The 50 most developed countries in the world and Universal Healthcare.

[Taz]

You learn something new every day. Fantastic, isn’t it?

I learned that you're not a libertarian.

That’s how I voted. You lose.

That doesn't make you a libertarian. You don't believe in any of it's central tenants.

It’s the party that had the most for me among all the parties. Only a fool blindly follows every single thing a party says.

That idiot they ran was hardly a libertarian. What about their platform do you support?

Your time is up, get back to the topic.

 

[Flash]

[Q

I’ve seen general emergency doctors, specialists and have been operated on. What’s your point?

A Libertarian would have paid for the treatment himself. A socialist would demand that somebody else pay for it.

Which one are you?

It was in Canada when I lived there. Doesn’t matter who you vote for, it’s free.

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

 

[Taz]

[Q

I’ve seen general emergency doctors, specialists and have been operated on. What’s your point?

A Libertarian would have paid for the treatment himself. A socialist would demand that somebody else pay for it.

Which one are you?

It was in Canada when I lived there. Doesn’t matter who you vote for, it’s free.

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

 

[sakinago]

Did you ever deal with a medical condition requiring specialized care?

And ask yourself why is it that someone preferred their own doctor with a socialized system?

Yes, and got great care. Rich people like to see their own doctor, not some random doctor in emergency or wherever.

With what exactly?

That’s personal, but I’ve always gotten great care.

Fine what type of physician did you see?

I’ve seen general emergency doctors, specialists and have been operated on. What’s your point?

Huwah?!? How old are you? I’m smelling something fishy here

 

[Andylusion]

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-co...dians-increasingly-come-to-us-for-health-care


Crossing the Border for Care
Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.



Why do they come here if it’s so good in Canada ? Are you just not going to answer? Name a country and people from that country come here to receive treatment for cancer and major illnesses. Why?

Its the assumption that the wealthiest country in the world has the best healthcare. The same assumption that drives people to go the hospital as best in the country. The reality though is much different.

Were not talking about the few with money who choose to travel because they believe something is better. Were talking about average life expectancy in each country and which countries are providing their citizens with Universal Healthcare. Most Europeans do not go to America to get healthcare. They stay in their countries and on average live longer than Americans. That last fact is by FAR the most relevant.

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

France, where doctors went on strike for weeks, and people were left without care, not to mention people died of heat stroke in hospitals during a heat wave years back.

Germany, has a system of private insurance, the nearly all people are part of.

Moreover, nearly all those countries have double our tax rate.

Which is more expensive: Current insurance premiums, or a 50% tax rate on the middle class?

And yes, the fact is, if you want to support your argument, then you do have to explain why people come from all over the world from their 'free health care' systems, to pay for health care here.

If you can't, then whether you admit it, or believe it, you have undeniably lost the argument that free government care is better.

SOME PEOPLE come to the United States for healthcare. Some. Its a tiny percentage and not proof that the United States healthcare system is better.

Healthcare cost in Europe are about 1/2 to 2/3s of what they are in the United States. The Quality is better because the people there live longer. Everyone there is provided for. Its the three BIG WINS!

The United States can get the taxes it needs for Universal Healthcare from the top 20% of income earners who have 80% of the wealth in the country. Capital Gains, Property, Estate and other things besides just income will need to see increased tax rates. The Middle Class will only be lightly effected if at all by the increased tax rates. The lower class and the poor won't have to pay anything.

This is yet another example of the mythology that I'm talking about.

If what you said was true, then why isn't Europe doing that? You claim we can get all the money we need from the top 20%, right? Why isn't Europe doing that? Why are people in Denmark, who earn $40,000 a year, paying 50% income tax?

Why are people in France that earn $30,000 a year, paying 30% income taxes?

All over Europe, it isn't the rich and wealth, or the top 20%, or 10%, or 1% paying for health care.... it's the middle and lower class paying for it.

Do you know why France is having riots right now? It's because the government was trying to jack up taxes on fuel. They are already paying almost double in income tax, and they want to screw the lower and middle class over with fuel taxes.

Why? To pay for, among other things, their expensive health care system.

You keep telling everyone how it's cheaper... and then when I compare their insane taxes, to my health insurance premium... there is nothing cheaper about it.

You keep blabbering about how the rich and wealthy will pay for it... and then point to all these countries with it, where the poor and middle class are paying for it.

There is not one single example in this world, where the rich and wealthy, pay for the health care of the poor.

And maybe you missed it, but France tried a wealth tax, and the all the wealthy packed up and left.

And clearly you didn't get the memo, because Amazon was about to create 25,000 jobs in New York, and the politicians tried to get them to pay for a bunch of stuff.... and Amazon left, just like the wealthy of France started leaving, just like the wealthy of Venezuela left.

Your system doesn't work. How many hundreds of examples do you need, before you stop believing the mythology the left-wing spews at you?

The irony is, even some of the socialists in this country admit that universal health care would cost at least a 12% on everyone. And that's BS, because that's way to low.

 

[Taz]

Yes, and got great care. Rich people like to see their own doctor, not some random doctor in emergency or wherever.

With what exactly?

That’s personal, but I’ve always gotten great care.

Fine what type of physician did you see?

I’ve seen general emergency doctors, specialists and have been operated on. What’s your point?

Huwah?!? How old are you? I’m smelling something fishy here

I’m not young, lol. Why?

 

[Crixus]

Its the assumption that the wealthiest country in the world has the best healthcare. The same assumption that drives people to go the hospital as best in the country. The reality though is much different.

Were not talking about the few with money who choose to travel because they believe something is better. Were talking about average life expectancy in each country and which countries are providing their citizens with Universal Healthcare. Most Europeans do not go to America to get healthcare. They stay in their countries and on average live longer than Americans. That last fact is by FAR the most relevant.

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

France, where doctors went on strike for weeks, and people were left without care, not to mention people died of heat stroke in hospitals during a heat wave years back.

Germany, has a system of private insurance, the nearly all people are part of.

Moreover, nearly all those countries have double our tax rate.

Which is more expensive: Current insurance premiums, or a 50% tax rate on the middle class?

And yes, the fact is, if you want to support your argument, then you do have to explain why people come from all over the world from their 'free health care' systems, to pay for health care here.

If you can't, then whether you admit it, or believe it, you have undeniably lost the argument that free government care is better.

SOME PEOPLE come to the United States for healthcare. Some. Its a tiny percentage and not proof that the United States healthcare system is better.

Healthcare cost in Europe are about 1/2 to 2/3s of what they are in the United States. The Quality is better because the people there live longer. Everyone there is provided for. Its the three BIG WINS!

The United States can get the taxes it needs for Universal Healthcare from the top 20% of income earners who have 80% of the wealth in the country. Capital Gains, Property, Estate and other things besides just income will need to see increased tax rates. The Middle Class will only be lightly effected if at all by the increased tax rates. The lower class and the poor won't have to pay anything.

This is yet another example of the mythology that I'm talking about.

If what you said was true, then why isn't Europe doing that? You claim we can get all the money we need from the top 20%, right? Why isn't Europe doing that? Why are people in Denmark, who earn $40,000 a year, paying 50% income tax?

Why are people in France that earn $30,000 a year, paying 30% income taxes?

All over Europe, it isn't the rich and wealth, or the top 20%, or 10%, or 1% paying for health care.... it's the middle and lower class paying for it.

Do you know why France is having riots right now? It's because the government was trying to jack up taxes on fuel. They are already paying almost double in income tax, and they want to screw the lower and middle class over with fuel taxes.

Why? To pay for, among other things, their expensive health care system.

You keep telling everyone how it's cheaper... and then when I compare their insane taxes, to my health insurance premium... there is nothing cheaper about it.

You keep blabbering about how the rich and wealthy will pay for it... and then point to all these countries with it, where the poor and middle class are paying for it.

There is not one single example in this world, where the rich and wealthy, pay for the health care of the poor.

And maybe you missed it, but France tried a wealth tax, and the all the wealthy packed up and left.

And clearly you didn't get the memo, because Amazon was about to create 25,000 jobs in New York, and the politicians tried to get them to pay for a bunch of stuff.... and Amazon left, just like the wealthy of France started leaving, just like the wealthy of Venezuela left.

Your system doesn't work. How many hundreds of examples do you need, before you stop believing the mythology the left-wing spews at you?

The irony is, even some of the socialists in this country admit that universal health care would cost at least a 12% on everyone. And that's BS, because that's way to low.

But it’s the humane thing to do. Think of the children who’s parents go bankrupt trying to buy cough syrup.

 

[Flash]

A Libertarian would have paid for the treatment himself. A socialist would demand that somebody else pay for it.

Which one are you?

It was in Canada when I lived there. Doesn’t matter who you vote for, it’s free.

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

I would much rather have somebody trying to make a profit on good service provide my health care rather than some stupid incompetent bureaucrat, whose boss is a corrupt politician, elected by special interest group.

A few years ago I had cancer that needed treatment. In my area I had three different facilities competing for my business. I got excellent treatment. Much better than if the filthy ass non caring government was running the facilities.

 

[Taz]

It was in Canada when I lived there. Doesn’t matter who you vote for, it’s free.

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

I would much rather have somebody trying to make a profit on good service provide my health care rather than some stupid incompetent bureaucrat, whose boss is a corrupt politician, elected by special interest group.

A few years ago I had cancer that needed treatment. In my area I had three different facilities competing for my business. I got excellent treatment. Much better than if the filthy ass non caring government was running the facilities.

The government in Canada doesn’t run hospitals, they simply pay the tab.

 

[Flash]

Which restaurant would you rather go to?

1. An establishment that wanted your business so that they could make money

2. An establishment run by government bureaucrats that didn't give a shit if you showed up or not

Which one do you think you would get the better food?

This is not a trick question.

 

[sealybobo]

“Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens?”

Because conservatives have successfully propagated the lie that in addition to being ‘too expensive,’ providing all Americans access to affordable healthcare will ‘destroy capitalism’ and make America ‘socialist’ – when in fact nothing could be further from the truth.

We should just have free healthcare for diabetes, cancer, aids and anything else that will kill you. Everything else is out of pocket or provided by your employer.

And you can’t sue the hospital when you’re getting free shit. If they make a mistake so sorry

 

[sealybobo]

Which restaurant would you rather go to?

1. An establishment that wanted your business so that they could make money

2. An establishment run by government bureaucrats that didn't give a shit if you showed up or not

Which one do you think you would get the better food?

This is not a trick question.

What if I don’t have any money?

 

[Taz]

Which restaurant would you rather go to?

1. An establishment that wanted your business so that they could make money

2. An establishment run by government bureaucrats that didn't give a shit if you showed up or not

Which one do you think you would get the better food?

This is not a trick question.

Strawman argument. We have administrators running the hospitals as well, except ours are trying to squeeze as much profit out of us as they can. Prescriptions drugs are cheaper in Canada as well.

 

[Flash]

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

I would much rather have somebody trying to make a profit on good service provide my health care rather than some stupid incompetent bureaucrat, whose boss is a corrupt politician, elected by special interest group.

A few years ago I had cancer that needed treatment. In my area I had three different facilities competing for my business. I got excellent treatment. Much better than if the filthy ass non caring government was running the facilities.

The government in Canada doesn’t run hospitals, they simply pay the tab.

Most governments subcontract out work in one form or another. That doesn't change anything. If you have a government contract to run a facility you are not being pushed to be competitive.

By the way, I lived in a borer state for seven years. Our medical facilities were inundated with Canadians coming over to get health care. They would rather pay for it in the US than to get whatever the Canadians gave away for "free".

Did you go to one of these facilities in this video?

 

[Flash]

Which restaurant would you rather go to?

1. An establishment that wanted your business so that they could make money

2. An establishment run by government bureaucrats that didn't give a shit if you showed up or not

Which one do you think you would get the better food?

This is not a trick question.

What if I don’t have any money?

Go earn the money to pay for your meal then you won't be hungry.

 

[sakinago]

A Libertarian would have paid for the treatment himself. A socialist would demand that somebody else pay for it.

Which one are you?

It was in Canada when I lived there. Doesn’t matter who you vote for, it’s free.

"Free"??? Really? LOL!

You aren't that stupid are you? Nobody is that stupid.

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

Yes they do or they wouldn’t have private insurance, and there’d be A LOT more specialists. In Canada you get your spine fused together, in America you actually get a new disk, and it’s life changing. In Canada you have to wait to get subpar cancer treatment, in America you could go to a mid-grade ranked hospital/cancer center and get way better treatment the day of. It’s not at all the same quality of care or else there wouldn’t medical tourism. I work at an infusion center, over 4 hours from the border. I see patients who wake up at 1 in the morning to drive to our facility for a midday appointment, just to sit in a chair for 4 hours for their chemo infusion, and then drive back. They consider themselves the lucky ones. We’re ranked like top 10 in PA alone, so not exactly world beaters. Surprise surprise, most of my American patients aren’t at all wealthy, barely middle class. Healthcare coverage is not at all the same as healthcare, people need to stop conflating the two.

 

[sakinago]

With what exactly?

That’s personal, but I’ve always gotten great care.

Fine what type of physician did you see?

I’ve seen general emergency doctors, specialists and have been operated on. What’s your point?

Huwah?!? How old are you? I’m smelling something fishy here

I’m not young, lol. Why?

Well you sound naive like a young person. What type of physicians did you see?

 

[Taz]

Well, it’s paid out of general tax revenues, but free when you go to hospital.

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

I would much rather have somebody trying to make a profit on good service provide my health care rather than some stupid incompetent bureaucrat, whose boss is a corrupt politician, elected by special interest group.

A few years ago I had cancer that needed treatment. In my area I had three different facilities competing for my business. I got excellent treatment. Much better than if the filthy ass non caring government was running the facilities.

The government in Canada doesn’t run hospitals, they simply pay the tab.

Most governments subcontract out work in one form or another. That doesn't change anything. If you have a government contract to run a facility you are not being pushed to be competitive.

By the way, I lived in a borer state for seven years. Our medical facilities were inundated with Canadians coming over to get health care. They would rather pay for it in the US than to get whatever the Canadians gave away for "free".

Did you go to one of these facilities in this video?

An American dissing a Canadian hospital. No.

 

[Flash]

So if you don't pay at the doctor then it is free?

Then in that case I get free treatment here in the US because I never have to pay a co payment or deductible with my insurance policy.

By the way there ain't so such thing as a free lunch. All Libertarians know that. The Canadians have about 20% higher taxes than we do.

We pay taxes and health insurance, and it depends where you live for how much tax you pay, just like here. But in Canada, everyone is covered, and they don’t care for people for profit.

I would much rather have somebody trying to make a profit on good service provide my health care rather than some stupid incompetent bureaucrat, whose boss is a corrupt politician, elected by special interest group.

A few years ago I had cancer that needed treatment. In my area I had three different facilities competing for my business. I got excellent treatment. Much better than if the filthy ass non caring government was running the facilities.

The government in Canada doesn’t run hospitals, they simply pay the tab.

Most governments subcontract out work in one form or another. That doesn't change anything. If you have a government contract to run a facility you are not being pushed to be competitive.

By the way, I lived in a borer state for seven years. Our medical facilities were inundated with Canadians coming over to get health care. They would rather pay for it in the US than to get whatever the Canadians gave away for "free".

Did you go to one of these facilities in this video?

An American dissing a Canadian hospital. No.

Actually he is Canadian.

 

[sealybobo]

Which restaurant would you rather go to?

1. An establishment that wanted your business so that they could make money

2. An establishment run by government bureaucrats that didn't give a shit if you showed up or not

Which one do you think you would get the better food?

This is not a trick question.

What if I don’t have any money?

Go earn the money to pay for your meal then you won't be hungry.

We don’t need universal healthcare for people like you and me.

If money is no object I’ll go to the most expensive restaurant