Stop all benefits for one year.

[SwimExpert]

We could eliminate the IRS and tie Congressional pay to their successful performance of the duties they were elected to accomplish.

If we eliminate the IRS there will be no taxes collected at all. Reforming Congressional pay is a great idea. But it would still be less than a drop in the bucket. "Successful" performance of their duties is too vague and opinion based a standard to base anything on. But their pay should definitely cease when a government shutdown occurs.

 

[SFC Ollie]

I gave one example out of hundreds.

If there are hundreds, then perhaps you can offer.....10? I don't think ten out of hundreds is an unreasonable request.

You really are that stupid...

One quick search and here's one site that lists at least ten worth billions.....
Now STFU with your stupidity.....

Coburn Releases Annual Wastebook Highlighting Most Egregious Spending of 2013 - Press Releases - Tom Coburn, M.D., United States Senator from Oklahoma

You see Senators know this and they publish it locally, If they would simply get together and collectively pull their heads out of their asses most problems in Washington would get fixed.....

 

[gallantwarrior]

There are billions being wasted every year in this country on really stupid programs. If people knew about even a tenth of them we'd be able to vote out every incumbent in Washington.

For instance:

$630,000 in stimulus funds meant to install energy efficiency retrofits around Washington D.C. were distributed to – of all recipients – a dance group and a film group. These groups had no energy installation qualifications whatsoever, and predictably failed to successfully perform the job that they took taxpayer money to do.

Down the Drain - Newsroom - Rob Portman

The stimulus was several years ago, and it's over. Not to mention $630,000 is less than a drop in the bucket. We have a $17 trillion debt. You are complaining about less than .00000004% of the total debt. And about .00000057% of last year's deficit.

Well, you see, that's the big problem here. Everyone wants to parse that portion of the debt represented by this or that program. We have to start looking at the bigger picture. Across-the-board cuts should be across the board. If one group suffers, so should all the others. Oh, yeah, SS...loads of money extorted from many of us who had no choice to contribute, or not, on the promise that we'd get that money back when we retired. That is definitely an entitlement. Welfare and all those other programs, those are giveaways that serve the purpose of buying public favor from specific groups of people.

 

[gallantwarrior]

People paid into Social Security and medicare, you can not just stop it.

Is it really any worse than raising the eligibility age while reducing benefits? After all, they'd still get their $7500 check for the year.

Yes, it is worse. Phasing in changes allows younger people to plan for their futures. Somebody who is already retired and made his plans for retirement based on SS payments is fucked if the rules are changed on him after the fact.

My personal preference would be to opt out of SS and to keep my money for my own retirement.

I'd be happy if they just paid me back what they've stolen from me. I would promise to never blacken their door, ever again.

 

[SwimExpert]

I'm curious. To you, what is it exactly that would "help" the economy? Give us some examples.

It's all about putting money into the hands of the people, so they can spend it as they see fit. By spending money, they will create jobs, which will create work opportunities for those who aren't working, and living on the government. This will then lead to increased tax receipts. And coupled with the spending and deficit reductions, will help to bring us closer to a balanced budget, and eventually to paying down the debt.

 

[SFC Ollie]

So we were wrong to plan on having social security? Really?

If your plan was to expect to survive off of government handouts, then yes, you were wrong. There is no reason why you could not have set yourself up for success without the government needing to provide for you. After all, it's exactly what you're expecting the younger generation to do. Set themselves up to survive without Social Security being available.

So since I paid into a program my entire adult life in your eye the government is providing for me...Not the money I paid into the system for all those years but the government.

I don't expect the younger generation to do anything other than be smarter than my generation. But since most young people these days are liberals I don't see that happening....But why wouldn't SS be available? Are you advocating the destruction of the program?

 

[SwimExpert]

BTW, can someone please hit me with some neg rep? Ollie hit me once already, and I really would like more.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Is it really any worse than raising the eligibility age while reducing benefits? After all, they'd still get their $7500 check for the year.

Yes, it is worse. Phasing in changes allows younger people to plan for their futures. Somebody who is already retired and made his plans for retirement based on SS payments is fucked if the rules are changed on him after the fact.

My personal preference would be to opt out of SS and to keep my money for my own retirement.

Why are people planning on government dependency? Shouldn't they be planning on self dependency?

I'm perfectly happy to be self-dependent, I just want all the money back that government has stolen from me for the past 45 years. I'll even forgo the employer contributions. I just want MY money back, thanks.

 

[SFC Ollie]

BTW, can someone please hit me with some neg rep? Ollie hit me once already, and I really would like more.

You keep up with the stupidity and you'll get it. Ask Rdean.......

 

[SwimExpert]

So since I paid into a program my entire adult life in your eye the government is providing for me...Not the money I paid into the system for all those years but the government.

Now you're getting it. We've all been paying taxes our entire life. I'm paying taxes right now. But is the government going to pay anything for me to retire on? Of course not. Hell, I'm paying Social Security taxes that are never going to give me any kind of retirement benefit. By the time I get to that age, Social Security is going to be a thing of the past. You're perfectly okay with that. As long as you get yours, that's all that matters. We can continue to sink down the rabbit hole of massive debt for YOUR entire life. The next generation will pay it off.

I don't expect the younger generation to do anything other than be smarter than my generation.

Yeah, you do.

But since most young people these days are liberals I don't see that happening....But why wouldn't SS be available? Are you advocating the destruction of the program?

Oh, I guess you're not aware. Social Security is going bankrupt and the federal government currently is in debt by $17 trillion dollars. How long do you think we can go before we can't borrow any more money to pay for your government hand out?

 

[SwimExpert]

I'm perfectly happy to be self-dependent, I just want all the money back that government has stolen from me for the past 45 years. I'll even forgo the employer contributions. I just want MY money back, thanks.

That would be great, it really would. I think we would all be in favor of that. Unfortunately, the funds do not exist anymore. We can either write off our losses now, or pass them on to the children currently in grade school.

 

[orogenicman]

Nice plan.

So all you have are complaints? No alternatives on how we can reduce spending while also helping those in need?

I have an idea. Cut the military budget in half. We'd still have the largest, most capable military on the planet, and wouldn't have to worry about throwing our sick and elderly into the streets, as you are suggesting.

 

[orogenicman]

Yes, it is worse. Phasing in changes allows younger people to plan for their futures. Somebody who is already retired and made his plans for retirement based on SS payments is fucked if the rules are changed on him after the fact.

My personal preference would be to opt out of SS and to keep my money for my own retirement.

Why are people planning on government dependency? Shouldn't they be planning on self dependency?

I'm perfectly happy to be self-dependent, I just want all the money back that government has stolen from me for the past 45 years. I'll even forgo the employer contributions. I just want MY money back, thanks.

You don't get to unilaterally disobey the Constitution. What? You didn't know that the government not only has the right, but has an obligation to collect taxes? Huh.

 

[SwimExpert]

Nice plan.

So all you have are complaints? No alternatives on how we can reduce spending while also helping those in need?

I have an idea. Cut the military budget in half. We'd still have the largest, most capable military on the planet, and wouldn't have to worry about throwing our sick and elderly into the streets, as you are suggesting.

As I noted before, we could cut defense spending by 100% and we would still have a deficit. Whether we like it or not, we need to address the biggest parts of our spending, which is entitlements.

 

[gallantwarrior]

So we were wrong to plan on having social security? Really?

If your plan was to expect to survive off of government handouts, then yes, you were wrong. There is no reason why you could not have set yourself up for success without the government needing to provide for you. After all, it's exactly what you're expecting the younger generation to do. Set themselves up to survive without Social Security being available.

Many of our generation were given NO choice. Our money was extorted from every, single paycheck and we had no choice to opt out of this bullshit program. So, yes, I (and many like me) fully expect to receive some stipend as a result of years of contributions. We were promised a return on our "investment". We are not responsible for the fact that government has squandered our investment and wasted the money we contributed, ostensibly for our retirements.

 

[Londoner]

It may come as some surprise to you, but the federal government OWES money to SS.

This was Reagan's grand trick.

The Reagan Administration needed more money to fund all of its increased spending, especially for things like the Star Wars Military Shield. Remember: Reagan increased the debt limit 17 times. He tripled Carter's spending. He invented our modern, outsized deficits by combining massive spending increases with massive tax breaks. (Despite his rhetoric to the contrary, he left a poisonous debt structure in place).

But, so . . . with his increased spending, Reagan needed to find more money ...

So Reagan created the Social Security Trust Fund to enable more government borrowing/spending (which became necessary when his tax cuts to the job shippers failed to produce the needed revenue to pay for his increased spending). The trust fund was an accounting trick that allowed the Government to borrow money against current and future Social Security receipts. Granted, Reagan did increase Social Security Taxes to counterbalance the fact that he raided the fund and put the American people deeply in debt because of it; however, those taxes were repressive and disproportionately levied on poor workers (-remember: the wealthy get more of their money from investments which, wink wink, do not have this particular tax. This was a classic Reagan scam from a presidency that was filled with them. Of course the current generation of Republican voters know nothing of this because they have been drugged with tales of the mythological Reagan, who was invented to give Movement Conservatism a Foundational Leader).

It was fucking hilarious though. Reagan basically put a massive IOU in the place where people's Social Security savings should have existed - which IOU required further government borrowing to fill the gap. It was a classic Reagan debt gimmick . . .criminal financial mismanagement... and you ain't never going to hear about it on FOX News.

Social Security was doing just fine. It was structured to remain solvent until the 2030's when a minor tweak would have kept it alive much longer. This is well known in wonk'ville.

However, Social Security was bankrupted by Reagan's gimmick. The program is now in debt in order to pay for things like Star Wars, which turned out to be a technological impossibility that, wink wink, created some very lucrative weapons contracts for the GOP donor base.

It gets worse. Anyone currently below 50 is in for a big surprise. The Government is going to cut the very Social Security benefits which the poor worker paid for in taxes. Fucking brilliant, right? You raise taxes on the poor worker so that he will have Social Security. Then, you take the fucking money that you told him would be for Social Security... and you spend that money on complete bullshit. Then ... [wait for it] . . . you tell the poor worker that his Social Security isn't there because you spent it on blow jobs to your weapons donors.

Oh Ronnie!!!!!

(if your cheerleaders only knew the truth)

 

[gallantwarrior]

I'm curious. To you, what is it exactly that would "help" the economy? Give us some examples.

It's all about putting money into the hands of the people, so they can spend it as they see fit. By spending money, they will create jobs, which will create work opportunities for those who aren't working, and living on the government. This will then lead to increased tax receipts. And coupled with the spending and deficit reductions, will help to bring us closer to a balanced budget, and eventually to paying down the debt.

I'm thinking we mostly disagree on how money should find its way to the hands of the people.

 

[gallantwarrior]

So since I paid into a program my entire adult life in your eye the government is providing for me...Not the money I paid into the system for all those years but the government.

Now you're getting it. We've all been paying taxes our entire life. I'm paying taxes right now. But is the government going to pay anything for me to retire on? Of course not. Hell, I'm paying Social Security taxes that are never going to give me any kind of retirement benefit. By the time I get to that age, Social Security is going to be a thing of the past. You're perfectly okay with that. As long as you get yours, that's all that matters. We can continue to sink down the rabbit hole of massive debt for YOUR entire life. The next generation will pay it off.

I don't expect the younger generation to do anything other than be smarter than my generation.

Yeah, you do.

But since most young people these days are liberals I don't see that happening....But why wouldn't SS be available? Are you advocating the destruction of the program?

Oh, I guess you're not aware. Social Security is going bankrupt and the federal government currently is in debt by $17 trillion dollars. How long do you think we can go before we can't borrow any more money to pay for your government hand out?

I am personally not "for" that. I see where we need to get government out of the pension business and let people plan for their own retirements...or not.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I repeat, if we stop paying Social Security then the TAX FOR Social Security goes away too.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I'm perfectly happy to be self-dependent, I just want all the money back that government has stolen from me for the past 45 years. I'll even forgo the employer contributions. I just want MY money back, thanks.

That would be great, it really would. I think we would all be in favor of that. Unfortunately, the funds do not exist anymore. We can either write off our losses now, or pass them on to the children currently in grade school.

You know what, if they can find funds to finance green energy, or to bail out automobile companies (that make more money then I have ever or will ever see), or to pay federal employees an extra 19 days vacation time, etc, I'd have no problem. But, you see, the money I paid into a fund should have been "earmarked" for my retirement...as promised. So what do you tell the millions who have been coerced into paying into SS and are now faced with being told "Sorry, we just don't have your money any more, starve as you see fit."?