CDZ Tax Simplification, Who Will be the Losers

[william the wie]

A consensus seems to be forming that simplification will disproportionately harm blue states because of increased tax flight. However compounding rates of tax flight have been with us for half a century so why the Hysteria now?

 

[AVG-JOE]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Fair and simple tax codes...

Public budgets that are balanced by law...

Transparency in spending.
​

Then, build an economy that your kids can drive to the stars.

Still not rocket science, y'all.​

 

[AVG-JOE]

A consensus seems to be forming that simplification will disproportionately harm blue states because of increased tax flight. However compounding rates of tax flight have been with us for half a century so why the Hysteria now?

Anyone bitching about a true simplification of the tax code is taking advantage of the complicated bullshit we currently employ to avoid paying their fair share.

 

[yiostheoy]

I think future generations will be the losers because Trump's changes will obviously increase the deficit and debt same as G.W. Bush's did.

There are already rumors of another 5% dividend repatriation rate for tax cheats like Apple, Microsoft, Wallmart, Google, etc.

 

[frigidweirdo]

A consensus seems to be forming that simplification will disproportionately harm blue states because of increased tax flight. However compounding rates of tax flight have been with us for half a century so why the Hysteria now?

It will always hurt the poor. It's only ever expounded by the rich or the right.

 

[AVG-JOE]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

 

[frigidweirdo]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

 

[william the wie]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Almost total agreement. Simplifying the tax code will also permit reduction in the size of the IRS but given that state and local taxes will remain more or less untouched that has implications. For example it will become much harder for many states to come up with the money for federal matching funds and the states that will suffer the most from this inability to come up with funds are going to be blue states.

 

[Never3ndr]

A consensus seems to be forming that simplification will disproportionately harm blue states because of increased tax flight. However compounding rates of tax flight have been with us for half a century so why the Hysteria now?

It really depends on the implementation of the tax simplification. However, our tax code is so complex that we really do need to invest in simplifying it...it is an unnecessary bureaucratic mess.

With that said, there are good reasons for some of the exemptions and complexities that are out there, but I would rather have a soft "tax reset" back to a simple base, and then force Congress to re-approve these measures rather than being happy with the morass of our tax code as it stands just because there are some reasons for some of the way that it is.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

define "fair share"

 

[Skull Pilot]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

of course it is.

everyone pays the same percentage of their income period

 

[frigidweirdo]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

of course it is.

everyone pays the same percentage of their income period

But does everyone get the same amount of services? No

It's like going into a restaurant and everyone pays the same to eat. Yet one person gets a great meal, and someone else gets rubbish.

 

[frigidweirdo]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

define "fair share"

Many rich and corporations get a lot from government but end up not paying for what they get.

 

[AVG-JOE]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

define "fair share"

Taxes based on a code that is applied exactly the same to everyone.

For example:

Federal tax of 15% on all personal income in excess of $40,000 and a federal corporate tax of 3% on all income net of non-executive payroll.

Everyone should know with certainty EXACTLY what everyone else is paying on a percentage basis, because that's what they're paying.

 

[FA_Q2]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

of course it is.

everyone pays the same percentage of their income period

But does everyone get the same amount of services? No

It's like going into a restaurant and everyone pays the same to eat. Yet one person gets a great meal, and someone else gets rubbish.

You really cant base tax on service. If you really wanted to base the tax code on that you would have the poor who use the vast majority of government services paying far more than the rich were.

And no, it is a false narrative that the rich use more government than the poor.

A simple tax code is the only way that it can be fair. There is no measure for government services like access to protected rights, national security and jails. Right now we have the poor paying a larger share of their income than the rich to the federal government. True simplification of the tax code will benefit not only the middle class but the poor as well. It will hose the uber rich as they are the ones that have been manipulating the code to benefit special interests.

It always amazes me that some claim simplifying the tax code will hurt the middle class and poor but then complain that Romney pays a smaller percentage than his secretary. The two concepts are entirely at odds.

 

[frigidweirdo]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

define "fair share"

Taxes based on a code that is applied exactly the same to everyone.

For example:

Federal tax of 15% on all personal income in excess of $40,000 and a federal corporate tax of 3% on all income net of non-executive payroll.

Everyone should know with certainty EXACTLY what everyone else is paying on a percentage basis, because that's what they're paying.

Except the rich who'll still get their tax breaks.

 

[frigidweirdo]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

of course it is.

everyone pays the same percentage of their income period

But does everyone get the same amount of services? No

It's like going into a restaurant and everyone pays the same to eat. Yet one person gets a great meal, and someone else gets rubbish.

You really cant base tax on service. If you really wanted to base the tax code on that you would have the poor who use the vast majority of government services paying far more than the rich were.

And no, it is a false narrative that the rich use more government than the poor.

A simple tax code is the only way that it can be fair. There is no measure for government services like access to protected rights, national security and jails. Right now we have the poor paying a larger share of their income than the rich to the federal government. True simplification of the tax code will benefit not only the middle class but the poor as well. It will hose the uber rich as they are the ones that have been manipulating the code to benefit special interests.

It always amazes me that some claim simplifying the tax code will hurt the middle class and poor but then complain that Romney pays a smaller percentage than his secretary. The two concepts are entirely at odds.

But the poor don't use the vast amount of services.

You have to remember that BOTH the poor and rich use things like education. You get given an education, the country gets given an educated worked, and a business gets educated workers. So, education isn't all about the individual, it's about the country and it's about making money.

What about infrastructure? Perhaps a person will use the road twice in a day, maybe a little more sometimes. How much are big corporations using the roads? Probably thousands of times a day to ship products, having employees get to work, having managers going from one place to another. All of this benefits business too.

You think about Iraq, how much did the war and post war period cost the US?

One estimate is $1.1 trillion. Who benefited from this? It certainly wasn't the poor. The poor got shot at and killed or maimed. So who made money? Defense contractors, oil companies and shareholders. So, who should be paying for such things?

Who benefits from the stability of the country? Everyone, but the rich are able to get rich from it, so they should be paying their fair share, which is a larger share than your average Joe.\

Look at Somalia, hard to make money and become rich there. Why? There's no security, there's no decent infrastructure.
In Russia in the 1990s the Mafias were basically taking about 30-40% of a company's income just to provide for security. The smaller people needed it less, they had less to steal from, they had less reason to be a target for the mafias. In the US most companies will pay a lot less for security and get everything else for free, basically.

What fair is isn't easy to come by. However it damn well isn't everyone paying the same percentage.

 

[AVG-JOE]

The answer isn't lowering taxes any more than the answer is raising taxes...

The answer is a fair and simple tax code.

I'll know that we're close when H & R Block is no longer a household name.

The resources we spend to do the fucking yearly paperwork to live in this country makes us look stupid.

Fair and simple? Simple isn't fair

of course it is.

everyone pays the same percentage of their income period

But does everyone get the same amount of services? No

It's like going into a restaurant and everyone pays the same to eat. Yet one person gets a great meal, and someone else gets rubbish.

Then "services" (spending) should be limited to what is common.

The government has no business micromanaging the economy by giving tax breaks to industries and business they think deserve an advantage and the government has no business doling out welfare via a the tax code.

Talk about an invitation to fraud, corruption and abuse!

 

[AVG-JOE]

The people and corporations currently not paying their fair share.

define "fair share"

Many rich and corporations get a lot from government but end up not paying for what they get.

Step one is to establish a fair and simple tax code so we know what our budget will bear... step two is to establish what We, The Peeps are willing to spend on various common needs like defense, infrastructure and education.