administration is spying on political opponents or anyone who just happens to piss him off at the moment. He thinks he can do anything he wants and get away with it. He doesn't believe the law applies to him.

 

[Oddball]

John Bolton says it's treason.

John Bolton is to Chimpola what Susan Rice is to your Deal Leader.

Chump.

 

[dblack]

John Bolton says it's treason.

Birds of a feather.

 

[alan1]

I think the main difference between the two - the only difference - is one learned from the mistakes of the other.

Both felt they were acting on strong moral principles.

Both betrayed information - one betrayed classified information, one betrayed Top Secret information.

One released information indiscrimminantly, one with more discrimmination.

Either both are heros or both are traiters.

One released classified information.
One released a process.
Two different things.
The founding fathers wrote this,

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Mr Snowden revealed that the government was violating the fourth amendment. A basis for our liberty being violated by a government that was purposefully created to prevent such action.

Snowden released Top Secret material - whether it's a process or specifics, it makes no difference - it was Top Secret. Manning released a far lower level of classified material, though more indiscriminately. Both felt the government was committing grave wrongs that the public had a right to know.

Whether the government was violating anything or not remains to be seen.

Name the top secret material Mr Snowden released. He only released a process.
Go back and read the Fourth Amendment I posted. It is written in clear and precise words that are not subject to interpretation. The government violated that with a generic order to seize the records of millions of people. Only a fool would think that the writers and signers of the US Constitution and Bill Of Rights would find this type of action acceptable.

 

[Lakhota]

Why NSA IT Guy Edward Snowden Leaked Top Secret Documents - Forbes

 

[LordBrownTrout]

John Bolton says it's treason.

So I guess you think by quoting Bolton, you have somehow gained a shred of legitimacy. Lol. The federal govt is only concerned because their horrible track record of usurping the constitution is being exposed.....and you're cheering it on.

 

[Lakhota]

John Bolton says it's treason.

So I guess you think by quoting Bolton, you have somehow gained a shred of legitimacy. Lol. The federal govt is only concerned because their horrible track record of usurping the constitution is being exposed.....and you're cheering it on.

Bolton is a lunatic - but he's your lunatic.