The Argument for A Wealth Tax

[Winston]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

Long term capital gains is what makes companies invest in people, you want to stop employing people? Figures dumbasses like you want more people on welfare, like you...

Yeah right because companies were never successful when they had to pay the same rates as working people on the profits on long term capital gains.

You do know that plenty of working people invest in stocks that pay capital gains, why do you want to punish them by taking from their retirement funds? Do you hate working people that much? But alas, I am done with you, as you are even dumber than Nanny Pelosi and AOC. I just cant continue lowering my IQ to your level, without you trying to elevate yours to enlighten yourself about economics. So I have to put you with the rest of the other 70 IQ libtards in the ignore zone. Buh Bye.

More stupid shit. Income from Qualified Retirement accounts like IRA's and 401K's are not taxed at the capital gains rate, they are taxed as income.

 

[abu afak]

By this response, I can only surmise you want to tax wealth. Wealth which has Already been taxed once when it was earned.

By what god-given right do you presume to seize someone's wealth and turn it over to a 29 year old bartender from Queens to decide who gets it?

Actually, the biggest Fortunes (Bezos, Buffett, Gates, Zuckerberg, etc, etc, etc)
are UNtaxed appreciation on now-huge stock positions they've held since inception.
Their Salary's are usually relatively token.
`

 

[Natural Citizen]

I disagree. Your ignorance of the Founders and the Constitution isn't funny at all.

Face it, Toddster. You're a Marxist. And everyone knows it now.

You believe in central economic planning by a central bank. You believe in deficit financing. You believe the government should tell the market what to do instead of the market dictating what the government does. Central economic planning by a central bank is the antithesis of a free-market.

You should be ashamed to call yourself a conservative around here. You have more in common with Karl Marx. Any real conservative can see that.

I guess technically, you're a Hamiltonian. Most confused leftists who identify as conservative are Hamiltonian. Heh heh.

 

[bendog]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

Long term capital gains is what makes companies invest in people, you want to stop employing people? Figures dumbasses like you want more people on welfare, like you...

Oy vay. LOL

I think if corporations don't turn a profit people will not invest in them. And they don't pay taxes, or declare dividends, on personnel development.

I think Aaron didn't follow my post as intended. And a person who buys stock in year one, has NOT paid taxes on profits in later years. And his purchase price does not reflect those profits.

 

[Pilot1]

Horseshit. The only jobs created when you purchase a stock on the open market is the job of the stock trader. I mean do you think the company gets that money or something?

So how are publicly traded corporations capitalized? Where do they get their equity?

 

[bendog]

By this response, I can only surmise you want to tax wealth. Wealth which has Already been taxed once when it was earned.

By what god-given right do you presume to seize someone's wealth and turn it over to a 29 year old bartender from Queens to decide who gets it?

Actually, the biggest Fortunes (Bezos, Buffett, Gates, Zuckerberg, etc, etc, etc)
are UNtaxed appreciation on now-huge stock positions they've held since inception.
Their Salary's are usually relatively token.
`

yeah, but there's no tax owed unless the stock is sold. So, G5000 is sort of wrong. Under cap gains, or even short term gains, no one wants to take anyone's wealth.

There is an argument about efficiency in organizational management in not wanting wealth to pass strictly by heredity. But that's another issue.

 

[Winston]

The Framers who created a Central Bank in 1791?

No. The Framers who, after having just suffered through the hyper-inflation of the continental dollar which was printed into oblivion to fund the Revolutionary War, who understood the dangers of a debt based monetary system. The Framers who, in order to protect future generations from institutional theft and out of control government, wrote in the Constitution that only gold and silver can be 'money' for the simple fact that you can't print it, since printing money robs us of the liberty and prosperity that our forefathers fought and died for.

Those Founders.

The Framers who, after having just suffered through the hyper-inflation of the continental dollar which was printed into oblivion to fund the Revolutionary War, who understood the dangers of a debt based monetary system.

They did all that and still created a Central Bank in 1791.

wrote in the Constitution that only gold and silver can be 'money'

Liar, liar, pants on fire.

Well how about some background of the creation of that central bank. It was Alexander Hamilton's baby and it's real purpose was the assumption of the debt of the states created by the Revolutionary War. See, during the war state militia would take property from locals to support the war effort. Say you were a farmer with some cattle. The militia would stroll in, take the cattle to feed the troops, and in return give your some "script" that would say they owed you twenty dollars.

Now when the war ended things were pretty tough. Those farmers were in dire straits, food was scarce because the workers were out fighting redcoats and not tending their fields. Supplies were short and the infrastructure was badly damaged. Desperate those farmers sold those scripts to speculators like, well, Alexander Hamilton. And they sold them for pennies on the dollar. Once most of those scripts were purchased by speculators Hamilton created the central bank. A major part of that creation was the payment of those scripts at full face value. In fact, it was a non-negotiable requirement of the creation of that bank. And where did the money come from to pay for those scripts? The whiskey tax, which led to the whiskey rebellion, which was put down by more federal troops than fought in the entire Revolutionary War.

 

[Winston]

Horseshit. The only jobs created when you purchase a stock on the open market is the job of the stock trader. I mean do you think the company gets that money or something?

So how are publicly traded corporations capitalized? Where do they get their equity?

That is an IPO. Have you ever bought into an IPO?

 

[bendog]

Horseshit. The only jobs created when you purchase a stock on the open market is the job of the stock trader. I mean do you think the company gets that money or something?

So how are publicly traded corporations capitalized? Where do they get their equity?

Ah, there's the answer and the question. Corpoate equity comes from people buying stock, but THAT is a one time infusion of equity per sale. Equity also comes from corp profits.

I'd agree with anyone who suggested corporations should not pay income tax, but dividends and cap gains should be individually taxed at the same rate as other income.

 

[Winston]

By this response, I can only surmise you want to tax wealth. Wealth which has Already been taxed once when it was earned.

By what god-given right do you presume to seize someone's wealth and turn it over to a 29 year old bartender from Queens to decide who gets it?

Actually, the biggest Fortunes (Bezos, Buffett, Gates, Zuckerberg, etc, etc, etc)
are UNtaxed appreciation on now-huge stock positions they've held since inception.
Their Salary's are usually relatively token.
`

yeah, but there's no tax owed unless the stock is sold. So, G5000 is sort of wrong. Under cap gains, or even short term gains, no one wants to take anyone's wealth.

There is an argument about efficiency in organizational management in not wanting wealth to pass strictly by heredity. But that's another issue.

Yes, capital gains are not accessed until a stock is sold. So, when the capital gains rate is low people buy and sell stock much more frequently than when capital gains rates are higher. The volatility of the current stock market is a direct result, and a clear sign, that the capital gains rate is too low.

 

[Pilot1]

That is an IPO. Have you ever bought into an IPO?

Yes, but after the initial offering that capital does not go back to the trading company. As others have said, profits also generate equity, and sometimes corps buy back stock. So the company retains the capital from that sale of stock, not the trader. Then there is the debt side.

 

[abu afak]

Yes, capital gains are not accessed until a stock is sold. So, when the capital gains rate is low people buy and sell stock much more frequently than when capital gains rates are higher. The volatility of the current stock market is a direct result, and a clear sign, that the capital gains rate is too low.

If and when they add a "Buffett Bracket" or two.. (ie, 50% or 70%)
Cap Gains should be taxed at that higher rate as ordinary income for that wealthy group.
`

 

[Natural Citizen]

Taxing isn't the solution. It's the system itself that needs addressed. But it first needs to be understood.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

I agree, 15% cap gains rate, 15% top income tax rate.

Again, why dont we cut the government by 15% for the next 10 years and get it down to a more manageable level instead of such overbloated agencies that spend more money than they take in? Damn you guys never talk about cuts, just raise taxes, raise taxes. I shake my head at how stupid the left is...

Damn you guys never talk about cuts, just raise taxes, raise taxes.

Ummmm….a 15% top rate would be a tax cut, not a hike.

I am talking about cutting the government, not a tax cut...If you have a government that only need 1 trillion dollars of revenue, then you only have to bring in 1 trillion dollars of revenue.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

Why would you try to destroy the reason many people, including foreign entities invest their money, create jobs, and products?

It's still income. Why is the money I make through my labors worth less than money made off of investments?

Because retard, it is already taxed as corporate profit. Fuck you, if you dont invest in corporations, but in EBT cards and Walmart shopping carts.

Capital gains are not taxed via corporate profits you dumbshit.

Dividend income, NOT capital gains is what comes from the corporate profits, you fucking moron, I never said capital gains.....Nice fucking try, go back to preschool...

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

Long term capital gains is what makes companies invest in people, you want to stop employing people? Figures dumbasses like you want more people on welfare, like you...

Yeah right because companies were never successful when they had to pay the same rates as working people on the profits on long term capital gains.

You do know that plenty of working people invest in stocks that pay capital gains, why do you want to punish them by taking from their retirement funds? Do you hate working people that much? But alas, I am done with you, as you are even dumber than Nanny Pelosi and AOC. I just cant continue lowering my IQ to your level, without you trying to elevate yours to enlighten yourself about economics. So I have to put you with the rest of the other 70 IQ libtards in the ignore zone. Buh Bye.

More stupid shit. Income from Qualified Retirement accounts like IRA's and 401K's are not taxed at the capital gains rate, they are taxed as income.

No fucking shit just like a pension is, if you take the IRA or 401s as an annuity. But if you roll those accounts into a dividend paying stock, then take only the dividends, then it is taxed at a lower rate. I really am getting tired of idiots like you putting words in my mouth...But then you are a dumbass liberal, and I already know better..

 

[Pilot1]

Capital gains are not taxed via corporate profits you dumbshit.
Dividend income, NOT capital gains is what comes from the corporate profits, you fucking moron, I never said capital gains.....Nice fucking try, go back to preschool...

Correct. Capital GAINS come from the increase in market value of the stock price, but you have to sell it to realize the gain, and have a taxable event.

 

[georgephillip]

The Ponzi Factor?

Home - The Ponzi Factor

"One of the biggest myths about stocks is the belief that profits from stocks come from the earnings of the underlying companies, and when companies make money, they share the profits with their investors.

"But the reality is, profits from stocks come from other investors who are buying and selling stocks, and when companies make money, they keep everything.

"The belief is, stocks represent value in a company. The truth is, stocks are Ponzi assets because investors’ profits are dependent on the inflow of money from new investors and no one is obligated to pay the shareholders anything."

Between 2010-2017 Tesla stock rose from about $20 a share to over $380, do you think they made or lost $4.3 billion over that same time frame?

https://www.amazon.com/Ponzi-Factor-Simple-Investment-Profits/dp/1976949955&tag=ff0d01-20

 

[Winston]

Never heard of the progressive tax rate.

However, long term capital gains should be treated like income and not given a lower rate.

Long term capital gains is what makes companies invest in people, you want to stop employing people? Figures dumbasses like you want more people on welfare, like you...

Yeah right because companies were never successful when they had to pay the same rates as working people on the profits on long term capital gains.

You do know that plenty of working people invest in stocks that pay capital gains, why do you want to punish them by taking from their retirement funds? Do you hate working people that much? But alas, I am done with you, as you are even dumber than Nanny Pelosi and AOC. I just cant continue lowering my IQ to your level, without you trying to elevate yours to enlighten yourself about economics. So I have to put you with the rest of the other 70 IQ libtards in the ignore zone. Buh Bye.

More stupid shit. Income from Qualified Retirement accounts like IRA's and 401K's are not taxed at the capital gains rate, they are taxed as income.

No fucking shit just like a pension is, if you take the IRA or 401s as an annuity. But if you roll those accounts into a dividend paying stock, then take only the dividends, then it is taxed at a lower rate. I really am getting tired of idiots like you putting words in my mouth...But then you are a dumbass liberal, and I already know better..

You are dumber than a box or rocks If you roll an IRA into a stock and then take the dividends the dividends become a distribution and are taxed as earned income. You know, the more nonsense you spout the more you prove to everyone that you are complete poser.

 

[Brain357]

We need to collect more taxes from somewhere. Those tax cuts sure didn't pay for themselves as Repubs promised.